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16534Re: [tips_and_tricks] Re: When GMAC goes bankrupt, Chapter 11 -- can a note holder recover his title?

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  • falconfield@comcast.net
    Jan 7, 2009
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      I tried to contact mn_chicago off list. He has posted 2 times since I emailed him privately. I will assume do to the possibility of security software my emails never made it to his inbox.



      I wanted to  see how mn_chicago would explain how a lender "unlawfully" converts promissory note into a negotiable instrument.  By definition a promissory note is a negotiable instrument.


      I do not believe that a mortgage banker would originate or buy a mortgage/note if they could not sell it to someone else.


      Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac  were created to purchase mortgages from mortgage bankers so the mortgage bankers could originate more mortgages. The originators make money from the fees and the holds of the mortgage make money off of the interest payments.


      Consideration is : Something of value exchanged between the parties to a contract. It may consist of goods, services or promises


      The seller brings the real estate, the buyer brings his labor in the form of a down payment and his pledge of future labor to amortize the promissory note and he also pledges the title to the real estate. The mortgage banker provides a service to facilitate the transfer of property between 2 people.  The mortgage banker did not have to bring any "money" to the deal it was already there. 


      In other words , if I owned a property free and clear of any mortgages and you wanted to buy it and we agreed on a down payment. you could either ask a mortgage broker to facilitate the deal or I could agree to accept your promise to pay me over time. I would make sure I had the right to sell that promise to a third party at anytime over the life of our agreement.


      Since most people do not own their property free and clear  and most people do not have enough of their labor converted into "money"   there is a need for a third party to facilitate the transfer of property. In this case the property is real property (the seller) and past labor converted into a down payment and future labor converted into a promissory note and a pledge of the real property by the buyer to the tihd party.  


      So you are right that the mortgage banker does not bring anything in the way of "money" into the deal but I do not agree with you that it is a fraudulent transaction. 






      ----- Original Message -----
      From: "mn_chicago" <mn_chicago@...>
      To: "tips and tricks" <tips_and_tricks@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2008 1:22:17 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
      Subject: [tips_and_tricks] Re: When GMAC goes bankrupt, Chapter 11 -- can a note holder recover his title?


      mn_chicago wrote:


      Let's see, a "lender" takes the promissory note,
      signed by a borrower, and unlawfully converts
      that signed note into a negotiable instrument,
      sells it to raise the funds needed to fund the
      borrower's own loan, and charges interest for
      the borrower to borrow his/her own funds.

      What does the "lender" give for consideration?

      Zip, nada, zilch....a computerzied blip into an
      account created to facilitate this fraud...

      ...and someone you deem trying to "weasel" out of
      a fradulent transaction doesn't sit well with you?

      It must please you to no end to sit on a judgment
      fence and act as the arbiter to determine at
      whom you point your judgmental finger...three of
      which are pointing back at you, as it were.

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