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Fw: Re: [tips_and_tricks] Immigration Forms - US citizen vs. Citizen of the United States of America (One of we the people)

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  • David E. Wolfensperger
    Hello, thanks for your imput: Have you cancelled your social insecurity number? I returned the SS card and cancelled the SS number in 1999. Have you cancelled
    Message 1 of 6 , Jul 4, 2006
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      Hello, thanks for your imput:
       
      Have you cancelled your social insecurity number?
      I returned the SS card and cancelled the SS number in 1999. 
       
      Have you cancelled Your voter registration?
      I have cancelled the voter registration as well. 
       
      Have you rescinded your birth certificate?
      The birth certificate, I see no need since it just verifies your place of birth. 
       
      Also, in doing what you want to do, you are asking for a benefit and 'they' still consider you a corporate Citizen whether you do or not. If you want something from them, you Will have to play in their ball park
      The Constitution does provide that "The Congress shall have power ... To establish an uniform Rule of Naturalization, ... Throughout the United States" (Constitution of the United States Article I Section 8 Paragraph 4). Therefore, shouldn't those uniform rules apply for me as well and not just for US Citizens?
       
      Besides, the statute even specifies citizens of the United States.  Would they not be referring to Citizens of the United States mentioned in The Constitution of the United States Article I Section 3 Paragraph 3?
       
      It irritates me that they changed the term to US Citizen on the forms.
       
      Dave
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    • one
      I have seen cited from Bouvier s 8th edition that a US Citizen is a citizen of Virgin Islands. I wonder if anyone has searched for the authority by which US
      Message 2 of 6 , Jul 5, 2006
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        I have seen cited from Bouvier's 8th edition that a US Citizen is a
        citizen of Virgin Islands.
        I wonder if anyone has searched for the authority by which US Citizen
        was entered on the forms.
      • mn_chicago
        There are two types of citizenship. 1. Constitutional Citizenship, with sovereign status, hardly applicable to anyone, these days. Spelled with a capital C.
        Message 3 of 6 , Jul 5, 2006
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          There are two types of citizenship.

          1. Constitutional Citizenship, with sovereign status, hardly
          applicable to anyone, these days. Spelled with a capital "C."


          2. Congress created a corporate fiction, via Art 1, sec 8, cl 17,
          and chose to call it the "United States," over which it has plenary
          power. Its citizens, spelled with a small "c," are pretty much
          subjects, literally subject to the 66 million, plus, statutes by
          which they must abide.

          Anyone who contracts to receive "benefits" from that corporate
          "United States," automatically becomes a "citizen of the United
          States." Therein begins all one's statutory problems.

          What kind of contracts?

          Birth certificate, SS#, voter registration card, driver's license,
          and one of the most insidious, the bank signature card. Once you
          sign the latter, you have enterend into a contract that makes you
          a party to all rules and regulations of the Treasuty Dept.

          Just my POV.
        • Phil Patana
          Thanks for clarifying that it is only your point of view, because I don t agreee with most of it. My wagon is hitched to the teachings of Eric Williams and
          Message 4 of 6 , Jul 5, 2006
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            Thanks for clarifying that it is only your point of view, because I don't agreee with most of it.  My wagon is hitched to the teachings of Eric Williams and Jack and Margy Flynn.  Anyone wanting to learn their stuff feel free to email me at phil@....  Why make this more complicated than it need be?

            mn_chicago <mn_chicago@...> wrote:
            There are two types of citizenship.

            1. Constitutional Citizenship, with sovereign status, hardly
            applicable to anyone, these days. Spelled with a capital "C."

            2. Congress created a corporate fiction, via Art 1, sec 8, cl 17,
            and chose to call it the "United States," over which it has plenary
            power. Its citizens, spelled with a small "c," are pretty much
            subjects, literally subject to the 66 million, plus, statutes by
            which they must abide.

            Anyone who contracts to receive "benefits" from that corporate
            "United States," automatically becomes a "citizen of the United
            States." Therein begins all one's statutory problems.



          • Moisha Pippik
            OK group, I appreciate the below information, as this is correct. But the question is, what do we do about it? Do we cancel any and all illegal contracts?
            Message 5 of 6 , Jul 6, 2006
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              OK group, I appreciate the below information, as this is correct.  But the question is, what do we do about it?  Do we cancel any and all illegal contracts?  That's right, these are illegal, because we did not have a meeting of the minds.  Or, do we make them prove everything...................prove that I'm a US citizen.  Prove that I have a driver's licence.  Prove that I have a SS card.  Prove that what you say is my signature, is, in fact, my signature.  We are not defeated by these so called contracts.  The courts, local, state, and federal gov't never question me when I show up to answer for the legal fiction.  Why would they?  They never make me prove who I am when completing a tax return, they never quesiton who I am when registering any information. Why is this?  Because they enjoy my labor, and the debt I suppply back to them.  Keep up the good work and information.  Remember, offer solutions to these issues.
               
              Moisha

              mn_chicago <mn_chicago@...> wrote:
              There are two types of citizenship.

              1. Constitutional Citizenship, with sovereign status, hardly
              applicable to anyone, these days. Spelled with a capital "C."

              2. Congress created a corporate fiction, via Art 1, sec 8, cl 17,
              and chose to call it the "United States," over which it has plenary
              power. Its citizens, spelled with a small "c," are pretty much
              subjects, literally subject to the 66 million, plus, statutes by
              which they must abide.

              Anyone who contracts to receive "benefits" from that corporate
              "United States," automatically becomes a "citizen of the United
              States." Therein begins all one's statutory problems.

              What kind of contracts?

              Birth certificate, SS#, voter registration card, driver's license,
              and one of the most insidious, the bank signature card. Once you
              sign the latter, you have enterend into a contract that makes you
              a party to all rules and regulations of the Treasuty Dept.

              Just my POV.


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            • mn_chicago
              No. Your idea of what constitutes a contract and the gov t s idea are somewhat different. The biggest major difference is that at least you would act
              Message 6 of 6 , Jul 6, 2006
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                No. Your idea of what constitutes a contract and the gov't's idea
                are somewhat different. The biggest major difference is that at
                least you would act honorably.

                Let's take the worst kind of gov't contract...the bank signature
                card.

                "The undersigned does hereby agree to abide by all the Rules of the
                Bank."

                Seems innouous enough, does it not? But wait!

                ALL the Rules? Yes, all the rules. That means you just signed on
                to abiding by all the rules of the Secretary of Treasury, an
                engrafted agreement. And yes, all of Title 26, the tax code, is a
                part of them rules.

                What did you get for consideration? Gov't benefits, such as they
                are.

                Consideration given. Valid contract. Nothing illegal here.

                You didn't have a meeting of the minds? Are you goofy?! What kind
                of contract would THAT be? (I told you you would be honorable.)

                Driver's license? You signed, willingly, knowingly, and
                intentionally. Consideration? You have privileges, and you are also
                responsible for all the fines that go with your privileges.

                Sounds valid to me. And not at all illegal.

                Voter registration card? "Sign here, please." "Sure."

                Make them prove you are a US citizen? For sure you are a citizen of
                the fictional "United States." That's citizen, with a small "c," aka
                a subject. They don't need to prove anything. You have been leaving
                your signature all over the place. Want proof?

                You think you are not defeated in these contracts? You might want to
                rethink that thought.

                And when you show up and announce yourself in court? You just agreed
                to the court's jurisdiction, yet another contract. While in court,
                and all court operate under contract law, per UCC, do not argue any
                Constitutional issues. The Bill of Rights cannot abridge any
                contracts.

                Don't argue how unfair it may seem. Unfairness is not a part of
                any contract, so it does not apply. A contract is a contract. The
                only things that matter are the terms of the contract. Nothing else,
                nothing else applies.

                Ask Irwin Schiff. Oh, wait. He's in jail. Know why? He failed to
                undertand his contractual obligations, as explained above. He
                argued Constitutional issues, issues of unfairness. I warned you,
                they don't apply. You do not want to become a cell mate, do you?

                Prove who you are when you sign a tax form? You are signing it under
                penalty of perjury. It had better be you. That, by the way, is yet
                another contract you signed willingly, knowingly, and intentionally.

                Solutions?

                Good idea.

                Get rid of all bank signature cards. Get rid of your driver's
                license. Don't sign any more W-4s. Stop voting.

                Of course, there are a few apparent problems with these tactics.

                You have to know how to say no.

                Send a Notice to the bank(s) rescinding your signature. Deny you
                are a party to any implied contracts in the signing. Make it in the
                form of an affidavit.

                Need to sign another form or open a new account? Cross out any
                damning agreements. Write "Without Prejudice" over your signature,
                and make it overlap in case of an "accidental erasure."

                These gov't contracts are "unconditional." When you sign "Without
                Prejudice" over your signature, you are imposing a "condition,"
                your reservation of rights. When you impose a condition on an
                unconditional contract, it becomes dead in law.

                "Without Prejudice," the UCC 1-308 remedy. Don't leave home without
                it.

                A W-4? Sign it "Without Prejudice." That'll put the brakes on the
                IRS leeches.

                Just a few thoughts.
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