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Re: [toyota-prius] Re: "Official" word on dead battaries

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  • Peter Blackford
    I d lean toward a simpler theory - that some of the batteries have been injured by sitting too long on the lot and/or in transit, before the careful owner has
    Message 1 of 24 , Apr 1, 2002
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      I'd lean toward a simpler theory - that some of the batteries have been injured
      by sitting too long on the lot and/or in transit, before the careful owner has
      any ability to control the situation. Heck, it happens to regular batteries on
      dealer lots, at times, so why not the occasional Prius battery too?

      Pete

      jsinton1 wrote:
      >
      > Coleman <jandmcoleman@e...> wrote:
      >
      > > I am paranoid about the headlight
      > > switch being off, and they changed
      > > the battery once already. So I
      > > think its simply a design defect,
      > > as someone else concluded.
      >
      > Yes indeed. The root cause of the 12 volt battery problem seems to
      > be the high key-off current drain. This is made more apparent by the
      > relatively small size of the battery.
      >
      > On top of which there appear to have been a small number of 12 volt
      > batteries that were defective from new. I have not been able to find
      > out what was wrong with them (I would love get my hands on one and
      > analyse it, but for some reason Toyota always gets to them first :-)
      >
      > Another line of reasoning I am considering is that if a Prius is not
      > used all that often the 12 volt battery will deteriorate. I cannot
      > prove anything yet, but it might be that if a Prius is used for less
      > than about one hour per week the 12 volt battery will spend a large
      > part of its life below full charge. This could cause it to sulphate
      > and lose capacity. Then you would be on a downward spiral with the
      > battery eventually losing so much capacity that it would go flat
      > within days rather than weeks. For now this is just a suggested
      > theory, but if it's true it would explain some of the 12 volt battery
      > experiences that have reported to this list. Would anyone else
      > familiar with lead acid batteries care to comment?
      >
      > Regards,
      > Julian.
      >
      > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
      > toyota-prius-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
      >
      >
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
    • ssavage1946
      More confusion!!! When I picked up my Prius the service writer told me the battery would die after 3 days of non-use. So far, from this group, it seems that
      Message 2 of 24 , Apr 1, 2002
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        More confusion!!! When I picked up my Prius the service writer told
        me the battery would die after 3 days of non-use. So far, from this
        group, it seems that 2weeks is the approx no-use life of the charge.
        What IS to be expected? Should I find out how to disconnect the
        battery if I know the car will be parked for a few days?


        --- In toyota-prius@y..., Peter Blackford <PriusPete@e...> wrote:
        > I'd lean toward a simpler theory - that some of the batteries have
        been injured
        > by sitting too long on the lot and/or in transit, before the
        careful owner has
        > any ability to control the situation. Heck, it happens to regular
        batteries on
        > dealer lots, at times, so why not the occasional Prius battery too?
        >
        > Pete
        >
        > jsinton1 wrote:
        > >
        > > Coleman <jandmcoleman@e...> wrote:
        > >
        > > > I am paranoid about the headlight
        > > > switch being off, and they changed
        > > > the battery once already. So I
        > > > think its simply a design defect,
        > > > as someone else concluded.
        > >
        > > Yes indeed. The root cause of the 12 volt battery problem seems
        to
        > > be the high key-off current drain. This is made more apparent by
        the
        > > relatively small size of the battery.
        > >
        > > On top of which there appear to have been a small number of 12
        volt
        > > batteries that were defective from new. I have not been able to
        find
        > > out what was wrong with them (I would love get my hands on one and
        > > analyse it, but for some reason Toyota always gets to them
        first :-)
        > >
        > > Another line of reasoning I am considering is that if a Prius is
        not
        > > used all that often the 12 volt battery will deteriorate. I
        cannot
        > > prove anything yet, but it might be that if a Prius is used for
        less
        > > than about one hour per week the 12 volt battery will spend a
        large
        > > part of its life below full charge. This could cause it to
        sulphate
        > > and lose capacity. Then you would be on a downward spiral with
        the
        > > battery eventually losing so much capacity that it would go flat
        > > within days rather than weeks. For now this is just a suggested
        > > theory, but if it's true it would explain some of the 12 volt
        battery
        > > experiences that have reported to this list. Would anyone else
        > > familiar with lead acid batteries care to comment?
        > >
        > > Regards,
        > > Julian.
        > >
        > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > > toyota-prius-unsubscribe@y...
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
        http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      • Muggler
        Greetings everyone, I purchased up my silver Prius about two weeks ago (350 miles already on it), and LOVE it. Had a great experience with the dealer (Toyota
        Message 3 of 24 , Apr 1, 2002
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          Greetings everyone,

          I purchased up my silver Prius about two weeks ago (350 miles already
          on it), and LOVE it. Had a great experience with the dealer (Toyota
          of Longwood, FL). Walked in, test drove a green Prius, told them I
          wanted a silver one with side airbags, daytime running lights, 6 disc
          changer -- basically everything but the Nav system, and one week
          later they called me up and told me it was ready for pick up!

          All of my friends who ride in it tell me that their next car will be
          a hybrid. I've only seen one other Prius cruising around in Orlando,
          but I imagine there are a few of us out there.

          I need to think of a good name for my car...

          Thanks for all the great info and stories - I hope to learn much more
          about my car on this list!

          -Mike
        • jsinton1
          ... According to the tests I carried out on my Prius, you should be OK for at least three weeks of non-use, assuming the battery is well charged to begin with.
          Message 4 of 24 , Apr 1, 2002
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            "ssavage1946" <s.savage@m...> wrote:

            > More confusion!!! When I picked up my
            > Prius the service writer told me the
            > battery would die after 3 days of non-use.
            > So far, from this group, it seems that
            > 2 weeks is the approx no-use life of the
            > charge. What IS to be expected?

            According to the tests I carried out on my Prius, you should be OK
            for at least three weeks of non-use, assuming the battery is well
            charged to begin with. But you'll need to use your judgement a bit.
            If you haven't used your Prius all that much just before you park,
            the battery might be below full charge and hence will go flat sooner.

            Take a look at this post on the technical group for the details of
            the test I did:

            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Prius_Technical_Stuff/message/1642

            Note that we're talking about the 12 volt battery here. The traction
            battery will keep its charge for much longer - I would expect
            approximately six months.

            > Should I find out how to disconnect the battery if I know
            > the car will be parked for a few days?

            You shouldn't need to disconnect if you're only parked for a few
            days. Mine starts without problem after the above mentioned three
            weeks. But it's useful to know how to get at the battery anyway.
            See post 25035 on this group for the details of how to disconnect it.

            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/toyota-prius/message/25035

            Regards,
            Julian.
          • prawlin10
            This statement (below)from your dealer is complete and utter tosh. The Prius inverter can deliver very many amps at a well regulated 14 Volts. If it didn t,
            Message 5 of 24 , Apr 6, 2002
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              This statement (below)from your dealer is complete and utter tosh.
              The Prius inverter can deliver very many amps at a well regulated 14
              Volts. If it didn't, then how could the rear demister, power
              steering, electric water pump, electric brake pump, fuel pump,
              headlights, heater fan, battery fan, radiator fan, etc. etc. etc.
              keep on working? All these take significant power from the 12 Volt
              battery.

              The battery itself, will draw as much current as it needs to be fully
              re-charged whenever the ready light is on (constant voltage charging
              principle), unless of course it is defective. If your battery is
              going flat so soon then it needs replacing.

              There have been a number of defective 12V batteries found in Prius. I
              think this is due to bad (discharged) storage in the compound or in
              transit. Any lead acid battery will be damaged if left in a
              discharged state for even a short time. Sure it may recharge and seem
              OK but the storage efficiency will be severely impaired. Get it
              replaced with a new one and I believe all will be well. You should
              easily be able to park for 2 weeks or more and it should start up no
              probs.

              regards

              Peter



              > "Note: The vehicle's battery charging rate is only approx 1 amp (as
              > per design), and is insufficient to fully charge a depleted
              battery.
              > If there is to be an extended period of vehicle non-use, the aux
              > batter must be disconnected to help prevent future re-occurances of
              > this complaint".
            • Peter Blackford
              ... At the risk of sounding like a smart ass (why stop now?), it s because, uh, they don t! In fact, other than booting the computer, the 12V does very little.
              Message 6 of 24 , Apr 6, 2002
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                prawlin10 wrote:
                >
                > This statement (below)from your dealer is complete and utter tosh.
                > The Prius inverter can deliver very many amps at a well regulated 14
                > Volts. If it didn't, then how could the rear demister, power
                > steering, electric water pump, electric brake pump, fuel pump,
                > headlights, heater fan, battery fan, radiator fan, etc. etc. etc.
                > keep on working? All these take significant power from the 12 Volt
                > battery.

                At the risk of sounding like a smart ass (why stop now?), it's because, uh, they
                don't!

                In fact, other than booting the computer, the 12V does very little. All the
                significant 12V operating loads are borne by the DC-DC converter portion of the
                THS, which is supplied by the HV battery pack.

                True, if you do something silly like turn ON the headlights AFTER you've turned
                OFF the car, or sit listening to the radio, you can kill it. Otherwise there
                should be no heavy draws at all which come directly from the 12V battery.

                cheers,

                Pete
              • prawlin10
                ... because, uh, they ... little. All the ... portion of the ... Hi there Pete. I actually agree with you exactly, that was the point I was trying to make.
                Message 7 of 24 , Apr 6, 2002
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                  > At the risk of sounding like a smart ass (why stop now?), it's
                  because, uh, they
                  > don't!
                  >
                  > In fact, other than booting the computer, the 12V does very
                  little. All the
                  > significant 12V operating loads are borne by the DC-DC converter
                  portion of the
                  > THS, which is supplied by the HV battery pack.
                  >

                  Hi there Pete.

                  I actually agree with you exactly, that was the point I was trying to
                  make. Perhaps I should have said all these items run from the "12Volt
                  supply rail" instead of "12Volt battery". I am saying that if there
                  was only 1 Amp available for charging the battery (as the dealer had
                  declared) then it could not work due as it would not keep up to all
                  the various loads on the 12 Volt rail.

                  One thing which is a little interesting though is that brake pump. If
                  the Prius has been parked a while (hours not days!), the brake
                  pressure is lost. It takes a significant current draw from the 12V
                  battery the instant you turn the key to the on position as the brake
                  pump runs. If someone is unlucky enough to have a weak or defective
                  but not totally flat 12V battery then the voltage could well drop
                  enough to prevent THS from booting up whilst the brake pump is
                  operating. For anyone in this situation, it may well be prudent to
                  turn the key to the on position (but not to start)and then wait until
                  the brake pump has completed pressurising the reservoir and stops
                  with the familiar clunk (around 10 seconds, maybe more with the low
                  battery) Then try turning the key to the start position. The voltage
                  may just recover enough after the brake pump turns off to enable
                  startup. Once the ready light is achieved, all should be OK as the
                  DC/DC kicks in. Of course whilst trying to start it, everything else
                  should also be turned off and the steering wheel should not be turned
                  at all as this also drains the battery quite heavily.

                  Cheers

                  Peter
                • prawlin10
                  ... because, uh, they ... little. All the ... portion of the ... Hi there Pete. I actually agree with you exactly, that was the point I was trying to make.
                  Message 8 of 24 , Apr 6, 2002
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                    > At the risk of sounding like a smart ass (why stop now?), it's
                    because, uh, they
                    > don't!
                    >
                    > In fact, other than booting the computer, the 12V does very
                    little. All the
                    > significant 12V operating loads are borne by the DC-DC converter
                    portion of the
                    > THS, which is supplied by the HV battery pack.
                    >

                    Hi there Pete.

                    I actually agree with you exactly, that was the point I was trying to
                    make. Perhaps I should have said all these items run from the "12Volt
                    supply rail" instead of "12Volt battery". I am saying that if there
                    was only 1 Amp available for charging the battery (as the dealer had
                    declared) then it could not work due as it would not keep up to all
                    the various loads on the 12 Volt rail.

                    One thing which is a little interesting though is that brake pump. If
                    the Prius has been parked a while (hours not days!), the brake
                    pressure is lost. It takes a significant current draw from the 12V
                    battery the instant you turn the key to the on position as the brake
                    pump runs. If someone is unlucky enough to have a weak or defective
                    but not totally flat 12V battery then the voltage could well drop
                    enough to prevent THS from booting up whilst the brake pump is
                    operating. For anyone in this situation, it may well be prudent to
                    turn the key to the on position (but not to start)and then wait until
                    the brake pump has completed pressurising the reservoir and stops
                    with the familiar clunk (around 10 seconds, maybe more with the low
                    battery) Then try turning the key to the start position. The voltage
                    may just recover enough after the brake pump turns off to enable
                    startup. Once the ready light is achieved, all should be OK as the
                    DC/DC kicks in. Of course whilst trying to start it, everything else
                    should also be turned off and the steering wheel should not be turned
                    at all as this also drains the battery quite heavily.

                    Cheers

                    Peter
                  • prawlin10
                    It is a little ironic that this small car has on board the biggest overall battery capacity of any ICE car yet some are plagued with flat batteries! It must
                    Message 9 of 24 , Apr 6, 2002
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                      It is a little ironic that this small car has on board the biggest
                      overall battery capacity of any ICE car yet some are plagued with
                      flat batteries!

                      It must also be frustrating when your 12V batt is flat (perhaps after
                      accidentally leaving something on or whatever), yet knowing that you
                      have killowatts of power on board, but stored in the wrong dang
                      battery!

                      What the car really needs, is an emergency 12V boost mode. A little
                      button somewhere which switches on the DC/DC converter say just for
                      30 seconds. Voilla, if you get a dead 12V battery, all you then do is
                      hit the emergency boost button then start as usual. This would I
                      believe have been pretty easy to incorporate at the design stage. It
                      would be a godsend when you get that dead feeling upon turning the
                      key!

                      One snag would be how to energise the circuit breaker contained in
                      the HV battery pack, as this is also powered from 12V and the above
                      boost button could not work unless the circuit breaker were bypassed
                      manually somehow. Ahmmm......


                      Peter Rawlinson
                    • lfmerrell@cs.com
                      Sounds like an opportunity for Coastal Tech. Come up with an in the trunk quick disconnect plug (AKA external auxiliary power unit connect on aircraft) to hook
                      Message 10 of 24 , Apr 6, 2002
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                        Sounds like an opportunity for Coastal Tech. Come up with an in the trunk
                        quick disconnect plug (AKA external auxiliary power unit connect on aircraft)
                        to hook up a booster source such as the sealed portable 12 volt 700 amp
                        battery packs. The plug or connect would be accessed without unbuttoning the
                        battery. They come with a cigarette lighter and red-black booster cables.
                        Recharges via the cigarette lighter port. These batteries are infinitely
                        useful. I use them with a 12 volt DC to 110 AC 350 watt inverter all the
                        time. This is the way for very extended video cam use especially those with
                        the large LCD viewers also as a second 12 volt powers supply to runs nicely
                        this way also. It is a way to eliminate the need for expensive dedicated
                        Video Cam and laptop voltage adapters. With this setup one uses the already
                        supplied home wall socket plug in transformers. These battery units are about
                        55-60 bucks at many places. Besides you can also jump start your car with
                        them. I try not to leave home without one.
                        L. F. Merrell, Plano TX



                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • sejhre
                        As regards the quick disconnect plug notion, go see the thread starting at #2305 in Technical (and be sure to read the posts that follow it). A rather nifty
                        Message 11 of 24 , Apr 7, 2002
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                          As regards the "quick disconnect plug" notion, go see the thread
                          starting at #2305 in Technical (and be sure to read the posts
                          that follow it). A rather nifty assembly intended as a jumper-
                          cable is skulled out/designed that would neatly fit the
                          use you posit (and might well be the sort of unit CoastalETech
                          could blodge up at a reasonable price ... provided they give
                          appropriate royalties to Ed <G>).

                          j.


                          --- In toyota-prius@y..., lfmerrell@c... wrote:
                          > Sounds like an opportunity for Coastal Tech. Come up with an
                          > in the trunk quick disconnect plug (AKA external auxiliary power
                          > unit connect on aircraft) to hook up a booster source such as
                          > the sealed portable 12 volt 700 amp battery packs. The plug or
                          > connect would be accessed without unbuttoning the battery. They
                          > come with a cigarette lighter and red-black booster cables.
                          > Recharges via the cigarette lighter port. These batteries are
                          > infinitely useful. I use them with a 12 volt DC to 110 AC 350
                          > watt inverter all the time. This is the way for very extended
                          > video cam use especially those with the large LCD viewers also
                          > as a second 12 volt powers supply to runs nicely this way also.
                          > It is a way to eliminate the need for expensive dedicated
                          > Video Cam and laptop voltage adapters. With this setup one uses
                          > the already supplied home wall socket plug in transformers.
                          > These battery units are about 55-60 bucks at many places. Besides
                          > you can also jump start your car with them. I try not to leave
                          > home without one.
                          > L. F. Merrell, Plano TX
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • etdavis
                          ... Royalties ... It s too late. I already freely offered the idea to Coastal. They came up with a better idea. Just modify the cigarette, um, power outlet
                          Message 12 of 24 , Apr 7, 2002
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                            --- In toyota-prius@y..., "sejhre" <sejhre@i...> wrote:
                            > As regards the "quick disconnect plug" notion, go see the thread
                            > starting at #2305 in Technical (and be sure to read the posts
                            > that follow it). A rather nifty assembly intended as a jumper-
                            > cable is skulled out/designed that would neatly fit the
                            > use you posit (and might well be the sort of unit CoastalETech
                            > could blodge up at a reasonable price ... provided they give
                            > appropriate royalties to Ed <G>).
                            >

                            Royalties ... It's too late. I already freely offered the idea to
                            Coastal. They came up with a better idea. Just modify the
                            cigarette, um, power outlet so that it is live all the time. Coastal
                            sells a simple kit to do this. I bought the kit and it took me all
                            of two minutes to change my power outlet to full time operation.
                            http://www.coastaletech.com/powermod.htm

                            Once the modification is complete there are a wide variety of power
                            outlet accessories available for your Prius.

                            Cigarette lighter jump start kit
                            http://www.safetycentral.com/autjumstarpo.html

                            Car battery charger/maintainer
                            http://www.thetoolwarehouse.net/shop/product1158.html

                            1.5 Watt Solar power 12V battery maintainer
                            http://www.solarelectric.com/products/level3_27.htm

                            I do not endorse any of the above products. These are just a few of
                            the many products available for the person that likes gadgets. :-)

                            Ed
                          • Jim Marconnet
                            ... of power outlet accessories available for your Prius. ... I happened to see an even less expensive one tonight at Wal*Mart. They are discontinuing their
                            Message 13 of 24 , Apr 7, 2002
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                              > Once the modification is complete there are a wide variety
                              of power outlet accessories available for your Prius.

                              > Cigarette lighter jump start kit
                              > http://www.safetycentral.com/autjumstarpo.html

                              I happened to see an even less expensive one tonight at
                              Wal*Mart. They are discontinuing their Plug n' Jump Cable by
                              PowerPro, PIC1612, with AWG 16/12' Power Cable, short
                              circuit protection (10 amp fuses), over-charge protection,
                              and LED indicators, formerly $9.92, but I paid $4.50. I
                              found them in the "Clearance" area near automotive. If
                              interested, check quickly, since such a deal may not last
                              long. And once Wal*Mart clearances something, I would not
                              expect them to carry them ever again.

                              About this modification, I bought the always-on kit, but not
                              sure if I really want to install it or not. Instead, I
                              bought a spring-loaded lid weatherproof "cigarette" lighter
                              receptacle which I plan to wire directly to the "little"
                              battery in the trunk. I'll mount the receptacle in the trunk
                              in a handy protected location. That way I can run my
                              thermoelectric cooler back there, and/or use the new Plug n'
                              Jump cable if/when necessary without worrying about burning
                              out fuses or wiring in the car.

                              Jim Marconnet
                            • bonehead9999992000
                              According to my local Prius mechanic, you should disconnect the battery if leaving the car for over 2-3 weeks. The reason for the pathetic battery is that it
                              Message 14 of 24 , Apr 15, 2002
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                                According to my local Prius mechanic, you should disconnect the
                                battery if leaving the car for over 2-3 weeks. The reason for
                                the "pathetic" battery is that it is as small as possible to save
                                weight and it is environmentally better to somehow, to fit in with
                                the image of the rest of the car. It's not an unusual task for him,
                                charging dead Priuses, he said..

                                --- In toyota-prius@y..., "jsinton1" <jsinton1@y...> wrote:
                                > "ssavage1946" <s.savage@m...> wrote:
                                >
                                > > More confusion!!! When I picked up my
                                > > Prius the service writer told me the
                                > > battery would die after 3 days of non-use.
                                > > So far, from this group, it seems that
                                > > 2 weeks is the approx no-use life of the
                                > > charge. What IS to be expected?
                                >
                                > According to the tests I carried out on my Prius, you should be OK
                                > for at least three weeks of non-use, assuming the battery is well
                                > charged to begin with. But you'll need to use your judgement a
                                bit.
                                > If you haven't used your Prius all that much just before you park,
                                > the battery might be below full charge and hence will go flat
                                sooner.
                                >
                                > Take a look at this post on the technical group for the details of
                                > the test I did:
                                >
                                > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Prius_Technical_Stuff/message/1642
                                >
                                > Note that we're talking about the 12 volt battery here. The
                                traction
                                > battery will keep its charge for much longer - I would expect
                                > approximately six months.
                                >
                                > > Should I find out how to disconnect the battery if I know
                                > > the car will be parked for a few days?
                                >
                                > You shouldn't need to disconnect if you're only parked for a few
                                > days. Mine starts without problem after the above mentioned three
                                > weeks. But it's useful to know how to get at the battery anyway.
                                > See post 25035 on this group for the details of how to disconnect
                                it.
                                >
                                > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/toyota-prius/message/25035
                                >
                                > Regards,
                                > Julian.
                              • electric_troy
                                ... OK. Let me start by saying this is NOT a bash. I am merely offering a comment/question from an engineer s perspective. I love ALL hybrids. (disclaimer
                                Message 15 of 24 , Apr 15, 2002
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                                  --- In toyota-prius@y..., "bonehead9999992000" <bonehead@y...> wrote:
                                  > According to my local Prius mechanic, you should disconnect the
                                  > battery if leaving the car for over 2-3 weeks. The reason for
                                  > the "pathetic" battery is that it is as small as possible to save
                                  > weight and it is environmentally better to somehow, to fit in with
                                  > the image of the rest of the car. It's not an unusual task for him,
                                  > charging dead Priuses, he said..

                                  OK. Let me start by saying this is NOT a bash. I am merely offering
                                  a comment/question from an engineer's perspective. I love ALL
                                  hybrids. (disclaimer over)


                                  I turned off my Insight in October 2001. I restarted it in April
                                  2002. It sat, unused, for 5 months.

                                  Why? The Insight has a small motorcycle battery similar to the Prius.
                                  Why was it not dead? Why would a Prius in the same situation not
                                  start?

                                  Surely the computers of the Insight and Prius are not that radically
                                  different in current draw?



                                  Maybe the Insight's HV battery is connected to the 12V battery so that
                                  it can't drain to dead? (shrug) I don't know.

                                  Troy
                                • priustek
                                  You can also pull the DOME fuse. This is what Toyota does during transit. You also lose memory functions and the security system is disabled. ... OK ... park,
                                  Message 16 of 24 , Apr 15, 2002
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                                    You can also pull the DOME fuse. This is what Toyota does during
                                    transit. You also lose memory functions and the security system is
                                    disabled.


                                    -- In toyota-prius@y..., "bonehead9999992000" <bonehead@y...> wrote:
                                    > According to my local Prius mechanic, you should disconnect the
                                    > battery if leaving the car for over 2-3 weeks. The reason for
                                    > the "pathetic" battery is that it is as small as possible to save
                                    > weight and it is environmentally better to somehow, to fit in with
                                    > the image of the rest of the car. It's not an unusual task for him,
                                    > charging dead Priuses, he said..
                                    >
                                    > --- In toyota-prius@y..., "jsinton1" <jsinton1@y...> wrote:
                                    > > "ssavage1946" <s.savage@m...> wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > > > More confusion!!! When I picked up my
                                    > > > Prius the service writer told me the
                                    > > > battery would die after 3 days of non-use.
                                    > > > So far, from this group, it seems that
                                    > > > 2 weeks is the approx no-use life of the
                                    > > > charge. What IS to be expected?
                                    > >
                                    > > According to the tests I carried out on my Prius, you should be
                                    OK
                                    > > for at least three weeks of non-use, assuming the battery is well
                                    > > charged to begin with. But you'll need to use your judgement a
                                    > bit.
                                    > > If you haven't used your Prius all that much just before you
                                    park,
                                    > > the battery might be below full charge and hence will go flat
                                    > sooner.
                                    > >
                                    > > Take a look at this post on the technical group for the details
                                    of
                                    > > the test I did:
                                    > >
                                    > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Prius_Technical_Stuff/message/1642
                                    > >
                                    > > Note that we're talking about the 12 volt battery here. The
                                    > traction
                                    > > battery will keep its charge for much longer - I would expect
                                    > > approximately six months.
                                    > >
                                    > > > Should I find out how to disconnect the battery if I know
                                    > > > the car will be parked for a few days?
                                    > >
                                    > > You shouldn't need to disconnect if you're only parked for a few
                                    > > days. Mine starts without problem after the above mentioned
                                    three
                                    > > weeks. But it's useful to know how to get at the battery
                                    anyway.
                                    > > See post 25035 on this group for the details of how to disconnect
                                    > it.
                                    > >
                                    > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/toyota-prius/message/25035
                                    > >
                                    > > Regards,
                                    > > Julian.
                                  • Stan Sieger
                                    ... No, it s just a troll. ... You ask questions any engineer should be able to figure out in his/her sleep, which is why your post is a troll. ... Curious
                                    Message 17 of 24 , Apr 16, 2002
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      >Message: 4
                                      > Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2002 23:26:24 -0000
                                      > From: "electric_troy" <electric_troy@...>
                                      >Subject: Re: "Official" word on dead battaries
                                      >
                                      >OK. Let me start by saying this is NOT a bash.

                                      No, it's just a troll.

                                      >I am merely offering
                                      >a comment/question from an engineer's perspective.

                                      You ask questions any "engineer" should be able to figure out in his/her sleep, which is why
                                      your post is a troll.

                                      >I turned off my Insight in October 2001. I restarted it in April
                                      >2002. It sat, unused, for 5 months.

                                      Curious behavior for someone who is always touting the superiority of that car above all others
                                      (and a bad idea for any car).

                                      >Why? The Insight has a small motorcycle battery similar to the Prius.

                                      Darned if most regular car batteries don't look "similar" to me, but they obviously vary in
                                      capacity. Have you bothered to check?

                                      >Why was it not dead? Why would a Prius in the same situation not start?

                                      Read a hundred previous posts on what draws current, even when the car is "off". Gosh, I guess
                                      the Insight doesn't have those. Why don't you measure the current draw in your Insight and let us
                                      know? This should be an easy project for an "engineer".

                                      >Surely the computers of the Insight and Prius are not that radically
                                      >different in current draw?

                                      On what basis could you possibly make this assumption?

                                      >Maybe the Insight's HV battery is connected to the 12V battery so that
                                      >it can't drain to dead? (shrug) I don't know.

                                      Or care to find out, I guess, since this could be the answer to you question and then you wouldn't
                                      have had to post this troll in the first place.

                                      [TroyStory--http://www.topica.com/lists/tlcnet-streettalk@.../read/message.html?
                                      mid=703001433&sort=d&start=3989]
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