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W-4 alteration by IRS letter

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  • Chuck D
    I need assistance locating the case, IRS/IRM rule or citation, Treasury Decision, or all of the above limiting the IRS, preventing them from issuing a letter
    Message 1 of 5 , Jul 30, 2006
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      I need assistance locating the case, IRS/IRM rule or citation,
      Treasury Decision, or all of the above limiting the IRS, preventing
      them from issuing a letter to a company to modify the withholding
      allowance for a compensated employee - not a Title-26 "employee." If
      someone also has a case I can cite (help him with) where the employer
      is under no obligation to such a letter, that would be helpful as well.

      A friend I've been trying to help, and his 'employer' received a
      letter roughly two years ago from the IRS indicated they (the
      employer) had to change my friend's W-4 (single/zero). We have been
      unable to convince this company that they need not honor this letter
      since, among other things, no judgement has ever been rendered against
      him. (He's never even had a hearing to discuss/argue his 1040s, or
      any other document.)

      Any help would be greatly appreciated.

      Chuck D
      Houston
    • mn_chicago
      Here is a letter from which your friend extract information: It is not his issue, but it show how one can deal with the IRS and employers. Keep in mind,
      Message 2 of 5 , Jul 30, 2006
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        Here is a letter from which your friend extract information:

        It is not his issue, but it show how one can deal with the
        IRS and employers. Keep in mind, employers do not want to
        get on the wrong side of the IRS, so they will not be overly
        receptive to challenging them.

        What your friend could do is ask his employer to write a
        letter to the IRS and have them cite the law or statute
        under which they are laboring. These guys are low-level
        thugs with lots of pull. But, they can crumble under a
        direct challenge to their legal position.

        Otherwise, they will continue to huff and puff, and....


        The letter: for informantion purposes:



        Director of Personnel (or whatever apporpriate)
        Company
        Address

        NOTICE OF WITHDRAWEL FROM WITHHOLDING TAXES

        It has come to my attention that I have been falsely under
        the impression that I was required, by law, to fill out a
        W-4 form and also supply my social security number as a
        condition for employment.

        I have recently discovered that there is no law requiring
        me to sign and submit a W-4 in order to get, or retain,
        employment. Nor am I required to submit a social security
        number.

        This Notice is my demand to cease and desist all
        withholding from my earnings, any type of tax, income,
        social security, or otherwise.

        According to internal revenue statutes, an employer is
        only required to request that an individual fill out
        and sign a W-4, and to request an individual's
        social security number, per 26 USC 3402(f)(2)-1(a):

        (a) on commencement of employment. The employer
        is required to request a withholding exemption
        certificate from each employee, but if the employee fails
        to furnish such certificate, such employee shall be
        considered as a single person claiming no withholding
        exemptions.

        I deny being a taxpayer, as defined by the tax code, and
        I have determined that I am not subject to any tax.
        I have also found out that by signing a W-4 form and
        supplying my social security number, I am providing prima
        facie evidence of being a taxpayer, as defined by the
        revenue code. I am not such a taxpayer.

        I have since found out that my previous belief of having
        to provide a signed W-4 form and my social security number
        resulted from a mistake of both fact and law, from
        misrepresentation, constructive fraud, and coercion.

        I hereby revoke my signature on any internal revenue tax
        forms, and I demand that my social security number be
        removed from any and all records in your possession.

        Further, I demand that the company not provide any 1099,
        W-4, or any kind of form to the internal revenue service.

        Should the IRS make any demands of this company to
        provide any such revenue forms, then this company should
        agree to provide said forms requested upon written proof
        from the IRS that I am a person who is subject to a
        revenue tax.

        Please confirm, in writing, within the next 14 days from
        the date of this letter, your course of action. You should
        also know that no individual can suffer the lose of
        employment for not providing IRS forms/social security
        number.

        Sincerely,


        P.S.

        Here is what 26 CFR 301.6109-1(c) provides:

        If he does not know the taxpayer identifying number of
        the other person, he shall request such number of
        the other person. A request should state that the
        identifying number is required to be furnished under
        authority of law. When the person filing the return, statement,
        or other document doesn not know the number of the
        other person, and has complied with the request
        provision of this paragraph, he shall sign an affidavit on
        the transmittal document forwarding such return, statement,
        or other document to the IRS so stating. (Emphasis added)
      • Fred Marshall
        I m in a similar situation, but with a little twist. Someone in the Questionable W-4 division in Andover, MA sent the company I work for a letter (Letter
        Message 3 of 5 , Jul 30, 2006
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          I'm in a similar situation, but with a little twist. Someone in the
          "Questionable W-4" division in Andover, MA sent the company I work for a
          letter (Letter 2800C) with very vague verbiage relating to the number of
          allowances/exemptions* on my W-4. (I'd changed it to 10 years ago based
          on someone in the payroll department saying that they were only required
          to forward it to the IRS if you claimed more than ten. Apparently
          untrue - keep reading.)

          In this letter, the lady used phrases like "more than /a certain number
          of/ allowances" (emphasis mine). Anyway, it instructs the employer
          (normal usage of the word) to change my withholding to "filing single,
          zero allowances".

          The twist is that, since March of 2005, about 87% of my pay has been
          garnished as a result of them honoring one of those bogus Notices of
          Levy. I've tried various things to get them to stop, so far to no
          avail. Thinking that they were going to start stealing even MORE of my
          pay than they already were, I sent a very direct letter to the
          author/signer of the Letter 2800C - and have received no response.

          Come to find out, I'm still getting the pay I've been getting (which is
          based on the amount exempt from levy on the outdated 2005 version of
          Publication 1494), but the check they're writing to the agent (yes, I've
          asked for, and they have provided me copies of the checks they've been
          sending, and they're payable to the actual agent - any ideas here?) have
          now been reduced by the amount of the difference due to the withholding
          change.

          So, I'll be interested in whatever meaningful responses anyone can offer
          with regard to Chuck D's situation, since mine is similar.

          Fred

          P.S. There is a Publication 15, I believe, that says, somewhere around
          page 13 or 14, that private (i.e. non-government) employers are not
          required to withhold. Also, I believe it's IRC 3402(p) or thereabouts
          that says that a W-4 Withholding agreement is voluntary, and can be
          terminated by either party at any time, in writing. Hope that helps.

          * I know that allowances & exemptions, while often used interchangeably,
          are not synonymous, but I can't recall or articulate the distinction.
        • Michael Noonan
          30 July 2006 Fred: For what little I know about the irs, I have only dealt with them directly on challenging their legal status re the income tax. In extensive
          Message 4 of 5 , Jul 30, 2006
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            30 July 2006

            Fred:

            For what little I know about the irs, I have only
            dealt with them directly on challenging their legal
            status re the income tax.

            In extensive reading, I have come across other issues,
            but no direct involvement in their regard. I can
            only pass along some acquired info.

            What you need to attack is the IRS Notice of Levy.
            Inform your employer that a Notice is NOT a Lien,
            only a Notice. Any time you get one, or your
            employer, get CERTIFIED COPIES, front and back, from
            the County Recorder.

            The IRS is playing you and your employer. This is one
            of the elements necesary to perfect a lien, via
            Admiralty:


            1. must be served a copy of the complaint (lien) upon
            an oath of solomn affirmation. Look at the signature
            line. The irs typically uses a "stamp" for another
            party. Check FedRulesCivP 56(e)(g). A solomn oath
            has to be signed by a specific party, not a stamp.

            The irs never gets anything properly sworn. They
            simply cannot. Inform your employer that you are
            being taken advantage of, once you get your thoughts
            together.

            Again, they do not want to go up against the IRS, even
            if you are getting reamed. Ask them to send a letter
            to the irs for the statute or law upon which they are
            relying. If your copies show nothing more than a
            Notice, advise both employer and irs that a Notice is
            insufficient to lean your wages and for them to cease
            and disist immediately.

            Hope this helps.

            Moderator/Bear: In the 16 years that I have been involved in this I am aware of a single employer, a patriot who understood, that took a stand and refused to honor a "notice of levy". I am unaware of any that were willing to ignore a "treat him as single with no dependants" letter or call. In many, many, many other instances, the employers all gave up the money and the "employee" ended up either quitting or living on a ridiculous sum like $150 a week until the so called levy was paid, or, having a full 37.5% taken out of their pay check. I searched and searched for a solution for this problem and believe that I found a much more viable solution that has actually succeeded in several instances in changing what the IRS is telling the employer. If you will follow the plan laid out at
            http://irs-armory.com/call_off_dogs.htm and the conference call at the top of that page you will put yourself in an excellent position to change what the IRS is telling the employer.


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          • mn_chicago
            Does this work? I have not had occasion to use it. My purpose in providing it was to provide something that holds water in the form of a response. Employers
            Message 5 of 5 , Jul 31, 2006
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              Does this work? I have not had occasion to use it.

              My purpose in providing it was to provide something
              that holds water in the form of a response.

              Employers do not want to take on the IRS, and it
              will never occur to them that you could be right in
              your assertions.

              The information comes from the IRC, and the IRS
              attorneys wrote it. How can they refute it?!

              I always recommend that anyone who uses this have the
              employer send a letter to the IRS for proof of their
              demand.

              As to the denial of being a taxpayer and not being
              subject to the code, I have used that, personally,
              and for someone else, and it has been v effective.
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