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Leon wrote: "...the Adepts who founded ULT...."

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  • Daniel H. Caldwell
    On Apr 12, 2005, Leon wrote about: ...the Adepts who founded ULT.... Quoted from: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/theos-talk/message/24241 And on April 18,
    Message 1 of 2 , May 5 9:45 AM
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      On Apr 12, 2005, Leon wrote about:

      "...the Adepts who founded ULT...."

      Quoted from:
      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/theos-talk/message/24241

      And on April 18, Leon also commented:

      "Therefore, if any current theosophical group
      could be the considered the heirs of the original
      TS, it would be those who followed in the footsteps
      of WQJ (one of the original founders), stayed far
      distant from any religious beliefs, practices or
      politics, and who still base their studies on the
      SD and other original writings of both HPB and WQJ
      -- such as ULT and its independent lodges,
      study groups, and associates... Some of whom
      (and I speak from both direct and indirect
      personal knowledge) have been in contact with
      certain occult 'Masters' who admonish them to
      never repeat the failed experiment of forming
      organized society's, or churches to represent
      "theosophy" -- lest it becomes just another
      dogmatic religion that ultimately must
      politically go to bed with the black magic
      practicing enemies of the true theosophical teachings."

      I call special attention to these two excerpts:

      "...the Adepts who founded ULT...."

      "Some [ULT associattes??] of whom (and I speak
      from both direct and indirect personal knowledge)
      have been in contact with certain occult 'Masters'..."

      There is no mention in the two histories of the
      Theosophical Movement published by the Theosophy
      Company that the ULT was found by "Adepts".

      In one publication issued by the Theosophy Company, one
      finds the following:

      ================================================
      There is also the association of Theosophical students known as the
      United Lodge of Theosophists, formed in 1909 in Los Angeles,
      California, under the inspiration and guidance of Robert Crosbie.
      Mr. Crosbie was a Boston Theosophist during the time of William Q.
      Judge. He worked very closely with Judge, enjoying his
      confidence....He secured work in Los Angeles and gradually began to
      gather around him a few students—most of them entirely new to
      Theosophy—to undertake once more the task of promulgating
      Theosophy in the same form as originally presented by the Founders
      of the Movement. When, in 1909, he had been joined by a small
      nucleus of persons who shared this ideal, The United Lodge of
      Theosophists was formed to carry out the purposes in view....

      U.L.T. has no "leaders," in the sense that any personal authority
      attaches to leadership, and no "teachers" save the literature of the
      Movement and the principles of the philosophy itself. As in all
      human endeavors, the influence of individuals is felt in the work of
      the United Lodge of Theosophists, but this occurs in the natural
      course of the working together of a number of people, more or less
      experienced, more or less devoted and schooled in the philosophy,
      toward a common end. It was the distinctive contribution of Robert
      Crosbie, in setting going the work of the United Lodge of
      Theosophists—and he lived until 1919, ten years after the
      formation of the Parent Lodge in Los Angeles—that the emphasis
      should
      always be upon ideas, principles and objectives, and never upon
      claims or living personalities, though recognition of H. P.
      Blavatsky and Wm. Q. Judge, through their teachings, was basic to
      understanding....

      While the students who were associated with Mr. Crosbie from the
      beginning made outstanding contributions to the Movement, they never
      sought personal recognition, and those coming later also follow the
      example of Mr. Crosbie in directing attention only to the original
      teachings and teachers and Theosophical principles....

      As Mr. Crosbie never made any claims in his own behalf, there is no
      need to defend his "status" in the Movement. What "status" belongs
      to him is that which might be naturally accorded the man who
      resuscitated the teachings, the methods and program of work of the
      Founders of the original Society, and who was able to inspire others
      to go and do likewise....
      ======================================================
      Quoted from:
      http://www.phx-ult-lodge.org/theosophica%20lmovement.htm
      pp. 316-318.

      In the above history there is NO mention of the ULT being
      founded by Adepts.

      Is Leon claiming that Robert Crosbie was one of these "adepts"?

      And who were the other "adepts"?

      Moving on.

      And when Leon writes about some ULT associates being
      "in contact with certain occult 'Masters'...", is he
      referring to present day associates or is he referring
      to the "early days" of the ULT??

      If Leon will enlighten us on these matters, we may have
      to have the following list of claimants updated to include
      Leon's "adepts" and "latter-day messengers" at:

      http://blavatskyarchives.com/latermessengers.htm#six

      Daniel H. Caldwell
      Blavatsky Study Center
      http://hpb.cc
    • Daniel H. Caldwell
      Relevant to Leon s comments quoted at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/theos-talk/message/26298 I give the below information. In 2001 on Theos-Talk, I wrote
      Message 2 of 2 , May 5 10:24 AM
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        Relevant to Leon's comments quoted at:
        http://groups.yahoo.com/group/theos-talk/message/26298
        I give the below information.

        In 2001 on Theos-Talk, I wrote Gregory
        Tillett as follows:

        "About 15 years ago Walter A. Carrithers, Jr.
        told me that the DES 'officials' (Robert Crosbie,
        John Garrigues, Grace Clough and others) claimed
        to be in contact and communication with HPB,
        WQJ and the Masters. I believe that in a phone
        conversation later with John Cooper he also
        told me that this was his understanding of
        the claims of the above named individuals."

        "Gregory, can you confirm these observations and
        are there any extant papers that verify what
        Walter and John believed was true?"

        Quoted from:

        http://www.theosophy.com/theos-talk/200107/tt00156.html

        Dr. Tillett replied as follows:

        "I do not recall the discussions you mention, although
        I was certainly told by several sources that Crosbie
        claimed to have left Pt Loma because he asserted he
        was in contact with HPB and the Masters, and that
        he continued to make this claim thereafter. I can
        cite not source for the story, given that my notebooks
        are now archived in the attic. I recall talking about
        this with John, but I do not now recall whether he
        mentioned any supporting evidence."

        Quoted from:

        http://www.theosophy.com/theos-talk/200108/tt00039.html

        Daniel
        http://hpb.cc
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