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Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?

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  • nutsaboutclara
    I don t think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that accompanies success
    Message 1 of 29 , Apr 30, 2007
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      I don't think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity
      more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that
      accompanies success sometimes. But, that's just a thought of mine.

      -Dario.


      --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
      <Woodsy@...> wrote:
      >
      > True, she pretty much said she "raised herself." There are several
      reasons
      > she didn't want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we'll
      never know.
      >
      >
      >
      > AM
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > _____
      >
      > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
      > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
      > nutsaboutclara
      > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:34 PM
      > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
      > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological Profile?
      >
      >
      >
      > Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
      > with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think
      her
      > troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
      > attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As
      Brooksie
      > herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were
      more
      > in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
      > their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.
      >
      > -Dario.
      >
      > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
      > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
      brooks@yahoogroups.com,
      > SMILEYJEN1@
      > wrote:
      > >
      > > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is
      that
      > she
      > > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if she
      > > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers. She
      > > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things, only
      to
      > strip
      > > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
      > theme in
      > > her life - she would never be complacent again.
      > >
      > > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
      > > Jennifer ^_^
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
      > > <no_reply@yahoogroup <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com> s.com>
      writes:
      > > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study on
      > > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
      > > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
      > fans
      > > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
      > > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In
      fact,
      > > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about
      > > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
      > >
      > > -Dario.
      > >
      > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
      > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
      brooks@yahoogroups.com,
      > Perri Lee
      > > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it
      > > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
      > > negative energy off others.
      > > >
      > > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
      > > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
      > > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio of
      > > her
      > > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an
      incredibly
      > > > complex person!
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Perri Lee Leuthard
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > ---------------------------------
      > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
      > > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
      > > >
      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
    • nutsaboutclara
      WHOOPS!!!!! I meant emptiness. Sorry, folks! -Dario. ... several ... Profile? ... she ... She ... only ... on ... about ... it ... of
      Message 2 of 29 , May 5, 2007
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        WHOOPS!!!!! I meant "emptiness." Sorry, folks!

        -Dario.


        --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, nutsaboutclara
        <no_reply@...> wrote:
        >
        > I don't think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity
        > more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that
        > accompanies success sometimes. But, that's just a thought of mine.
        >
        > -Dario.
        >
        >
        > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
        > <Woodsy@> wrote:
        > >
        > > True, she pretty much said she "raised herself." There are
        several
        > reasons
        > > she didn't want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we'll
        > never know.
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > AM
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > _____
        > >
        > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
        > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
        > > nutsaboutclara
        > > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:34 PM
        > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
        > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological
        Profile?
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
        > > with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think
        > her
        > > troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
        > > attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As
        > Brooksie
        > > herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were
        > more
        > > in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
        > > their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.
        > >
        > > -Dario.
        > >
        > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
        > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
        > brooks@yahoogroups.com,
        > > SMILEYJEN1@
        > > wrote:
        > > >
        > > > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is
        > that
        > > she
        > > > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if
        she
        > > > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers.
        She
        > > > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things,
        only
        > to
        > > strip
        > > > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
        > > theme in
        > > > her life - she would never be complacent again.
        > > >
        > > > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
        > > > Jennifer ^_^
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
        > > > <no_reply@yahoogroup <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com> s.com>
        > writes:
        > > > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study
        on
        > > > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
        > > > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
        > > fans
        > > > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
        > > > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In
        > fact,
        > > > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING
        about
        > > > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
        > > >
        > > > -Dario.
        > > >
        > > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
        > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
        > brooks@yahoogroups.com,
        > > Perri Lee
        > > > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew
        it
        > > > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
        > > > negative energy off others.
        > > > >
        > > > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
        > > > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
        > > > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio
        of
        > > > her
        > > > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an
        > incredibly
        > > > > complex person!
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > Perri Lee Leuthard
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > ---------------------------------
        > > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
        > > > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
        > > > >
        > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
        >
      • olive_e_thomas
        The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her book club Louise would likely
        Message 3 of 29 , May 5, 2007
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          The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
          personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
          book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
          success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
        • Anita M
          I can understand that, and I wouldn’t blame her, either. Anita M. Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult that you do. -
          Message 4 of 29 , May 6, 2007
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            I can understand that, and I wouldn’t blame her, either.



            Anita M.



            "Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult
            that you do." - Elizabeth Goudge

            _____

            From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
            [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
            olive_e_thomas
            Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2007 10:27 PM
            To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



            The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
            personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
            book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
            success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Anita M
            No worries; we know what you meant ;-) Anita M. Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult that you do. - Elizabeth Goudge
            Message 5 of 29 , May 6, 2007
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              No worries; we know what you meant ;-)



              Anita M.



              "Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult
              that you do." - Elizabeth Goudge

              _____

              From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
              [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
              nutsaboutclara
              Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2007 11:38 AM
              To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



              WHOOPS!!!!! I meant "emptiness." Sorry, folks!

              -Dario.

              --- In thenewcovenoflouise
              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
              nutsaboutclara
              <no_reply@...> wrote:
              >
              > I don't think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity
              > more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that
              > accompanies success sometimes. But, that's just a thought of mine.
              >
              > -Dario.
              >
              >
              > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
              "Anita M"
              > <Woodsy@> wrote:
              > >
              > > True, she pretty much said she "raised herself." There are
              several
              > reasons
              > > she didn't want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we'll
              > never know.
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > AM
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > _____
              > >
              > > From: thenewcovenoflouise
              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com
              > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouise
              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com]
              On Behalf Of
              > > nutsaboutclara
              > > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:34 PM
              > > To: thenewcovenoflouise
              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com
              > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological
              Profile?
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
              > > with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think
              > her
              > > troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
              > > attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As
              > Brooksie
              > > herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were
              > more
              > > in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
              > > their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.
              > >
              > > -Dario.
              > >
              > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
              > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
              > brooks@yahoogroups. <mailto:brooks%40yahoogroups.com> com,
              > > SMILEYJEN1@
              > > wrote:
              > > >
              > > > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is
              > that
              > > she
              > > > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if
              she
              > > > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers.
              She
              > > > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things,
              only
              > to
              > > strip
              > > > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
              > > theme in
              > > > her life - she would never be complacent again.
              > > >
              > > > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
              > > > Jennifer ^_^
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
              > > > <no_reply@yahoogroup <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com> s.com>
              > writes:
              > > > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study
              on
              > > > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
              > > > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
              > > fans
              > > > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
              > > > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In
              > fact,
              > > > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING
              about
              > > > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
              > > >
              > > > -Dario.
              > > >
              > > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
              > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
              > brooks@yahoogroups. <mailto:brooks%40yahoogroups.com> com,
              > > Perri Lee
              > > > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
              > > > >
              > > > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew
              it
              > > > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
              > > > negative energy off others.
              > > > >
              > > > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
              > > > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
              > > > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio
              of
              > > > her
              > > > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an
              > incredibly
              > > > > complex person!
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > Perri Lee Leuthard
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > ---------------------------------
              > > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
              > > > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
              > > > >
              > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              >





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Chuck Golden
              I think you ve hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it s evident that she had to be in
              Message 6 of 29 , May 6, 2007
              • 0 Attachment
                I think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident that
                she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but in
                control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster piece "The
                Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to the
                top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without her
                knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite the
                increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation where
                she couldn't be 100% in control of it.

                Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out there?
                Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls far
                from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something as
                simple as that.


                --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                <no_reply@...> wrote:
                >
                > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                >
              • Perri Lee
                I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades she was
                Message 7 of 29 , May 6, 2007
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                  I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed with the twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee

                  Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: I think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                  through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident that
                  she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but in
                  control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster piece "The
                  Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to the
                  top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                  from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without her
                  knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                  ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite the
                  increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                  excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                  involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                  wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation where
                  she couldn't be 100% in control of it.

                  Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out there?
                  Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls far
                  from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something as
                  simple as that.

                  --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                  <no_reply@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                  > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                  > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                  > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                  >






                  Perri Lee Leuthard



                  ---------------------------------
                  Don't pick lemons.
                  See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Anita M
                  I m not sure that public knowledge of her escapades would have bothered her. She never appeared to be embarrassed about anything she did, nor cared what anyone
                  Message 8 of 29 , May 7, 2007
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                    I'm not sure that public knowledge of her escapades would have bothered her.
                    She never appeared to be embarrassed about anything she did, nor cared what
                    anyone else thought of her. I think it was a 100% control issue.



                    Anita M.

                    _____

                    From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                    [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Perri Lee
                    Sent: Sunday, May 06, 2007 1:35 PM
                    To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



                    I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to
                    publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades
                    she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed with the
                    twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee

                    Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@yahoo. <mailto:bagnoli2%40yahoo.com> com> wrote: I
                    think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All through
                    the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident that she had to be
                    in control - not so much in control of the people but in control of the
                    situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster piece "The Girl in the Black
                    Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to the top of the public
                    consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word from him that he'd been out
                    on the West Coast discussing (without her knowing it) a bio-pic with a major
                    Hollywood director. She went ballistic, refused any thought of letting the
                    film be done (despite the increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off
                    forever. She excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project
                    that involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                    wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation where she
                    couldn't be 100% in control of it.

                    Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out there?
                    Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls far from
                    the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something as simple as
                    that.

                    --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                    <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                    olive_e_thomas
                    <no_reply@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of personal
                    control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her book club Louise
                    would likely refuse on the grounds any success would "belong" to Oprah and
                    not to her...
                    >

                    Perri Lee Leuthard

                    ---------------------------------
                    Don't pick lemons.
                    See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Chuck Golden
                    Perri Lee, She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn t publish her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the sexual
                    Message 9 of 29 , May 7, 2007
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                      Perri Lee,

                      She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't publish
                      her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                      sexual beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                      potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted to her priest
                      in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she wanted a drink
                      and when she read about sex she got excited. So she opted not to
                      publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable young women.
                      On the one hand, she wouldn't renounce her lifestyle (standing toe-to-
                      toe with her priest), on the other hand she was concerned about
                      having young girls see her habits and lifestyle as desirable and
                      exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant contradictions of
                      Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a proof
                      of her brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                      being anything but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.

                      I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs of
                      her region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                      was mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                      attended a Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough
                      to evidently have a fling with an older man in the church before
                      moving to Manhatten), and for ten years as a Catholic between 1954
                      and 1964 in New York. I certainly don't see either of them as being
                      twisted in either location. Except for the Catholic period, I think
                      Louise's attitude towards religion was ambivalence rather than
                      antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring that she left the
                      Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of note in her
                      little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she
                      had a statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                      religious beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that
                      opinion.

                      Cheers!


                      --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, Perri Lee
                      <cheaptrickaz@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not
                      want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all
                      the escapades she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was
                      also mixed with the twisted religious beliefs of her region and her
                      day. Perri Lee
                      >
                      > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: I think you've hit on
                      one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                      > through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident
                      that
                      > she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but
                      in
                      > control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster
                      piece "The
                      > Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to
                      the
                      > top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                      > from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without
                      her
                      > knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                      > ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite
                      the
                      > increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                      > excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                      > involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                      > wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation
                      where
                      > she couldn't be 100% in control of it.
                      >
                      > Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out
                      there?
                      > Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls
                      far
                      > from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something
                      as
                      > simple as that.
                      >
                      > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                      > <no_reply@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                      > > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                      > > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                      > > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                      > >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Perri Lee Leuthard
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ---------------------------------
                      > Don't pick lemons.
                      > See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                    • Perri Lee
                      I still beleive that the reason she did not publish was some how tied to the twisted religious moral thing. It is why I feel she did not write and it still is
                      Message 10 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                      • 0 Attachment
                        I still beleive that the reason she did not publish was some how tied to the twisted religious moral thing. It is why I feel she did not write and it still is the same thing and reason why people and persons hold themselves back today. But of course this is getting to be too large of a subject for this group. thanks

                        Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: Perri Lee,

                        She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't publish
                        her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                        sexual beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                        potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted to her priest
                        in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she wanted a drink
                        and when she read about sex she got excited. So she opted not to
                        publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable young women.
                        On the one hand, she wouldn't renounce her lifestyle (standing toe-to-
                        toe with her priest), on the other hand she was concerned about
                        having young girls see her habits and lifestyle as desirable and
                        exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant contradictions of
                        Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a proof
                        of her brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                        being anything but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.

                        I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs of
                        her region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                        was mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                        attended a Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough
                        to evidently have a fling with an older man in the church before
                        moving to Manhatten), and for ten years as a Catholic between 1954
                        and 1964 in New York. I certainly don't see either of them as being
                        twisted in either location. Except for the Catholic period, I think
                        Louise's attitude towards religion was ambivalence rather than
                        antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring that she left the
                        Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of note in her
                        little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she
                        had a statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                        religious beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that
                        opinion.

                        Cheers!

                        --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, Perri Lee
                        <cheaptrickaz@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not
                        want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all
                        the escapades she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was
                        also mixed with the twisted religious beliefs of her region and her
                        day. Perri Lee
                        >
                        > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: I think you've hit on
                        one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                        > through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident
                        that
                        > she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but
                        in
                        > control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster
                        piece "The
                        > Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to
                        the
                        > top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                        > from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without
                        her
                        > knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                        > ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite
                        the
                        > increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                        > excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                        > involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                        > wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation
                        where
                        > she couldn't be 100% in control of it.
                        >
                        > Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out
                        there?
                        > Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls
                        far
                        > from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something
                        as
                        > simple as that.
                        >
                        > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                        > <no_reply@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                        > > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                        > > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                        > > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                        > >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Perri Lee Leuthard
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ---------------------------------
                        > Don't pick lemons.
                        > See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >






                        Perri Lee Leuthard



                        ---------------------------------
                        Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                        Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Anita M
                        IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect to underage girls, who (judging from my own experience) are impressionable and most likely to
                        Message 11 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                        • 0 Attachment
                          IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect to underage
                          girls, who (judging from my own experience) are impressionable and most
                          likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my life, illegal
                          drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew people who bought
                          into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her adventures
                          and saying at the end “don’t do what I did,” (which seldom carries any
                          weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.



                          Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day “spilling
                          the sexual beans” could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If you ever
                          have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which celebrities are
                          doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you want to see
                          them or not.)



                          Anita M.



                          _____

                          From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                          [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                          Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                          To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



                          Perri Lee,

                          She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't publish her
                          biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the sexual
                          beans and that she had concerns about what this could potentially do to
                          influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s that when
                          she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she read about sex she
                          got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for
                          impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't renounce her
                          lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other hand she was
                          concerned about having young girls see her habits and lifestyle as desirable
                          and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant contradictions of
                          Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a proof of her
                          brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on being anything
                          but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.

                          I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs of her
                          region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion was
                          mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she attended a
                          Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to evidently have
                          a fling with an older man in the church before moving to Manhatten), and for
                          ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I certainly don't
                          see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except for the
                          Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was ambivalence
                          rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring that she left
                          the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of note in her
                          little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she had a
                          statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the religious
                          beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.

                          Cheers!

                          >
                          > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to
                          publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades
                          she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed with the
                          twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee





                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • nutsaboutclara
                          That s quite true, Olive. Brooksie always wanted to control the situation, so that she could be the center of attention. It was that way at home, when she
                          Message 12 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                          • 0 Attachment
                            That's quite true, Olive. Brooksie always wanted to control the
                            situation, so that she could be the center of attention. It was that
                            way at home, when she and her mother bickered, and it continued well
                            into adulthood. She was her own marching band, which turned a lot of
                            people off, that's for sure.

                            -Dario.


                            --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                            <no_reply@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                            > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                            > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                            > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                            >
                          • nutsaboutclara
                            She was a very willful person, Chuck; it was her way and nothing else. Clara Bow was like that to an extent, but she was outgoing and cheerful towards all
                            Message 13 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                            • 0 Attachment
                              She was a very willful person, Chuck; it was her way and nothing
                              else. Clara Bow was like that to an extent, but she was outgoing and
                              cheerful towards all that met Clara. But Brooksie was moody,
                              taciturn at times, and an intelectual snob, who thought that she was
                              above everyone when it came film(film history, film making, actors &
                              actresses, etc.), literature, politics, sex, male/female
                              relationships, etc. And, very opinionated. But, I love her for it,
                              because she would be who she was if she wasn't that in the first
                              place. I marvel at her strong sense of independence. That made her
                              stand out more than her contemporaries.

                              -Dario.



                              --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Chuck Golden"
                              <bagnoli2@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > I think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality.
                              All
                              > through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident
                              that
                              > she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but
                              in
                              > control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster
                              piece "The
                              > Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to
                              the
                              > top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                              > from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without
                              her
                              > knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                              > ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite
                              the
                              > increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                              > excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                              > involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                              > wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation
                              where
                              > she couldn't be 100% in control of it.
                              >
                              > Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out
                              there?
                              > Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls
                              far
                              > from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something
                              as
                              > simple as that.
                              >
                              >
                              > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                              > <no_reply@> wrote:
                              > >
                              > > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                              > > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                              > > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                              > > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                              > >
                              >
                            • olive_e_thomas
                              I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of child-care in that respect). My guess is
                              Message 14 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                              • 0 Attachment
                                I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed little
                                brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and it
                                was easier to torch than try and rewrite...

                                It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of one
                                whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                went.

                                But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                words that just don't seem to go together...

                                --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect
                                to underage
                                > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                impressionable and most
                                > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my life,
                                illegal
                                > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                people who bought
                                > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                adventures
                                > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                carries any
                                > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day
                                "spilling
                                > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If
                                you ever
                                > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                celebrities are
                                > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                want to see
                                > them or not.)
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > Anita M.
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > _____
                                >
                                > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                Profile?
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > Perri Lee,
                                >
                                > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                publish her
                                > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                sexual
                                > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                potentially do to
                                > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s
                                that when
                                > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                read about sex she
                                > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                concern for
                                > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                renounce her
                                > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other hand
                                she was
                                > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                lifestyle as desirable
                                > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                contradictions of
                                > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                proof of her
                                > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on being
                                anything
                                > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                >
                                > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs
                                of her
                                > region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                was
                                > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                attended a
                                > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                evidently have
                                > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                Manhatten), and for
                                > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                certainly don't
                                > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                for the
                                > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was
                                ambivalence
                                > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                that she left
                                > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                note in her
                                > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she
                                had a
                                > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                religious
                                > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                >
                                > Cheers!
                                >
                                > >
                                > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not
                                want to
                                > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the
                                escapades
                                > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed
                                with the
                                > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                >
                              • nutsaboutclara
                                HEAR, HEAR!!! Discriminatory would probably be a better word for what Brooksie was all about, in respect to people, art, literature, etc. You hit the nail on
                                Message 15 of 29 , May 9, 2007
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  HEAR, HEAR!!! Discriminatory would probably be a better word for
                                  what Brooksie was all about, in respect to people, art, literature,
                                  etc. You hit the nail on the head perfectly, Olive. Kudos!

                                  -Dario.


                                  --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                  <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                  > children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                  > child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                  > ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed
                                  little
                                  > brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                  > selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and
                                  it
                                  > was easier to torch than try and rewrite...
                                  >
                                  > It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of
                                  one
                                  > whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                  > went.
                                  >
                                  > But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                  > words that just don't seem to go together...
                                  >
                                  > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                  > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                                  > >
                                  > > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect
                                  > to underage
                                  > > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                  > impressionable and most
                                  > > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my
                                  life,
                                  > illegal
                                  > > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                  > people who bought
                                  > > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                  > adventures
                                  > > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                  > carries any
                                  > > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day
                                  > "spilling
                                  > > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If
                                  > you ever
                                  > > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                  > celebrities are
                                  > > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                  > want to see
                                  > > them or not.)
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > Anita M.
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > _____
                                  > >
                                  > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                  > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                  > Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                  > > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                  > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                  > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                  > Profile?
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > Perri Lee,
                                  > >
                                  > > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                  > publish her
                                  > > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                  > sexual
                                  > > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                  > potentially do to
                                  > > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s
                                  > that when
                                  > > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                  > read about sex she
                                  > > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                  > concern for
                                  > > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                  > renounce her
                                  > > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other
                                  hand
                                  > she was
                                  > > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                  > lifestyle as desirable
                                  > > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                  > contradictions of
                                  > > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                  > proof of her
                                  > > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                                  being
                                  > anything
                                  > > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                  > >
                                  > > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs
                                  > of her
                                  > > region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                  > was
                                  > > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                  > attended a
                                  > > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                  > evidently have
                                  > > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                  > Manhatten), and for
                                  > > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                  > certainly don't
                                  > > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                  > for the
                                  > > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was
                                  > ambivalence
                                  > > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                  > that she left
                                  > > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                  > note in her
                                  > > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think
                                  she
                                  > had a
                                  > > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                  > religious
                                  > > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                  > >
                                  > > Cheers!
                                  > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did
                                  not
                                  > want to
                                  > > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the
                                  > escapades
                                  > > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed
                                  > with the
                                  > > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  > >
                                  >
                                • Anita M.
                                  Now I m confused. Chuck said She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn t publish her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling
                                  Message 16 of 29 , May 9, 2007
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Now I'm confused.

                                    Chuck said "She said several times that one of the reasons she
                                    wouldn't publish her biography was that to do it properly would mean
                                    spilling all the sexual beans and that she had concerns about what
                                    this could potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted to
                                    her priest in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she
                                    wanted a drink and when she read about sex she got excited. So she
                                    opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable
                                    young women."

                                    But then, some people say one thing one day and the opposite another
                                    day - maybe a way to hold onto a little privacy.

                                    Anita M.


                                    --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                    <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                    > children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                    > child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                    > ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed
                                    little
                                    > brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                    > selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and it
                                    > was easier to torch than try and rewrite...
                                    >
                                    > It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of
                                    one
                                    > whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                    > went.
                                    >
                                    > But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                    > words that just don't seem to go together...
                                    >
                                    > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                    > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect
                                    > to underage
                                    > > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                    > impressionable and most
                                    > > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my
                                    life,
                                    > illegal
                                    > > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                    > people who bought
                                    > > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                    > adventures
                                    > > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                    > carries any
                                    > > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day
                                    > "spilling
                                    > > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If
                                    > you ever
                                    > > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                    > celebrities are
                                    > > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                    > want to see
                                    > > them or not.)
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > Anita M.
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > _____
                                    > >
                                    > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                    > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                    > Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                    > > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                    > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                    > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                    > Profile?
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > Perri Lee,
                                    > >
                                    > > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                    > publish her
                                    > > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                    > sexual
                                    > > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                    > potentially do to
                                    > > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s
                                    > that when
                                    > > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                    > read about sex she
                                    > > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                    > concern for
                                    > > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                    > renounce her
                                    > > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other
                                    hand
                                    > she was
                                    > > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                    > lifestyle as desirable
                                    > > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                    > contradictions of
                                    > > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                    > proof of her
                                    > > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on being
                                    > anything
                                    > > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                    > >
                                    > > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs
                                    > of her
                                    > > region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                    > was
                                    > > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                    > attended a
                                    > > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                    > evidently have
                                    > > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                    > Manhatten), and for
                                    > > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                    > certainly don't
                                    > > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                    > for the
                                    > > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was
                                    > ambivalence
                                    > > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                    > that she left
                                    > > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                    > note in her
                                    > > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think
                                    she
                                    > had a
                                    > > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                    > religious
                                    > > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                    > >
                                    > > Cheers!
                                    > >
                                    > > >
                                    > > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did
                                    not
                                    > want to
                                    > > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the
                                    > escapades
                                    > > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed
                                    > with the
                                    > > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    > >
                                    >
                                  • olive_e_thomas
                                    Some clue as to her reasoning might be found in her comments after turning down Playboy magazine for a writing job all they want is (an article about) tits
                                    Message 17 of 29 , May 9, 2007
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                                      Some clue as to her reasoning might be found in her comments
                                      after turning down Playboy magazine for a writing job "all they
                                      want is (an article about) tits and free-fucking for men."

                                      --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M."
                                      <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > Now I'm confused.
                                      >
                                      > Chuck said "She said several times that one of the reasons
                                      she
                                      > wouldn't publish her biography was that to do it properly would
                                      mean
                                      > spilling all the sexual beans and that she had concerns about
                                      what
                                      > this could potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted
                                      to
                                      > her priest in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking
                                      she
                                      > wanted a drink and when she read about sex she got excited.
                                      So she
                                      > opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for
                                      impressionable
                                      > young women."
                                      >
                                      > But then, some people say one thing one day and the opposite
                                      another
                                      > day - maybe a way to hold onto a little privacy.
                                      >
                                      > Anita M.
                                      >
                                      >
                                    • nutsaboutclara
                                      Brooksie was trying to protect herself from what others said about her. She never did trust people whom she met and later talked trash about her. Brooksie
                                      Message 18 of 29 , May 12, 2007
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                                        Brooksie was trying to protect herself from what others said about
                                        her. She never did trust people whom she met and later talked trash
                                        about her. Brooksie was one tough egg to crack, that's for sure.

                                        -Dario.


                                        --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M."
                                        <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > Now I'm confused.
                                        >
                                        > Chuck said "She said several times that one of the reasons she
                                        > wouldn't publish her biography was that to do it properly would
                                        mean
                                        > spilling all the sexual beans and that she had concerns about what
                                        > this could potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted
                                        to
                                        > her priest in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she
                                        > wanted a drink and when she read about sex she got excited. So she
                                        > opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable
                                        > young women."
                                        >
                                        > But then, some people say one thing one day and the opposite
                                        another
                                        > day - maybe a way to hold onto a little privacy.
                                        >
                                        > Anita M.
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                        > <no_reply@> wrote:
                                        > >
                                        > > I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                        > > children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                        > > child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                        > > ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed
                                        > little
                                        > > brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                        > > selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and
                                        it
                                        > > was easier to torch than try and rewrite...
                                        > >
                                        > > It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of
                                        > one
                                        > > whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                        > > went.
                                        > >
                                        > > But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                        > > words that just don't seem to go together...
                                        > >
                                        > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                        > > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                                        > > >
                                        > > > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in
                                        respect
                                        > > to underage
                                        > > > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                        > > impressionable and most
                                        > > > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my
                                        > life,
                                        > > illegal
                                        > > > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                        > > people who bought
                                        > > > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                        > > adventures
                                        > > > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                        > > carries any
                                        > > > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her
                                        day
                                        > > "spilling
                                        > > > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it.
                                        (If
                                        > > you ever
                                        > > > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                        > > celebrities are
                                        > > > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                        > > want to see
                                        > > > them or not.)
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Anita M.
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > _____
                                        > > >
                                        > > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                        > > Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                        > > > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                        > > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                        > > Profile?
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Perri Lee,
                                        > > >
                                        > > > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                        > > publish her
                                        > > > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all
                                        the
                                        > > sexual
                                        > > > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                        > > potentially do to
                                        > > > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-
                                        50s
                                        > > that when
                                        > > > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                        > > read about sex she
                                        > > > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                        > > concern for
                                        > > > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                        > > renounce her
                                        > > > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other
                                        > hand
                                        > > she was
                                        > > > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                        > > lifestyle as desirable
                                        > > > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                        > > contradictions of
                                        > > > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                        > > proof of her
                                        > > > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                                        being
                                        > > anything
                                        > > > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions
                                        beliefs
                                        > > of her
                                        > > > region and her day". The only periods in her life where
                                        religion
                                        > > was
                                        > > > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                        > > attended a
                                        > > > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                        > > evidently have
                                        > > > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                        > > Manhatten), and for
                                        > > > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                        > > certainly don't
                                        > > > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                        > > for the
                                        > > > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion
                                        was
                                        > > ambivalence
                                        > > > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                        > > that she left
                                        > > > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                        > > note in her
                                        > > > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think
                                        > she
                                        > > had a
                                        > > > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                        > > religious
                                        > > > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Cheers!
                                        > > >
                                        > > > >
                                        > > > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did
                                        > not
                                        > > want to
                                        > > > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all
                                        the
                                        > > escapades
                                        > > > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also
                                        mixed
                                        > > with the
                                        > > > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        >
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