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Re: [torchwood] Re: Anyone Else Hate Gwen?

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  • msunshne
    Owen, at least, seems like an amazing doctor. He s redeemable in that respect. M
    Message 1 of 92 , May 9, 2007
      Owen, at least, seems like an amazing doctor.
      He's redeemable in that respect.


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    • psionycx
      This is very true. But pound for pound, Jack is so far weighing in as a shy virgin compared to someone like, say, Patrick on Coupling. Now granted, Coupling
      Message 92 of 92 , May 15, 2007
        This is very true. But pound for pound, Jack is so far weighing in
        as a shy virgin compared to someone like, say, Patrick on Coupling.
        Now granted, Coupling was a relationship comedy whereas Torchwood is
        a sci-fi show. But as you noted below, we have more concrete
        evidence of sex on the parts of Gwen, Owen and Tosh.

        It is true that imagination can be relied upon to fill in the blanks
        as it were. And where that fails there's all those lovely people
        writing fanfic (about 3/4 of which is Jack/Ianto bless their little
        hearts). It is true that while all of Torchwood's gay audience and
        most of it's straight female audience would be perfectly fine with
        the sight of Jack and Ianto doing something rather more graphic, it's
        open to debate if the straight male demographic (the usual core sci-
        fi audience) would cope well, even allowing for the fact that the
        British have more evolved sensibilities than Americans.

        Naturally this is manifest in the fact that Jack's kiss with Jack, or
        even his brief one with Ianto, is considered as more "daring" than
        Owen and Diane being shown in bed. Welcome back to Melrose Place.
        Still it is irksome though. Plus, Jack and Ianto frankly have more
        chemistry than Gwen and Owen. It's that whole angsty men together

        I suppose it's just a little funny, because so much hype has been put
        to this, but really only Carys's possession by alien sex gas was
        really especially titillating. Otherwise Torchwood is noticeably
        less risque than Buffy the Vampire Slayer was.

        Jack may have some major issues going back to his abandonment by the
        Doctor and Rose (however unintentional it may have been). But for
        pity's sake that was at least a century ago on his personal
        timeline! At some point you just have to get over it Jack! May
        series two bring a little more "excitement" to the show. And fewer

        --- In torchwood@yahoogroups.com, pfyre <pfyre@...> wrote:
        > this is not an usual scenario in television series - I recall a
        > series in which the nominal lead was supposed to be the 'ladies'
        > always on the prowl, on the make, and yet if you were to go back
        and check
        > the eps of the series - the socalled ladies man had very few dates
        > less much else and yet the secondary lead was the one hopping in
        and out of
        > bed - but to this day the illusion persists
        > that's what they've done with Jack - right from 'The Empty Child'
        onwards -
        > we've gotten plenty of innuendo and double entendres galore but as
        > actual physical evidence of Jack doing more than flirting and
        > kissing we've gotten virtually nada hard evidence -- yet I'd be
        willing to
        > bet that the average and casual viewers of DW and/or TW would still
        > that Jack in the rogue the one on the make and constantly hopping
        > whether occupied by male or female or some other gender human or

        > perhaps because as open and progressive as British tv and audiences
        > you have to wonder if they're truly ready to see Jack shagging a
        > alien or exquisitely, gorgeous Ianto? we want to see it, but is the
        > audience member ready for it?

        > I honestly don't think this means that Ianto is 'no one' to Jack
        but more a
        > comment on that there is no one that Jack has been able to be
        truthful and
        > completely open about himself since being brought back to life on
        > Five and abandoned by the two people he loved and trusted....

        > me too - though we would have to say there is some proof that Gwen
        > getting some from both Rhys and Owen (Rhys leaving the bed starkers
        in the
        > morning, etc. - Owen, starkers, stepping up behind Gwen - who is
        > dressed only in his shirt) -- and we saw Tosh and Mary apparently
        > coital so she got some in series one -- so here's to hoping and
        > that Jack AND Ianto manage to get some in series two with a bit
        > evidence for the audience
        > pfyre
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