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RE: [tips_and_tricks] Signing under duress

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  • Frog Farmer
    ... I would try to pre-empt this point by trying to get the GORP to not even begin to make out the paperwork, by actually getting his attention and offering
    Message 1 of 2 , Sep 30 7:57 PM
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      > Next, I believe it would be necessary to ask the GORP what would
      > happen if I do not sign", which would probably elicit an answer
      > of, "You will be arrested."

      I would try to pre-empt this point by trying to get the "GORP" to not
      even begin to make out the paperwork, by actually getting his attention
      and offering him an opportunity to think out some possible outcomes,
      both of NOT issuing his paper, AND of issuing it. I'd play upon his
      sense of independence to act according to his own discretion, if indeed
      he was of the officer status he claims.

      > At that point, it is now possible to
      > sign the contract under duress, under color of law, writing that
      > statement on the ticket, and then using that defense before even
      > going to court."

      Yes, it's possible, but there's nothing stating that he has to accept it
      as a signature, because under the rules, it is called an "ambiguous
      signature" and cannot be used as evidence in court, and cannot have any
      lawful force or effect. So it is equal to not signing it. He should
      know that, but he may not. Some do; some don't. Same with most
      anything.

      > (or refusing to sign and being arrested, and that is
      > a completely different set of circumstances to address, but not with
      > this post).

      Right, also refusing to sign and not being arrested...

      > The question - is this path a good one to take and is there any other
      > experience or advice a group member can volunteer.

      Good for what? Getting the pizza home before it gets cold? It's worth
      the effort there. I've known a few people who got beat up when they've
      offered any resistance at all. I've never had any kind of problem and
      always lots of fun, so as I say, results may vary. Did I mention that I
      might offer to take the back seat of the patrol car while we discuss
      things? I personally would never sign a ticket - I would always demand
      to see a magistrate immediately. When we saw him I'd be pointing out
      how the non-officer was guilty of impersonation and even if he wasn't he
      was not ready with the required paperwork necessary to present to a
      magistrate in order to hold me to answer. I would have to be released.
      If I was such a threat, they could follow me with enough goons until
      someone could get the paperwork together and then arrest me. Until
      then, I'm not going to cooperate in my own prosecution.

      Regards,

      FF





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