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RE: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

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  • tbaker@pro-ns.net
    For folks interested in pix of TR and his dogs, I have an album hosted by a friend that contains pix that I have scanned from books. It contains the pic of TR
    Message 1 of 17 , Jan 31, 2003
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      For folks interested in pix of TR and his dogs, I have an album hosted by a
      friend that contains pix that I have scanned from books. It contains the pic
      of TR with Skip in the cabin doorway, and also one of TR and a hound -
      misidentified as Skip - in the book I copied it from (so noted.) It ain't
      great- the picture quality is poor in many cases, but peeking thru it may
      satisfy your TR cravings in a rough spell :-).

      T.

      http://imageevent.com/wudnshu/theodoreroosveltdogs
    • Jeremy Johnston
      To all TR Dog Lovers, I am proud to say my great-great grandfather, John B. Goff, gave TR Skip when they hunted together in Colorado. I have a lot of
      Message 2 of 17 , Feb 1, 2003
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        To all TR Dog Lovers,

        I am proud to say my great-great grandfather, John B. Goff, gave TR "Skip" when they hunted together in Colorado. I have a lot of information pertaining to "Skip" that I would be happy to share. Right now I am out of my home area but when I return I would be happy to dig it all out and share it with the group. TR describes "Skip" and John Goff's other dogs in the book Outdoor Pastimes of an American Hunter. According to the information I have, Goff was not too proud of "Skip" as a hunting dog, but TR and "Skip" fell in love with each other so "Skip" left the West for the East.

        I can tell you all that my family is quite proud to send one dog to the White House.

        Sincerely,
        Jeremy Johnston
        Northwest College
        231 West 6th Street
        Powell, WY 82435

        -----Original Message-----
        From: John A. Gable [mailto:TRA_Gable@...]
        Sent: Fri 1/31/2003 3:05 PM
        To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
        Cc:
        Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

        Sure, that is the President of the United States with Skip in Great Divide,
        Colorado in 1905. Photo by Dr. Alexander Lambert, presidential physician.
        This was, by the way, Hermann Hagedorn's favorite photograph of TR. TR was
        on a hunting trip in Colorado, and Skip was a dog he brought back with him
        to Sagamore Hill, where he was a favorite of the children. Skip is buried in
        the pet cemetery at Sagamore, his name engraved on the stone there. These
        and all other TR photos may be obtained from
        Wallace F. Dailey
        Curator, Theodore Roosevelt Collection
        Houghton Library
        Harvard
        Cambridge, Mass. 02138.
        e-mail
        wfdailey@...
        Just say picture of TR with Skip, Colorado 1905. Tell him what you want
        the picture for and what size print you want.
        There will, of course, be a charge.
        John Gable
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: <BrotherPres@...>
        To: <tr-m@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 1:57 PM
        Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?


        > I too would like to know about this Teddy Roosevelt Terrier!
        >
        > On a related note, one of my favorite pictures in the world is of TR
        sitting in a doorway, reading with a dog either on his lap or at his feet.
        I have seen it in a few books, but have not been able to find a good copy of
        it online. I'd love to have it as my wallpaper. Does anyone have any idea
        where I might find it?
        >
        > Thank you for your help.
        >
        > G.T.
        >
        > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
        > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...
        >
        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        >
        >



        To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
        To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...

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      • BrotherPres@aol.com
        Thank you very much to everyone for your help! I ll be emailing Mr. Dailey shortly. G.T.
        Message 3 of 17 , Feb 1, 2003
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          Thank you very much to everyone for your help!  I'll be emailing Mr. Dailey shortly.

          G.T.
        • TBaker
          Jeremy - so excited to hear this!! I would love info on the breeding and use of your great-great-grandpa s dogs, and interested in any pictures you have.
          Message 4 of 17 , Feb 2, 2003
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            Jeremy - so excited to hear this!!

            I would love info on the breeding and use of your great-great-grandpa's
            dogs, and interested in any pictures you have.

            Waiting here with baited breath...counting the minutes....hehehe..

            THANKS,
            T.




            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Jeremy Johnston <johnstoe@...>
            To: <tr-m@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Saturday, February 01, 2003 9:51 AM
            Subject: RE: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?


            > To all TR Dog Lovers,
            >
            > I am proud to say my great-great grandfather, John B. Goff, gave TR "Skip"
            when they hunted together in Colorado. I have a lot of information
            pertaining to "Skip" that I would be happy to share. Right now I am out of
            my home area but when I return I would be happy to dig it all out and share
            it with the group. TR describes "Skip" and John Goff's other dogs in the
            book Outdoor Pastimes of an American Hunter. According to the information I
            have, Goff was not too proud of "Skip" as a hunting dog, but TR and "Skip"
            fell in love with each other so "Skip" left the West for the East.
            >
            > I can tell you all that my family is quite proud to send one dog to the
            White House.
            >
            > Sincerely,
            > Jeremy Johnston
            > Northwest College
            > 231 West 6th Street
            > Powell, WY 82435
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: John A. Gable [mailto:TRA_Gable@...]
            > Sent: Fri 1/31/2003 3:05 PM
            > To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
            > Cc:
            > Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?
            >
            > Sure, that is the President of the United States with Skip in Great
            Divide,
            > Colorado in 1905. Photo by Dr. Alexander Lambert, presidential physician.
            > This was, by the way, Hermann Hagedorn's favorite photograph of TR. TR was
            > on a hunting trip in Colorado, and Skip was a dog he brought back with him
            > to Sagamore Hill, where he was a favorite of the children. Skip is buried
            in
            > the pet cemetery at Sagamore, his name engraved on the stone there. These
            > and all other TR photos may be obtained from
            > Wallace F. Dailey
            > Curator, Theodore Roosevelt Collection
            > Houghton Library
            > Harvard
            > Cambridge, Mass. 02138.
            > e-mail
            > wfdailey@...
            > Just say picture of TR with Skip, Colorado 1905. Tell him what you
            want
            > the picture for and what size print you want.
            > There will, of course, be a charge.
            > John Gable
            > ----- Original Message -----
            > From: <BrotherPres@...>
            > To: <tr-m@yahoogroups.com>
            > Sent: Friday, January 31, 2003 1:57 PM
            > Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?
            >
            >
            > > I too would like to know about this Teddy Roosevelt Terrier!
            > >
            > > On a related note, one of my favorite pictures in the world is of TR
            > sitting in a doorway, reading with a dog either on his lap or at his feet.
            > I have seen it in a few books, but have not been able to find a good copy
            of
            > it online. I'd love to have it as my wallpaper. Does anyone have any
            idea
            > where I might find it?
            > >
            > > Thank you for your help.
            > >
            > > G.T.
            > >
            > > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
            > > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...
            > >
            > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
            http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            > >
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
            > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
            > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            >
            >
          • Jeremy Johnston
            Dear TR Discussion Group Members, I finally made it back home and found my material on Skip, Goff, and TR. For those readers who are sensitive to hunting
            Message 5 of 17 , Feb 4, 2003
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              Message

              Dear TR Discussion Group Members,

              I finally made it back home and found my material on “Skip,” Goff, and TR.  For those readers who are sensitive to hunting stories, may I suggest you stop reading this email at this point.   I have also attached a biography of John B. Goff.  I wrote this a number of years ago in grad school and it is a little rough, especially the endnotes. 

              TR and John Goff hunted together in northwestern Colorado in 1901 and 1905.  TR and Goff hunted cougars in 1901 and then bear in 1905.  In both hunts, Goff’s dogs were used to track and tree the hunters’ prey.  In an Outdoor Life article, John Goff described his pack as follows:
                      I am often asked “What kind of dogs are best adapted to bear and lion hunting?” My answer has been that common curs have often done me more service than the finely-bred     dogs of any breed.  I have in my pack – and name them here in the order of their efficiency – foxhounds, bloodhounds, crosses between these two, bull-terriers, fox-terriers, fox-terrier crosses with other terriers, and canines that can only be called just “dog.” 
                      While the greatest essential of a bear dog is the sense of scent, yet there are other qualifications that crowd this one awfully close, such, for instance, as that of worrying a bear and causing him to lose time by fighting off the dogs, which, in grizzly hunting especially, is a valuable aid.  Then the hunter can come up and get a shot, or if a black bear, this worrying process will soon cause him to tree, when of course the chase is ended.
                      With the fighting and worrying of the bear by the dogs is combined the essential of being able to run in and nip and then get away before the powerful paw of the bear can land.  This habit is only acquired by actual bear-hunting, and is one of the dearest lessons the bear dog learns, for nearly all my dogs have at one time or another – in some cases many more times than one – received chastisement from bears which impresses vividly on their minds that they must hurry after biting the bear if they would continue to grace this terrestrial sphere with their presence.
                      A bulldog or bull-terrier is one of the hardest dogs to teach this lesson of self-protection.  Owing to their disposition it is hard for them to let go in time to save themselves, while they will rush in (at first) on a bear or lion, absolutely unmindful of the consequences.
                      The first lesson is invariably taught by the despised little porcupine, but even this does not remind them that they must be careful of bears.  After one or two clouts from the big paws, however, they realize that care must be taken – that is, if they survive the blows.
              (Outdoor Life, volume vol. xvi, number 3, September, 1905)



              During the 1905 bear hunt, TR met “Skip.”  TR wrote in Outdoor Pastimes of an American Hunter:

               There was a funny little black and tan[terrier], named Skip, a most friendly little fellow, especially found of riding in front or behind the saddle of any one of us who would take him up, although perfectly able to travel forty miles a day on his own sturdy legs if he had to, and then to join in the worry of the quarry when once it had been shot…Skip adopted me as his special master, rode with me whenever I would let him, and slept on the foot of my bed at night, growling defiance at anything that came near.  I grew attached to the friendly, bright little fellow, and at the end of the hunt took him home with me as a playmate for the children. (OPAH, pg. 71-72)

              Of course Skip would have gone through the training process described by Goff.  Perhaps being a little smarter than the other terriers, he decided his place in the hunt was on the back of a saddle instead of in the middle of the pack.  Still Skip was willing to participate in any fight with bobcats and bears.  TR recalled two incidents when Skip and Shorty, another of Goff’s dogs, treed bobcats.  In one incident, Skip climbed 30feet into a tree in hopes of tangling with a bobcat.  TR also wrote in Outdoor Pastimes that Skip was the first one to attack a bear after it had been shot from its perch in a tree. 
               
              The story of Skip in the Roosevelt family is well documented in the book, A Bully Father:  Theodore Roosevelt’s Letters to His Children.  In this collection of letters to his children, TR tells the story of Skip’s life in the White House and Sagamore Hill.  It is a very moving collection, detailing the housebreaking of a western hunting dog into the presidential home, Skip’s adventures with Archie, and the sorrows of Skip running away and then the joy of his return.  It also includes a poignant letter from TR to Archie expressing delight in the memories of Skip after his untimely death. 

              TR reported to Goff the following news in a letter dated   January 25, 1908, “I am very sorry to say that both Shorty and Skip got killed by automobiles last summer.  Skip’s death nearly broke Archie’s heart.”

              I always found the story of Skip to be an amazing animal tale (no pun intended).  It is fascinating to ponder all the experiences this little terrier went through, from the mountains of Colorado, to the corridors of the White House, and to the fields of Sagamore Hill.  I would also have to agree with what many of you have expressed, one of my favorite photos is the one of TR sitting in the doorway of a cabin, reading a book, with Skip on his lap.

              Sincerely,
              Jeremy Johnston


              -----Original Message-----
              From: TBaker [mailto:tbaker@...]
              Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 10:20 PM
              To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?


              Jeremy - so excited to hear this!!

              I would love info on the breeding and use of your great-great-grandpa's dogs, and interested in any pictures you have.

              Waiting here with baited breath...counting the minutes....hehehe..

              THANKS,
              T.


            • Tim Glas
              Excellent posting, and greatly amusing. Actually, in reading Theodore Roosevelt Jr. (by H. Paul Jeffers --
              Message 6 of 17 , Feb 8, 2003
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                Message

                 

                Excellent posting, and greatly amusing.

                 

                Actually, in reading Theodore Roosevelt Jr. (by H. Paul Jeffers -- http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0891417397/104-9339910-5383103) a quoted letter by TR (to his eldest son) makes reference to the hunt, indicating delight at seeing the dogs pursue the cat up a tree, and mentioning the cougar he killed by knife.  He writes “Soon we saw the lion in a treetop, with two of his dogs so high up among the branches that he was striking at them.  He was more afraid of us than the dogs, and as soon as he saw us he took a great flying leap and was off, the pack close behind.  In a few hundred yards they had him up another tree.  They could have killed him by themselves.  But he bit and clawed four of them, and for fear that he might kill one I ran in and stabbed him behind the shoulder, thrusting the knife right into his heart.  I have always wished to kill a cougar as I did this one, with dogs and the knife.”

                 

                The book (which incidentally, is a terrific read) then states that “The tale was even more thrilling for [Theodore Roosevelt, Jr.] because the knife his father used was one that Ted had given him.” p 36.

                 

                I wonder why it’s not available at http://www.theodoreroosevelt.org/association/products.htm.

                 

                Cheers,

                Tim G

                 

                -----Original Message-----
                From: Jeremy Johnston [mailto:johnstoe@...]
                Sent:
                Tuesday, February 04, 2003 1:11 PM
                To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

                 

                Dear TR Discussion Group Members,

                I finally made it back home and found my material on “Skip,” Goff, and TR.  For those readers who are sensitive to hunting stories, may I suggest you stop reading this email at this point.   I have also attached a biography of John B. Goff.  I wrote this a number of years ago in grad school and it is a little rough, especially the endnotes. 

                TR and John Goff hunted together in northwestern Colorado in 1901 and 1905.  TR and Goff hunted cougars in 1901 and then bear in 1905.  In both hunts, Goff’s dogs were used to track and tree the hunters’ prey.  In an Outdoor Life article, John Goff described his pack as follows:
                        I am often asked “What kind of dogs are best adapted to bear and lion hunting?” My answer has been that common curs have often done me more service than the finely-bred     dogs of any breed.  I have in my pack – and name them here in the order of their efficiency – foxhounds, bloodhounds, crosses between these two, bull-terriers, fox-terriers, fox-terrier crosses with other terriers, and canines that can only be called just “dog.” 
                        While the greatest essential of a bear dog is the sense of scent, yet there are other qualifications that crowd this one awfully close, such, for instance, as that of worrying a bear and causing him to lose time by fighting off the dogs, which, in grizzly hunting especially, is a valuable aid.  Then the hunter can come up and get a shot, or if a black bear, this worrying process will soon cause him to tree, when of course the chase is ended.
                        With the fighting and worrying of the bear by the dogs is combined the essential of being able to run in and nip and then get away before the powerful paw of the bear can land.  This habit is only acquired by actual bear-hunting, and is one of the dearest lessons the bear dog learns, for nearly all my dogs have at one time or another – in some cases many more times than one – received chastisement from bears which impresses vividly on their minds that they must hurry after biting the bear if they would continue to grace this terrestrial sphere with their presence.
                        A bulldog or bull-terrier is one of the hardest dogs to teach this lesson of self-protection.  Owing to their disposition it is hard for them to let go in time to save themselves, while they will rush in (at first) on a bear or lion, absolutely unmindful of the consequences.
                        The first lesson is invariably taught by the despised little porcupine, but even this does not remind them that they must be careful of bears.  After one or two clouts from the big paws, however, they realize that care must be taken – that is, if they survive the blows.
                (Outdoor Life, volume vol. xvi, number 3, September, 1905)



                During the 1905 bear hunt, TR met “Skip.”  TR wrote in Outdoor Pastimes of an American Hunter:

                 There was a funny little black and tan[terrier], named Skip, a most friendly little fellow, especially found of riding in front or behind the saddle of any one of us who would take him up, although perfectly able to travel forty miles a day on his own sturdy legs if he had to, and then to join in the worry of the quarry when once it had been shot…Skip adopted me as his special master, rode with me whenever I would let him, and slept on the foot of my bed at night, growling defiance at anything that came near.  I grew attached to the friendly, bright little fellow, and at the end of the hunt took him home with me as a playmate for the children. (OPAH, pg. 71-72)

                Of course Skip would have gone through the training process described by Goff.  Perhaps being a little smarter than the other terriers, he decided his place in the hunt was on the back of a saddle instead of in the middle of the pack.  Still Skip was willing to participate in any fight with bobcats and bears.  TR recalled two incidents when Skip and Shorty, another of Goff’s dogs, treed bobcats.  In one incident, Skip climbed 30feet into a tree in hopes of tangling with a bobcat.  TR also wrote in Outdoor Pastimes that Skip was the first one to attack a bear after it had been shot from its perch in a tree. 
                 
                The story of Skip in the Roosevelt family is well documented in the book, A Bully Father:  Theodore Roosevelt’s Letters to His Children.  In this collection of letters to his children, TR tells the story of Skip’s life in the White House and Sagamore Hill.  It is a very moving collection, detailing the housebreaking of a western hunting dog into the presidential home, Skip’s adventures with Archie, and the sorrows of Skip running away and then the joy of his return.  It also includes a poignant letter from TR to Archie expressing delight in the memories of Skip after his untimely death. 

                TR reported to Goff the following news in a letter dated   January 25, 1908, “I am very sorry to say that both Shorty and Skip got killed by automobiles last summer.  Skip’s death nearly broke Archie’s heart.”

                I always found the story of Skip to be an amazing animal tale (no pun intended).  It is fascinating to ponder all the experiences this little terrier went through, from the mountains of Colorado, to the corridors of the White House, and to the fields of Sagamore Hill.  I would also have to agree with what many of you have expressed, one of my favorite photos is the one of TR sitting in the doorway of a cabin, reading a book, with Skip on his lap.

                Sincerely,
                Jeremy Johnston


                -----Original Message-----
                From: TBaker [mailto:tbaker@...]
                Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 10:20 PM
                To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?


                Jeremy - so excited to hear this!!

                I would love info on the breeding and use of your great-great-grandpa's dogs, and interested in any pictures you have.

                Waiting here with baited breath...counting the minutes....hehehe..

                THANKS,
                T.


                To Post a message, send it to:   tr-m@...
                To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...


                Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


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              • John A. Gable
                MessageAbout putting TR s books on line, we do not have the funds to do that at present. John Gable TRA ... From: Tim Glas To: johnstoe@northwestcollege.edu
                Message 7 of 17 , Feb 9, 2003
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                  Message
                  About putting TR's books on line, we do not have the funds to do that at present. 
                                      John Gable
                  TRA
                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Tim Glas
                  Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 10:45 PM
                  Subject: RE: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

                   

                  Excellent posting, and greatly amusing.

                   

                  Actually, in reading Theodore Roosevelt Jr. (by H. Paul Jeffers -- http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0891417397/104-9339910-5383103) a quoted letter by TR (to his eldest son) makes reference to the hunt, indicating delight at seeing the dogs pursue the cat up a tree, and mentioning the cougar he killed by knife.  He writes “Soon we saw the lion in a treetop, with two of his dogs so high up among the branches that he was striking at them.  He was more afraid of us than the dogs, and as soon as he saw us he took a great flying leap and was off, the pack close behind.  In a few hundred yards they had him up another tree.  They could have killed him by themselves.  But he bit and clawed four of them, and for fear that he might kill one I ran in and stabbed him behind the shoulder, thrusting the knife right into his heart.  I have always wished to kill a cougar as I did this one, with dogs and the knife.”

                   

                  The book (which incidentally, is a terrific read) then states that “The tale was even more thrilling for [Theodore Roosevelt, Jr.] because the knife his father used was one that Ted had given him.” p 36.

                   

                  I wonder why it’s not available at http://www.theodoreroosevelt.org/association/products.htm.

                   

                  Cheers,

                  Tim G

                   

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: Jeremy Johnston [mailto:johnstoe@...]
                  Sent:
                  Tuesday, February 04, 2003 1:11 PM
                  To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

                   

                  Dear TR Discussion Group Members,

                  I finally made it back home and found my material on “Skip,” Goff, and TR.  For those readers who are sensitive to hunting stories, may I suggest you stop reading this email at this point.   I have also attached a biography of John B. Goff.  I wrote this a number of years ago in grad school and it is a little rough, especially the endnotes. 

                  TR and John Goff hunted together in northwestern Colorado in 1901 and 1905.  TR and Goff hunted cougars in 1901 and then bear in 1905.  In both hunts, Goff’s dogs were used to track and tree the hunters’ prey.  In an Outdoor Life article, John Goff described his pack as follows:
                          I am often asked “What kind of dogs are best adapted to bear and lion hunting?” My answer has been that common curs have often done me more service than the finely-bred     dogs of any breed.  I have in my pack – and name them here in the order of their efficiency – foxhounds, bloodhounds, crosses between these two, bull-terriers, fox-terriers, fox-terrier crosses with other terriers, and canines that can only be called just “dog.” 
                          While the greatest essential of a bear dog is the sense of scent, yet there are other qualifications that crowd this one awfully close, such, for instance, as that of worrying a bear and causing him to lose time by fighting off the dogs, which, in grizzly hunting especially, is a valuable aid.  Then the hunter can come up and get a shot, or if a black bear, this worrying process will soon cause him to tree, when of course the chase is ended.
                          With the fighting and worrying of the bear by the dogs is combined the essential of being able to run in and nip and then get away before the powerful paw of the bear can land.  This habit is only acquired by actual bear-hunting, and is one of the dearest lessons the bear dog learns, for nearly all my dogs have at one time or another – in some cases many more times than one – received chastisement from bears which impresses vividly on their minds that they must hurry after biting the bear if they would continue to grace this terrestrial sphere with their presence.
                          A bulldog or bull-terrier is one of the hardest dogs to teach this lesson of self-protection.  Owing to their disposition it is hard for them to let go in time to save themselves, while they will rush in (at first) on a bear or lion, absolutely unmindful of the consequences.
                          The first lesson is invariably taught by the despised little porcupine, but even this does not remind them that they must be careful of bears.  After one or two clouts from the big paws, however, they realize that care must be taken – that is, if they survive the blows.
                  (Outdoor Life, volume vol. xvi, number 3, September, 1905)



                  During the 1905 bear hunt, TR met “Skip.”  TR wrote in Outdoor Pastimes of an American Hunter:

                   There was a funny little black and tan[terrier], named Skip, a most friendly little fellow, especially found of riding in front or behind the saddle of any one of us who would take him up, although perfectly able to travel forty miles a day on his own sturdy legs if he had to, and then to join in the worry of the quarry when once it had been shot…Skip adopted me as his special master, rode with me whenever I would let him, and slept on the foot of my bed at night, growling defiance at anything that came near.  I grew attached to the friendly, bright little fellow, and at the end of the hunt took him home with me as a playmate for the children. (OPAH, pg. 71-72)

                  Of course Skip would have gone through the training process described by Goff.  Perhaps being a little smarter than the other terriers, he decided his place in the hunt was on the back of a saddle instead of in the middle of the pack.  Still Skip was willing to participate in any fight with bobcats and bears.  TR recalled two incidents when Skip and Shorty, another of Goff’s dogs, treed bobcats.  In one incident, Skip climbed 30feet into a tree in hopes of tangling with a bobcat.  TR also wrote in Outdoor Pastimes that Skip was the first one to attack a bear after it had been shot from its perch in a tree. 
                   
                  The story of Skip in the Roosevelt family is well documented in the book, A Bully Father:  Theodore Roosevelt’s Letters to His Children.  In this collection of letters to his children, TR tells the story of Skip’s life in the White House and Sagamore Hill.  It is a very moving collection, detailing the housebreaking of a western hunting dog into the presidential home, Skip’s adventures with Archie, and the sorrows of Skip running away and then the joy of his return.  It also includes a poignant letter from TR to Archie expressing delight in the memories of Skip after his untimely death. 

                  TR reported to Goff the following news in a letter dated   January 25, 1908, “I am very sorry to say that both Shorty and Skip got killed by automobiles last summer.  Skip’s death nearly broke Archie’s heart.”

                  I always found the story of Skip to be an amazing animal tale (no pun intended).  It is fascinating to ponder all the experiences this little terrier went through, from the mountains of Colorado, to the corridors of the White House, and to the fields of Sagamore Hill.  I would also have to agree with what many of you have expressed, one of my favorite photos is the one of TR sitting in the doorway of a cabin, reading a book, with Skip on his lap.

                  Sincerely,
                  Jeremy Johnston


                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: TBaker [mailto:tbaker@...]
                  Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 10:20 PM
                  To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?


                  Jeremy - so excited to hear this!!

                  I would love info on the breeding and use of your great-great-grandpa's dogs, and interested in any pictures you have.

                  Waiting here with baited breath...counting the minutes....hehehe..

                  THANKS,
                  T.


                  To Post a message, send it to:   tr-m@...
                  To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...


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                • Tim Glas
                  No, Dr. G. I meant a link to the Theodore Roosevelt Junior book being made available for sale on the TRA website, or thorugh the TRA link to amazon.com, so
                  Message 8 of 17 , Feb 9, 2003
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Message

                    No, Dr. G… I meant a link to the Theodore Roosevelt Junior book being made available for sale on the TRA website, or thorugh the TRA link to amazon.com, so that my purchase helps out the TRA.  That way… we could help give the funds to allow for the other bit. ;)

                    But I’d rather buy a copy and cut the association in on the sale.  I was very chagrinned to buy a copy of “For Lust of Knowing” at the
                    International Spy Museum here in Washington DC recently only to find it available online.

                     

                    Hmm… I just checked out the web site and found (a bit buried) something interesting… not only is Theodore Roosevelt Jr. Listed on the amazon.com link page (http://users.ids.net/%7Eejren/trbk.htm) but it seems that any purchase, if sent through a link on that page, may help out the TRA.   With the amount of items I buy via Amazon… I’m going to use this link more often.

                     

                    Sorry about the confusion!

                    Cheers,

                    Tim G

                     

                    (PS) Am I right in assuming that, in descending order, the value to the TRA of online purchases would be:
                       * Purchasing via the link to Amazon on the link above.

                    * Purchasing directly from the TRA.

                       * Sending in my check directly to you all as a contribution to ongoing projects?

                    (PPS) For those who haven’t joined already on the list… please forgive a shameless plug for an organization which, in addition to being such a valued resource on our favorite past politician, does really good work with schoolchildren, hospitals, historical preservation, and honoring policemen across the country.

                     

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: John A. Gable [mailto:TRA_Gable@...]
                    Sent:
                    Sunday, February 09, 2003 3:06 PM
                    To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com; johnstoe@...
                    Cc: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

                     

                    About putting TR's books on line, we do not have the funds to do that at present. 

                                        John Gable

                    TRA

                    ----- Original Message -----

                    From: Tim Glas

                    Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 10:45 PM

                    Subject: RE: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

                     

                     

                    Excellent posting, and greatly amusing.

                     

                    Actually, in reading Theodore Roosevelt Jr. (by H. Paul Jeffers -- http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0891417397/104-9339910-5383103) a quoted letter by TR (to his eldest son) makes reference to the hunt, indicating delight at seeing the dogs pursue the cat up a tree, and mentioning the cougar he killed by knife.  He writes “Soon we saw the lion in a treetop, with two of his dogs so high up among the branches that he was striking at them.  He was more afraid of us than the dogs, and as soon as he saw us he took a great flying leap and was off, the pack close behind.  In a few hundred yards they had him up another tree.  They could have killed him by themselves.  But he bit and clawed four of them, and for fear that he might kill one I ran in and stabbed him behind the shoulder, thrusting the knife right into his heart.  I have always wished to kill a cougar as I did this one, with dogs and the knife.”

                     

                    The book (which incidentally, is a terrific read) then states that “The tale was even more thrilling for [Theodore Roosevelt, Jr.] because the knife his father used was one that Ted had given him.” p 36.

                     

                    I wonder why it’s not available at http://www.theodoreroosevelt.org/association/products.htm.

                     

                    Cheers,

                    Tim G

                     

                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: Jeremy Johnston [mailto:johnstoe@...]
                    Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 1:11 PM
                    To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

                     

                    Dear TR Discussion Group Members,

                    I finally made it back home and found my material on “Skip,” Goff, and TR.  For those readers who are sensitive to hunting stories, may I suggest you stop reading this email at this point.   I have also attached a biography of John B. Goff.  I wrote this a number of years ago in grad school and it is a little rough, especially the endnotes. 

                    TR and John Goff hunted together in northwestern Colorado in 1901 and 1905.  TR and Goff hunted cougars in 1901 and then bear in 1905.  In both hunts, Goff’s dogs were used to track and tree the hunters’ prey.  In an Outdoor Life article, John Goff described his pack as follows:
                            I am often asked “What kind of dogs are best adapted to bear and lion hunting?” My answer has been that common curs have often done me more service than the finely-bred     dogs of any breed.  I have in my pack – and name them here in the order of their efficiency – foxhounds, bloodhounds, crosses between these two, bull-terriers, fox-terriers, fox-terrier crosses with other terriers, and canines that can only be called just “dog.” 
                            While the greatest essential of a bear dog is the sense of scent, yet there are other qualifications that crowd this one awfully close, such, for instance, as that of worrying a bear and causing him to lose time by fighting off the dogs, which, in grizzly hunting especially, is a valuable aid.  Then the hunter can come up and get a shot, or if a black bear, this worrying process will soon cause him to tree, when of course the chase is ended.
                            With the fighting and worrying of the bear by the dogs is combined the essential of being able to run in and nip and then get away before the powerful paw of the bear can land.  This habit is only acquired by actual bear-hunting, and is one of the dearest lessons the bear dog learns, for nearly all my dogs have at one time or another – in some cases many more times than one – received chastisement from bears which impresses vividly on their minds that they must hurry after biting the bear if they would continue to grace this terrestrial sphere with their presence.
                            A bulldog or bull-terrier is one of the hardest dogs to teach this lesson of self-protection.  Owing to their disposition it is hard for them to let go in time to save themselves, while they will rush in (at first) on a bear or lion, absolutely unmindful of the consequences.
                            The first lesson is invariably taught by the despised little porcupine, but even this does not remind them that they must be careful of bears.  After one or two clouts from the big paws, however, they realize that care must be taken – that is, if they survive the blows.
                    (Outdoor Life, volume vol. xvi, number 3, September, 1905)



                    During the 1905 bear hunt, TR met “Skip.”  TR wrote in Outdoor Pastimes of an American Hunter:

                     There was a funny little black and tan[terrier], named Skip, a most friendly little fellow, especially found of riding in front or behind the saddle of any one of us who would take him up, although perfectly able to travel forty miles a day on his own sturdy legs if he had to, and then to join in the worry of the quarry when once it had been shot…Skip adopted me as his special master, rode with me whenever I would let him, and slept on the foot of my bed at night, growling defiance at anything that came near.  I grew attached to the friendly, bright little fellow, and at the end of the hunt took him home with me as a playmate for the children. (OPAH, pg. 71-72)

                    Of course Skip would have gone through the training process described by Goff.  Perhaps being a little smarter than the other terriers, he decided his place in the hunt was on the back of a saddle instead of in the middle of the pack.  Still Skip was willing to participate in any fight with bobcats and bears.  TR recalled two incidents when Skip and Shorty, another of Goff’s dogs, treed bobcats.  In one incident, Skip climbed 30feet into a tree in hopes of tangling with a bobcat.  TR also wrote in Outdoor Pastimes that Skip was the first one to attack a bear after it had been shot from its perch in a tree. 
                     
                    The story of Skip in the Roosevelt family is well documented in the book, A Bully Father:  Theodore Roosevelt’s Letters to His Children.  In this collection of letters to his children, TR tells the story of Skip’s life in the White House and Sagamore Hill.  It is a very moving collection, detailing the housebreaking of a western hunting dog into the presidential home, Skip’s adventures with Archie, and the sorrows of Skip running away and then the joy of his return.  It also includes a poignant letter from TR to Archie expressing delight in the memories of Skip after his untimely death. 

                    TR reported to Goff the following news in a letter dated   January 25, 1908, “I am very sorry to say that both Shorty and Skip got killed by automobiles last summer.  Skip’s death nearly broke Archie’s heart.”

                    I always found the story of Skip to be an amazing animal tale (no pun intended).  It is fascinating to ponder all the experiences this little terrier went through, from the mountains of Colorado, to the corridors of the White House, and to the fields of Sagamore Hill.  I would also have to agree with what many of you have expressed, one of my favorite photos is the one of TR sitting in the doorway of a cabin, reading a book, with Skip on his lap.

                    Sincerely,
                    Jeremy Johnston


                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: TBaker [mailto:tbaker@...]
                    Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 10:20 PM
                    To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?


                    Jeremy - so excited to hear this!!

                    I would love info on the breeding and use of your great-great-grandpa's dogs, and interested in any pictures you have.

                    Waiting here with baited breath...counting the minutes....hehehe..

                    THANKS,
                    T.


                    To Post a message, send it to:   tr-m@...
                    To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...


                    Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.

                     


                    To Post a message, send it to:   tr-m@...
                    To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: tr-m-unsubscribe@...


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                  • Edward J. Renehan Jr.
                    Dear Tim, On book sales, the TRA recoups the most money if you order books directly from the TRA. But the office can t stock everything, the way Amazon can,
                    Message 9 of 17 , Feb 10, 2003
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Dear Tim,
                      On book sales, the TRA recoups the most money if you
                      order books directly from the TRA. But the office
                      can't stock everything, the way Amazon can, therefore
                      the Amazon book sales web page is a useful fallback.
                      And yes, you can order ANYTHING from Amazon, whether
                      TR-related or not, and have a piece of the action fo
                      to the TRA, so long as you enter Amazon through the
                      TRA-provided link. The percentage the TRA gets on
                      Amazon sales is small, but can add up. Of course, the
                      BEST way to support the TRA us to join-up. Web site
                      http://www.theodoreroosevelt.org
                      Best,
                      Ed Renehan

                      --- Tim Glas <Tim.Glas@...> wrote:
                      > No, Dr. G. I meant a link to the Theodore Roosevelt
                      > Junior book being
                      > made available for sale on the TRA website, or
                      > thorugh the TRA link to
                      > amazon.com, so that my purchase helps out the TRA.
                      > That way. we could
                      > help give the funds to allow for the other bit. ;)
                      >
                      > But I'd rather buy a copy and cut the association in
                      > on the sale. I was
                      > very chagrinned to buy a copy of "For Lust of
                      > Knowing" at the
                      > International Spy Museum here in Washington DC
                      > recently only to find it
                      > available online.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Hmm. I just checked out the web site and found (a
                      > bit buried) something
                      > interesting. not only is Theodore Roosevelt Jr.
                      > Listed on the amazon.com
                      > link page (http://users.ids.net/%7Eejren/trbk.htm)
                      > but it seems that any
                      > purchase, if sent through a link on that page, may
                      > help out the TRA.
                      > With the amount of items I buy via Amazon. I'm going
                      > to use this link
                      > more often.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Sorry about the confusion!
                      >
                      > Cheers,
                      >
                      > Tim G
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > (PS) Am I right in assuming that, in descending
                      > order, the value to the
                      > TRA of online purchases would be:
                      > * Purchasing via the link to Amazon on the link
                      > above.
                      >
                      > * Purchasing directly from the TRA.
                      >
                      > * Sending in my check directly to you all as a
                      > contribution to
                      > ongoing projects?
                      >
                      > (PPS) For those who haven't joined already on the
                      > list. please forgive a
                      > shameless plug for an organization which, in
                      > addition to being such a
                      > valued resource on our favorite past politician,
                      > does really good work
                      > with schoolchildren, hospitals, historical
                      > preservation, and honoring
                      > policemen across the country.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > -----Original Message-----
                      > From: John A. Gable [mailto:TRA_Gable@...]
                      > Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 3:06 PM
                      > To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com;
                      > johnstoe@...
                      > Cc: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                      > Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to
                      > foreign dignitaries?
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > About putting TR's books on line, we do not have the
                      > funds to do that at
                      > present.
                      >
                      > John Gable
                      >
                      > TRA
                      >
                      > ----- Original Message -----
                      >
                      > From: Tim Glas <mailto:Tim.Glas@...>
                      >
                      > To: johnstoe@...
                      >
                      > Cc: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                      >
                      > Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 10:45 PM
                      >
                      > Subject: RE: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to
                      > foreign dignitaries?
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Excellent posting, and greatly amusing.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Actually, in reading Theodore Roosevelt Jr. (by H.
                      > Paul Jeffers --
                      >
                      http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0891417397/104-9339910-538
                      > 3103) a quoted letter by TR (to his eldest son)
                      > makes reference to the
                      > hunt, indicating delight at seeing the dogs pursue
                      > the cat up a tree,
                      > and mentioning the cougar he killed by knife. He
                      > writes "Soon we saw
                      > the lion in a treetop, with two of his dogs so high
                      > up among the
                      > branches that he was striking at them. He was more
                      > afraid of us than
                      > the dogs, and as soon as he saw us he took a great
                      > flying leap and was
                      > off, the pack close behind. In a few hundred yards
                      > they had him up
                      > another tree. They could have killed him by
                      > themselves. But he bit and
                      > clawed four of them, and for fear that he might kill
                      > one I ran in and
                      > stabbed him behind the shoulder, thrusting the knife
                      > right into his
                      > heart. I have always wished to kill a cougar as I
                      > did this one, with
                      > dogs and the knife."
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > The book (which incidentally, is a terrific read)
                      > then states that "The
                      > tale was even more thrilling for [Theodore
                      > Roosevelt, Jr.] because the
                      > knife his father used was one that Ted had given
                      > him." p 36.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > I wonder why it's not available at
                      >
                      http://www.theodoreroosevelt.org/association/products.htm.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Cheers,
                      >
                      > Tim G
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > -----Original Message-----
                      > From: Jeremy Johnston
                      > [mailto:johnstoe@...]
                      > Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 1:11 PM
                      > To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                      > Subject: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign
                      > dignitaries?
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Dear TR Discussion Group Members,
                      >
                      > I finally made it back home and found my material on
                      > "Skip," Goff, and
                      > TR. For those readers who are sensitive to hunting
                      > stories, may I
                      > suggest you stop reading this email at this point.
                      > I have also
                      > attached a biography of John B. Goff. I wrote this
                      > a number of years
                      > ago in grad school and it is a little rough,
                      > especially the endnotes.
                      >
                      > TR and John Goff hunted together in northwestern
                      > Colorado in 1901 and
                      > 1905. TR and Goff hunted cougars in 1901 and then
                      > bear in 1905. In
                      > both hunts, Goff's dogs were used to track and tree
                      > the hunters' prey.
                      > In an Outdoor Life article, John Goff described his
                      > pack as follows:
                      > I am often asked "What kind of dogs are best
                      > adapted to bear and
                      > lion hunting?" My answer has been that common curs
                      > have often done me
                      > more service than the finely-bred dogs of any
                      > breed. I have in my
                      > pack - and name them here in the order of their
                      > efficiency - foxhounds,
                      > bloodhounds, crosses between these two,
                      > bull-terriers, fox-terriers,
                      > fox-terrier crosses with other terriers, and canines
                      > that can only be
                      > called just "dog."
                      > While the greatest essential of a bear dog
                      > is the sense of
                      > scent, yet there are other qualifications that crowd
                      > this one awfully
                      > close, such, for instance, as that of worrying a
                      > bear and causing him to
                      > lose time by fighting off the dogs, which, in
                      > grizzly hunting
                      > especially, is a valuable aid. Then the hunter can
                      > come up and get a
                      > shot, or if a black bear, this worrying process will
                      > soon cause him to
                      > tree, when of course the chase is ended.
                      > With the fighting and worrying of the bear
                      > by the dogs is
                      > combined the essential of being able to run in and
                      > nip and then get away
                      > before the powerful paw of the bear can land. This
                      > habit is only
                      > acquired by actual bear-hunting, and is one of the
                      > dearest lessons the
                      > bear dog learns, for nearly all my dogs have at one
                      > time or another - in
                      > some cases many more times than one - received
                      > chastisement from bears
                      > which impresses vividly on their minds that they
                      > must hurry after biting
                      > the bear if they would continue to grace this
                      > terrestrial sphere with
                      > their presence.
                      > A bulldog or bull-terrier is one of the
                      > hardest dogs to teach
                      > this lesson of self-protection. Owing to their
                      > disposition it is hard
                      > for them to let go in time to save themselves, while
                      > they will rush in
                      > (at first) on a bear or lion, absolutely unmindful
                      > of the consequences.
                      > The first lesson is invariably taught by the
                      > despised little
                      > porcupine, but even this does not remind them that
                      > they must be careful
                      > of bears. After one or two clouts from the big
                      > paws, however, they
                      > realize that care must be taken - that is, if they
                      > survive the blows.
                      > (Outdoor Life, volume vol. xvi, number 3, September,
                      > 1905)
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > During the 1905 bear hunt, TR met "Skip." TR wrote
                      > in Outdoor Pastimes
                      > of an American Hunter:
                      >
                      > There was a funny little black and tan[terrier],
                      > named Skip, a most
                      > friendly little fellow, especially found of riding
                      > in front or behind
                      > the saddle of any one of us who would take him up,
                      > although perfectly
                      > able to travel forty miles a day on his own sturdy
                      > legs if he had to,
                      > and then to join in the worry of the quarry when
                      > once it had been
                      > shot.Skip adopted me as his special master, rode
                      > with me whenever I
                      > would let him, and slept on the foot of my bed at
                      > night, growling
                      > defiance at anything that came near. I grew
                      > attached to the friendly,
                      > bright little fellow, and at the end of the hunt
                      > took him home with me
                      > as a playmate for the children. (OPAH, pg. 71-72)
                      >
                      > Of course Skip would have gone through the training
                      > process described by
                      > Goff. Perhaps being a little smarter than the other
                      > terriers, he
                      > decided his place in the hunt was on the back of a
                      > saddle instead of in
                      > the middle of the pack. Still Skip was willing to
                      > participate in any
                      > fight with bobcats and bears. TR recalled two
                      > incidents when Skip and
                      > Shorty, another of Goff's dogs, treed bobcats. In
                      > one incident, Skip
                      > climbed 30feet into a tree in hopes of tangling with
                      > a bobcat. TR also
                      > wrote in Outdoor Pastimes that Skip was the first
                      > one to attack a bear
                      > after it had been shot from its perch in a tree.
                      >
                      > The story of Skip in the Roosevelt family is well
                      > documented in the
                      > book, A Bully Father: Theodore Roosevelt's Letters
                      > to His Children. In
                      > this collection of letters to his children, TR tells
                      > the story of Skip's
                      > life in the White House and Sagamore Hill. It is a
                      > very moving
                      > collection, detailing the housebreaking of a western
                      > hunting dog into
                      > the presidential home, Skip's adventures with
                      > Archie, and the sorrows of
                      > Skip running away and then the joy of his return.
                      > It also includes a
                      > poignant letter from TR to Archie expressing delight
                      > in the memories of
                      > Skip after his untimely death.
                      >
                      > TR reported to Goff the following news in a letter
                      > dated January 25,
                      > 1908, "I am very sorry to say that both Shorty and
                      > Skip got killed by
                      > automobiles last summer. Skip's death nearly broke
                      > Archie's heart."
                      >
                      > I always found the story of Skip to be an amazing
                      > animal tale (no pun
                      > intended). It is fascinating to ponder all the
                      > experiences this little
                      > terrier went through, from the mountains of
                      > Colorado, to the corridors
                      > of the White House, and to the fields of Sagamore
                      > Hill. I would also
                      > have to agree with what many of you have expressed,
                      > one of my favorite
                      > photos is the one of TR sitting in the doorway of a
                      > cabin, reading a
                      > book, with Skip on his lap.
                      >
                      > Sincerely,
                      > Jeremy Johnston
                      >
                      >
                      > -----Original Message-----
                      > From: TBaker [mailto:tbaker@...]
                      > Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 10:20 PM
                      > To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                      > Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to
                      > foreign dignitaries?
                      >
                      >
                      > Jeremy - so excited to hear this!!
                      >
                      > I would love info on the breeding and use of your
                      > great-great-grandpa's
                      > dogs, and interested in any pictures you have.
                      >
                      > Waiting here with baited breath...counting the
                      > minutes....hehehe..
                      >
                      > THANKS,
                      > T.
                      >
                      >
                      > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
                      > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
                      > tr-m-unsubscribe@...
                      >
                      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
                      > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of
                      > Service.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
                      > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
                      > tr-m-unsubscribe@...
                      >
                      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
                      > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of
                      > Service.
                      >
                      > ---
                      > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
                      > Checked by AVG anti-virus system
                      > (http://www.grisoft.com).
                      > Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release
                      > Date: 1/27/2003
                      >
                      >
                      > To Post a message, send it to: tr-m@...
                      > To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to:
                      > tr-m-unsubscribe@...
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                      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
                      > <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> Terms of
                      > Service.
                      >
                      >
                      > ---
                      > Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
                      > Checked by AVG anti-virus system
                      > (http://www.grisoft.com).
                      > Version: 6.0.449 / Virus Database: 251 - Release
                      > Date: 1/27/2003
                      >
                      >
                      >


                      =====
                      EDWARD J. RENEHAN JR.
                      erenehan@...
                      http://renehan.net

                      __________________________________________________
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                    • TRA
                      MessageActually the TRA gets more if you buy directly from us, rather than at Amazon.com... What Tim was mentioning about the Association - we have a
                      Message 10 of 17 , Feb 10, 2003
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Message
                        Actually the TRA gets more if you buy directly from us, rather than at Amazon.com...
                         
                        What Tim was mentioning about the Association - we have a country-wide program of police awards that honor officers who have suffered a disability and continue to render outstanding service; we have student contests and awards, one dating back to 1925; we give out teddy bears to hospitalized children at Christmas in New York City and Nashville; we are the official support organization of the aircraft carrier USS Theodore Roosevelt (CVN-71); etc.
                         
                        Best wishes from Oyster Bay,
                         
                        Linda E. Milano
                        Assistant Director                        (516) 921-6319
                        Theodore Roosevelt Association       Fax:  (516) 921-6481
                        P.O. Box 719                              E-Mail:  TRA_Milano@...
                        Oyster Bay, NY 11771-0719              web:  www.theodoreroosevelt.org
                         
                         
                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: Tim Glas
                        Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 10:46 PM
                        Subject: RE: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

                        No, Dr. G… I meant a link to the Theodore Roosevelt Junior book being made available for sale on the TRA website, or thorugh the TRA link to amazon.com, so that my purchase helps out the TRA.  That way… we could help give the funds to allow for the other bit. ;)

                        But I’d rather buy a copy and cut the association in on the sale.  I was very chagrinned to buy a copy of “For Lust of Knowing” at the
                        International Spy Museum here in Washington DC recently only to find it available online.

                         

                        Hmm… I just checked out the web site and found (a bit buried) something interesting… not only is Theodore Roosevelt Jr. Listed on the amazon.com link page (http://users.ids.net/%7Eejren/trbk.htm) but it seems that any purchase, if sent through a link on that page, may help out the TRA.   With the amount of items I buy via Amazon… I’m going to use this link more often.

                         

                        Sorry about the confusion!

                        Cheers,

                        Tim G

                         

                        (PS) Am I right in assuming that, in descending order, the value to the TRA of online purchases would be:
                           * Purchasing via the link to Amazon on the link above.

                        * Purchasing directly from the TRA.

                           * Sending in my check directly to you all as a contribution to ongoing projects?

                        (PPS) For those who haven’t joined already on the list… please forgive a shameless plug for an organization which, in addition to being such a valued resource on our favorite past politician, does really good work with schoolchildren, hospitals, historical preservation, and honoring policemen across the country.

                         

                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: John A. Gable [mailto:TRA_Gable@...]
                        Sent:
                        Sunday, February 09, 2003 3:06 PM
                        To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com; johnstoe@...
                        Cc: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

                         

                        About putting TR's books on line, we do not have the funds to do that at present. 

                                            John Gable

                        TRA

                        ----- Original Message -----

                        From: Tim Glas

                        Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 10:45 PM

                        Subject: RE: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

                         

                         

                        Excellent posting, and greatly amusing.

                         

                        Actually, in reading Theodore Roosevelt Jr. (by H. Paul Jeffers -- http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0891417397/104-9339910-5383103) a quoted letter by TR (to his eldest son) makes reference to the hunt, indicating delight at seeing the dogs pursue the cat up a tree, and mentioning the cougar he killed by knife.  He writes “Soon we saw the lion in a treetop, with two of his dogs so high up among the branches that he was striking at them.  He was more afraid of us than the dogs, and as soon as he saw us he took a great flying leap and was off, the pack close behind.  In a few hundred yards they had him up another tree.  They could have killed him by themselves.  But he bit and clawed four of them, and for fear that he might kill one I ran in and stabbed him behind the shoulder, thrusting the knife right into his heart.  I have always wished to kill a cougar as I did this one, with dogs and the knife.”

                         

                        The book (which incidentally, is a terrific read) then states that “The tale was even more thrilling for [Theodore Roosevelt, Jr.] because the knife his father used was one that Ted had given him.” p 36.

                         

                        I wonder why it’s not available at http://www.theodoreroosevelt.org/association/products.htm.

                         

                        Cheers,

                        Tim G

                         

                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: Jeremy Johnston [mailto:johnstoe@...]
                        Sent: Tuesday, February 04, 2003 1:11 PM
                        To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?

                         

                        Dear TR Discussion Group Members,

                        I finally made it back home and found my material on “Skip,” Goff, and TR.  For those readers who are sensitive to hunting stories, may I suggest you stop reading this email at this point.   I have also attached a biography of John B. Goff.  I wrote this a number of years ago in grad school and it is a little rough, especially the endnotes. 

                        TR and John Goff hunted together in northwestern Colorado in 1901 and 1905.  TR and Goff hunted cougars in 1901 and then bear in 1905.  In both hunts, Goff’s dogs were used to track and tree the hunters’ prey.  In an Outdoor Life article, John Goff described his pack as follows:
                                I am often asked “What kind of dogs are best adapted to bear and lion hunting?” My answer has been that common curs have often done me more service than the finely-bred     dogs of any breed.  I have in my pack – and name them here in the order of their efficiency – foxhounds, bloodhounds, crosses between these two, bull-terriers, fox-terriers, fox-terrier crosses with other terriers, and canines that can only be called just “dog.” 
                                While the greatest essential of a bear dog is the sense of scent, yet there are other qualifications that crowd this one awfully close, such, for instance, as that of worrying a bear and causing him to lose time by fighting off the dogs, which, in grizzly hunting especially, is a valuable aid.  Then the hunter can come up and get a shot, or if a black bear, this worrying process will soon cause him to tree, when of course the chase is ended.
                                With the fighting and worrying of the bear by the dogs is combined the essential of being able to run in and nip and then get away before the powerful paw of the bear can land.  This habit is only acquired by actual bear-hunting, and is one of the dearest lessons the bear dog learns, for nearly all my dogs have at one time or another – in some cases many more times than one – received chastisement from bears which impresses vividly on their minds that they must hurry after biting the bear if they would continue to grace this terrestrial sphere with their presence.
                                A bulldog or bull-terrier is one of the hardest dogs to teach this lesson of self-protection.  Owing to their disposition it is hard for them to let go in time to save themselves, while they will rush in (at first) on a bear or lion, absolutely unmindful of the consequences.
                                The first lesson is invariably taught by the despised little porcupine, but even this does not remind them that they must be careful of bears.  After one or two clouts from the big paws, however, they realize that care must be taken – that is, if they survive the blows.
                        (Outdoor Life, volume vol. xvi, number 3, September, 1905)



                        During the 1905 bear hunt, TR met “Skip.”  TR wrote in Outdoor Pastimes of an American Hunter:

                         There was a funny little black and tan[terrier], named Skip, a most friendly little fellow, especially found of riding in front or behind the saddle of any one of us who would take him up, although perfectly able to travel forty miles a day on his own sturdy legs if he had to, and then to join in the worry of the quarry when once it had been shot…Skip adopted me as his special master, rode with me whenever I would let him, and slept on the foot of my bed at night, growling defiance at anything that came near.  I grew attached to the friendly, bright little fellow, and at the end of the hunt took him home with me as a playmate for the children. (OPAH, pg. 71-72)

                        Of course Skip would have gone through the training process described by Goff.  Perhaps being a little smarter than the other terriers, he decided his place in the hunt was on the back of a saddle instead of in the middle of the pack.  Still Skip was willing to participate in any fight with bobcats and bears.  TR recalled two incidents when Skip and Shorty, another of Goff’s dogs, treed bobcats.  In one incident, Skip climbed 30feet into a tree in hopes of tangling with a bobcat.  TR also wrote in Outdoor Pastimes that Skip was the first one to attack a bear after it had been shot from its perch in a tree. 
                         
                        The story of Skip in the Roosevelt family is well documented in the book, A Bully Father:  Theodore Roosevelt’s Letters to His Children.  In this collection of letters to his children, TR tells the story of Skip’s life in the White House and Sagamore Hill.  It is a very moving collection, detailing the housebreaking of a western hunting dog into the presidential home, Skip’s adventures with Archie, and the sorrows of Skip running away and then the joy of his return.  It also includes a poignant letter from TR to Archie expressing delight in the memories of Skip after his untimely death. 

                        TR reported to Goff the following news in a letter dated   January 25, 1908, “I am very sorry to say that both Shorty and Skip got killed by automobiles last summer.  Skip’s death nearly broke Archie’s heart.”

                        I always found the story of Skip to be an amazing animal tale (no pun intended).  It is fascinating to ponder all the experiences this little terrier went through, from the mountains of Colorado, to the corridors of the White House, and to the fields of Sagamore Hill.  I would also have to agree with what many of you have expressed, one of my favorite photos is the one of TR sitting in the doorway of a cabin, reading a book, with Skip on his lap.

                        Sincerely,
                        Jeremy Johnston


                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: TBaker [mailto:tbaker@...]
                        Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 10:20 PM
                        To: tr-m@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [tr-m] Did TR give dogs as gifts to foreign dignitaries?


                        Jeremy - so excited to hear this!!

                        I would love info on the breeding and use of your great-great-grandpa's dogs, and interested in any pictures you have.

                        Waiting here with baited breath...counting the minutes....hehehe..

                        THANKS,
                        T.


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