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19703Re: [tips_and_tricks] Westlaw

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  • Frog Farmer
    Aug 26, 2014
      On Tue, August 19, 2014 9:23 am, Linda Moriarity buffalogirl93561@...
      [tips_and_tricks] wrote:
      > It is very tricky. what works for one person in one specific area with a
      > specific officer is likely not to work with with another and/or
      > elsewhere. That is correct, the officer only know what they are told to
      > learn, they do NOT know all the laws or the limits to their authorities.

      When I used to look for trouble with my homemade plates and no license or
      insurance (I had a stroke since then and now can barely walk or see
      straight) I used to carry a big salesman's case full of books and
      exhibits. First was an 8th grade English grammar book. It's purpose was
      to explain the concept of "statement".

      Then there were all the codes I'd rely upon. Several times I held
      "curbstone court" and covered the cop's hood with papers. I never was
      arrested and taken in. My room-mate was, but was always released without
      a signature.

      > The majority of the time, you are better off just taking
      > the ticket and trying to convince the court of the unlawful issues.

      Here in California that would be a mistake. The way I'd do it is, refuse
      to self-identify, that helps them when you then demand an immediate visit
      to a magistrate. If you give ID, they can then DELAY that appearance up
      to 72 hours. However, if one was to go immediately one could challenge
      both the officer's and the magistrate's oaths and bonds and find them
      lacking. That would establish a kidnapping. If you inform them of your
      agenda, odds are they'll decide they don't want to play anymore and let
      you go.

      > However the cop and the court are accustomed to getting their way and not
      > having their presumed authority questioned. But the response you will
      > likely get at the time the ticket is issued, is 'take it up with the
      > judge'.

      "Exactly, so let's go right now."

      > So look to your own state codes that 'authorize' an 'arrest'. In
      > Calif the minute the officer initiates the 'stop' you ARE "arrested'
      > which is totally different from 'in custody', but never the less
      > 'arrested' and that may only occur with 'probable cause ' being the
      > commission or suspecion of a crime about to be committed.. So the initial
      > question when approached would be "Sir, what CRIME was observed or
      > suspected ".. They will say you broke the LAW by speeding or failing to
      > stop at red light, or ???. Your response would be, BUT IS that a CRIME or
      > simply an INFRACTION, and depending on your state may or may not be
      > deemed a CRIME. They ASK if you are 'arrested'? If he says NO, then say
      > "ok, then I am free to go ?" he will say NO, meaning which you can
      > clarify, IF I am NOT free to go then I MUST be ARRESTED, which by section
      > ???? means I must have committed a crime, so again "please advise of the
      > CRIME I am being arrested for." Above all, keep it pleasant and calm.
      > Half will let you go, some will call their supervisor, which is GREAT.
      > And for those who believe the 4th amendment prevents stops, you are
      > wrong. It DOES allow for brief encounters of say 10 minutes to address
      > 'infractions', yes there IS case law to support this. All is on my
      > crashed computer in the shop, but it exists. linda

      In California, an infraction is a way for people to waive their rights and
      waive jurisdiction, which makes it easier for the prosecution. It is
      better to elect to have the infraction prosecuted as a misdemeanor as the
      penal code provides for. This ups the cost for them and helps expose more
      fraud. Accepting any ticket is a big mistake, but people will do it
      because the pizza is getting cold.

      > -------------------------------------------- On Mon, 8/18/14, al danesh
      > reachmeal@... [tips_and_tricks] <tips_and_tricks@yahoogroups.com>
      > wrote: Subject: Re: [tips_and_tricks] Westlaw To:
      > tips_and_tricks@yahoogroups.com Date: Monday, August 18, 2014, 3:17 AM
      > In regards to FF Westlaw, and his last paragraph copied below, I would
      > like to ask this group how to deal with cops on the side of the road, for
      > challenging their authority when stopped can lead to a physical
      > alteration even though it is physically unprovoked.

      I quit pulling over for them, If they then wanted to stop me, they have
      those ramming bars on the front of their cars. I guess they never really
      wanted to stop me. They never rammed me or set up a roadblock. The right
      way is to travel to a private property destination, get out and lock the
      car. Then hold court and if necessary go immediately to a magistrate. If
      you communicate the full 110-line agenda I've developed (versus the usual
      4 line agenda of most folks) odds are you'll be asked to "have a nice

      The only way you can be jailed in California is with your consent. Most
      people can be easily tricked into giving it. Most people give it over and
      over again by:

      1. getting a license and registration and insurance.
      2. pulling over
      3. Calling an impersonator "officer"
      4, Giving ID
      5. consenting to in-custody interrogation without counsel present
      6. signing a ticket and waiving the immediate trip to a magistrate.
      7. appearing without disqualifying anyone....etc. etc.


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