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8602Re: Leadbeater & Blavatsky

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  • netemara888
    Nov 11, 2002
      I have been reading about the TS as a group of personalities for 30
      years now, and combined with my intuition I never thought there was
      any connection of substance between HPB and WCL. And as we know HPB
      is not shy. If she had some substantial dealings with WCL and that
      group...it would be documented somewhere. No way did she give WCL the
      Voice. I have read all of ODL by Olcott and that is the real
      historian of the group. While he had more of a relationship with
      Annie who was involved with WLC and others, even he mentions WLC
      little if at all. I think there was a strain, but probably suspect
      that the interests of the two groups were probably splintered which
      happens all the time in these groups.

      Just like one yahoo group grows out of another one. There is no
      hostility there necessarily just people exploring their interests in
      more depth. Now, we know that WLC did have an interest in having
      young men follow him and vice versa, plus his spiritists interest.
      There is a great deal spoken about the relationship between WLC and
      Krishnamurti in the books about K's life. That is good source
      actually. Luckily K and his brother were not part of WLC's entourage
      as far as emotionally. K said he did not like WLC but loved Red



      --- In theos-talk@y..., <gregory@z...> wrote:
      > The claim that Leadbeater was a member of ³HPB¹s circle in Avenue
      Road² both lacks any support from historical evidence, and is
      contrary to such evidence as there is. It was a claim only made (of
      course) after HPB¹s death. What is meant by ³a member of HPB¹s
      circle²? Clearly, it does not mean membership of the ES, let alone of
      the IG of the ES; membership lists for both exist and Leadbeater was
      not among those named. Why was he not a member of either of these two
      > No correspondence between HPB and Leadbeater exists to support any
      intimate relationship, and no correspondence of HPB exists in which
      there is any reference to Leadbeater implying any such relationship.
      Leadbeater is known to have visited HPB twice between his return to
      England from India and her death. Boris de Zirkhoff stated that there
      was no evidence in any of HPB¹s papers or correspondence to suggest
      any close relationship between Leadbeater and HPB, and Alice Leighton
      Cleather, a member of HPB¹s Inner Group, denied that HPB had ever
      referred to Leadbeater as a pupil or associate, and said she had
      never seen him at the London headquarters during HPB¹s life.
      Leadbeater¹s own accounts of his life at that period make no
      reference to or claim of a special relationship with HPB - until he
      revised his history well after HPB¹s death. Indeed, Leadbeater was a
      member of the London Lodge, and a close associate of A.P. Sinnett, at
      a time when there was tension, if not conflict, between Sinnett and
      the London Lodge, and HPB and the Blavatsky Lodge. Leadbeater acted
      as a medium in Sinnett¹s quest to make contact with the Masters, and
      was a member of what was, in effect, Sinnett¹s ³Inner Group².
      > Jinarajadasa, who was living with Leadbeater at the time, made no
      claim for any special relationship between HPB and Leadbeater in his
      accounts of the period. See, for example, Jinarajadasa¹s ³K.H.Letters
      to C.W.Leadbeater², 1943:68-69.
      > Given the total absence of evidence to support the claim that
      Leadbeater was a member of ³HPB¹s circle in Avenue Road², and the
      evidence against the claim, anyone asserting Leadbeater¹s special
      relationship is obliged to present their evidence.
      > The claim that HPB presented Leadbeater with the ³first copy² of
      ³The Voice of the Silence² is similarly entirely unsupported by
      historical evidence. That she presented him with a copy is certain;
      curiously enough, her inscription in that copy does not correctly
      name Leadbeater. She inscribed it to ³W.C.Leadbeater². This implies
      either that she did not even correctly recall his name, or that she
      was making a peculiarly English joke at his expense. Neither
      explanation suggests a close or personal relationship. As with all
      claims about Leadbeater, those who make them should present evidence,
      not mere assertions in the absence of evidence. Given that Leadbeater
      was obviously a pathological liar, nothing can be taken on his word
      > Dr Gregory Tillett
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