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Re: jazz greats

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  • OLDSCHREC@xxx.xxx
    In a message dated 11/3/98 10:37:02 PM, you wrote:
    Message 1 of 9 , Nov 3, 1998
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      In a message dated 11/3/98 10:37:02 PM, you wrote:

      <<i've heard a little pharoah sanders, and i have to imagine this

      is what most of his stuff sounds like. i'd like to get into more cherry and

      pharoah sanders, so if anyone wants to drop ideas to explore (that goes for

      ayler too..i'll definitely be getting more of his stuff), please do.>>

      For CD recomendations try:


      Ayler:




      Spiritual Unity (ESP)

      Love Cry (Impulse)

      My Name Is Albert Ayler (Fantasy)

      Sanders:




      1st (ESP)

      Tahuid, Thembi or Karma (Impulse)

      Izipho Zam (Charly) lp on Strata East

      Sun Ra Arkestra feat. P. Sanders & Harold Black (1976 Saturn release of early
      60's live stuff) www.lastvestige.com might still have this lp for about $120

      Alice Coltrane records on Impulse

      or late period John Coltrane recordings on Impulse

      Cherry:



      Mu (Charly) lp on BYG/Actuel

      blue note releases

      Where Is Brooklyn? (Blue Note) w/ Sanders

      Sonet Recordings (see www.forcedexposure.com)

      Pete
    • Benito Vergara
      ... He s referring to Bernhard Gunter s Un Peu de Neige Salie, seen most recently in The Wire s Top 100 Records Issue With A Cover Featuring A Plastic Globe
      Message 2 of 9 , Nov 3, 1998
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        > -----Original Message-----
        > From: Davis Ford [mailto:forddavi@...]
        > Sent: Tuesday, November 03, 1998 11:37 PM

        > >about three or four months ago
        > >i bought un peu de neige salie
        > >and it may have changed my
        > >life
        >
        > can you expound on this a little more, richard. more explicitly, what the
        > hell record/artist are you referring to?

        He's referring to Bernhard Gunter's "Un Peu de Neige Salie," seen most
        recently in The Wire's Top 100 Records Issue With A Cover Featuring A
        Plastic Globe On Fire Instead Of Coil etc. etc.

        In response I already scoured the net and discovered it's on sale at
        Anomalous Records. (The usual suspects -- Amazon.com, CDNow, Forced
        Exposure -- didn't have it.)

        On Ayler's "Live in Greenwich Village":

        Amazing stuff. I like playing it along with "A Love Supreme" and
        "Meditations."

        > the songs within contain somewhat
        > recognizable melodies, yet you can never place them.

        They sound like traditional American spirituals, but I guess they're not.
        However on "Goin' Home" Ayler apparently plays off "When the Saints Go
        Marching In" and "Swing Low, Sweet Chariot."

        Ayler's "Spiritual Unity," I guess, should be your next purchase if you
        don't have it. Gary Peacock on bass, Sunny Murray on drums. The formidable
        duo of Richard Cook and Brian Morton (from the Penguin Guide to Jazz) give
        it their coveted crown. The album's out on ESP, so finding it may be a
        little dicey.

        Later,
        Ben
      • Davis Ford
        ... can you expound on this a little more, richard. more explicitly, what the hell record/artist are you referring to? i recently introduced myself to albert
        Message 3 of 9 , Nov 3, 1998
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          RE:

          >about three or four months ago
          >i bought un peu de neige salie
          >and it may have changed my
          >life

          can you expound on this a little more, richard. more explicitly, what the
          hell record/artist are you referring to?

          i recently introduced myself to albert ayler and don cherry yesterday. i'm
          now devoted fans of both.

          i'm listening to ayler's "live in greenwich village: complete impulse
          recordings". i always knew he was considered somewhat of an 'out' player,
          and i finally decided to take a dive. the songs within contain somewhat
          recognizable melodies, yet you can never place them. most of the time, it
          seems as if he's playing the kind of themes you'd find in early sax tutorial
          books (when the saints go marching in). he takes these simple lines and
          phrases and tortures them, only to play the next meter completely clean.
          his playing is all over the place. it's madness. meanwhile, the rhythm
          section is alive and rumbling with sweeps of hi-hat attack, and a muted bass
          kick that could be mistaken for the neighbors pounding on the wall. double
          bass rounds out the room...sometimes bowed, sometimes plucked...it's a
          swirling mess. i'm reminded at times of the no-neck blues band. i'm sure
          they've probably listened to a few ayler records. is it true donald ayler
          ended up in an insane asylum?

          i found a copy of don cherry's horizon/a&m album. it seems to be s/t
          (1975), with 'brown rice' as the lead off track. wild eastern-inflected
          space jazz permutations. cherry's religious incantations are spaced
          throughout. i've heard a little pharoah sanders, and i have to imagine this
          is what most of his stuff sounds like. i'd like to get into more cherry and
          pharoah sanders, so if anyone wants to drop ideas to explore (that goes for
          ayler too..i'll definitely be getting more of his stuff), please do.

          davis
        • rf
          ... sorry, bernhard günter and the point is that it has altered the extent of the sound environment that i now perceive and the extent to which i am
          Message 4 of 9 , Nov 4, 1998
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            >From: "Davis Ford" <forddavi@...>
            >
            >RE:
            >
            >>about three or four months ago
            >>i bought un peu de neige salie
            >>and it may have changed my
            >>life
            >
            >can you expound on this a little more, richard. more explicitly, what the
            >hell record/artist are you referring to?
            >
            sorry, bernhard g�nter and the point is that
            it has altered the extent of the sound
            environment that i now perceive and the
            extent to which i am uncontrollably
            listening to it in a detail/with as much
            'reading' of it as i would the cd itself.
            also the memory of the sounds from the cd
            impose themselves to the same degree
            when i am listening to it and when otherwise
            occupied - though this is not in the same
            way as say, negentropy (h3o, another recent buy)
            which when recalled would seem to be replayed
            abstractly, but it pervades with the same intensities
            and localisations (in my head) as when it is being played.

            so basically it interacts with me/ my envoronment beyond the cd being played
            and it has a changing effect on my perceptions - i take that to
            be a political move from some instrumental music.
            the crappy tactic of writing obliquely was an acknowledgement
            of being at ease with david grubbs' lyricism

            and no i don't mind being so far up my arse i can eat something twice in one go

            rf
          • Davis Ford
            ... played ... i managed your oblique strategies ok. i was just curious what specific sound medium you were referring to that caused this reaction. i ve had
            Message 5 of 9 , Nov 4, 1998
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              >sorry, bernhard g�nter and the point is that
              >it has altered the extent of the sound
              >environment that i now perceive and the
              >extent to which i am uncontrollably
              >listening to it in a detail/with as much
              >'reading' of it as i would the cd itself.
              >also the memory of the sounds from the cd
              >impose themselves to the same degree
              >when i am listening to it and when otherwise
              >occupied - though this is not in the same
              >way as say, negentropy (h3o, another recent buy)
              >which when recalled would seem to be replayed
              >abstractly, but it pervades with the same intensities
              >and localisations (in my head) as when it is being played.
              >
              >so basically it interacts with me/ my envoronment beyond the cd being
              played
              >and it has a changing effect on my perceptions - i take that to
              >be a political move from some instrumental music.
              >the crappy tactic of writing obliquely was an acknowledgement
              >of being at ease with david grubbs' lyricism

              i managed your oblique strategies ok. i was just curious what specific
              sound medium you were referring to that caused this reaction. i've had the
              same sort of reaction(s) with various minimalistic/musique concrete
              pieces --> mainly the effect of not knowing whether the record is playing or
              not (in my head vs. on the table), even occasionally in an environment where
              i'm nowhere near a stereo. this is a good thing, and not drug induced.
              that's why i was curious. it's likely something i will investigate. thanks
              for the tip.

              >
              >and no i don't mind being so far up my arse i can eat something twice in
              one go
              >
              >rf


              as long as you're comfortable in that position.

              thanks to the others for those ayler/sanders/cherry tips. i just ordered
              Sonet Recordings from Forced Exposure.

              davis
            • rf
              ... it gives me a unique insight into the feeling stimpy might have had when he folded into his navel it ll probably be safer than when i go to see d.bailey in
              Message 6 of 9 , Nov 4, 1998
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                >
                >as long as you're comfortable in that position.
                >
                it gives me a unique insight into the feeling stimpy might
                have had when he folded into his navel

                it'll probably be safer than when i go to see d.bailey in action tonight

                rf
              • Davis Ford
                ... From: rf To: thewire@onelist.com Date: Wednesday, November 04, 1998 9:03 AM Subject: [thewire] Re: jazz
                Message 7 of 9 , Nov 4, 1998
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                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: rf <richard.faith@...>
                  To: thewire@onelist.com <thewire@onelist.com>
                  Date: Wednesday, November 04, 1998 9:03 AM
                  Subject: [thewire] Re: jazz greats


                  >From: rf <richard.faith@...>
                  >
                  >
                  >>
                  >>as long as you're comfortable in that position.
                  >>
                  >it gives me a unique insight into the feeling stimpy might
                  >have had when he folded into his navel
                  >
                  >it'll probably be safer than when i go to see d.bailey in action tonight
                  >
                  >rf


                  please report promptly following the bailey performance.

                  stimpy may be dead, but george liquor ain't: www.spumco.com

                  davis
                • DeeDee
                  Hi, I know I´m a little late with my reply, but well... if anyone wants to drop ideas to explore (that goes for ... There´s a great album that Cherry and
                  Message 8 of 9 , Nov 4, 1998
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                    Hi,
                    I know I�m a little late with my reply, but well...

                    if anyone wants to drop ideas to explore (that goes for
                    > ayler too..i'll definitely be getting more of his stuff), please do.

                    There�s a great album that Cherry and Ayler did together, it�s called
                    "Vibrations"
                    Also,there�s a great Cherry album called "Actions" which was recorded
                    at the Donaueschingen Festival in the early seventies, with an all
                    star cast, Peter Br�tzmann among them. It�s a very powerful fusion of
                    indian chants and free Jazz. The same piece is also on an album called
                    "Humus"
                    And of course, all the Ornette Coleman records with Cherry are well
                    worth exploring, most of all "The Shape of Jazz to Come" and "This is
                    our Music". Cherry also had a project with Collin Walcott and Nana
                    Vasconcelos, they have three records on ECM full of great ethno-jazz.

                    And about Sanders, I recommend Alice Coltrane�s "Journey in
                    Satchinanada" and his own "Black Unity". Journey is very heavily
                    indluenced by indian music, and Sanders plays adorably on that one.
                    "unity" is one long piece ,very percussive and very dense.
                    And Albert Ayler�s "Love Cry" on Impulse! is quite a masterpiece, too.

                    I don�t have to mention you need "Ascension" and "Meditations" by
                    Coltrane, do I ?

                    I hope this may be of some use to you,
                    Cheers,
                    DeeDee
                  • Davis Ford
                    ... Thanks Dee Dee, and everybody else. It s been very helpful. Incidentally, is the new issue out yet in the US? I ve yet to see a copy. I suppose we get
                    Message 9 of 9 , Nov 4, 1998
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                      >From: DeeDee <deedee_523@...>
                      >Hi,
                      >I know I�m a little late with my reply, but well...

                      >I hope this may be of some use to you,
                      >Cheers,
                      >DeeDee
                      >


                      Thanks Dee Dee, and everybody else. It's been very helpful.

                      Incidentally, is the new issue out yet in the US? I've yet to see a copy.
                      I suppose we get shafted on the cover cd, too. Ah well.

                      davis
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