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Re: Theos-World Indigenous Australians

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  • gregory@zeta.org.au
    Any reference to indigenous Australians in relation to Theosophy is somewhat unfortunate given the racist comments made about them by Theosophical writers,
    Message 1 of 5 , Aug 12, 2001
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      Any reference to indigenous Australians in relation to Theosophy is
      somewhat unfortunate given the racist comments made about them by
      Theosophical writers, including Blavatsky. Admittedly, none has quite
      surpassed Leadbeater's promotion of a quasi-thoeosphical genocide as the
      solution to the "karmic" problem (?) of Australian Aboriginal people, but
      others like Jinarajadasa seem to have tried valiantly to do so. His
      "First Principles of Theosophy" heads enthusiastically in the direction
      of the Nazi's pseudo-science of racial "classification". This has been
      claimed as the reason the book has never been reprinted by the TPH in the
      USA (although one US publisher has indeed recently released a reprint of
      the work). Ignorance of science can, presumably, explain the strangely
      racist views of Blavatsky, Leadbeater et al towards the indigenous
      peoples of Australia. One would be hard pressed to argue that they
      possessed insights into "universal wisdom" in this regard. It is either
      ironic or scandalous to note that various TS groups in Australia offer
      lectures on such topics as the "Wisdom of the Australian Aborigines"
      while still selling (and sometimes in modern editions) works which define
      them as less than fully human. Of course, it is more common for the TPH
      to selectively edit out the more blatant racism from the writings of
      Leadbeater and others. For a country still (after 200 years) struggling
      to find a place in its family of humanity for its first peoples, the
      standard works of theosophical writers have only a message of despair.
      The influence of theosophy on various forms of racism against Australian
      Aborigines is a topic which warrants further historical study.

      Gregory Tillett
    • Bart Lidofsky
      Notably, in the Mahatma letters, while they do refer to the Australian aborigines, at most they say that the Australian aborigines have the remains of the
      Message 2 of 5 , Aug 12, 2001
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        Notably, in the Mahatma letters, while they do refer to the Australian
        aborigines, at most they say that the Australian aborigines have the
        remains of the CIVILIZATION of the 4th root race, and this has been read
        into by many that Australian aborigines are MEMBERS of the 4th root
        race. From Blavatsky, what I have read implies not that the Aborigines
        should be put to death, but that, as their civilization is pretty much,
        "been there, done that", that there are fewer and fewer people who have
        something to learn from them, and therefore they are dying out due to
        low birth rate.

        But it is important to remember that acting as an agent of karma does
        not absolve one of any of the karmic debt that one brings upon one's
        self by one's actions. A good parable is in the New Testament, where it
        was Jesus' karma to be crucified, but Judas was still damned for
        betraying him.

        Bart Lidofsky

        gregory@... wrote:
        > USA (although one US publisher has indeed recently released a reprint of
        > the work). Ignorance of science can, presumably, explain the strangely
        > racist views of Blavatsky, Leadbeater et al towards the indigenous
        > peoples of Australia.
      • Drpsionic@aol.com
        In a message dated 8/12/01 10:36:13 PM Central Daylight Time, bartl@sprynet.com writes:
        Message 3 of 5 , Aug 12, 2001
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          In a message dated 8/12/01 10:36:13 PM Central Daylight Time,
          bartl@... writes:

          << but Judas was still damned for
          betraying him.
          >>

          Except in the minds of those of us who through history have wished he had
          done it three years earlier!

          Chuck the Heretic
        • Peter Merriott
          ... Bart, That was very well put. A relevant passage from the Mahatma Letters is below and indicates that from the perspective of the Secret Doctine... * The
          Message 4 of 5 , Aug 13, 2001
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            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: Bart Lidofsky
            > Sent: 13 August 2001 04:34
            > To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: Re: Theos-World Indigenous Australians
            >
            >
            > Notably, in the Mahatma letters, while they do refer to the
            > Australian
            > aborigines, at most they say that the Australian aborigines have the
            > remains of the CIVILIZATION of the 4th root race, and this has been read
            > into by many that Australian aborigines are MEMBERS of the 4th root
            > race. From Blavatsky, what I have read implies not that the Aborigines
            > should be put to death, but that, as their civilization is pretty much,
            > "been there, done that", that there are fewer and fewer people who have
            > something to learn from them, and therefore they are dying out due to
            > low birth rate.


            Bart,

            That was very well put. A relevant passage from the Mahatma Letters is
            below and indicates that from the perspective of the Secret Doctine...

            * The aborigenes belonged to the highest and last branch of the 4th Root
            Race and had reached their highest civilisation long before our strutting
            peacock of western physical-intellectual subraces had even appeared.

            * The majority of mankind belongs to the last sub race of the Fourth Race
            and the last sub race of the Third Race

            * The "white conquerors" (presumably the white Indo-European Stock - 5th
            Sub race of Fifth Race) are spoken of by the Mahatma as the most developed
            in "physical-intellectual" capacity. (To get this in perspective, we need
            to keep in mind this is 'brain intellect' or Lower Manas devoid of the
            spiritual light of Buddhi and probably nothing to feel that proud about.)

            * From the SPIRITUAL perspective the highest spiritually developed race of
            this 5th Root Race of are the Aryan Asiatics. (1st Sub race of Fifth Race)


            I qoute the whole passage below, for the interested reader.

            ...Peter

            =====================
            From the MAHATMA LETTERS TO A.P. SINNETT;

            But to return to "civilizations." Do you know that the Chaldees were at the
            apex of their Occult fame before what you term as the "bronze Age"? That the
            "Sons of Ad" or the children of the Fire Mist preceded by hundreds of
            centuries the Age of Iron, which was an old age already, when what you now
            call the Historical Period -- probably because what is known of it is
            generally no history but fiction -- had hardly begun. We hold -- but then
            what warrant can you give the world that we are right? -- that far "greater
            civilizations than our own have risen and decayed." It is not enough to say
            as some of your modern writers do -- that an extinct civilization existed
            before Rome and Athens were founded. We affirm that a series of
            civilizations existed before, as well as after the Glacial Period, that they
            existed upon various points, of the globe, reached the apex of glory and --
            died. Every trace and memory had been lost of the Assyrian and Phoenikean
            civilizations until discoveries began to be made a few years ago. And now
            they open a new, though not by far one of the earliest pages in the history
            of mankind. And yet how far back do those civilizations go in comparison
            with the oldest? -- and even them, history is shy to accept. Archeo-geology
            has sufficiently demonstrated that the memory of man runs back vastly
            further than history has been willing to accept, and the sacred records of
            once mighty nations preserved by their heirs are still more worthy of trust.
            We speak of civilizations of the anteglacial period; and (not only in the
            minds of the vulgar and the profane but even in the opinion of the highly
            learned geologist) the claim sounds preposterous. What would you say then to
            our affirmation that the Chinese -- I now speak of the inland, the true
            Chinaman, not of the hybrid mixture between the fourth and the fifth Races
            now occupying the throne -- the aborigines, who belong in their unallied
            nationality wholly to the highest and last branch of the fourth Race,
            reached their highest civilization when the fifth had hardly appeared in
            Asia, and that its first off-shoot was yet a thing of the future. When was
            it? Calculate. You cannot think that we, who have such tremendous odds
            against the acceptance of our doctrine would deliberately go on inventing
            Races and sub-races (in the opinion of Mr. Hume) were not they a matter of
            undeniable fact. The group of islands off the Siberian coast discovered by
            Nordeneskjol of the "Vega" was found strewn with fossils of horses, sheep,
            oxen, etc., among gigantic bones of elephants, mammoths, rhinoceroses and
            other monsters belonging to periods when man -- says your science -- had not
            yet made his appearance on earth. How came horses and sheep to be found in
            company with the huge "ante-diluvians"? The horse, we are taught in
            schools -- is quite a modern invention of nature, and no man ever saw its
            pedactyl ancestor. The group of the Siberian islands may give the lie to the
            comfortable theory. The region now locked in the fetters of eternal winter
            uninhabited by man -- that most fragile of animals, -- will be very soon
            proved to have had not only a tropical climate -- something your science
            knows and does not dispute, -- but having been likewise the seat of one of
            the most ancient civilisations of that fourth race, whose highest relics now
            we find in the degenerated Chinaman, and whose lowest are hopelessly (for
            the profane scientist) intermixed with the remnants of the third. I told you
            before now, that the highest people now on earth (spiritually) belong to the
            first sub-race of the fifth root Race; and those are the Aryan Asiatics; the
            highest race (physical intellectuality) is the last sub-race of the fifth --
            yourselves the white conquerors. The majority of mankind belongs to the
            seventh sub-race of the fourth Root race, -- the above mentioned Chinamen
            and their off-shoots and branchlets (Malayans, Mongolians, Tibetans,
            Javanese, etc., etc., etc.) and remnants of other sub-races of the fourth --
            and the seventh sub-race of the third race. All these, fallen, degraded
            semblances of humanity are the direct lineal descendants of highly civilized
            nations neither the names nor memory of which have survived except in such
            books as Popalvul and a few others unknown to Science.

            (Mahatma Letter No. 23b - T Barker edition)
            =============================
          • dalval14@earthlink.net
            Monday, August 13, 2001 Dear Gregory: I am quite sure that H.P.Blavatsky did not write about the various Races of men that were on the decline (as considered
            Message 5 of 5 , Aug 13, 2001
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              Monday, August 13, 2001

              Dear Gregory:

              I am quite sure that H.P.Blavatsky did not write about the
              various Races of men that were on the decline (as considered from
              the point of view of Theosophical progress, evolution and
              vocabulary) in any sense as similar to our present
              anthropological concepts of race, racism, etc.

              Theosophy views the physiological races as the temporary
              residences of immortal reincarnating EGOS. From that point of
              view a physiological race may actually decline and eventually
              vanish from the point of view of heredity. Though I would
              observe that those close distinctions that prevailed as to
              locality and racial characteristics were more sharply identified
              in her days than ours -- due to the great then prevailing
              restrictions in travel.

              No slurs are cast by her (in this context) on any "race" as we
              used the term today. In fact under Theosophical theory and
              teaching the EGO uses the race-body best suited to its individual
              development when it reincarnates -- that is, if we accept the
              concept of individual KARMA melding at all times with the World,
              and country Karma on the time. Heredity merely serves to
              indicate the formation of a group of peculiarly characteristics
              that are developed in a "race." Their physiological heredity has
              something to do with that.

              It is most unfortunate that in the past 1,000 or more years, our
              history traces many instances of genocide based on prejudices or
              a social, a religious, or a hereditary base -- and pay little
              attention to INDIVIDUALS and their development as persons during
              a particular era and at a particular time.

              The norms that we have framed and adopted are not necessarily
              universally true either in the past or the present. Therefore i
              say the whole of the Theosophical philosophy has to be considered
              and checked to see if it is as complete and intermeshing as it
              claims.

              Of course if the Theosophical scheme is rejected, any explanation
              falls to the ground. But I would observe that our science is
              very accurate in observation, and quite inaccurate in trying to
              review and devise answers that when applied theoretically,
              explain the past. There are constant revision being made. The
              motives considered to be anthropologically active of our society
              are not necessarily the motives of a past, or a different one,
              that exists elsewhere today.

              Best wishes,

              Dallas

              ========================

              -----Original Message-----
              From: gregory@... [mailto:gregory@...]
              Sent: Sunday, August 12, 2001 12:16 PM
              To: theos-talk@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: Theos-World Indigenous Australians

              Any reference to indigenous Australians in relation to Theosophy
              is
              somewhat unfortunate given the racist comments made about them by
              Theosophical writers, including Blavatsky. Admittedly, none has
              quite
              surpassed Leadbeater's promotion of a quasi-thoeosphical genocide
              as the
              solution to the "karmic" problem (?) of Australian Aboriginal
              people, but
              others like Jinarajadasa seem to have tried valiantly to do so.
              His
              "First Principles of Theosophy" heads enthusiastically in the
              direction
              of the Nazi's pseudo-science of racial "classification". This has
              been
              claimed as the reason the book has never been reprinted by the
              TPH in the
              USA (although one US publisher has indeed recently released a
              reprint of
              the work). Ignorance of science can, presumably, explain the
              strangely
              racist views of Blavatsky, Leadbeater et al towards the
              indigenous
              peoples of Australia. One would be hard pressed to argue that
              they
              possessed insights into "universal wisdom" in this regard. It is
              either
              ironic or scandalous to note that various TS groups in Australia
              offer
              lectures on such topics as the "Wisdom of the Australian
              Aborigines"
              while still selling (and sometimes in modern editions) works
              which define
              them as less than fully human. Of course, it is more common for
              the TPH
              to selectively edit out the more blatant racism from the writings
              of
              Leadbeater and others. For a country still (after 200 years)
              struggling
              to find a place in its family of humanity for its first peoples,
              the
              standard works of theosophical writers have only a message of
              despair.
              The influence of theosophy on various forms of racism against
              Australian
              Aborigines is a topic which warrants further historical study.

              Gregory Tillett



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