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Lulu in The Guardian

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  • olive_e_thomas
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/21/female-icons-cinema/print
    Message 1 of 13 , Jan 22, 2009
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    • ioracara
      Interesting list, but a possible error in Brooksie s section. I have never seen anything that suggests she and Pabst were lovers, and especially in anything
      Message 2 of 13 , Jan 22, 2009
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        Interesting list, but a possible error in Brooksie's section. I have
        never seen anything that suggests she and Pabst were lovers, and
        especially in anything I've read that Louise wrote herself. What hat did
        this Rachel Millward pull that out of? Is there anything out there I
        missed that supports this?

        --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
        <no_reply@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/21/female-icons-cinema/p\
        rint
        >



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • das_imperator
        ... Not so much from a hat as from a helmet... From The Girl in the Black Helmet by Kenneth Tynan From the fattest of all her files, Brooks now pulled out a
        Message 3 of 13 , Jan 22, 2009
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          --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "ioracara"
          <ioracara@...> wrote:
          >
          > Interesting list, but a possible error in Brooksie's section. I have
          > never seen anything that suggests she and Pabst were lovers, and
          > especially in anything I've read that Louise wrote herself. What hat did
          > this Rachel Millward pull that out of? Is there anything out there I
          > missed that supports this?
          >

          Not so much from a hat as from a helmet...

          From "The Girl in the Black Helmet" by Kenneth Tynan

          From the fattest of all her files, Brooks now pulled out a two-shot.
          Beaming in a cloche hat, she stands arm in arm with a stocky,
          self-possessed man in a homburg. He also wears steel-rimmed glasses, a
          bow tie, and a well-cut business suit; you would guess he was in his
          early forties. "Mr. Pabst," she said simply. "That was 1928, in
          Berlin, while we were making Pandora's Box. As I told you, I arrived
          with George Marshall, and Mr. Pabst hated him, because he kept me up
          all night, going round the clubs. A few weeks later, George went back
          to the States, and after that Mr. Pabst locked me up in my hotel when
          the day's shooting was finished. Everyone thought he was in love with
          me. On the rare evenings when I went to his apartment for dinner, his
          wife, Trudi, would walk out and bang the door. Mr. Pabst was a highly
          respectable man, but he had the most extraordinary collection of
          obscene stills in the world. He even had one of Sarah Bernhardt nude
          with a black-lace fan. Did you know that in the twenties it was the
          custom for European actresses to send naked pictures of themselves to
          movie directors? He had all of them. Anyway, I didn't have an affair
          with him in Berlin. In 1929, though, when he was in Paris trying to
          set up Prix de BeautŽ, we went out to dinner at a restaurant and I
          behaved rather outrageously. For some reason, I slapped a close friend
          of mine across the face with a bouquet of roses. Mr. Pabst was
          horrified. He hustled me out of the place and took me back to my
          hotel, where - what do I do? I'm in a terrific mood, so I decide to
          banish his disgust by giving the best sexual performance of my career.
          I jump into the hay and deliver myself to him body and soul. [Her
          voice is jubilant.] He acted as if he'd never experienced such a thing
          in his life. You know how men want to pin medals on themselves when
          they excite you? They get positively radiant. Next morning, Mr. Pabst
          was so pleased he couldn't see straight. That was why he postponed
          Prix de BeautŽ and arranged to make The Diary of a Lost Girl first. He
          wanted the affair to continue. But I didn't, and when I got to Berlin
          it was like Pandora's Box all over again, except that this time the
          man I brought with me was the Eskimo - my white headed boy from Zelli's."

          © Kenneth Tynan Estate

          This article originally appeared in The New Yorker in 1979.

          This text taken from: Show People: Profiles in Entertainment by
          Kenneth Tynan, published by Weidenfeld and Nicolson, London, 1980
        • ioracara
          Welllllll OK. But I m only awarding half a point. The wording in The Guardian implies she was Pabst s lover when she went off to Germany, when in reality she
          Message 4 of 13 , Jan 22, 2009
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            Welllllll OK. But I'm only awarding half a point.

            The wording in The Guardian implies she was Pabst's lover when she
            went off to Germany, when in reality she didn't even know who he was
            at the time.

            Also, I think the word "lover" is in error anyway. The Tynan piece
            seems to indicate a one-night performance, which I think defines a
            "fling" rather than a romance.

            But perhaps I'm splitting bobbed hairs.

            --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "das_imperator"
            <dasimperator@...> wrote:
            >
            > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "ioracara"
            > <ioracara@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Interesting list, but a possible error in Brooksie's section. I have
            > > never seen anything that suggests she and Pabst were lovers, and
            > > especially in anything I've read that Louise wrote herself. What
            hat did
            > > this Rachel Millward pull that out of? Is there anything out there I
            > > missed that supports this?
            > >
            >
            > Not so much from a hat as from a helmet...
            >
            > From "The Girl in the Black Helmet" by Kenneth Tynan
            >
            > From the fattest of all her files, Brooks now pulled out a two-shot.
            > Beaming in a cloche hat, she stands arm in arm with a stocky,
            > self-possessed man in a homburg. He also wears steel-rimmed glasses, a
            > bow tie, and a well-cut business suit; you would guess he was in his
            > early forties. "Mr. Pabst," she said simply. "That was 1928, in
            > Berlin, while we were making Pandora's Box. As I told you, I arrived
            > with George Marshall, and Mr. Pabst hated him, because he kept me up
            > all night, going round the clubs. A few weeks later, George went back
            > to the States, and after that Mr. Pabst locked me up in my hotel when
            > the day's shooting was finished. Everyone thought he was in love with
            > me. On the rare evenings when I went to his apartment for dinner, his
            > wife, Trudi, would walk out and bang the door. Mr. Pabst was a highly
            > respectable man, but he had the most extraordinary collection of
            > obscene stills in the world. He even had one of Sarah Bernhardt nude
            > with a black-lace fan. Did you know that in the twenties it was the
            > custom for European actresses to send naked pictures of themselves to
            > movie directors? He had all of them. Anyway, I didn't have an affair
            > with him in Berlin. In 1929, though, when he was in Paris trying to
            > set up Prix de BeautŽ, we went out to dinner at a restaurant and I
            > behaved rather outrageously. For some reason, I slapped a close friend
            > of mine across the face with a bouquet of roses. Mr. Pabst was
            > horrified. He hustled me out of the place and took me back to my
            > hotel, where - what do I do? I'm in a terrific mood, so I decide to
            > banish his disgust by giving the best sexual performance of my career.
            > I jump into the hay and deliver myself to him body and soul. [Her
            > voice is jubilant.] He acted as if he'd never experienced such a thing
            > in his life. You know how men want to pin medals on themselves when
            > they excite you? They get positively radiant. Next morning, Mr. Pabst
            > was so pleased he couldn't see straight. That was why he postponed
            > Prix de BeautŽ and arranged to make The Diary of a Lost Girl first. He
            > wanted the affair to continue. But I didn't, and when I got to Berlin
            > it was like Pandora's Box all over again, except that this time the
            > man I brought with me was the Eskimo - my white headed boy from
            Zelli's."
            >
            > © Kenneth Tynan Estate
            >
            > This article originally appeared in The New Yorker in 1979.
            >
            > This text taken from: Show People: Profiles in Entertainment by
            > Kenneth Tynan, published by Weidenfeld and Nicolson, London, 1980
            >
          • nutsaboutclara
            Nice to see Brooksie get a mention from the Guardian. At least Europeans like the British appreciate silent film performers like Louise, not like the rest of
            Message 5 of 13 , Jan 23, 2009
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              Nice to see Brooksie get a mention from the Guardian. At least
              Europeans like the British appreciate silent film performers like
              Louise, not like the rest of America, who could give a (blank) about
              silent film. Shame on the U.S.A.!

              -Dario.


              --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
              <no_reply@...> wrote:
              >
              > http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/21/female-icons-
              cinema/print
              >
            • das_imperator
              To be fair you might want to check the member list of this and your Clara Bow group before making such a blanket statement. I m sure the good old USA is fairly
              Message 6 of 13 , Jan 24, 2009
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                To be fair you might want to check the member list of this and your
                Clara Bow group before making such a blanket statement. I'm sure the
                good old USA is fairly well represented in silent movie fandom. Most
                of the books and DVDs that cover the silent period come out of the US
                market and do so because there are buyers for them.

                --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, nutsaboutclara
                <no_reply@...> wrote:
                >
                > Nice to see Brooksie get a mention from the Guardian. At least
                > Europeans like the British appreciate silent film performers like
                > Louise, not like the rest of America, who could give a (blank) about
                > silent film. Shame on the U.S.A.!
                >
                > -Dario.
                >
                >
                > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                > <no_reply@> wrote:
                > >
                > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/21/female-icons-
                > cinema/print
                > >
                >
              • nutsaboutclara
                True, but I was talking about the movie-going public of today, not specifically the silent film fan base here in America. The silent film fan base already
                Message 7 of 13 , Jan 24, 2009
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                  True, but I was talking about the movie-going public of today, not
                  specifically the silent film fan base here in America. The silent
                  film fan base already appreciates Brooksie very much, but not the
                  general movie-going public; anything that's not made for today's
                  taste is held in high regard. Europeans on the other hand, not only
                  view today's films, but enjoy the classics of the past, including
                  silent films. That's why I posted the comment; Europeans appreciate
                  silent films more than the average American does. It's a reflection
                  of our times, really.

                  -Dario.


                  --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "das_imperator"
                  <dasimperator@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > To be fair you might want to check the member list of this and your
                  > Clara Bow group before making such a blanket statement. I'm sure the
                  > good old USA is fairly well represented in silent movie fandom. Most
                  > of the books and DVDs that cover the silent period come out of the
                  US
                  > market and do so because there are buyers for them.
                  >
                  > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, nutsaboutclara
                  > <no_reply@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Nice to see Brooksie get a mention from the Guardian. At least
                  > > Europeans like the British appreciate silent film performers like
                  > > Louise, not like the rest of America, who could give a (blank)
                  about
                  > > silent film. Shame on the U.S.A.!
                  > >
                  > > -Dario.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                  > > <no_reply@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/21/female-icons-
                  > > cinema/print
                  > > >
                  > >
                  >
                • ioracara
                  Like das impersonator, I have to disagree with this. I have traveled extensively in Europe, and there does not seem to be any greater popular appreciation for
                  Message 8 of 13 , Jan 24, 2009
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                    Like das impersonator, I have to disagree with this. I have traveled
                    extensively in Europe, and there does not seem to be any greater
                    popular appreciation for silent films than here in the U.S. The only
                    country I've seen that has an appreciation for those films is possibly
                    France, and they also seem to be the only one with any organized
                    groups trying to preserve silents . . . but only a couple, and they
                    are government sponsored.

                    Here, however, we have a great number of groups dedicated to
                    preserving old films, and most are publicly and corporately sponsored,
                    as well as by the government. We have the LOC, but also the Eastman
                    House, the AFI, Turner Classics, Kino, Criterion, UCLA, and on and on.
                    I have no concrete info to make this next statement, but via
                    observation I firmly believe more silent films have been preserved
                    through American efforts than the rest of the world combined.

                    Germany has no such groups, nor does Britain. Italy has enough trouble
                    just being Italy. And Eastern Europe? Not at all.

                    Furthermore, I know of theaters in at least three U.S. different
                    cities that regularly show silent films, including one in Los Angeles
                    that shows nothing BUT silent films. Even France cannot claim that.

                    Grass is often greener on the other side, but in this case I think the
                    original statement was incorrect in its assumption. Even though it's
                    easy to make such claims, not everything in Europe is better than in
                    the U.S.

                    --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, nutsaboutclara
                    <no_reply@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > True, but I was talking about the movie-going public of today, not
                    > specifically the silent film fan base here in America. The silent
                    > film fan base already appreciates Brooksie very much, but not the
                    > general movie-going public; anything that's not made for today's
                    > taste is held in high regard. Europeans on the other hand, not only
                    > view today's films, but enjoy the classics of the past, including
                    > silent films. That's why I posted the comment; Europeans appreciate
                    > silent films more than the average American does. It's a reflection
                    > of our times, really.
                    >
                    > -Dario.
                    >
                    >
                    > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "das_imperator"
                    > <dasimperator@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > To be fair you might want to check the member list of this and your
                    > > Clara Bow group before making such a blanket statement. I'm sure the
                    > > good old USA is fairly well represented in silent movie fandom. Most
                    > > of the books and DVDs that cover the silent period come out of the
                    > US
                    > > market and do so because there are buyers for them.
                    > >
                    > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, nutsaboutclara
                    > > <no_reply@> wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > > Nice to see Brooksie get a mention from the Guardian. At least
                    > > > Europeans like the British appreciate silent film performers like
                    > > > Louise, not like the rest of America, who could give a (blank)
                    > about
                    > > > silent film. Shame on the U.S.A.!
                    > > >
                    > > > -Dario.
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                    > > > <no_reply@> wrote:
                    > > > >
                    > > > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/21/female-icons-
                    > > > cinema/print
                    > > > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    >
                  • olive_e_thomas
                    Actually much of the crap movies made here are done so with an eye to being able to sell them in the European market. The pleathora of minimalist dialogue
                    Message 9 of 13 , Jan 24, 2009
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                      Actually much of the crap movies made here are done so with an
                      eye to being able to sell them in the European market. The
                      pleathora of minimalist dialogue 'action' pictures are made
                      because Europeans hate reading subtitles as much as
                      Americans do.

                      It's the same reason techno music is popular over there. Songs
                      where the lryics don't really matter sell better in a multilinqual
                      market.

                      As for silent movies, they sell better when you can adapt the title
                      cards to the language of the country you're showing them in so
                      naturally they'll get programmed more in Europe than the US.

                      Also the economics and politics of European cinema are such
                      that each nation demands a certain amount of 'national' content
                      so small budget dialog-rich pictures are more easily made
                      there.

                      We have a market of about 300 million which tends to support
                      the production of big budget pictures.

                      One might suspect that because europe has so many different
                      nationalities with their own social strata they'll have a larger base
                      of the intellectual type that appreciates cinema than a large
                      country like ours. Someone once noted that Switzerland has a
                      population the size of Chicago that because it's broken up into
                      numerous cities, towns and villages supports dozens of different
                      newspapers while Chicago can only support a couple due to the
                      economy of scale.

                      --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com,
                      nutsaboutclara <no_reply@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > True, but I was talking about the movie-going public of today,
                      not
                      > specifically the silent film fan base here in America. The silent
                      > film fan base already appreciates Brooksie very much, but not
                      the
                      > general movie-going public; anything that's not made for
                      today's
                      > taste is held in high regard. Europeans on the other hand, not
                      only
                      > view today's films, but enjoy the classics of the past, including
                      > silent films. That's why I posted the comment; Europeans
                      appreciate
                      > silent films more than the average American does. It's a
                      reflection
                      > of our times, really.
                      >
                      > -Dario.
                      >
                      >
                    • KarenUK
                      Bristol, England (where I live) is doing a Silent Film Festival at the moment. About two years ago, they had another where I saw Pandora s Box in a theatre on
                      Message 10 of 13 , Jan 24, 2009
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                        Bristol, England (where I live) is doing a Silent Film Festival at the
                        moment. About two years ago, they had another where I saw Pandora's Box in a
                        theatre on a big screen with a live orchestra doing the music!

                        Karen (UK).


                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: "ioracara" <ioracara@...>
                        To: <thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com>
                        Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2009 7:02 PM
                        Subject: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Re: Lulu in The Guardian


                        > Like das impersonator, I have to disagree with this. I have traveled
                        > extensively in Europe, and there does not seem to be any greater
                        > popular appreciation for silent films than here in the U.S. The only
                        > country I've seen that has an appreciation for those films is possibly
                        > France, and they also seem to be the only one with any organized
                        > groups trying to preserve silents . . . but only a couple, and they
                        > are government sponsored.
                        >
                        > Here, however, we have a great number of groups dedicated to
                        > preserving old films, and most are publicly and corporately sponsored,
                        > as well as by the government. We have the LOC, but also the Eastman
                        > House, the AFI, Turner Classics, Kino, Criterion, UCLA, and on and on.
                        > I have no concrete info to make this next statement, but via
                        > observation I firmly believe more silent films have been preserved
                        > through American efforts than the rest of the world combined.
                        >
                        > Germany has no such groups, nor does Britain. Italy has enough trouble
                        > just being Italy. And Eastern Europe? Not at all.
                        >
                        > Furthermore, I know of theaters in at least three U.S. different
                        > cities that regularly show silent films, including one in Los Angeles
                        > that shows nothing BUT silent films. Even France cannot claim that.
                        >
                        > Grass is often greener on the other side, but in this case I think the
                        > original statement was incorrect in its assumption. Even though it's
                        > easy to make such claims, not everything in Europe is better than in
                        > the U.S.
                        >
                        > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, nutsaboutclara
                        > <no_reply@...> wrote:
                        >>
                        >> True, but I was talking about the movie-going public of today, not
                        >> specifically the silent film fan base here in America. The silent
                        >> film fan base already appreciates Brooksie very much, but not the
                        >> general movie-going public; anything that's not made for today's
                        >> taste is held in high regard. Europeans on the other hand, not only
                        >> view today's films, but enjoy the classics of the past, including
                        >> silent films. That's why I posted the comment; Europeans appreciate
                        >> silent films more than the average American does. It's a reflection
                        >> of our times, really.
                        >>
                        >> -Dario.
                        >>
                        >>
                        >> --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "das_imperator"
                        >> <dasimperator@> wrote:
                        >> >
                        >> > To be fair you might want to check the member list of this and your
                        >> > Clara Bow group before making such a blanket statement. I'm sure the
                        >> > good old USA is fairly well represented in silent movie fandom. Most
                        >> > of the books and DVDs that cover the silent period come out of the
                        >> US
                        >> > market and do so because there are buyers for them.
                        >> >
                        >> > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, nutsaboutclara
                        >> > <no_reply@> wrote:
                        >> > >
                        >> > > Nice to see Brooksie get a mention from the Guardian. At least
                        >> > > Europeans like the British appreciate silent film performers like
                        >> > > Louise, not like the rest of America, who could give a (blank)
                        >> about
                        >> > > silent film. Shame on the U.S.A.!
                        >> > >
                        >> > > -Dario.
                        >> > >
                        >> > >
                        >> > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                        >> > > <no_reply@> wrote:
                        >> > > >
                        >> > > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/21/female-icons-
                        >> > > cinema/print
                        >> > > >
                        >> > >
                        >> >
                        >>
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ------------------------------------
                        >
                        > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                      • nutsaboutclara
                        Did you go see it, Karen? -Dario. ... the ... Pandora s Box in a ... traveled ... only ... possibly ... they ... sponsored, ... Eastman ... and on. ...
                        Message 11 of 13 , Feb 6, 2009
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                          Did you go see it, Karen?

                          -Dario.


                          --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "KarenUK"
                          <nhbr22476@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Bristol, England (where I live) is doing a Silent Film Festival at
                          the
                          > moment. About two years ago, they had another where I saw
                          Pandora's Box in a
                          > theatre on a big screen with a live orchestra doing the music!
                          >
                          > Karen (UK).
                          >
                          >
                          > ----- Original Message -----
                          > From: "ioracara" <ioracara@...>
                          > To: <thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com>
                          > Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2009 7:02 PM
                          > Subject: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Re: Lulu in The Guardian
                          >
                          >
                          > > Like das impersonator, I have to disagree with this. I have
                          traveled
                          > > extensively in Europe, and there does not seem to be any greater
                          > > popular appreciation for silent films than here in the U.S. The
                          only
                          > > country I've seen that has an appreciation for those films is
                          possibly
                          > > France, and they also seem to be the only one with any organized
                          > > groups trying to preserve silents . . . but only a couple, and
                          they
                          > > are government sponsored.
                          > >
                          > > Here, however, we have a great number of groups dedicated to
                          > > preserving old films, and most are publicly and corporately
                          sponsored,
                          > > as well as by the government. We have the LOC, but also the
                          Eastman
                          > > House, the AFI, Turner Classics, Kino, Criterion, UCLA, and on
                          and on.
                          > > I have no concrete info to make this next statement, but via
                          > > observation I firmly believe more silent films have been
                          preserved
                          > > through American efforts than the rest of the world combined.
                          > >
                          > > Germany has no such groups, nor does Britain. Italy has enough
                          trouble
                          > > just being Italy. And Eastern Europe? Not at all.
                          > >
                          > > Furthermore, I know of theaters in at least three U.S. different
                          > > cities that regularly show silent films, including one in Los
                          Angeles
                          > > that shows nothing BUT silent films. Even France cannot claim
                          that.
                          > >
                          > > Grass is often greener on the other side, but in this case I
                          think the
                          > > original statement was incorrect in its assumption. Even though
                          it's
                          > > easy to make such claims, not everything in Europe is better
                          than in
                          > > the U.S.
                          > >
                          > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, nutsaboutclara
                          > > <no_reply@> wrote:
                          > >>
                          > >> True, but I was talking about the movie-going public of today,
                          not
                          > >> specifically the silent film fan base here in America. The
                          silent
                          > >> film fan base already appreciates Brooksie very much, but not
                          the
                          > >> general movie-going public; anything that's not made for today's
                          > >> taste is held in high regard. Europeans on the other hand, not
                          only
                          > >> view today's films, but enjoy the classics of the past,
                          including
                          > >> silent films. That's why I posted the comment; Europeans
                          appreciate
                          > >> silent films more than the average American does. It's a
                          reflection
                          > >> of our times, really.
                          > >>
                          > >> -Dario.
                          > >>
                          > >>
                          > >> --- In
                          thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "das_imperator"
                          > >> <dasimperator@> wrote:
                          > >> >
                          > >> > To be fair you might want to check the member list of this
                          and your
                          > >> > Clara Bow group before making such a blanket statement. I'm
                          sure the
                          > >> > good old USA is fairly well represented in silent movie
                          fandom. Most
                          > >> > of the books and DVDs that cover the silent period come out
                          of the
                          > >> US
                          > >> > market and do so because there are buyers for them.
                          > >> >
                          > >> > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com,
                          nutsaboutclara
                          > >> > <no_reply@> wrote:
                          > >> > >
                          > >> > > Nice to see Brooksie get a mention from the Guardian. At
                          least
                          > >> > > Europeans like the British appreciate silent film
                          performers like
                          > >> > > Louise, not like the rest of America, who could give a
                          (blank)
                          > >> about
                          > >> > > silent film. Shame on the U.S.A.!
                          > >> > >
                          > >> > > -Dario.
                          > >> > >
                          > >> > >
                          > >> > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com,
                          olive_e_thomas
                          > >> > > <no_reply@> wrote:
                          > >> > > >
                          > >> > > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/21/female-
                          icons-
                          > >> > > cinema/print
                          > >> > > >
                          > >> > >
                          > >> >
                          > >>
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > ------------------------------------
                          > >
                          > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          >
                        • KarenUK
                          Not to this year s, but I saw Pandora s Box & loved it. Karen (UK). ... From: nutsaboutclara To:
                          Message 12 of 13 , Feb 6, 2009
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Not to this year's, but I saw Pandora's Box & loved it.
                            Karen (UK).


                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: "nutsaboutclara" <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
                            To: <thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com>
                            Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 6:45 PM
                            Subject: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Re: Lulu in The Guardian


                            > Did you go see it, Karen?
                            >
                            > -Dario.
                            >
                            >
                            > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "KarenUK"
                            > <nhbr22476@...> wrote:
                            >>
                            >> Bristol, England (where I live) is doing a Silent Film Festival at
                            > the
                            >> moment. About two years ago, they had another where I saw
                            > Pandora's Box in a
                            >> theatre on a big screen with a live orchestra doing the music!
                            >>
                            >> Karen (UK).
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> ----- Original Message -----
                            >> From: "ioracara" <ioracara@...>
                            >> To: <thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com>
                            >> Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2009 7:02 PM
                            >> Subject: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Re: Lulu in The Guardian
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> > Like das impersonator, I have to disagree with this. I have
                            > traveled
                            >> > extensively in Europe, and there does not seem to be any greater
                            >> > popular appreciation for silent films than here in the U.S. The
                            > only
                            >> > country I've seen that has an appreciation for those films is
                            > possibly
                            >> > France, and they also seem to be the only one with any organized
                            >> > groups trying to preserve silents . . . but only a couple, and
                            > they
                            >> > are government sponsored.
                            >> >
                            >> > Here, however, we have a great number of groups dedicated to
                            >> > preserving old films, and most are publicly and corporately
                            > sponsored,
                            >> > as well as by the government. We have the LOC, but also the
                            > Eastman
                            >> > House, the AFI, Turner Classics, Kino, Criterion, UCLA, and on
                            > and on.
                            >> > I have no concrete info to make this next statement, but via
                            >> > observation I firmly believe more silent films have been
                            > preserved
                            >> > through American efforts than the rest of the world combined.
                            >> >
                            >> > Germany has no such groups, nor does Britain. Italy has enough
                            > trouble
                            >> > just being Italy. And Eastern Europe? Not at all.
                            >> >
                            >> > Furthermore, I know of theaters in at least three U.S. different
                            >> > cities that regularly show silent films, including one in Los
                            > Angeles
                            >> > that shows nothing BUT silent films. Even France cannot claim
                            > that.
                            >> >
                            >> > Grass is often greener on the other side, but in this case I
                            > think the
                            >> > original statement was incorrect in its assumption. Even though
                            > it's
                            >> > easy to make such claims, not everything in Europe is better
                            > than in
                            >> > the U.S.
                            >> >
                            >> > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, nutsaboutclara
                            >> > <no_reply@> wrote:
                            >> >>
                            >> >> True, but I was talking about the movie-going public of today,
                            > not
                            >> >> specifically the silent film fan base here in America. The
                            > silent
                            >> >> film fan base already appreciates Brooksie very much, but not
                            > the
                            >> >> general movie-going public; anything that's not made for today's
                            >> >> taste is held in high regard. Europeans on the other hand, not
                            > only
                            >> >> view today's films, but enjoy the classics of the past,
                            > including
                            >> >> silent films. That's why I posted the comment; Europeans
                            > appreciate
                            >> >> silent films more than the average American does. It's a
                            > reflection
                            >> >> of our times, really.
                            >> >>
                            >> >> -Dario.
                            >> >>
                            >> >>
                            >> >> --- In
                            > thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "das_imperator"
                            >> >> <dasimperator@> wrote:
                            >> >> >
                            >> >> > To be fair you might want to check the member list of this
                            > and your
                            >> >> > Clara Bow group before making such a blanket statement. I'm
                            > sure the
                            >> >> > good old USA is fairly well represented in silent movie
                            > fandom. Most
                            >> >> > of the books and DVDs that cover the silent period come out
                            > of the
                            >> >> US
                            >> >> > market and do so because there are buyers for them.
                            >> >> >
                            >> >> > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com,
                            > nutsaboutclara
                            >> >> > <no_reply@> wrote:
                            >> >> > >
                            >> >> > > Nice to see Brooksie get a mention from the Guardian. At
                            > least
                            >> >> > > Europeans like the British appreciate silent film
                            > performers like
                            >> >> > > Louise, not like the rest of America, who could give a
                            > (blank)
                            >> >> about
                            >> >> > > silent film. Shame on the U.S.A.!
                            >> >> > >
                            >> >> > > -Dario.
                            >> >> > >
                            >> >> > >
                            >> >> > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com,
                            > olive_e_thomas
                            >> >> > > <no_reply@> wrote:
                            >> >> > > >
                            >> >> > > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/21/female-
                            > icons-
                            >> >> > > cinema/print
                            >> >> > > >
                            >> >> > >
                            >> >> >
                            >> >>
                            >> >
                            >> >
                            >> >
                            >> > ------------------------------------
                            >> >
                            >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >> >
                            >> >
                            >> >
                            >> >
                            >>
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > ------------------------------------
                            >
                            > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                          • nutsaboutclara
                            Well, that s what I meant, Karen, about seeing PANDORA S BOX(1929). -Dario. ... at ... Guardian ... greater ... The ... organized ... different ... though ...
                            Message 13 of 13 , Feb 11, 2009
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Well, that's what I meant, Karen, about seeing PANDORA'S BOX(1929).

                              -Dario.


                              --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "KarenUK"
                              <nhbr22476@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > Not to this year's, but I saw Pandora's Box & loved it.
                              > Karen (UK).
                              >
                              >
                              > ----- Original Message -----
                              > From: "nutsaboutclara" <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
                              > To: <thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com>
                              > Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 6:45 PM
                              > Subject: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Re: Lulu in The Guardian
                              >
                              >
                              > > Did you go see it, Karen?
                              > >
                              > > -Dario.
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "KarenUK"
                              > > <nhbr22476@> wrote:
                              > >>
                              > >> Bristol, England (where I live) is doing a Silent Film Festival
                              at
                              > > the
                              > >> moment. About two years ago, they had another where I saw
                              > > Pandora's Box in a
                              > >> theatre on a big screen with a live orchestra doing the music!
                              > >>
                              > >> Karen (UK).
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >> ----- Original Message -----
                              > >> From: "ioracara" <ioracara@>
                              > >> To: <thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com>
                              > >> Sent: Saturday, January 24, 2009 7:02 PM
                              > >> Subject: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Re: Lulu in The
                              Guardian
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >> > Like das impersonator, I have to disagree with this. I have
                              > > traveled
                              > >> > extensively in Europe, and there does not seem to be any
                              greater
                              > >> > popular appreciation for silent films than here in the U.S.
                              The
                              > > only
                              > >> > country I've seen that has an appreciation for those films is
                              > > possibly
                              > >> > France, and they also seem to be the only one with any
                              organized
                              > >> > groups trying to preserve silents . . . but only a couple, and
                              > > they
                              > >> > are government sponsored.
                              > >> >
                              > >> > Here, however, we have a great number of groups dedicated to
                              > >> > preserving old films, and most are publicly and corporately
                              > > sponsored,
                              > >> > as well as by the government. We have the LOC, but also the
                              > > Eastman
                              > >> > House, the AFI, Turner Classics, Kino, Criterion, UCLA, and on
                              > > and on.
                              > >> > I have no concrete info to make this next statement, but via
                              > >> > observation I firmly believe more silent films have been
                              > > preserved
                              > >> > through American efforts than the rest of the world combined.
                              > >> >
                              > >> > Germany has no such groups, nor does Britain. Italy has enough
                              > > trouble
                              > >> > just being Italy. And Eastern Europe? Not at all.
                              > >> >
                              > >> > Furthermore, I know of theaters in at least three U.S.
                              different
                              > >> > cities that regularly show silent films, including one in Los
                              > > Angeles
                              > >> > that shows nothing BUT silent films. Even France cannot claim
                              > > that.
                              > >> >
                              > >> > Grass is often greener on the other side, but in this case I
                              > > think the
                              > >> > original statement was incorrect in its assumption. Even
                              though
                              > > it's
                              > >> > easy to make such claims, not everything in Europe is better
                              > > than in
                              > >> > the U.S.
                              > >> >
                              > >> > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com,
                              nutsaboutclara
                              > >> > <no_reply@> wrote:
                              > >> >>
                              > >> >> True, but I was talking about the movie-going public of
                              today,
                              > > not
                              > >> >> specifically the silent film fan base here in America. The
                              > > silent
                              > >> >> film fan base already appreciates Brooksie very much, but not
                              > > the
                              > >> >> general movie-going public; anything that's not made for
                              today's
                              > >> >> taste is held in high regard. Europeans on the other hand,
                              not
                              > > only
                              > >> >> view today's films, but enjoy the classics of the past,
                              > > including
                              > >> >> silent films. That's why I posted the comment; Europeans
                              > > appreciate
                              > >> >> silent films more than the average American does. It's a
                              > > reflection
                              > >> >> of our times, really.
                              > >> >>
                              > >> >> -Dario.
                              > >> >>
                              > >> >>
                              > >> >> --- In
                              > > thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "das_imperator"
                              > >> >> <dasimperator@> wrote:
                              > >> >> >
                              > >> >> > To be fair you might want to check the member list of this
                              > > and your
                              > >> >> > Clara Bow group before making such a blanket statement. I'm
                              > > sure the
                              > >> >> > good old USA is fairly well represented in silent movie
                              > > fandom. Most
                              > >> >> > of the books and DVDs that cover the silent period come out
                              > > of the
                              > >> >> US
                              > >> >> > market and do so because there are buyers for them.
                              > >> >> >
                              > >> >> > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com,
                              > > nutsaboutclara
                              > >> >> > <no_reply@> wrote:
                              > >> >> > >
                              > >> >> > > Nice to see Brooksie get a mention from the Guardian. At
                              > > least
                              > >> >> > > Europeans like the British appreciate silent film
                              > > performers like
                              > >> >> > > Louise, not like the rest of America, who could give a
                              > > (blank)
                              > >> >> about
                              > >> >> > > silent film. Shame on the U.S.A.!
                              > >> >> > >
                              > >> >> > > -Dario.
                              > >> >> > >
                              > >> >> > >
                              > >> >> > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com,
                              > > olive_e_thomas
                              > >> >> > > <no_reply@> wrote:
                              > >> >> > > >
                              > >> >> > > >
                              http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2009/jan/21/female-
                              > > icons-
                              > >> >> > > cinema/print
                              > >> >> > > >
                              > >> >> > >
                              > >> >> >
                              > >> >>
                              > >> >
                              > >> >
                              > >> >
                              > >> > ------------------------------------
                              > >> >
                              > >> > Yahoo! Groups Links
                              > >> >
                              > >> >
                              > >> >
                              > >> >
                              > >>
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > ------------------------------------
                              > >
                              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
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