- The truth behind the origins of 'Torchwood' or 'Excalibur' as it was originally titled when first pedaled to TPTB at the BBC by RTD has been discussed, dissected, debated and bandied about since pretty much since Torchwood premiered on BBC3.
RTD may say he's a big 'Captain Jack Harkness' aka 'John Barrowman' fan, his actions speak louder than words. All too often Jack aka John has been passed over in favor of Gwen/Eve. Long as RTD shouted, shoved and demanded that Gwen be viewed as 'the heart of Torchwood' - yet the character as written and demonstrated by dialogue and action is anything BUT sympathetic or compassionate or moral.
We're discussing a character that cheated on her lover with Owen only to later confess to said lover only AFTER she retconned him. Her self-centered actions, her self-righteous judgement of Jack, Ianto, Owen - pretty much everyone else has been demonstrated over and over and over. Her actions during the various series are seriously flawed and should have gotten her Retconned back to drooling infancy,
Hell, at the end of the second series ep 'Adrift' she's tearfully telling Rhys about what happened with Nicki and her son and it was all about HER. Her sense of 'guilt', her feelings of saddness, etc. It wasn't about Nicki or Jonah or the fact that she directly defied Jack and has done so in the past and will do so again in the future. It's all 'she feels so bad BUT obviously she is certain that what she did was right even if everyone else said she was wrong and should not have done what she did, etc. The episode sealed it for me. After this there was NO REDEEMING of the character of Gwen Cooper for me.
So what happens? She ends up the only survivor of Torchwood 3 save Jack at the end of Children of Earth - why? cause she's pregnant and married, etc. But mostly because RTD effing loves Eve and Gwen. The character never truly faces the consequences of her actions. Hell, she turned against Jack in MD - she tasered him and then tied him up and drove hours to turn him over to the ones holding her child and family. No one could blame her for her initial panic, but she drove for freaking HOURS and still never got her head out of her ass to realize that even if she killed Jack and turned him over there was virtually zero likelihood that the baddies would simply release her child or family.
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, Leanne Wilensky <leanne1672@...> wrote:
> Where are you getting that? I've never heard this version of the show's origin. While I also don't like Gwen - I don't things went down the way you state.
- I am so enjoying this discussion. I can't stand Gwen, never could for all the reasons listed - mean, selfish, but touted as perfect. I think I could have handled the mean and selfish if she'd not been considered wonderful, if she;d had some redeeming characteristic.
I haven;t seen Even in much, so no comments from me on that.
I too wonder what made RTD fall for her and mess up the show so badly. I still miss Ianto, but after all these years I'm finally reading Janto again.
Did not watch MD again; once was enough. I am watching the eps from the 1st two seasons that I have saved.
---- "pfyre@..." <pfyre@...> wrote:
> The truth behind the origins of 'Torchwood' or 'Excalibur' as it was originally titled when first pedaled to TPTB at the BBC by RTD has been discussed, dissected, debated and bandied about since pretty much since Torchwood premiered on BBC3.big snip