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Re: Theos-World What Were They The Masters Of ? Parts III and IV together

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  • Steven Levey
    Dear Sir-It is clear to me that your eruditneness regarding the lineage of these things is profound, and far beyond me as a student. But, I have something to
    Message 1 of 3 , Nov 25, 2002
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      Dear Sir-It is clear to me that your eruditneness regarding the lineage of
      these things is profound, and far beyond me as a student. But, I have
      something to say because I believe there are other perspectives (at least
      0ne) to take regrading the Mahatmas that are as self-validateing to this
      student as your learned perspective is to you. I was a member of the T.S 30
      years ago and after a short stay of a couple of years, I joined the United
      Lodge of Theosophists. As a student of ancient wisdom in general I developed
      a focus upon the concept of Mahatmas, primarily because the concept of
      Masters of Wisdom as brothers and sincere spiritual human beings who became
      what they are through their own self-devised effort, is very motivating. And
      that is how they are characterized in true Theosophical writings. Now, you
      may feel, that becoming "what they are" is erroneous and therefore should
      certainly not be emulated. And, it seems, your decision would be made based
      upon what you have perused of the "Mahatma Letters". Frankly I would and
      actually felt similarly, if they were all I was steering my studies by. My
      study and the closest students within my circle of study feel as if they
      (The Mahatma Letters)are nearly impossible to use since their context or
      focus seemed to be to individual students. They are valid as productions of
      the beings attributed to, but their subject matter seemed to be limited to
      the student on the original receiving end. Therefore, and as such, they
      should never have been published to a general audience. I read them when
      they came my way as a member of the T.S. At that time, as I do when I read
      something difficult to characterize or to practically use, I put them on a
      "back burner", so to speak. Upon spending many years studying HPB's The
      Secret Doctrine along with her collective writtings as well as Willam Quan
      Judge's, Robert Crosbie, and others, it became clear to me that students who
      flaunt knowledge of the Mahatma Letters are doing so for some egocentric
      purpose. Why? Because when you place what the Mahatmas have said in the
      context in which they are placed in thoughtful writtings aimed at giving the
      student as much context as possible in which to understand their wisdom, one
      might learn something useful. Otherwise, the Mahatma Letters stand only as
      an inigma. Real, but rather practically useless. Those in HPB's direct
      lineage, which leaves out many, if not most writers in the Thesophical
      Society, who have recieved further instruction from the Lodge of Mahatmas,
      have never given a collection of the Mahatma letters to be printed. They
      have ALWAYS been exerpted and put in the context of principled ideation
      regarding a subject matter in discussion. Why exerpted? Because it is clear
      to students of the Wisdom religion, that the Chelas of Mahatmas are given
      instructions as to how the wisdom of the Teacher will be used. This trust is
      beyond question amongst those so chosen. In fact that is part and parcel of
      the Teacher-Desciplic realtionship. None the less, each student is implored
      to study on their own and to draw their own conclusions.
      Perhaps, more importantly, is the ideal of putting to work the best
      ethical thought, word and deed that one can. The great Paramitas are most
      always overlooked by the phenomena addicted student. This great ethical
      teaching is pronounced by HPB and Her Teachers as the paramount motive
      behind the Theosophical Movement. This is true now and I know it was true in
      HPB's day. And disscusion of high beings and their powers are a terrible
      trap. AS can be the trap of high erudition becaue it can become an end in
      itself. The path which it uncovers may seem not as "tasty" to the mind, as
      the nearly tactle feeling of accruing knowledge, which leaves the mystically
      inclined, ethical student within, simply ignored. The becoming of the
      Pratyeka Buddha is at the crown of this while the Nirmanakaya is the product
      of the practice of the Heart Doctrine. These choices need to be made and one
      is making them by our inclinations whether we know it or not. A good thing I
      say. Sincerely-Steven Levey





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    • Daniel H. Caldwell
      Steven, you wrote in part: My study and the closest students within my circle of study feel as if they (The Mahatma Letters)are nearly impossible to use since
      Message 2 of 3 , Nov 25, 2002
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        Steven, you wrote in part:

        "My study and the closest students within my circle of study feel as
        if they (The Mahatma Letters)are nearly impossible to use since their
        context or focus seemed to be to individual students. They are valid
        as productions of the beings attributed to, but their subject matter
        seemed to be limited to the student on the original receiving end."

        You write that the Mahatma Letters are "nearly impossible to use."
        Why? Steven, could you clarify what you mean in the above passage?

        I am somewhat unclear what you are referring to when you write
        that "their subject matter seemed to be limited to the student of the
        original receiving end."

        Daniel
      • dalval14@earthlink.net
        Nov 26 2002 Re MAHATMA LETTERS Dear Steven: Thanks for this copy for me to see ? It is easier to read if you could break up your message into paragraphs, and
        Message 3 of 3 , Nov 26, 2002
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          Nov 26 2002
          Re MAHATMA LETTERS
          Dear Steven:

          Thanks for this copy for me to see ?

          It is easier to read if you could break up your message into
          paragraphs, and make the breaks when you change observations or
          subject. Do help.

          I don't make it a practice of quoting much from the MAHATMA LETTERS,
          as The SECRET DOCTRINE which came at the end of that correspondence in
          1888, sums up the Theosophical position, and sets Mr Sinnett's
          writings into their true perspective..

          I would never attribute motives to others as we do not know what they
          are. But we can ask questions.

          I find the MAHATMA LETTERS is most valuable in assisting devotees, and
          in setting the ethical and moral tone for aspirant We can all use
          that for self-examination. But the results are of course kept private
          as they concern ourselves only, as I see it..

          Exactly how things were, in H P B's time we can only guess at.

          I think you are right in the matter of the goals of those who follow
          the "eye" or the "heart" doctrines.

          Best wishes,

          Dallas

          =================



          -----Original Message-----
          From: Steven Levey [mailto:levey_steven@...]
          Sent: Monday, November 25, 2002 12:41 PM
          To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: Theos-World What Were They The Masters Of ? Parts III and
          IV together

          Dear Sir-It is clear to me that your eruditneness regarding the
          lineage of
          these things is profound, and far beyond me as a student. But, I have
          something to say because I believe there are other perspectives (at
          least
          0ne) to take regarding the Mahatmas that are as self-validating to
          this
          student as your learned perspective is to you. I was a member of the
          T.S 30
          years ago and after a short stay of a couple of years, I joined the
          United
          Lodge of Theosophists. As a student of ancient wisdom in general I
          developed
          a focus upon the concept of Mahatmas, primarily because the concept of
          Masters of Wisdom as brothers and sincere spiritual human beings who
          became
          what they are through their own self-devised effort, is very
          motivating. And
          that is how they are characterized in true Theosophical writings. Now,
          you
          may feel, that becoming "what they are" is erroneous and therefore
          should
          certainly not be emulated. And, it seems, your decision would be made
          based
          upon what you have perused of the "Mahatma Letters". Frankly I would
          and
          actually felt similarly, if they were all I was steering my studies
          by. My
          study and the closest students within my circle of study feel as if
          they
          (The Mahatma Letters)are nearly impossible to use since their context
          or
          focus seemed to be to individual students. They are valid as
          productions of
          the beings attributed to, but their subject matter seemed to be
          limited to
          the student on the original receiving end. Therefore, and as such,
          they
          should never have been published to a general audience. I read them
          when
          they came my way as a member of the T.S. At that time, as I do when I
          read
          something difficult to characterize or to practically use, I put them
          on a
          "back burner", so to speak. Upon spending many years studying HPB's
          The
          Secret Doctrine along with her collective writings as well as William
          Quan
          Judge's, Robert Crosbie, and others, it became clear to me that
          students who
          flaunt knowledge of the Mahatma Letters are doing so for some
          egocentric
          purpose. Why? Because when you place what the Mahatmas have said in
          the
          context in which they are placed in thoughtful writings aimed at
          giving the
          student as much context as possible in which to understand their
          wisdom, one
          might learn something useful. Otherwise, the Mahatma Letters stand
          only as
          an enigma. Real, but rather practically useless. Those in HPB's direct
          lineage, which leaves out many, if not most writers in the
          Theosophical
          Society, who have received further instruction from the Lodge of
          Mahatmas,
          have never given a collection of the Mahatma letters to be printed.
          They
          have ALWAYS been excerpted and put in the context of principled
          ideation
          regarding a subject matter in discussion. Why excerpted? Because it is
          clear
          to students of the Wisdom religion, that the Chelas of Mahatmas are
          given
          instructions as to how the wisdom of the Teacher will be used. This
          trust is
          beyond question amongst those so chosen. In fact that is part and
          parcel of
          the Teacher-Disciple relationship. None the less, each student is
          implored
          to study on their own and to draw their own conclusions.
          Perhaps, more importantly, is the ideal of putting to work the
          best
          ethical thought, word and deed that one can. The great Paramitas are
          most
          always overlooked by the phenomena addicted student. This great
          ethical
          teaching is pronounced by HPB and Her Teachers as the paramount motive
          behind the Theosophical Movement. This is true now and I know it was
          true in
          HPB's day. And discussion of high beings and their powers are a
          terrible
          trap. AS can be the trap of high erudition because it can become an
          end in
          itself. The path which it uncovers may seem not as "tasty" to the
          mind, as
          the nearly tactile feeling of accruing knowledge, which leaves the
          mystically
          inclined, ethical student within, simply ignored. The becoming of the
          Pratyeka Buddha is at the crown of this while the Nirmanakaya is the
          product
          of the practice of the Heart Doctrine. These choices need to be made
          and one
          is making them by our inclinations whether we know it or not. A good
          thing I
          say. Sincerely-Steven Levey





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