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  • adilinden
    Hi, Happy New Year! I have perhaps a silly question. But what is the proper receive level to send to TNCX? Thanks, Adi VA3ADI
    Message 1 of 7 , Jan 4, 2013
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      Hi,

      Happy New Year! I have perhaps a silly question. But what is the proper receive level to send to TNCX?

      Thanks,
      Adi
      VA3ADI
    • ve3gws
      Lots of info at this web site Adi. 73 George VE3GWS http://fettechnologies.com/tncx.html Transmit Deviation A problem with the TNC-X being so simple, is that
      Message 2 of 7 , Jan 5, 2013
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        Lots of info at this web site Adi.

        73
        George
        VE3GWS


        http://fettechnologies.com/tncx.html



        Transmit Deviation
        A "problem" with the TNC-X being so simple, is that it lacks a means to properly set the transmit deviation. Most TNC's have a "calibration mode" that can be used to manually transmit the Mark and Space tones for proper transmitter alignment. Because the TNC-X just wants to see KISS frames to transmit, there is no feature like a "calibration mode" possible.

        However, all is not lost. When the TNC-X is idle, the mode select pins to the modem chip are both logic 0. This puts the MX614P into a mode where it is transmitting a 487Hz tone.

        Normally, you would adjust a TNC using the high (2200Hz) tone for a deviation of about 3.5kHz, and let the low tone (1200Hz) fall where it may (due to the 6dB/octave pre-emphasis curve in the radio).

        Well, we have to do it a little backwards here. Since we only have a low (487Hz) tone to work with, we have to use it for asjustment and verify our results by sending some data.

        Following the 6dB/octave (pre-emphasis) curve, if we half 2200Hz twice, we get 550Hz. That's pretty close to the 487Hz we've got to work with. So if we half the desired output deviation (3.5kHz) twice, we get 875Hz of deviation.

        This means that if we set up the TNC-X to transmit the 487Hz tone at about 900Hz deviation, we should be transmitting the correct deviation so that our output signal is clean and not hitting the limiter in the radio. A clean output signal is essential to being able to have the data decoded properly on the receiving end of your transmissions.

        In order to get the 487Hz tone out of the TNC, all you need to do is apply power (no computer needed) and temporarily jumper the /PTT (J7) to ground. This should key your radio, and if you listen to the demodulated audio on a service monitor or nearby receiver, you'll hear the tone. Set the TX Audio pot (R12) to give you about 900Hz deviation, and you're all set!



        --- In tnc-x@yahoogroups.com, "adilinden" wrote:
        >
        > Hi,
        >
        > Happy New Year! I have perhaps a silly question. But what is the proper receive level to send to TNCX?
        >
        > Thanks,
        > Adi
        > VA3ADI
        >
      • max wheatley
        Needs www in front of that link ...
        Message 3 of 7 , Jan 5, 2013
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          Needs www in front of that link ...



          On 6/01/2013 02:23, ve3gws wrote:
          > Lots of info at this web site Adi.
          >
          > 73
          > George
          > VE3GWS
          >
          >
          > http://fettechnologies.com/tncx.html
          >
          >
          >
          > Transmit Deviation
          > A "problem" with the TNC-X being so simple, is that it lacks a means to properly set the transmit deviation. Most TNC's have a "calibration mode" that can be used to manually transmit the Mark and Space tones for proper transmitter alignment. Because the TNC-X just wants to see KISS frames to transmit, there is no feature like a "calibration mode" possible.
          >
          > However, all is not lost. When the TNC-X is idle, the mode select pins to the modem chip are both logic 0. This puts the MX614P into a mode where it is transmitting a 487Hz tone.
          >
          > Normally, you would adjust a TNC using the high (2200Hz) tone for a deviation of about 3.5kHz, and let the low tone (1200Hz) fall where it may (due to the 6dB/octave pre-emphasis curve in the radio).
          >
          > Well, we have to do it a little backwards here. Since we only have a low (487Hz) tone to work with, we have to use it for asjustment and verify our results by sending some data.
          >
          > Following the 6dB/octave (pre-emphasis) curve, if we half 2200Hz twice, we get 550Hz. That's pretty close to the 487Hz we've got to work with. So if we half the desired output deviation (3.5kHz) twice, we get 875Hz of deviation.
          >
          > This means that if we set up the TNC-X to transmit the 487Hz tone at about 900Hz deviation, we should be transmitting the correct deviation so that our output signal is clean and not hitting the limiter in the radio. A clean output signal is essential to being able to have the data decoded properly on the receiving end of your transmissions.
          >
          > In order to get the 487Hz tone out of the TNC, all you need to do is apply power (no computer needed) and temporarily jumper the /PTT (J7) to ground. This should key your radio, and if you listen to the demodulated audio on a service monitor or nearby receiver, you'll hear the tone. Set the TX Audio pot (R12) to give you about 900Hz deviation, and you're all set!
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In tnc-x@yahoogroups.com, "adilinden" wrote:
          >> Hi,
          >>
          >> Happy New Year! I have perhaps a silly question. But what is the proper receive level to send to TNCX?
          >>
          >> Thanks,
          >> Adi
          >> VA3ADI
          >>
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ________________________________________________________________________
          > Delivered using the Free Personal Edition of Mailtraq (www.mailtraq.com)
          > .
          >
        • adilinden
          Hi George, Yes :) I found that website and the information on setting transmit level, deviation, is great. What I seem to be missing is the volume level I
          Message 4 of 7 , Jan 7, 2013
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            Hi George,

            Yes :) I found that website and the information on setting transmit level, deviation, is great. What I seem to be missing is the volume level I should be feeding to the TNCX. It just mentioned the need to have the audio input modified to not present too much load to the radio. But I have plenty of drive from the radio, but how much audio level should I be aiming for?

            Thanks,
            Adi
            VA3ADI

            --- In tnc-x@yahoogroups.com, "ve3gws" wrote:
            >
            > Lots of info at this web site Adi.
            >
            > 73
            > George
            > VE3GWS
            >
            >
            > http://fettechnologies.com/tncx.html
            >
            >
            >
            > Transmit Deviation
            > A "problem" with the TNC-X being so simple, is that it lacks a means to properly set the transmit deviation. Most TNC's have a "calibration mode" that can be used to manually transmit the Mark and Space tones for proper transmitter alignment. Because the TNC-X just wants to see KISS frames to transmit, there is no feature like a "calibration mode" possible.
            >
            > However, all is not lost. When the TNC-X is idle, the mode select pins to the modem chip are both logic 0. This puts the MX614P into a mode where it is transmitting a 487Hz tone.
            >
            > Normally, you would adjust a TNC using the high (2200Hz) tone for a deviation of about 3.5kHz, and let the low tone (1200Hz) fall where it may (due to the 6dB/octave pre-emphasis curve in the radio).
            >
            > Well, we have to do it a little backwards here. Since we only have a low (487Hz) tone to work with, we have to use it for asjustment and verify our results by sending some data.
            >
            > Following the 6dB/octave (pre-emphasis) curve, if we half 2200Hz twice, we get 550Hz. That's pretty close to the 487Hz we've got to work with. So if we half the desired output deviation (3.5kHz) twice, we get 875Hz of deviation.
            >
            > This means that if we set up the TNC-X to transmit the 487Hz tone at about 900Hz deviation, we should be transmitting the correct deviation so that our output signal is clean and not hitting the limiter in the radio. A clean output signal is essential to being able to have the data decoded properly on the receiving end of your transmissions.
            >
            > In order to get the 487Hz tone out of the TNC, all you need to do is apply power (no computer needed) and temporarily jumper the /PTT (J7) to ground. This should key your radio, and if you listen to the demodulated audio on a service monitor or nearby receiver, you'll hear the tone. Set the TX Audio pot (R12) to give you about 900Hz deviation, and you're all set!
            >
            >
            >
            > --- In tnc-x@yahoogroups.com, "adilinden" wrote:
            > >
            > > Hi,
            > >
            > > Happy New Year! I have perhaps a silly question. But what is the proper receive level to send to TNCX?
            > >
            > > Thanks,
            > > Adi
            > > VA3ADI
            > >
            >
          • George Sansom
            You don t need very much. The best way is to take the audio from a monitor jack on the radio which mutes the actual speaker. Last thing you want is to have
            Message 5 of 7 , Jan 7, 2013
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              You don't need very much.  The best way is to take the audio from a monitor jack on the radio which mutes the actual speaker.  Last thing you want is to have to listen to all the packets.  The input to the TNC will be looking for a voltage of about 2 V P-P which you can get from the monitor jack if your radio has one.  If you are going to disconnect the radio speaker and feed the TNC that way you should build a resister 'PAD' to replace the speaker load and it will feed the TNC input with a voltage.
               
              All this being said, the TNCs are pretty forgiving.  Just enough volume to make it work.  I find that if I am hooked to the actual speaker the volume control needs to be almost off.  If you are in to the monitor jack the volume will be constant.
               
              Once again, depends on the radio and less is better.
               
               
              Good luck.
               
               
              73
              George


               
              On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 3:49 PM, adilinden <adiy@...> wrote:
               

              Hi George,

              Yes :) I found that website and the information on setting transmit level, deviation, is great. What I seem to be missing is the volume level I should be feeding to the TNCX. It just mentioned the need to have the audio input modified to not present too much load to the radio. But I have plenty of drive from the radio, but how much audio level should I be aiming for?

              Thanks,
              Adi
              VA3ADI



              --- In tnc-x@yahoogroups.com, "ve3gws" wrote:
              >
              > Lots of info at this web site Adi.
              >
              > 73
              > George
              > VE3GWS
              >
              >
              > http://fettechnologies.com/tncx.html
              >
              >
              >
              > Transmit Deviation
              > A "problem" with the TNC-X being so simple, is that it lacks a means to properly set the transmit deviation. Most TNC's have a "calibration mode" that can be used to manually transmit the Mark and Space tones for proper transmitter alignment. Because the TNC-X just wants to see KISS frames to transmit, there is no feature like a "calibration mode" possible.
              >
              > However, all is not lost. When the TNC-X is idle, the mode select pins to the modem chip are both logic 0. This puts the MX614P into a mode where it is transmitting a 487Hz tone.
              >
              > Normally, you would adjust a TNC using the high (2200Hz) tone for a deviation of about 3.5kHz, and let the low tone (1200Hz) fall where it may (due to the 6dB/octave pre-emphasis curve in the radio).
              >
              > Well, we have to do it a little backwards here. Since we only have a low (487Hz) tone to work with, we have to use it for asjustment and verify our results by sending some data.
              >
              > Following the 6dB/octave (pre-emphasis) curve, if we half 2200Hz twice, we get 550Hz. That's pretty close to the 487Hz we've got to work with. So if we half the desired output deviation (3.5kHz) twice, we get 875Hz of deviation.
              >
              > This means that if we set up the TNC-X to transmit the 487Hz tone at about 900Hz deviation, we should be transmitting the correct deviation so that our output signal is clean and not hitting the limiter in the radio. A clean output signal is essential to being able to have the data decoded properly on the receiving end of your transmissions.
              >
              > In order to get the 487Hz tone out of the TNC, all you need to do is apply power (no computer needed) and temporarily jumper the /PTT (J7) to ground. This should key your radio, and if you listen to the demodulated audio on a service monitor or nearby receiver, you'll hear the tone. Set the TX Audio pot (R12) to give you about 900Hz deviation, and you're all set!
              >
              >
              >
              > --- In tnc-x@yahoogroups.com, "adilinden" wrote:
              > >
              > > Hi,
              > >
              > > Happy New Year! I have perhaps a silly question. But what is the proper receive level to send to TNCX?
              > >
              > > Thanks,
              > > Adi
              > > VA3ADI
              > >
              >




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              Thanks
               
            • max wheatley
              For what it is worth ...... I just plugged it in where my tnc2 was, its audio feed was off the top of the volume control Another easy point to pick is the
              Message 6 of 7 , Jan 8, 2013
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                For what it is worth ......

                I just plugged it in where my tnc2 was, its audio feed was off the top
                of the volume control

                Another easy point to pick is the points where CTCSS etc type tones go
                in and out ...

                Max



                On 8/01/2013 09:49, adilinden wrote:
                > Hi George,
                >
                > Yes :) I found that website and the information on setting transmit level, deviation, is great. What I seem to be missing is the volume level I should be feeding to the TNCX. It just mentioned the need to have the audio input modified to not present too much load to the radio. But I have plenty of drive from the radio, but how much audio level should I be aiming for?
                >
                > Thanks,
                > Adi
                > VA3ADI
                >
                > --- In tnc-x@yahoogroups.com, "ve3gws" wrote:
                >> Lots of info at this web site Adi.
                >>
                >> 73
                >> George
                >> VE3GWS
                >>
                >>
                >> http://fettechnologies.com/tncx.html
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >> Transmit Deviation
                >> A "problem" with the TNC-X being so simple, is that it lacks a means to properly set the transmit deviation. Most TNC's have a "calibration mode" that can be used to manually transmit the Mark and Space tones for proper transmitter alignment. Because the TNC-X just wants to see KISS frames to transmit, there is no feature like a "calibration mode" possible.
                >>
                >> However, all is not lost. When the TNC-X is idle, the mode select pins to the modem chip are both logic 0. This puts the MX614P into a mode where it is transmitting a 487Hz tone.
                >>
                >> Normally, you would adjust a TNC using the high (2200Hz) tone for a deviation of about 3.5kHz, and let the low tone (1200Hz) fall where it may (due to the 6dB/octave pre-emphasis curve in the radio).
                >>
                >> Well, we have to do it a little backwards here. Since we only have a low (487Hz) tone to work with, we have to use it for asjustment and verify our results by sending some data.
                >>
                >> Following the 6dB/octave (pre-emphasis) curve, if we half 2200Hz twice, we get 550Hz. That's pretty close to the 487Hz we've got to work with. So if we half the desired output deviation (3.5kHz) twice, we get 875Hz of deviation.
                >>
                >> This means that if we set up the TNC-X to transmit the 487Hz tone at about 900Hz deviation, we should be transmitting the correct deviation so that our output signal is clean and not hitting the limiter in the radio. A clean output signal is essential to being able to have the data decoded properly on the receiving end of your transmissions.
                >>
                >> In order to get the 487Hz tone out of the TNC, all you need to do is apply power (no computer needed) and temporarily jumper the /PTT (J7) to ground. This should key your radio, and if you listen to the demodulated audio on a service monitor or nearby receiver, you'll hear the tone. Set the TX Audio pot (R12) to give you about 900Hz deviation, and you're all set!
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >> --- In tnc-x@yahoogroups.com, "adilinden" wrote:
                >>> Hi,
                >>>
                >>> Happy New Year! I have perhaps a silly question. But what is the proper receive level to send to TNCX?
                >>>
                >>> Thanks,
                >>> Adi
                >>> VA3ADI
                >>>
                >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ________________________________________________________________________
                > Delivered using the Free Personal Edition of Mailtraq (www.mailtraq.com)
                > .
                >
              • ve3gws
                That is actually the best point to pick off the audio. It is un-equalized audio which the TNC likes. We use that point on our packet network radios. It is
                Message 7 of 7 , Jan 8, 2013
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                  That is actually the best point to pick off the audio. It is un-equalized audio which the TNC likes. We use that point on our packet network radios.

                  It is taken from a point at the discriminator output before any audio equalization takes place. The audio equalization is to make the normal 'voice' traffic sound like we like to hear it. Tones are outside that range.

                  --- In tnc-x@yahoogroups.com, max wheatley wrote:
                  >
                  > For what it is worth ......
                  >
                  > I just plugged it in where my tnc2 was, its audio feed was off the top
                  > of the volume control
                  >
                  > Another easy point to pick is the points where CTCSS etc type tones go
                  > in and out ...
                  >
                  > Max
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > On 8/01/2013 09:49, adilinden wrote:
                  > > Hi George,
                  > >
                  > > Yes :) I found that website and the information on setting transmit level, deviation, is great. What I seem to be missing is the volume level I should be feeding to the TNCX. It just mentioned the need to have the audio input modified to not present too much load to the radio. But I have plenty of drive from the radio, but how much audio level should I be aiming for?
                  > >
                  > > Thanks,
                  > > Adi
                  > > VA3ADI
                  > >
                  > > --- In tnc-x@yahoogroups.com, "ve3gws" wrote:
                  > >> Lots of info at this web site Adi.
                  > >>
                  > >> 73
                  > >> George
                  > >> VE3GWS
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >> http://fettechnologies.com/tncx.html
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >> Transmit Deviation
                  > >> A "problem" with the TNC-X being so simple, is that it lacks a means to properly set the transmit deviation. Most TNC's have a "calibration mode" that can be used to manually transmit the Mark and Space tones for proper transmitter alignment. Because the TNC-X just wants to see KISS frames to transmit, there is no feature like a "calibration mode" possible.
                  > >>
                  > >> However, all is not lost. When the TNC-X is idle, the mode select pins to the modem chip are both logic 0. This puts the MX614P into a mode where it is transmitting a 487Hz tone.
                  > >>
                  > >> Normally, you would adjust a TNC using the high (2200Hz) tone for a deviation of about 3.5kHz, and let the low tone (1200Hz) fall where it may (due to the 6dB/octave pre-emphasis curve in the radio).
                  > >>
                  > >> Well, we have to do it a little backwards here. Since we only have a low (487Hz) tone to work with, we have to use it for asjustment and verify our results by sending some data.
                  > >>
                  > >> Following the 6dB/octave (pre-emphasis) curve, if we half 2200Hz twice, we get 550Hz. That's pretty close to the 487Hz we've got to work with. So if we half the desired output deviation (3.5kHz) twice, we get 875Hz of deviation.
                  > >>
                  > >> This means that if we set up the TNC-X to transmit the 487Hz tone at about 900Hz deviation, we should be transmitting the correct deviation so that our output signal is clean and not hitting the limiter in the radio. A clean output signal is essential to being able to have the data decoded properly on the receiving end of your transmissions.
                  > >>
                  > >> In order to get the 487Hz tone out of the TNC, all you need to do is apply power (no computer needed) and temporarily jumper the /PTT (J7) to ground. This should key your radio, and if you listen to the demodulated audio on a service monitor or nearby receiver, you'll hear the tone. Set the TX Audio pot (R12) to give you about 900Hz deviation, and you're all set!
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >> --- In tnc-x@yahoogroups.com, "adilinden" wrote:
                  > >>> Hi,
                  > >>>
                  > >>> Happy New Year! I have perhaps a silly question. But what is the proper receive level to send to TNCX?
                  > >>>
                  > >>> Thanks,
                  > >>> Adi
                  > >>> VA3ADI
                  > >>>
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ------------------------------------
                  > >
                  > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ________________________________________________________________________
                  > > Delivered using the Free Personal Edition of Mailtraq (www.mailtraq.com)
                  > > .
                  > >
                  >
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