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4 x CD-Synchro Release, anyone?

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  • Eric Scott
    Hi All, If memory serves (and it doesn t) there was a somewhat dubious review of an experimental release in The Wire some time back...It was from an artist
    Message 1 of 23 , Sep 3, 2002
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      Hi All,

      If memory serves (and it doesn't) there was a
      somewhat dubious review of an experimental
      release in The Wire some time back...It was from
      an artist (and I'm thinking E.A.R. or Negativland here,
      but I'm unsure)...the gimmick was that there were
      4 discs in the box, all to be played simultaneously
      using 4 separate players (and to be cued up
      specially with front-end "countdowns" I believe...)
      so you & 3 of your best friends could hear the noises
      in a kind of mutated quad-sound...

      Can anyone remember the artist /and/or release title?

      Very much appreciated to anyone who can!

      Cheers,

      Eric

      --
      ------------------------------------------------------
      DAY for NIGHT
      voice: 310.393.3840 fax/modem: 310.393.2374
      ericscott@... http://www.dayfornight.com
      ======================================================
    • David Moore
      It was The Flaming Lips - Zaireeka. http://allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=Agekvikvkbb89 ...
      Message 2 of 23 , Sep 3, 2002
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        It was The Flaming Lips - Zaireeka.

        http://allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=Agekvikvkbb89

        >From: Eric Scott <ericscott@...>
        >Reply-To: thewire@yahoogroups.com
        >To: The Wire List <thewire@yahoogroups.com>
        >Subject: [thewire] 4 x CD-Synchro Release, anyone?
        >Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2002 22:55:35 -0700
        >
        >Hi All,
        >
        >If memory serves (and it doesn't) there was a
        >somewhat dubious review of an experimental
        >release in The Wire some time back...It was from
        >an artist (and I'm thinking E.A.R. or Negativland here,
        >but I'm unsure)...the gimmick was that there were
        >4 discs in the box, all to be played simultaneously
        >using 4 separate players (and to be cued up
        >specially with front-end "countdowns" I believe...)
        >so you & 3 of your best friends could hear the noises
        >in a kind of mutated quad-sound...
        >
        >Can anyone remember the artist /and/or release title?
        >
        >Very much appreciated to anyone who can!
        >
        >Cheers,
        >
        >Eric
        >
        >--
        >------------------------------------------------------
        > DAY for NIGHT
        > voice: 310.393.3840 fax/modem: 310.393.2374
        >ericscott@... http://www.dayfornight.com
        >======================================================
        >
        >




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      • Brett Miller
        Flaming Lips.
        Message 3 of 23 , Sep 4, 2002
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          Flaming Lips.


          Eric Scott wrote:
          >
          > Hi All,
          >
          > If memory serves (and it doesn't) there was a
          > somewhat dubious review of an experimental
          > release in The Wire some time back...It was from
          > an artist (and I'm thinking E.A.R. or Negativland here,
          > but I'm unsure)...the gimmick was that there were
          > 4 discs in the box, all to be played simultaneously
          > using 4 separate players (and to be cued up
          > specially with front-end "countdowns" I believe...)
          > so you & 3 of your best friends could hear the noises
          > in a kind of mutated quad-sound...
          >
          > Can anyone remember the artist /and/or release title?
          >
          > Very much appreciated to anyone who can!
          >
          > Cheers,
          >
          > Eric
          >
          > --
          > ------------------------------------------------------
          > DAY for NIGHT
          > voice: 310.393.3840 fax/modem: 310.393.2374
          > ericscott@... http://www.dayfornight.com
          > ======================================================
          >
          >
          > UNSUBSCRIBE = mailto:thewire-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          >
          > TheWire List Info Page: [getting there]
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        • wingsoftoast
          zaireeka is an interesting experience - i haven t managed to play the whole thing but on three cd players it makes you physically ill in a melancholic /
          Message 4 of 23 , Sep 4, 2002
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            zaireeka is an interesting experience - i haven't managed to play the
            whole thing but on three cd players it makes you physically ill in a
            melancholic / melodic way...

            incidentally i thought the recent editorial response to the new Lips
            lp was a little unfair - especially since a few issues ago they were
            singing the praises of the sadly gone completely dull mercury rev

            pete
          • Davis Ford
            ... hmm..completely dull now. i ve never heard music that emits more yawns. back in the day, tho.. boces, yerself is steam, etc., they were a great band.
            Message 5 of 23 , Sep 4, 2002
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              > incidentally i thought the recent editorial response
              > to the new Lips
              > lp was a little unfair - especially since a few
              > issues ago they were
              > singing the praises of the sadly gone completely
              > dull mercury rev
              >
              > pete

              hmm..completely dull now. i've never heard music that
              emits more yawns. back in the day, tho.. boces,
              yerself is steam, etc., they were a great band. maybe
              they need to get back into drugs and reform.

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            • gradyfinklemyer
              Yeah, they should get back into drugs . Who cares if they destroy their lives? At least Davis will find the music enjoyable.
              Message 6 of 23 , Sep 4, 2002
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                Yeah, they should "get back into drugs". Who cares if they destroy
                their lives? At least Davis will find the music enjoyable.

                --- In thewire@y..., Davis Ford <davisford@y...> wrote:
                >
                > > incidentally i thought the recent editorial response
                > > to the new Lips
                > > lp was a little unfair - especially since a few
                > > issues ago they were
                > > singing the praises of the sadly gone completely
                > > dull mercury rev
                > >
                > > pete
                >
                > hmm..completely dull now. i've never heard music that
                > emits more yawns. back in the day, tho.. boces,
                > yerself is steam, etc., they were a great band. maybe
                > they need to get back into drugs and reform.
                >
                > __________________________________________________
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                > http://finance.yahoo.com
              • wingsoftoast
                i m sure they re all grown-up and responsible enough to know just when to say when .... - mercury rev started out sounding like an inspired mix of butthole
                Message 7 of 23 , Sep 5, 2002
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                  i'm sure they're all grown-up and responsible enough to know just
                  when to say 'when'....
                  - mercury rev started out sounding like an inspired mix of butthole
                  surfers / dinosaur jnr / mbv and now sound like what rem probably
                  think they sound like only worse and real.
                  does anyone know what mr shady is doing with himself these days (last
                  time i saw mercury rev he got into a rather hilarious drunken fight
                  with a guy i was sharing a house with...)

                  peter



                  --- In thewire@y..., "gradyfinklemyer" <gradyfinklemyer@y...> wrote:
                  > Yeah, they should "get back into drugs". Who cares if they destroy
                  > their lives? At least Davis will find the music enjoyable.
                  >
                  > --- In thewire@y..., Davis Ford <davisford@y...> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > > incidentally i thought the recent editorial response
                  > > > to the new Lips
                  > > > lp was a little unfair - especially since a few
                  > > > issues ago they were
                  > > > singing the praises of the sadly gone completely
                  > > > dull mercury rev
                  > > >
                  > > > pete
                  > >
                  > > hmm..completely dull now. i've never heard music that
                  > > emits more yawns. back in the day, tho.. boces,
                  > > yerself is steam, etc., they were a great band. maybe
                  > > they need to get back into drugs and reform.
                  > >
                  > > __________________________________________________
                  > > Do You Yahoo!?
                  > > Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
                  > > http://finance.yahoo.com
                • Davis Ford
                  good one, carrot top. hey, next time you want to eat a pumpkin-head full of peyote and go lie down in the desert let me know. we ll take the ghetto-blaster
                  Message 8 of 23 , Sep 5, 2002
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                    good one, carrot top. hey, next time you want to eat
                    a pumpkin-head full of peyote and go lie down in the
                    desert let me know. we'll take the ghetto-blaster and
                    nothing but missy elliot and keiji haino cds!
                    woops...forgot about destroying your "life".

                    1-800-CALL-ATT, good buddy!

                    > --- In thewire@y..., "gradyfinklemyer"
                    > <gradyfinklemyer@y...> wrote:
                    > > Yeah, they should "get back into drugs". Who
                    > cares if they destroy
                    > > their lives? At least Davis will find the music
                    > enjoyable.


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                  • gradyfinklemyer
                    Wow that s funny. Did you recently purchase a sense of humour from someone? But seriously, could you recommend which David Hasselhoff cd s sound best when
                    Message 9 of 23 , Sep 5, 2002
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                      Wow that's funny. Did you recently purchase a sense of humour from
                      someone? But seriously, could you recommend which David Hasselhoff
                      cd's sound best when you're on your treadmill? Oh, I forgot, you only
                      listen to "stoner metal". Hey everyone, just picture Davis pretending
                      to be a stoner whilst listening to his stoner metal. Did your little
                      school mates call you a "poseur" when you were in junior high/high
                      school?


                      --- In thewire@y..., Davis Ford <davisford@y...> wrote:
                      > good one, carrot top. hey, next time you want to eat
                      > a pumpkin-head full of peyote and go lie down in the
                      > desert let me know. we'll take the ghetto-blaster and
                      > nothing but missy elliot and keiji haino cds!
                      > woops...forgot about destroying your "life".
                      >
                      > 1-800-CALL-ATT, good buddy!
                      >
                      > > --- In thewire@y..., "gradyfinklemyer"
                      > > <gradyfinklemyer@y...> wrote:
                      > > > Yeah, they should "get back into drugs". Who
                      > > cares if they destroy
                      > > > their lives? At least Davis will find the music
                      > > enjoyable.
                      >
                      >
                      > __________________________________________________
                      > Do You Yahoo!?
                      > Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
                      > http://finance.yahoo.com
                    • John Jones
                      That editorial was awful: I mean, Mr Young has a right to his tastes but when he starts making an argument about the Lips not being valid because it won t last
                      Message 10 of 23 , Sep 6, 2002
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                        That editorial was awful: I mean, Mr Young has a right
                        to his tastes but when he starts making an argument
                        about the Lips not being valid because it won't last
                        ten years...how the fuck does he know what's gonna
                        sound good in ten years? What kind of dumb,
                        post-historicist, transcendtalist criticism is this.
                        Sounds like something a Mojo writer would argue.



                        --- wingsoftoast <wingsoftoast@...> wrote:
                        <HR>
                        <html><body>


                        <tt>
                        <BR>
                        zaireeka is an interesting experience - i haven't
                        managed to play the <BR>
                        whole thing but on three cd players it makes you
                        physically ill in a <BR>
                        melancholic / melodic way...<BR>
                        <BR>
                        incidentally i thought the recent editorial response
                        to the new Lips <BR>
                        lp was a little unfair - especially since a few issues
                        ago they were <BR>
                        singing the praises of the sadly gone completely dull
                        mercury rev<BR>
                        <BR>
                        pete<BR>
                        <BR>
                        <BR>
                        </tt>

                        <br>

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                      • wingsoftoast
                        blimey- do you two know each other or something??? cool your boots davis! personally the whole rev being a bit dull thing to me is just part of a wider
                        Message 11 of 23 , Sep 6, 2002
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                          blimey- do you two know each other or something??? cool your boots
                          davis!
                          personally the whole rev being a bit dull thing to me is just part of
                          a wider post-rock dullness malaise (apart from the boredoms and
                          selected acid mothers bits) - rock seems to have as much in common
                          with fashion as it does with classical / jazz / folk - the spurious
                          quest for novelty for its own sake. The Strokes album is easily the
                          strongest 'rock' album of the last year despite the fact that it
                          sounds just like Television (why is originality such a big deal in
                          the age of mechanical reproduction?)- though i bought stuff by Jackie-
                          O and the No-Necks i can't help feeling that it's somewhat joyless
                          nurdley rubbish - emerson lake and palmer without the money / pomp-
                          vague? to like post-rock is to buy into a myth and i'd rather be
                          entertained myth or no myth.

                          a lot of post-rock bands seem to wear the badge of 'improvisation' as
                          if this was some sort of seal of quality in itself - what they forget
                          is that spontanaeity is part of any truly creative act (see cocteau
                          or wagner for similar viewpoint)whether written on a page or blown
                          straight out of a saxophone. aside from this they all seem to be
                          slightly overweight and bald.

                          on a final note - brainfuck fans should check out the last hour of
                          wagner's 'tristan and isolde' for a totally unexpected and completely
                          devastatingly fucking fantastic direct to the motherlode experience -
                          oh and the wire was right a couple of issues ago about shirley
                          collins (who'd have though folk could be so untweediddly?)

                          pete







                          --- In thewire@y..., "gradyfinklemyer" <gradyfinklemyer@y...> wrote:
                          > Wow that's funny. Did you recently purchase a sense of humour from
                          > someone? But seriously, could you recommend which David Hasselhoff
                          > cd's sound best when you're on your treadmill? Oh, I forgot, you
                          only
                          > listen to "stoner metal". Hey everyone, just picture Davis
                          pretending
                          > to be a stoner whilst listening to his stoner metal. Did your
                          little
                          > school mates call you a "poseur" when you were in junior high/high
                          > school?
                          >
                          >
                          > --- In thewire@y..., Davis Ford <davisford@y...> wrote:
                          > > good one, carrot top. hey, next time you want to eat
                          > > a pumpkin-head full of peyote and go lie down in the
                          > > desert let me know. we'll take the ghetto-blaster and
                          > > nothing but missy elliot and keiji haino cds!
                          > > woops...forgot about destroying your "life".
                          > >
                          > > 1-800-CALL-ATT, good buddy!
                          > >
                          > > > --- In thewire@y..., "gradyfinklemyer"
                          > > > <gradyfinklemyer@y...> wrote:
                          > > > > Yeah, they should "get back into drugs". Who
                          > > > cares if they destroy
                          > > > > their lives? At least Davis will find the music
                          > > > enjoyable.
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > __________________________________________________
                          > > Do You Yahoo!?
                          > > Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
                          > > http://finance.yahoo.com
                        • stevolende
                          ... the gimmick was that there were ... Die Todlichte Doris? or was that just 2lps? Think they got there a longtime earlier since that was released in the
                          Message 12 of 23 , Sep 6, 2002
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                            --- In thewire@y..., Eric Scott <ericscott@d...> wrote:
                            > Hi All,
                            the gimmick was that there were
                            > 4 discs in the box, all to be played simultaneously
                            > using 4 separate players (and to be cued up
                            > specially with front-end "countdowns" I believe...)
                            > so you & 3 of your best friends could hear the noises
                            > in a kind of mutated quad-sound...
                            >
                            > Can anyone remember the artist /and/or release title?
                            >
                            >

                            Die Todlichte Doris?
                            or was that just 2lps?
                            Think they got there a longtime earlier since that was released in
                            the early 80s, wonder if anybody else beat them to it?

                            it used to be fun to stick 2 tapes on simultaneously on the player at
                            my mothers place -Flipper and Howling wolf was cool as I recall
                            stevo
                            Np Savage REpublic Ivory Coast (parking lot version)
                          • majounrecordings
                            ... You re probably thinking of Choere & Soli (Choirs and Solos), which Toedliche Doris released in 1983, but that was something completely different: 8
                            Message 13 of 23 , Sep 6, 2002
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                              --- In thewire@y..., "stevolende" <stevolende@y...> wrote:

                              > Die Todlichte Doris?
                              > or was that just 2lps?

                              You're probably thinking of "Choere & Soli" (Choirs and Solos), which
                              Toedliche Doris released in 1983, but that was something completely
                              different: 8 "miniphon records" (a bit like these things you had to put
                              in the back of talking dolls) featuring garbled a cappellas of
                              childrens' songs, plus a battery-driven playing device (because the
                              records couldn't be played on a record player) and a book. The device
                              played only one record at a time, however, not several simultaneously.
                              I think about 1,000 were released by the Pure Freude label of
                              Dusseldorf (which was linked to Der Plan, those other German New Wave
                              pranksters).

                              There's a picture of it on the Doris website (www.die-toedliche-
                              doris.de) which also has MP3 soundfiles of all their recordings,
                              including a live performance of Choere & Soli, where a chattering and
                              unimpressed audience drowns out the actual play backs.

                              Cheers,
                              Carl
                            • Perfect Sound Forever
                              ... ...which is something much more toothsome than you would see in most any American music magazine. True, he s going out on a limb but a good editor and a
                              Message 14 of 23 , Sep 6, 2002
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                                >From: John Jones <jahminguk@...>
                                >That editorial was awful: I mean, Mr Young has a right to his tastes but
                                >when he starts making an argument about the Lips not being valid because
                                >it won't last ten years...how the fuck does he know what's gonna sound
                                >good in ten years? What kind of dumb, post-historicist, transcendtalist
                                >criticism is this. Sounds like something a Mojo writer would argue.

                                ...which is something much more toothsome than you would see in most any
                                American music magazine. True, he's going out on a limb but a good editor
                                and a good writer has the courage of their convictions to do this sometimes
                                rather than simply praise or damn each new release.

                                I know I'm in the minority but I happen to agree with Rob on this point, by
                                the way. I think the ideas behind the experiments that the Lips execute
                                (the 4-CD set, the boombox symphonies) are much more interesting and
                                satisfying than the music itself and even then, I don't think that will
                                constitute any kind of enduring legacy.

                                Best,
                                Jason

                                Perfect Sound Forever
                                online music magazine
                                perfect-sound@...
                                http://www.perfectsoundforever.com
                              • Davis Ford
                                you appear to be new to the list, mr. toast. the aforementioned friend-of-the-list mightily commands the wit of a limp fork. most folks have put him on the
                                Message 15 of 23 , Sep 7, 2002
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                                  you appear to be new to the list, mr. toast. the
                                  aforementioned friend-of-the-list mightily commands
                                  the wit of a limp fork. most folks have put him on
                                  the email block list. why, you ask? well, b/c it is
                                  painfully sad to habitually read his cries for help.

                                  post-rock dull malaise, eh? actually, i've just dug
                                  out all those swell post-rock albums from the early
                                  90s, and begun listening again. after 10 years of
                                  dust, they still don't sound that bad.

                                  polvo, pavement, windsor for the derby, tortoise,
                                  ganger, fridge, etc., etc. this stuff still sounds
                                  good after 10 years. rob young's mileage may vary.
                                  actually, the new windsor for the derby is quite good.

                                  the strokes..man,what the fuck is that? i think i
                                  heard the strokes on tv once? you say that is a
                                  strong rock album? why is it that all the bands i see
                                  on mainstream tv and radio sound like the jon spencer
                                  blues explosion and similar cohorts? rewind ten years
                                  ago: why is it all the indie bands sound like garage
                                  bands of the 60s? mtv should fling out copies of
                                  crypt's back from the grave series and pebbles comps
                                  to these kids. on a similar note, why is it that jon
                                  spencer decayed into total crap - bell bottom irony?
                                  isn't there some other spotlight icon called the white
                                  stripes or something or other? from detroit, even? i
                                  used to live in detroit..we had a good handful of
                                  garage rock winners - bantam rooster, gories,
                                  demolition doll rods, dirt bombs, etc. jesus, it's
                                  like the world caught up to garage rock revival bands.
                                  too bad the good ones aren't getting a deserved
                                  paycheck.

                                  no-neck blues band is joyless nurdley rubbish? what
                                  the hell does nurdley mean?

                                  --- wingsoftoast <wingsoftoast@...> wrote:
                                  > blimey- do you two know each other or something???
                                  > cool your boots
                                  > davis!
                                  > personally the whole rev being a bit dull thing to
                                  > me is just part of
                                  > a wider post-rock dullness malaise (apart from the
                                  > boredoms and
                                  > selected acid mothers bits) - rock seems to have as
                                  > much in common
                                  > with fashion as it does with classical / jazz / folk
                                  > - the spurious
                                  > quest for novelty for its own sake. The Strokes
                                  > album is easily the
                                  > strongest 'rock' album of the last year despite the
                                  > fact that it
                                  > sounds just like Television (why is originality such
                                  > a big deal in
                                  > the age of mechanical reproduction?)- though i
                                  > bought stuff by Jackie-
                                  > O and the No-Necks i can't help feeling that it's
                                  > somewhat joyless
                                  > nurdley rubbish - emerson lake and palmer without
                                  > the money / pomp-
                                  > vague? to like post-rock is to buy into a myth and
                                  > i'd rather be
                                  > entertained myth or no myth.
                                  >
                                  > a lot of post-rock bands seem to wear the badge of
                                  > 'improvisation' as
                                  > if this was some sort of seal of quality in itself -
                                  > what they forget
                                  > is that spontanaeity is part of any truly creative
                                  > act (see cocteau
                                  > or wagner for similar viewpoint)whether written on a
                                  > page or blown
                                  > straight out of a saxophone. aside from this they
                                  > all seem to be
                                  > slightly overweight and bald.

                                  ha! i can name one such culprit - anyone remember an
                                  album by some jokers called storm and stress on drag
                                  city 50 million years ago? what a crock of shit that
                                  was..but it got rave reviews -- "they are really
                                  encroaching on new territory", 'they' espoused. Give
                                  me Derek Bailey's worst plonking. i don't think those
                                  guys were bald, though.


                                  >
                                  > on a final note - brainfuck fans should check out
                                  > the last hour of
                                  > wagner's 'tristan and isolde' for a totally
                                  > unexpected and completely
                                  > devastatingly fucking fantastic direct to the
                                  > motherlode experience -
                                  > oh and the wire was right a couple of issues ago
                                  > about shirley
                                  > collins (who'd have though folk could be so
                                  > untweediddly?)
                                  >
                                  > pete

                                  grady, i feel bad for you. if you want public
                                  humiliation, why not just paint yourself naked green
                                  and go stand in the middle of a NASCAR race?
                                  follow-ups to alt.flame if you want to continue this
                                  (i'm game). don't bore the people here, though.

                                  >
                                  > --- In thewire@y..., "gradyfinklemyer"
                                  > <gradyfinklemyer@y...> wrote:
                                  > > Wow that's funny. Did you recently purchase a
                                  > sense of humour from
                                  > > someone? But seriously, could you recommend which
                                  > David Hasselhoff
                                  > > cd's sound best when you're on your treadmill? Oh,
                                  > I forgot, you
                                  > only
                                  > > listen to "stoner metal". Hey everyone, just
                                  > picture Davis
                                  > pretending
                                  > > to be a stoner whilst listening to his stoner
                                  > metal. Did your
                                  > little
                                  > > school mates call you a "poseur" when you were in
                                  > junior high/high
                                  > > school?
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > --- In thewire@y..., Davis Ford <davisford@y...>
                                  > wrote:
                                  > > > good one, carrot top. hey, next time you want
                                  > to eat
                                  > > > a pumpkin-head full of peyote and go lie down in
                                  > the
                                  > > > desert let me know. we'll take the
                                  > ghetto-blaster and
                                  > > > nothing but missy elliot and keiji haino cds!
                                  > > > woops...forgot about destroying your "life".
                                  > > >
                                  > > > 1-800-CALL-ATT, good buddy!
                                  > > >
                                  > > > > --- In thewire@y..., "gradyfinklemyer"
                                  > > > > <gradyfinklemyer@y...> wrote:
                                  > > > > > Yeah, they should "get back into drugs".
                                  > Who
                                  > > > > cares if they destroy
                                  > > > > > their lives? At least Davis will find the
                                  > music
                                  > > > > enjoyable.
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > __________________________________________________
                                  > > > Do You Yahoo!?
                                  > > > Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
                                  > > > http://finance.yahoo.com
                                  >
                                  >


                                  __________________________________________________
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                                • gradyfinklemyer
                                  Ya see, what I done did was, I took me my fishin pole down to the lake, and I put me some good bait on that there hook, then I cast out into that there water.
                                  Message 16 of 23 , Sep 7, 2002
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                                    Ya see, what I done did was, I took me my fishin' pole down to the
                                    lake, and I put me some good bait on that there hook, then I cast out
                                    into that there water. Waddya know, befo' long them davisfort fish
                                    was uh jumpin' n'bitin' at that there bait like crazy. Yippee. Also,
                                    Davis if'n you wants to know what "nurdley" means, just have a look
                                    see in your mirror.


                                    --- In thewire@y..., Davis Ford <davisford@y...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > no-neck blues band is joyless nurdley rubbish? what
                                    > the hell does nurdley mean?
                                    >
                                    > --- wingsoftoast <wingsoftoast@y...> wrote:
                                    > > blimey- do you two know each other or something???
                                    > > cool your boots
                                    > > davis!
                                    > > personally the whole rev being a bit dull thing to
                                    > > me is just part of
                                    > > a wider post-rock dullness malaise (apart from the
                                    > > boredoms and
                                    > > selected acid mothers bits) - rock seems to have as
                                    > > much in common
                                    > > with fashion as it does with classical / jazz / folk
                                    > > - the spurious
                                    > > quest for novelty for its own sake. The Strokes
                                    > > album is easily the
                                    > > strongest 'rock' album of the last year despite the
                                    > > fact that it
                                    > > sounds just like Television (why is originality such
                                    > > a big deal in
                                    > > the age of mechanical reproduction?)- though i
                                    > > bought stuff by Jackie-
                                    > > O and the No-Necks i can't help feeling that it's
                                    > > somewhat joyless
                                    > > nurdley rubbish - emerson lake and palmer without
                                    > > the money / pomp-
                                    > > vague? to like post-rock is to buy into a myth and
                                    > > i'd rather be
                                    > > entertained myth or no myth.
                                    > >
                                    > > a lot of post-rock bands seem to wear the badge of
                                    > > 'improvisation' as
                                    > > if this was some sort of seal of quality in itself -
                                    > > what they forget
                                    > > is that spontanaeity is part of any truly creative
                                    > > act (see cocteau
                                    > > or wagner for similar viewpoint)whether written on a
                                    > > page or blown
                                    > > straight out of a saxophone. aside from this they
                                    > > all seem to be
                                    > > slightly overweight and bald.
                                    >
                                    > ha! i can name one such culprit - anyone remember an
                                    > album by some jokers called storm and stress on drag
                                    > city 50 million years ago? what a crock of shit that
                                    > was..but it got rave reviews -- "they are really
                                    > encroaching on new territory", 'they' espoused. Give
                                    > me Derek Bailey's worst plonking. i don't think those
                                    > guys were bald, though.
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > >
                                    > > on a final note - brainfuck fans should check out
                                    > > the last hour of
                                    > > wagner's 'tristan and isolde' for a totally
                                    > > unexpected and completely
                                    > > devastatingly fucking fantastic direct to the
                                    > > motherlode experience -
                                    > > oh and the wire was right a couple of issues ago
                                    > > about shirley
                                    > > collins (who'd have though folk could be so
                                    > > untweediddly?)
                                    > >
                                    > > pete
                                    >
                                    > grady, i feel bad for you. if you want public
                                    > humiliation, why not just paint yourself naked green
                                    > and go stand in the middle of a NASCAR race?
                                    > follow-ups to alt.flame if you want to continue this
                                    > (i'm game). don't bore the people here, though.
                                    >
                                    > >
                                    > > --- In thewire@y..., "gradyfinklemyer"
                                    > > <gradyfinklemyer@y...> wrote:
                                    > > > Wow that's funny. Did you recently purchase a
                                    > > sense of humour from
                                    > > > someone? But seriously, could you recommend which
                                    > > David Hasselhoff
                                    > > > cd's sound best when you're on your treadmill? Oh,
                                    > > I forgot, you
                                    > > only
                                    > > > listen to "stoner metal". Hey everyone, just
                                    > > picture Davis
                                    > > pretending
                                    > > > to be a stoner whilst listening to his stoner
                                    > > metal. Did your
                                    > > little
                                    > > > school mates call you a "poseur" when you were in
                                    > > junior high/high
                                    > > > school?
                                    > > >
                                    > > >
                                    > > > --- In thewire@y..., Davis Ford <davisford@y...>
                                    > > wrote:
                                    > > > > good one, carrot top. hey, next time you want
                                    > > to eat
                                    > > > > a pumpkin-head full of peyote and go lie down in
                                    > > the
                                    > > > > desert let me know. we'll take the
                                    > > ghetto-blaster and
                                    > > > > nothing but missy elliot and keiji haino cds!
                                    > > > > woops...forgot about destroying your "life".
                                    > > > >
                                    > > > > 1-800-CALL-ATT, good buddy!
                                    > > > >
                                    > > > > > --- In thewire@y..., "gradyfinklemyer"
                                    > > > > > <gradyfinklemyer@y...> wrote:
                                    > > > > > > Yeah, they should "get back into drugs".
                                    > > Who
                                    > > > > > cares if they destroy
                                    > > > > > > their lives? At least Davis will find the
                                    > > music
                                    > > > > > enjoyable.
                                    > > > >
                                    > > > >
                                    > > > >
                                    > > __________________________________________________
                                    > > > > Do You Yahoo!?
                                    > > > > Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
                                    > > > > http://finance.yahoo.com
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > __________________________________________________
                                    > Do You Yahoo!?
                                    > Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes
                                    > http://finance.yahoo.com
                                  • A.S. Van Dorston
                                    Olias Nil of the recently defunct The Fire Show wrote a nice tribute to seven artists who deserved a bigger audience than they had -- The Velvet Underground,
                                    Message 17 of 23 , Sep 8, 2002
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                                      Olias Nil of the recently defunct The Fire Show wrote a nice tribute to
                                      seven artists who deserved a bigger audience than they had -- The Velvet
                                      Underground, The Fall, Robert Wyatt, Public Image Ltd., Arto Lindsay (DNA,
                                      Ambitious Lovers & solo), The Birthday Party and This Heat.

                                      http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/watw/02-06/fire-show.shtml

                                      What should we add to that list?

                                      Mine:
                                      Captain Beefheart: Often misunderstood with Trout Mask Replica as a Zappa
                                      protege delving in weirdness for weirdness' sake, on parts of Lick My
                                      Decals, Clear Spot, Shiny Beast, Doc At The Radar Station and Ice Cream For
                                      Crow Beefheart was actually as lucid, sharp, terse and powerful as anything
                                      in post-punk's oeuvre.

                                      Sun Ra: Wrongly written off as a loony by many jazz fans, Sun Ra mastered
                                      big band jazz in the 50s and went on to be a pioneer in avant-garde jazz,
                                      was a mentor to John Gilmore who was just as good as players like Archie
                                      Shepp and Ornette Coleman, and a body of work larger than Duke Ellington
                                      and Miles Davis combined.

                                      James Blood Ulmer: A protégé of Ornette Coleman, hugely influenced by Jimi
                                      Hendrix, his unique mix of jazz, blues, rock and avant-garde was hard to
                                      pigeonhole, and he never fully got the acclaim he deserved. Even
                                      Beefheart's later albums had more influence among the post-punk crowd than
                                      Ulmer's Tales Of Captain Black (1978), Are You Glad To Be In America?
                                      (1980), Free Lancing (1981), Black Rock (1982), Odyssey (1983).

                                      Fela Kuti: Often maligned by critics for his somewhat rudimentary horn
                                      playing, and James Brown influence, Fela deserved far more respect than
                                      that. Inventing Afro-Beat is nothing to sneeze at, he was a dynamo
                                      performer and band leader, and was regularly beaten and jailed for his
                                      outspoken politics. Who's willing to go through that for their art these days?

                                      Tom Zé: Caetano Veloso and Gilberto Gil founded Tropicália and were jailed
                                      and deported by the corrupt Brazilian dictatorship. But along with Os
                                      Mutantes, Zé gave the Tropicálistas their wildly anarchic, creative
                                      edge. The classically trained trickster was presumed missing/in hiding in
                                      the 70s, but actually he made four of his most brilliant albums -- Se O
                                      Caso É Chorar (1972), Todos os Olhos (1973), Estudando o Samba (1975), and
                                      Correio da Estação do Brás (1978). It wasn't until David Byrne reissued a
                                      compilation in 1989 that more than a handful of people heard of him.

                                      Roy Harper: A former folkie who was pals with Pink Floyd and Led Zeppelin
                                      (who paid tribute to him on "Hats Off To Harper" on III), he put out a
                                      string of stunning albums that were unknown to the mainstream audiences of
                                      both bands, and is just now are starting to show influences on people like
                                      Jim O'Rourke. On Stormcock ('71), "The Same Old Rock" features some hot
                                      guitar playing by Jimmy Page (playing under the pseudonym S. Flavius
                                      Mercurius). Lifemask ('73), Valentine ('74) and HQ ('75) are increasingly
                                      adventurous.

                                      Peter Hammill: Like Robert Wyatt, Robert Fripp and Fred Frith, Hammill is a
                                      prog player (Van Der Graaf Generator) who transcended the genre in his solo
                                      albums: Nadir's Big Chance ('74), Over ('75), and The Future Now ('78) are
                                      dark, intense albums. John Lydon cited him as an influence along with Can
                                      and Beefheart.





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                                      www.fastnbulbous.com

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                                    • jamello@aol.com
                                      Agree with some of those already mentioned (although some of them seemed pretty well recognized in their categories). A few off the top of my head: Out jazz
                                      Message 18 of 23 , Sep 8, 2002
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                                        Agree with some of those already mentioned (although some of them seemed
                                        pretty well recognized in their categories). A few off the top of my head:

                                        Out jazz -- Circle, The Necks
                                        Electronic -- Patrick Pulsinger
                                        Rock/pop -- Redd Kross, Silver Sun


                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      • John Farrar
                                        ... Mine: Captain Beefheart: Hmmm, I think he has a pretty large fan base. James Blood Ulmer: True! I ve only heard Are You Glad To Be In America -
                                        Message 19 of 23 , Sep 9, 2002
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                                          > What should we add to that list?

                                          Mine:
                                          Captain Beefheart:

                                          Hmmm, I think he has a pretty large fan base.

                                          James Blood Ulmer:

                                          True! I've only heard "Are You Glad To Be In America" - extraordinary
                                          album!


                                          Roy Harper:

                                          Again spot on! The double live is superb. "When an Old Crickerter Leaves
                                          the Crease" never fails to moisten the eyes.

                                          Peter Hammill:

                                          And again! He's got some new stuff out hasn't he?

                                          Maybe add:

                                          Andy Roberts - "Nina and the Dream Tree" was an amazing album.

                                          The Residents - OK, may have a reasonably sized cult following, but still
                                          mainly unknown.

                                          Gene Clark - "No Other" was the classic Americana album - before the genre
                                          was born.

                                          Wire - Seem to have recently been the band to name check. But no-one
                                          mentioned them much in the late 79s and early 80s.

                                          John F.
                                        • A.S. Van Dorston
                                          I don t know how large Beefheart s following is. Sure, a lot of people know about him and may have heard something from Trout Mask. But how many people do
                                          Message 20 of 23 , Sep 9, 2002
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                                            I don't know how "large" Beefheart's following is. Sure, a lot of people know about him and may have heard something from Trout Mask. But how many people do you actually know who own his albums? I can count them on one hand.
                                            Gene Clark and Residents are good ones. I just got the reissued White Light (1971) which is good but not amazing. No Other really needs to be reissued -- I haven't heard it. I'm giong to trade for a CDR with someone soon -- it must have been dubbed from vinyl.
                                            Having been into post-punk for a long time, it seems that every other band is compared to them in some way, which goes to show how they were really quite well known.
                                            T.
                                            John Farrar wrote:> What should we add to that list?

                                            Mine:
                                            Captain Beefheart:

                                            Hmmm, I think he has a pretty large fan base.

                                            James Blood Ulmer:

                                            True! I've only heard "Are You Glad To Be In America" - extraordinary
                                            album!


                                            Roy Harper:

                                            Again spot on! The double live is superb. "When an Old Crickerter Leaves
                                            the Crease" never fails to moisten the eyes.

                                            Peter Hammill:

                                            And again! He's got some new stuff out hasn't he?

                                            Maybe add:

                                            Andy Roberts - "Nina and the Dream Tree" was an amazing album.

                                            The Residents - OK, may have a reasonably sized cult following, but still
                                            mainly unknown.

                                            Gene Clark - "No Other" was the classic Americana album - before the genre
                                            was born.

                                            Wire - Seem to have recently been the band to name check. But no-one
                                            mentioned them much in the late 79s and early 80s.


                                            __________________________________
                                            Fast 'n' Bulbous
                                            Music Webzine
                                            www.fastnbulbous.com
                                            tony@...


                                            ---------------------------------
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                                          • John Farrar
                                            ... know about him and may have heard something from Trout Mask. But how many people do you actually know who own his albums? I can count them on one hand.
                                            Message 21 of 23 , Sep 9, 2002
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                                              > I don't know how "large" Beefheart's following is. Sure, a lot of people
                                              know about him and may have heard something from Trout Mask. But how many
                                              people do you actually know who own his albums? I can count them on one
                                              hand.

                                              Well, me anyway..... I went to his shows in the UK in the 70s and they
                                              were always sold out. But, of course, I suppose it's all relative.

                                              There were other bands from the US that seemed to be a lot less recognised
                                              than they should have been: Spirit, Steve Miller Band and later, Giant
                                              Sand.

                                              > Having been into post-punk for a long time, it seems that every other band
                                              is compared to them (Wire) in some way, which goes to show how they were
                                              really quite well known.

                                              On the other hand, Wire gigs were pretty poorly attended during the period
                                              of their first couple of albums.

                                              Oh, and how about John Martyn, Michael Rother, The Comsat Angels, Viv
                                              Stanshall, The Chameleons, Kevin Ayres, XTC.....

                                              John F.
                                            • trommer
                                              i d have to throw talk talk in there as well, from the colour of spring on, anyhow.
                                              Message 22 of 23 , Sep 9, 2002
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                                                i'd have to throw talk talk in there as well, from 'the colour of spring'
                                                on, anyhow.
                                              • tasha yee-king
                                                ... know about him and may have heard something from Trout Mask. But how many people do you actually know who own his albums? I can count them on one hand.
                                                Message 23 of 23 , Sep 13, 2002
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                                                  Price of tasmanian fish check its fresh meat think about it on your cloven shoesJohn Farrar <jfarrar@...> wrote:
                                                  > I don't know how "large" Beefheart's following is. Sure, a lot of people
                                                  know about him and may have heard something from Trout Mask. But how many
                                                  people do you actually know who own his albums? I can count them on one
                                                  hand.

                                                  Well, me anyway..... I went to his shows in the UK in the 70s and they
                                                  were always sold out. But, of course, I suppose it's all relative.

                                                  There were other bands from the US that seemed to be a lot less recognised
                                                  than they should have been: Spirit, Steve Miller Band and later, Giant
                                                  Sand.

                                                  > Having been into post-punk for a long time, it seems that every other band
                                                  is compared to them (Wire) in some way, which goes to show how they were
                                                  really quite well known.

                                                  On the other hand, Wire gigs were pretty poorly attended during the period
                                                  of their first couple of albums.

                                                  Oh, and how about John Martyn, Michael Rother, The Comsat Angels, Viv
                                                  Stanshall, The Chameleons, Kevin Ayres, XTC.....

                                                  John F.



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