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Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological Profile?

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  • SMILEYJEN1@JUNO.COM
    She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is that she was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if she allowed herself to
    Message 1 of 29 , Apr 26 11:07 AM
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      She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is that she
      was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if she
      allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers. She
      followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things, only to strip
      her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing theme in
      her life - she would never be complacent again.

      Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
      Jennifer ^_^



      On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
      <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> writes:
      To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study on
      Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
      viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film fans
      at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
      community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In fact,
      there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about
      Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.

      -Dario.

      --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, Perri Lee
      <cheaptrickaz@...> wrote:
      >
      > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it
      and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
      negative energy off others.
      >
      > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: Has anyone seen or
      know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
      > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio of
      her
      > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an incredibly
      > complex person!
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Perri Lee Leuthard
      >
      >
      >
      > ---------------------------------
      > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
      > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >




      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • nutsaboutclara
      Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think her troubles were that
      Message 2 of 29 , Apr 27 10:34 AM
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        Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
        with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think her
        troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
        attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As Brooksie
        herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were more
        in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
        their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.

        -Dario.


        --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, SMILEYJEN1@...
        wrote:
        >
        > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is that
        she
        > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if she
        > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers. She
        > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things, only to
        strip
        > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
        theme in
        > her life - she would never be complacent again.
        >
        > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
        > Jennifer ^_^
        >
        >
        >
        > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
        > <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> writes:
        > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study on
        > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
        > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
        fans
        > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
        > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In fact,
        > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about
        > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
        >
        > -Dario.
        >
        > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, Perri Lee
        > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
        > >
        > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it
        > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
        > negative energy off others.
        > >
        > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
        > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
        > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio of
        > her
        > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an incredibly
        > > complex person!
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Perri Lee Leuthard
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > ---------------------------------
        > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
        > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
        > >
        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • Anita M
        True, she pretty much said she “raised herself.” There are several reasons she didn’t want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we’ll never know.
        Message 3 of 29 , Apr 27 5:25 PM
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          True, she pretty much said she “raised herself.” There are several reasons
          she didn’t want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we’ll never know.



          AM





          _____

          From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
          [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
          nutsaboutclara
          Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:34 PM
          To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological Profile?



          Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
          with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think her
          troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
          attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As Brooksie
          herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were more
          in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
          their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.

          -Dario.

          --- In thenewcovenoflouise
          <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
          SMILEYJEN1@...
          wrote:
          >
          > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is that
          she
          > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if she
          > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers. She
          > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things, only to
          strip
          > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
          theme in
          > her life - she would never be complacent again.
          >
          > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
          > Jennifer ^_^
          >
          >
          >
          > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
          > <no_reply@yahoogroup <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com> s.com> writes:
          > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study on
          > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
          > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
          fans
          > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
          > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In fact,
          > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about
          > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
          >
          > -Dario.
          >
          > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
          <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
          Perri Lee
          > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
          > >
          > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it
          > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
          > negative energy off others.
          > >
          > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
          > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
          > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio of
          > her
          > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an incredibly
          > > complex person!
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Perri Lee Leuthard
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > ---------------------------------
          > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
          > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
          > >
          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          > >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Chuck Golden
          Thanks for the great discussion, everybody, I just joined the group and you seem like my kind of people. As originally mentioned, I m in my third reading of
          Message 4 of 29 , Apr 28 7:55 AM
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            Thanks for the great discussion, everybody, I just joined the group
            and you seem like my kind of people. As originally mentioned, I'm in
            my third reading of Barry Paris's bio of her. It doesn't usually take
            very long to figure out a person. Whether you interact with them in
            person or read about them (with enough detail), you can normally put
            them into one or two catagories. Not Louise Brooks, at least with me
            so far. I'll be fourty-seven in a month or so, and I've dealt with
            thousands of people by now. I enjoy histories and biographies and
            have read a great many of both. Nobody I know or have studies so
            intrigues and disturbs me like Louise.

            Small-town girl, aesthete, great dancer, unbelievably well-read,
            articulate, undisciplined, sexually abused, emotionally abused,
            neglected, great actor, promiscuous, prostitute, Catholic,
            self-destructive, the list goes on and on. She was a high school
            dropout who was able to write like a professional at age seventeen,
            and did so. She had no formal acting training that I knew of, but at
            twenty-one she was Lulu. She was most likely of genious mentality but
            throughout her life she systematically did everything possible to
            destroy herself. She was such a complex, complex person.

            Like most everyone, I fully believe that her biggest problems sprang
            from her upbringing. You can't overstate the emotional damage brought
            onto a child by parental neglect and sexual abuse, and Louise suffered
            both of them. I can't help but wonder what she would have been like
            if her mother had shown her even a modicom of affection and hadn't
            blamed her when Louise told her mother at age nine for being raped by
            Mr. Flowers. I also believe, because she said as much when she was
            old, that she only wanted to be a dancer. The one thing in her life
            to which she had given focused and committed attention was her studies
            at Denishawn, and I think that her getting so viciously dismissed from
            the group at seventeen fractured something in her psyche that never
            healed. I could go on for hour. Ask my wife, she'll tell you. :o)

            Louise was wonderful. Disturbing, but wonderful. I wonder if I'd
            have liked her.
          • Perri Lee
            has anyone heard when Neve Cambell is going to get started on filming Louise s bio. I read she bought the rights and wanted to star in it. I hope she gets on
            Message 5 of 29 , Apr 28 12:58 PM
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              has anyone heard when Neve Cambell is going to get started on filming Louise's bio. I read she bought the rights and wanted to star in it. I hope she gets on with it before she gets too old

              Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: Thanks for the great discussion, everybody, I just joined the group
              and you seem like my kind of people. As originally mentioned, I'm in
              my third reading of Barry Paris's bio of her. It doesn't usually take
              very long to figure out a person. Whether you interact with them in
              person or read about them (with enough detail), you can normally put
              them into one or two catagories. Not Louise Brooks, at least with me
              so far. I'll be fourty-seven in a month or so, and I've dealt with
              thousands of people by now. I enjoy histories and biographies and
              have read a great many of both. Nobody I know or have studies so
              intrigues and disturbs me like Louise.

              Small-town girl, aesthete, great dancer, unbelievably well-read,
              articulate, undisciplined, sexually abused, emotionally abused,
              neglected, great actor, promiscuous, prostitute, Catholic,
              self-destructive, the list goes on and on. She was a high school
              dropout who was able to write like a professional at age seventeen,
              and did so. She had no formal acting training that I knew of, but at
              twenty-one she was Lulu. She was most likely of genious mentality but
              throughout her life she systematically did everything possible to
              destroy herself. She was such a complex, complex person.

              Like most everyone, I fully believe that her biggest problems sprang
              from her upbringing. You can't overstate the emotional damage brought
              onto a child by parental neglect and sexual abuse, and Louise suffered
              both of them. I can't help but wonder what she would have been like
              if her mother had shown her even a modicom of affection and hadn't
              blamed her when Louise told her mother at age nine for being raped by
              Mr. Flowers. I also believe, because she said as much when she was
              old, that she only wanted to be a dancer. The one thing in her life
              to which she had given focused and committed attention was her studies
              at Denishawn, and I think that her getting so viciously dismissed from
              the group at seventeen fractured something in her psyche that never
              healed. I could go on for hour. Ask my wife, she'll tell you. :o)

              Louise was wonderful. Disturbing, but wonderful. I wonder if I'd
              have liked her.






              Perri Lee Leuthard



              ---------------------------------
              Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
              Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Anita M
              She was a self-made woman, as you described. That’s what makes her so admirable to me – that she got so far starting with so little. But she was every bit
              Message 6 of 29 , Apr 29 6:30 AM
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                She was a self-made woman, as you described. That’s what makes her so
                admirable to me – that she got so far starting with so little. But she was
                every bit as tragic as Marilyn Monroe, IMO; she never truly overcame her
                inner ‘demons’ so she sabotaged herself and drove away anyone who got close
                to her. I’d like to know the whole story of her dismissal from Denishawn.
                I’d read that she drank heavily and often didn’t show up for rehearsals.
                Today we have help for kids with drinking/drug problems, anti-social
                behavior, victims of abuse, etc. Unfortunately, such programs didn’t exist
                then.



                I’ve just joined the group, too, and have read only “Lulu in Hollywood” and
                whatever I can find on the net. I also have the “Biography” special on DVD.
                I see that Barry Paris’ bio is a must.



                (Neve Campbell certainly looks the part!)



                Anita M.
              • Chuck Golden
                Anita, She wasn t quite the fully-fledged hellion yet when she was kicked off the Denishawn team, but she was well on her way. She went to New York with a
                Message 7 of 29 , Apr 30 6:16 AM
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                  Anita,

                  She wasn't quite the fully-fledged hellion yet when she was kicked
                  off the Denishawn team, but she was well on her way. She went to New
                  York with a chaperone at first, but she quickly graduated from paying
                  student to paid troupe member with lots of travel involved. Barry
                  Paris doesn't say much if anything about the chaperone when Louise
                  was picked up as a regular. Likely she went home to Kansas soon
                  thereafter. On the road, she was required to be above moral and
                  social reproach, but she wasn't always. She was the subject of a lot
                  of rumors and her reputation soured. She was evidently sneaking
                  around to clubs and not coming back to the room until wake-up time.
                  Being an incredible dancer, however, her pecadillos were overlooked
                  for the most part. She toured, and starred, with the troupe for two
                  seasons, getting harder and harder to manage all the time, more
                  independent, more stubborn, fuller and fuller of herself. Finally,
                  she came into a group meeting late and the boss gave her the heave-ho
                  in front of everybody. Not so much as a word of caution is ever
                  mentioned as I recalled. She just crossed the line once too many
                  times and got the boot. Ruth St. Denis gave told her she was being
                  dismissed because she wanted the world on a silver salver. Soon
                  after that, she was dancing in Scandals and later Zeigfield, that's
                  when she really started racing the party engine. Hope this helps!

                  And do get the Barry Paris book, you'll love it.



                  --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                  <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > She was a self-made woman, as you described. That's what makes her
                  so
                  > admirable to me – that she got so far starting with so little. But
                  she was
                  > every bit as tragic as Marilyn Monroe, IMO; she never truly
                  overcame her
                  > inner `demons' so she sabotaged herself and drove away anyone who
                  got close
                  > to her. I'd like to know the whole story of her dismissal from
                  Denishawn.
                  > I'd read that she drank heavily and often didn't show up for
                  rehearsals.
                  > Today we have help for kids with drinking/drug problems, anti-social
                  > behavior, victims of abuse, etc. Unfortunately, such programs
                  didn't exist
                  > then.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > I've just joined the group, too, and have read only "Lulu in
                  Hollywood" and
                  > whatever I can find on the net. I also have the "Biography" special
                  on DVD.
                  > I see that Barry Paris' bio is a must.
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > (Neve Campbell certainly looks the part!)
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Anita M.
                  >
                • Perri Lee
                  In one of her bio s she was quoted as saying I love to drink and fuck she was quite the party girl. I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall the
                  Message 8 of 29 , Apr 30 7:42 AM
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                    In one of her bio's she was quoted as saying "I love to drink and fuck" she was quite the party girl. I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall the afternoon her and Charlie Chaplin and another woman was in a hotel room all after noon and was drinking and Louise doing the Charleston..That was a story in one of the bio's . Happy reading

                    Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: Anita,

                    She wasn't quite the fully-fledged hellion yet when she was kicked
                    off the Denishawn team, but she was well on her way. She went to New
                    York with a chaperone at first, but she quickly graduated from paying
                    student to paid troupe member with lots of travel involved. Barry
                    Paris doesn't say much if anything about the chaperone when Louise
                    was picked up as a regular. Likely she went home to Kansas soon
                    thereafter. On the road, she was required to be above moral and
                    social reproach, but she wasn't always. She was the subject of a lot
                    of rumors and her reputation soured. She was evidently sneaking
                    around to clubs and not coming back to the room until wake-up time.
                    Being an incredible dancer, however, her pecadillos were overlooked
                    for the most part. She toured, and starred, with the troupe for two
                    seasons, getting harder and harder to manage all the time, more
                    independent, more stubborn, fuller and fuller of herself. Finally,
                    she came into a group meeting late and the boss gave her the heave-ho
                    in front of everybody. Not so much as a word of caution is ever
                    mentioned as I recalled. She just crossed the line once too many
                    times and got the boot. Ruth St. Denis gave told her she was being
                    dismissed because she wanted the world on a silver salver. Soon
                    after that, she was dancing in Scandals and later Zeigfield, that's
                    when she really started racing the party engine. Hope this helps!

                    And do get the Barry Paris book, you'll love it.

                    --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                    <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > She was a self-made woman, as you described. That's what makes her
                    so
                    > admirable to me – that she got so far starting with so little. But
                    she was
                    > every bit as tragic as Marilyn Monroe, IMO; she never truly
                    overcame her
                    > inner `demons' so she sabotaged herself and drove away anyone who
                    got close
                    > to her. I'd like to know the whole story of her dismissal from
                    Denishawn.
                    > I'd read that she drank heavily and often didn't show up for
                    rehearsals.
                    > Today we have help for kids with drinking/drug problems, anti-social
                    > behavior, victims of abuse, etc. Unfortunately, such programs
                    didn't exist
                    > then.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > I've just joined the group, too, and have read only "Lulu in
                    Hollywood" and
                    > whatever I can find on the net. I also have the "Biography" special
                    on DVD.
                    > I see that Barry Paris' bio is a must.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > (Neve Campbell certainly looks the part!)
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Anita M.
                    >






                    Perri Lee Leuthard



                    ---------------------------------
                    Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                    Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • nutsaboutclara
                    I don t think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that accompanies success
                    Message 9 of 29 , Apr 30 10:24 AM
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                      I don't think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity
                      more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that
                      accompanies success sometimes. But, that's just a thought of mine.

                      -Dario.


                      --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                      <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > True, she pretty much said she "raised herself." There are several
                      reasons
                      > she didn't want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we'll
                      never know.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > AM
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > _____
                      >
                      > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                      > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                      > nutsaboutclara
                      > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:34 PM
                      > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                      > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological Profile?
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
                      > with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think
                      her
                      > troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
                      > attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As
                      Brooksie
                      > herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were
                      more
                      > in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
                      > their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.
                      >
                      > -Dario.
                      >
                      > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                      > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                      brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                      > SMILEYJEN1@
                      > wrote:
                      > >
                      > > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is
                      that
                      > she
                      > > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if she
                      > > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers. She
                      > > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things, only
                      to
                      > strip
                      > > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
                      > theme in
                      > > her life - she would never be complacent again.
                      > >
                      > > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
                      > > Jennifer ^_^
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
                      > > <no_reply@yahoogroup <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com> s.com>
                      writes:
                      > > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study on
                      > > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
                      > > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
                      > fans
                      > > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
                      > > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In
                      fact,
                      > > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about
                      > > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
                      > >
                      > > -Dario.
                      > >
                      > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                      > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                      brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                      > Perri Lee
                      > > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it
                      > > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
                      > > negative energy off others.
                      > > >
                      > > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
                      > > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
                      > > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio of
                      > > her
                      > > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an
                      incredibly
                      > > > complex person!
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > Perri Lee Leuthard
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > ---------------------------------
                      > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                      > > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                      > > >
                      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      > > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      > >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                    • nutsaboutclara
                      WHOOPS!!!!! I meant emptiness. Sorry, folks! -Dario. ... several ... Profile? ... she ... She ... only ... on ... about ... it ... of
                      Message 10 of 29 , May 5, 2007
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                        WHOOPS!!!!! I meant "emptiness." Sorry, folks!

                        -Dario.


                        --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, nutsaboutclara
                        <no_reply@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > I don't think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity
                        > more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that
                        > accompanies success sometimes. But, that's just a thought of mine.
                        >
                        > -Dario.
                        >
                        >
                        > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                        > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > True, she pretty much said she "raised herself." There are
                        several
                        > reasons
                        > > she didn't want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we'll
                        > never know.
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > AM
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > _____
                        > >
                        > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                        > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                        > > nutsaboutclara
                        > > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:34 PM
                        > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                        > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological
                        Profile?
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
                        > > with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think
                        > her
                        > > troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
                        > > attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As
                        > Brooksie
                        > > herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were
                        > more
                        > > in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
                        > > their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.
                        > >
                        > > -Dario.
                        > >
                        > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                        > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                        > brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                        > > SMILEYJEN1@
                        > > wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is
                        > that
                        > > she
                        > > > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if
                        she
                        > > > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers.
                        She
                        > > > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things,
                        only
                        > to
                        > > strip
                        > > > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
                        > > theme in
                        > > > her life - she would never be complacent again.
                        > > >
                        > > > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
                        > > > Jennifer ^_^
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
                        > > > <no_reply@yahoogroup <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com> s.com>
                        > writes:
                        > > > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study
                        on
                        > > > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
                        > > > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
                        > > fans
                        > > > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
                        > > > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In
                        > fact,
                        > > > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING
                        about
                        > > > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
                        > > >
                        > > > -Dario.
                        > > >
                        > > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                        > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                        > brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                        > > Perri Lee
                        > > > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
                        > > > >
                        > > > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew
                        it
                        > > > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
                        > > > negative energy off others.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
                        > > > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
                        > > > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio
                        of
                        > > > her
                        > > > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an
                        > incredibly
                        > > > > complex person!
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > Perri Lee Leuthard
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > ---------------------------------
                        > > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                        > > > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                        > > > >
                        > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        > > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        > > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        > >
                        >
                      • olive_e_thomas
                        The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her book club Louise would likely
                        Message 11 of 29 , May 5, 2007
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                          The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                          personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                          book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                          success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                        • Anita M
                          I can understand that, and I wouldn’t blame her, either. Anita M. Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult that you do. -
                          Message 12 of 29 , May 6, 2007
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                            I can understand that, and I wouldn’t blame her, either.



                            Anita M.



                            "Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult
                            that you do." - Elizabeth Goudge

                            _____

                            From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                            [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                            olive_e_thomas
                            Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2007 10:27 PM
                            To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



                            The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                            personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                            book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                            success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...





                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Anita M
                            No worries; we know what you meant ;-) Anita M. Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult that you do. - Elizabeth Goudge
                            Message 13 of 29 , May 6, 2007
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                              No worries; we know what you meant ;-)



                              Anita M.



                              "Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult
                              that you do." - Elizabeth Goudge

                              _____

                              From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                              [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                              nutsaboutclara
                              Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2007 11:38 AM
                              To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                              Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



                              WHOOPS!!!!! I meant "emptiness." Sorry, folks!

                              -Dario.

                              --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                              nutsaboutclara
                              <no_reply@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > I don't think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity
                              > more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that
                              > accompanies success sometimes. But, that's just a thought of mine.
                              >
                              > -Dario.
                              >
                              >
                              > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                              "Anita M"
                              > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                              > >
                              > > True, she pretty much said she "raised herself." There are
                              several
                              > reasons
                              > > she didn't want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we'll
                              > never know.
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > AM
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > _____
                              > >
                              > > From: thenewcovenoflouise
                              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com
                              > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouise
                              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com]
                              On Behalf Of
                              > > nutsaboutclara
                              > > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:34 PM
                              > > To: thenewcovenoflouise
                              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com
                              > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological
                              Profile?
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
                              > > with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think
                              > her
                              > > troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
                              > > attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As
                              > Brooksie
                              > > herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were
                              > more
                              > > in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
                              > > their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.
                              > >
                              > > -Dario.
                              > >
                              > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                              > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                              > brooks@yahoogroups. <mailto:brooks%40yahoogroups.com> com,
                              > > SMILEYJEN1@
                              > > wrote:
                              > > >
                              > > > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is
                              > that
                              > > she
                              > > > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if
                              she
                              > > > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers.
                              She
                              > > > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things,
                              only
                              > to
                              > > strip
                              > > > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
                              > > theme in
                              > > > her life - she would never be complacent again.
                              > > >
                              > > > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
                              > > > Jennifer ^_^
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
                              > > > <no_reply@yahoogroup <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com> s.com>
                              > writes:
                              > > > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study
                              on
                              > > > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
                              > > > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
                              > > fans
                              > > > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
                              > > > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In
                              > fact,
                              > > > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING
                              about
                              > > > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
                              > > >
                              > > > -Dario.
                              > > >
                              > > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                              > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                              > brooks@yahoogroups. <mailto:brooks%40yahoogroups.com> com,
                              > > Perri Lee
                              > > > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
                              > > > >
                              > > > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew
                              it
                              > > > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
                              > > > negative energy off others.
                              > > > >
                              > > > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
                              > > > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
                              > > > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio
                              of
                              > > > her
                              > > > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an
                              > incredibly
                              > > > > complex person!
                              > > > >
                              > > > >
                              > > > >
                              > > > >
                              > > > >
                              > > > >
                              > > > > Perri Lee Leuthard
                              > > > >
                              > > > >
                              > > > >
                              > > > > ---------------------------------
                              > > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                              > > > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                              > > > >
                              > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              > > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              > > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              > >
                              >





                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • Chuck Golden
                              I think you ve hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it s evident that she had to be in
                              Message 14 of 29 , May 6, 2007
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                                I think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                                through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident that
                                she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but in
                                control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster piece "The
                                Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to the
                                top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                                from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without her
                                knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                                ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite the
                                increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                                excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                                involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation where
                                she couldn't be 100% in control of it.

                                Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out there?
                                Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls far
                                from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something as
                                simple as that.


                                --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                >
                              • Perri Lee
                                I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades she was
                                Message 15 of 29 , May 6, 2007
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                                  I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed with the twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee

                                  Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: I think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                                  through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident that
                                  she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but in
                                  control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster piece "The
                                  Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to the
                                  top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                                  from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without her
                                  knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                                  ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite the
                                  increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                                  excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                                  involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                  wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation where
                                  she couldn't be 100% in control of it.

                                  Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out there?
                                  Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls far
                                  from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something as
                                  simple as that.

                                  --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                  <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                  > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                  > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                  > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                  >






                                  Perri Lee Leuthard



                                  ---------------------------------
                                  Don't pick lemons.
                                  See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • Anita M
                                  I m not sure that public knowledge of her escapades would have bothered her. She never appeared to be embarrassed about anything she did, nor cared what anyone
                                  Message 16 of 29 , May 7, 2007
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                                    I'm not sure that public knowledge of her escapades would have bothered her.
                                    She never appeared to be embarrassed about anything she did, nor cared what
                                    anyone else thought of her. I think it was a 100% control issue.



                                    Anita M.

                                    _____

                                    From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                    [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Perri Lee
                                    Sent: Sunday, May 06, 2007 1:35 PM
                                    To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                    Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



                                    I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to
                                    publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades
                                    she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed with the
                                    twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee

                                    Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@yahoo. <mailto:bagnoli2%40yahoo.com> com> wrote: I
                                    think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All through
                                    the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident that she had to be
                                    in control - not so much in control of the people but in control of the
                                    situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster piece "The Girl in the Black
                                    Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to the top of the public
                                    consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word from him that he'd been out
                                    on the West Coast discussing (without her knowing it) a bio-pic with a major
                                    Hollywood director. She went ballistic, refused any thought of letting the
                                    film be done (despite the increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off
                                    forever. She excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project
                                    that involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                    wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation where she
                                    couldn't be 100% in control of it.

                                    Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out there?
                                    Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls far from
                                    the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something as simple as
                                    that.

                                    --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                                    <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                                    olive_e_thomas
                                    <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of personal
                                    control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her book club Louise
                                    would likely refuse on the grounds any success would "belong" to Oprah and
                                    not to her...
                                    >

                                    Perri Lee Leuthard

                                    ---------------------------------
                                    Don't pick lemons.
                                    See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  • Chuck Golden
                                    Perri Lee, She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn t publish her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the sexual
                                    Message 17 of 29 , May 7, 2007
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                                      Perri Lee,

                                      She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't publish
                                      her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                      sexual beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                      potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted to her priest
                                      in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she wanted a drink
                                      and when she read about sex she got excited. So she opted not to
                                      publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable young women.
                                      On the one hand, she wouldn't renounce her lifestyle (standing toe-to-
                                      toe with her priest), on the other hand she was concerned about
                                      having young girls see her habits and lifestyle as desirable and
                                      exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant contradictions of
                                      Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a proof
                                      of her brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                                      being anything but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.

                                      I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs of
                                      her region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                      was mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                      attended a Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough
                                      to evidently have a fling with an older man in the church before
                                      moving to Manhatten), and for ten years as a Catholic between 1954
                                      and 1964 in New York. I certainly don't see either of them as being
                                      twisted in either location. Except for the Catholic period, I think
                                      Louise's attitude towards religion was ambivalence rather than
                                      antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring that she left the
                                      Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of note in her
                                      little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she
                                      had a statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                      religious beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that
                                      opinion.

                                      Cheers!


                                      --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, Perri Lee
                                      <cheaptrickaz@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not
                                      want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all
                                      the escapades she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was
                                      also mixed with the twisted religious beliefs of her region and her
                                      day. Perri Lee
                                      >
                                      > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: I think you've hit on
                                      one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                                      > through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident
                                      that
                                      > she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but
                                      in
                                      > control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster
                                      piece "The
                                      > Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to
                                      the
                                      > top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                                      > from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without
                                      her
                                      > knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                                      > ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite
                                      the
                                      > increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                                      > excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                                      > involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                      > wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation
                                      where
                                      > she couldn't be 100% in control of it.
                                      >
                                      > Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out
                                      there?
                                      > Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls
                                      far
                                      > from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something
                                      as
                                      > simple as that.
                                      >
                                      > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                      > <no_reply@> wrote:
                                      > >
                                      > > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                      > > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                      > > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                      > > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                      > >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Perri Lee Leuthard
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > ---------------------------------
                                      > Don't pick lemons.
                                      > See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                                      >
                                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      >
                                    • Perri Lee
                                      I still beleive that the reason she did not publish was some how tied to the twisted religious moral thing. It is why I feel she did not write and it still is
                                      Message 18 of 29 , May 7, 2007
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                                        I still beleive that the reason she did not publish was some how tied to the twisted religious moral thing. It is why I feel she did not write and it still is the same thing and reason why people and persons hold themselves back today. But of course this is getting to be too large of a subject for this group. thanks

                                        Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: Perri Lee,

                                        She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't publish
                                        her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                        sexual beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                        potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted to her priest
                                        in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she wanted a drink
                                        and when she read about sex she got excited. So she opted not to
                                        publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable young women.
                                        On the one hand, she wouldn't renounce her lifestyle (standing toe-to-
                                        toe with her priest), on the other hand she was concerned about
                                        having young girls see her habits and lifestyle as desirable and
                                        exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant contradictions of
                                        Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a proof
                                        of her brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                                        being anything but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.

                                        I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs of
                                        her region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                        was mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                        attended a Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough
                                        to evidently have a fling with an older man in the church before
                                        moving to Manhatten), and for ten years as a Catholic between 1954
                                        and 1964 in New York. I certainly don't see either of them as being
                                        twisted in either location. Except for the Catholic period, I think
                                        Louise's attitude towards religion was ambivalence rather than
                                        antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring that she left the
                                        Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of note in her
                                        little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she
                                        had a statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                        religious beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that
                                        opinion.

                                        Cheers!

                                        --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, Perri Lee
                                        <cheaptrickaz@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not
                                        want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all
                                        the escapades she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was
                                        also mixed with the twisted religious beliefs of her region and her
                                        day. Perri Lee
                                        >
                                        > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: I think you've hit on
                                        one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                                        > through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident
                                        that
                                        > she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but
                                        in
                                        > control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster
                                        piece "The
                                        > Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to
                                        the
                                        > top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                                        > from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without
                                        her
                                        > knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                                        > ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite
                                        the
                                        > increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                                        > excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                                        > involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                        > wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation
                                        where
                                        > she couldn't be 100% in control of it.
                                        >
                                        > Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out
                                        there?
                                        > Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls
                                        far
                                        > from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something
                                        as
                                        > simple as that.
                                        >
                                        > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                        > <no_reply@> wrote:
                                        > >
                                        > > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                        > > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                        > > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                        > > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                        > >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > Perri Lee Leuthard
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > ---------------------------------
                                        > Don't pick lemons.
                                        > See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                                        >
                                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        >






                                        Perri Lee Leuthard



                                        ---------------------------------
                                        Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                                        Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      • Anita M
                                        IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect to underage girls, who (judging from my own experience) are impressionable and most likely to
                                        Message 19 of 29 , May 7, 2007
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                                          IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect to underage
                                          girls, who (judging from my own experience) are impressionable and most
                                          likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my life, illegal
                                          drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew people who bought
                                          into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her adventures
                                          and saying at the end “don’t do what I did,” (which seldom carries any
                                          weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.



                                          Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day “spilling
                                          the sexual beans” could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If you ever
                                          have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which celebrities are
                                          doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you want to see
                                          them or not.)



                                          Anita M.



                                          _____

                                          From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                          [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                          Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                          To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                          Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



                                          Perri Lee,

                                          She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't publish her
                                          biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the sexual
                                          beans and that she had concerns about what this could potentially do to
                                          influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s that when
                                          she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she read about sex she
                                          got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for
                                          impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't renounce her
                                          lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other hand she was
                                          concerned about having young girls see her habits and lifestyle as desirable
                                          and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant contradictions of
                                          Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a proof of her
                                          brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on being anything
                                          but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.

                                          I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs of her
                                          region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion was
                                          mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she attended a
                                          Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to evidently have
                                          a fling with an older man in the church before moving to Manhatten), and for
                                          ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I certainly don't
                                          see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except for the
                                          Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was ambivalence
                                          rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring that she left
                                          the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of note in her
                                          little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she had a
                                          statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the religious
                                          beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.

                                          Cheers!

                                          >
                                          > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to
                                          publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades
                                          she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed with the
                                          twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee





                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        • nutsaboutclara
                                          That s quite true, Olive. Brooksie always wanted to control the situation, so that she could be the center of attention. It was that way at home, when she
                                          Message 20 of 29 , May 7, 2007
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                                            That's quite true, Olive. Brooksie always wanted to control the
                                            situation, so that she could be the center of attention. It was that
                                            way at home, when she and her mother bickered, and it continued well
                                            into adulthood. She was her own marching band, which turned a lot of
                                            people off, that's for sure.

                                            -Dario.


                                            --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                            <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                            > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                            > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                            > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                            >
                                          • nutsaboutclara
                                            She was a very willful person, Chuck; it was her way and nothing else. Clara Bow was like that to an extent, but she was outgoing and cheerful towards all
                                            Message 21 of 29 , May 7, 2007
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                                              She was a very willful person, Chuck; it was her way and nothing
                                              else. Clara Bow was like that to an extent, but she was outgoing and
                                              cheerful towards all that met Clara. But Brooksie was moody,
                                              taciturn at times, and an intelectual snob, who thought that she was
                                              above everyone when it came film(film history, film making, actors &
                                              actresses, etc.), literature, politics, sex, male/female
                                              relationships, etc. And, very opinionated. But, I love her for it,
                                              because she would be who she was if she wasn't that in the first
                                              place. I marvel at her strong sense of independence. That made her
                                              stand out more than her contemporaries.

                                              -Dario.



                                              --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Chuck Golden"
                                              <bagnoli2@...> wrote:
                                              >
                                              > I think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality.
                                              All
                                              > through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident
                                              that
                                              > she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but
                                              in
                                              > control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster
                                              piece "The
                                              > Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to
                                              the
                                              > top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                                              > from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without
                                              her
                                              > knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                                              > ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite
                                              the
                                              > increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                                              > excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                                              > involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                              > wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation
                                              where
                                              > she couldn't be 100% in control of it.
                                              >
                                              > Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out
                                              there?
                                              > Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls
                                              far
                                              > from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something
                                              as
                                              > simple as that.
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                              > <no_reply@> wrote:
                                              > >
                                              > > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                              > > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                              > > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                              > > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                              > >
                                              >
                                            • olive_e_thomas
                                              I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of child-care in that respect). My guess is
                                              Message 22 of 29 , May 7, 2007
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                                                I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                                children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                                child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                                ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed little
                                                brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                                selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and it
                                                was easier to torch than try and rewrite...

                                                It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of one
                                                whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                                went.

                                                But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                                words that just don't seem to go together...

                                                --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                                <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                                                >
                                                > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect
                                                to underage
                                                > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                                impressionable and most
                                                > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my life,
                                                illegal
                                                > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                                people who bought
                                                > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                                adventures
                                                > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                                carries any
                                                > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day
                                                "spilling
                                                > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If
                                                you ever
                                                > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                                celebrities are
                                                > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                                want to see
                                                > them or not.)
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > Anita M.
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > _____
                                                >
                                                > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                                > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                                > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                                Profile?
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > Perri Lee,
                                                >
                                                > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                                publish her
                                                > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                                sexual
                                                > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                                potentially do to
                                                > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s
                                                that when
                                                > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                                read about sex she
                                                > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                                concern for
                                                > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                                renounce her
                                                > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other hand
                                                she was
                                                > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                                lifestyle as desirable
                                                > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                                contradictions of
                                                > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                                proof of her
                                                > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on being
                                                anything
                                                > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                                >
                                                > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs
                                                of her
                                                > region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                                was
                                                > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                                attended a
                                                > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                                evidently have
                                                > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                                Manhatten), and for
                                                > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                                certainly don't
                                                > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                                for the
                                                > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was
                                                ambivalence
                                                > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                                that she left
                                                > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                                note in her
                                                > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she
                                                had a
                                                > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                                religious
                                                > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                                >
                                                > Cheers!
                                                >
                                                > >
                                                > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not
                                                want to
                                                > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the
                                                escapades
                                                > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed
                                                with the
                                                > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                >
                                              • nutsaboutclara
                                                HEAR, HEAR!!! Discriminatory would probably be a better word for what Brooksie was all about, in respect to people, art, literature, etc. You hit the nail on
                                                Message 23 of 29 , May 9, 2007
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                                                  HEAR, HEAR!!! Discriminatory would probably be a better word for
                                                  what Brooksie was all about, in respect to people, art, literature,
                                                  etc. You hit the nail on the head perfectly, Olive. Kudos!

                                                  -Dario.


                                                  --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                                  <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                                  > children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                                  > child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                                  > ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed
                                                  little
                                                  > brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                                  > selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and
                                                  it
                                                  > was easier to torch than try and rewrite...
                                                  >
                                                  > It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of
                                                  one
                                                  > whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                                  > went.
                                                  >
                                                  > But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                                  > words that just don't seem to go together...
                                                  >
                                                  > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                                  > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                                                  > >
                                                  > > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect
                                                  > to underage
                                                  > > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                                  > impressionable and most
                                                  > > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my
                                                  life,
                                                  > illegal
                                                  > > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                                  > people who bought
                                                  > > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                                  > adventures
                                                  > > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                                  > carries any
                                                  > > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day
                                                  > "spilling
                                                  > > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If
                                                  > you ever
                                                  > > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                                  > celebrities are
                                                  > > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                                  > want to see
                                                  > > them or not.)
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > > Anita M.
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > > _____
                                                  > >
                                                  > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                  > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                  > Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                                  > > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                                  > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                  > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                                  > Profile?
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > > Perri Lee,
                                                  > >
                                                  > > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                                  > publish her
                                                  > > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                                  > sexual
                                                  > > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                                  > potentially do to
                                                  > > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s
                                                  > that when
                                                  > > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                                  > read about sex she
                                                  > > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                                  > concern for
                                                  > > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                                  > renounce her
                                                  > > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other
                                                  hand
                                                  > she was
                                                  > > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                                  > lifestyle as desirable
                                                  > > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                                  > contradictions of
                                                  > > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                                  > proof of her
                                                  > > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                                                  being
                                                  > anything
                                                  > > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                                  > >
                                                  > > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs
                                                  > of her
                                                  > > region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                                  > was
                                                  > > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                                  > attended a
                                                  > > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                                  > evidently have
                                                  > > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                                  > Manhatten), and for
                                                  > > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                                  > certainly don't
                                                  > > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                                  > for the
                                                  > > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was
                                                  > ambivalence
                                                  > > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                                  > that she left
                                                  > > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                                  > note in her
                                                  > > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think
                                                  she
                                                  > had a
                                                  > > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                                  > religious
                                                  > > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                                  > >
                                                  > > Cheers!
                                                  > >
                                                  > > >
                                                  > > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did
                                                  not
                                                  > want to
                                                  > > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the
                                                  > escapades
                                                  > > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed
                                                  > with the
                                                  > > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > >
                                                  > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                  > >
                                                  >
                                                • Anita M.
                                                  Now I m confused. Chuck said She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn t publish her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling
                                                  Message 24 of 29 , May 9, 2007
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                                                    Now I'm confused.

                                                    Chuck said "She said several times that one of the reasons she
                                                    wouldn't publish her biography was that to do it properly would mean
                                                    spilling all the sexual beans and that she had concerns about what
                                                    this could potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted to
                                                    her priest in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she
                                                    wanted a drink and when she read about sex she got excited. So she
                                                    opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable
                                                    young women."

                                                    But then, some people say one thing one day and the opposite another
                                                    day - maybe a way to hold onto a little privacy.

                                                    Anita M.


                                                    --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                                    <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                                    >
                                                    > I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                                    > children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                                    > child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                                    > ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed
                                                    little
                                                    > brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                                    > selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and it
                                                    > was easier to torch than try and rewrite...
                                                    >
                                                    > It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of
                                                    one
                                                    > whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                                    > went.
                                                    >
                                                    > But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                                    > words that just don't seem to go together...
                                                    >
                                                    > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                                    > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                                                    > >
                                                    > > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect
                                                    > to underage
                                                    > > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                                    > impressionable and most
                                                    > > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my
                                                    life,
                                                    > illegal
                                                    > > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                                    > people who bought
                                                    > > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                                    > adventures
                                                    > > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                                    > carries any
                                                    > > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day
                                                    > "spilling
                                                    > > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If
                                                    > you ever
                                                    > > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                                    > celebrities are
                                                    > > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                                    > want to see
                                                    > > them or not.)
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > > Anita M.
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > > _____
                                                    > >
                                                    > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                    > Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                                    > > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                                    > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                                    > Profile?
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > > Perri Lee,
                                                    > >
                                                    > > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                                    > publish her
                                                    > > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                                    > sexual
                                                    > > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                                    > potentially do to
                                                    > > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s
                                                    > that when
                                                    > > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                                    > read about sex she
                                                    > > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                                    > concern for
                                                    > > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                                    > renounce her
                                                    > > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other
                                                    hand
                                                    > she was
                                                    > > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                                    > lifestyle as desirable
                                                    > > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                                    > contradictions of
                                                    > > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                                    > proof of her
                                                    > > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on being
                                                    > anything
                                                    > > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                                    > >
                                                    > > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs
                                                    > of her
                                                    > > region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                                    > was
                                                    > > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                                    > attended a
                                                    > > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                                    > evidently have
                                                    > > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                                    > Manhatten), and for
                                                    > > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                                    > certainly don't
                                                    > > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                                    > for the
                                                    > > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was
                                                    > ambivalence
                                                    > > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                                    > that she left
                                                    > > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                                    > note in her
                                                    > > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think
                                                    she
                                                    > had a
                                                    > > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                                    > religious
                                                    > > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                                    > >
                                                    > > Cheers!
                                                    > >
                                                    > > >
                                                    > > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did
                                                    not
                                                    > want to
                                                    > > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the
                                                    > escapades
                                                    > > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed
                                                    > with the
                                                    > > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > >
                                                    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                    > >
                                                    >
                                                  • olive_e_thomas
                                                    Some clue as to her reasoning might be found in her comments after turning down Playboy magazine for a writing job all they want is (an article about) tits
                                                    Message 25 of 29 , May 9, 2007
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                                                      Some clue as to her reasoning might be found in her comments
                                                      after turning down Playboy magazine for a writing job "all they
                                                      want is (an article about) tits and free-fucking for men."

                                                      --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M."
                                                      <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                                                      >
                                                      > Now I'm confused.
                                                      >
                                                      > Chuck said "She said several times that one of the reasons
                                                      she
                                                      > wouldn't publish her biography was that to do it properly would
                                                      mean
                                                      > spilling all the sexual beans and that she had concerns about
                                                      what
                                                      > this could potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted
                                                      to
                                                      > her priest in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking
                                                      she
                                                      > wanted a drink and when she read about sex she got excited.
                                                      So she
                                                      > opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for
                                                      impressionable
                                                      > young women."
                                                      >
                                                      > But then, some people say one thing one day and the opposite
                                                      another
                                                      > day - maybe a way to hold onto a little privacy.
                                                      >
                                                      > Anita M.
                                                      >
                                                      >
                                                    • nutsaboutclara
                                                      Brooksie was trying to protect herself from what others said about her. She never did trust people whom she met and later talked trash about her. Brooksie
                                                      Message 26 of 29 , May 12, 2007
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                                                        Brooksie was trying to protect herself from what others said about
                                                        her. She never did trust people whom she met and later talked trash
                                                        about her. Brooksie was one tough egg to crack, that's for sure.

                                                        -Dario.


                                                        --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M."
                                                        <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                                                        >
                                                        > Now I'm confused.
                                                        >
                                                        > Chuck said "She said several times that one of the reasons she
                                                        > wouldn't publish her biography was that to do it properly would
                                                        mean
                                                        > spilling all the sexual beans and that she had concerns about what
                                                        > this could potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted
                                                        to
                                                        > her priest in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she
                                                        > wanted a drink and when she read about sex she got excited. So she
                                                        > opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable
                                                        > young women."
                                                        >
                                                        > But then, some people say one thing one day and the opposite
                                                        another
                                                        > day - maybe a way to hold onto a little privacy.
                                                        >
                                                        > Anita M.
                                                        >
                                                        >
                                                        > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                                        > <no_reply@> wrote:
                                                        > >
                                                        > > I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                                        > > children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                                        > > child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                                        > > ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed
                                                        > little
                                                        > > brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                                        > > selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and
                                                        it
                                                        > > was easier to torch than try and rewrite...
                                                        > >
                                                        > > It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of
                                                        > one
                                                        > > whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                                        > > went.
                                                        > >
                                                        > > But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                                        > > words that just don't seem to go together...
                                                        > >
                                                        > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                                        > > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in
                                                        respect
                                                        > > to underage
                                                        > > > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                                        > > impressionable and most
                                                        > > > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my
                                                        > life,
                                                        > > illegal
                                                        > > > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                                        > > people who bought
                                                        > > > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                                        > > adventures
                                                        > > > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                                        > > carries any
                                                        > > > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her
                                                        day
                                                        > > "spilling
                                                        > > > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it.
                                                        (If
                                                        > > you ever
                                                        > > > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                                        > > celebrities are
                                                        > > > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                                        > > want to see
                                                        > > > them or not.)
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > Anita M.
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > _____
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                        > > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                        > > Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                                        > > > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                                        > > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                        > > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                                        > > Profile?
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > Perri Lee,
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                                        > > publish her
                                                        > > > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all
                                                        the
                                                        > > sexual
                                                        > > > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                                        > > potentially do to
                                                        > > > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-
                                                        50s
                                                        > > that when
                                                        > > > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                                        > > read about sex she
                                                        > > > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                                        > > concern for
                                                        > > > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                                        > > renounce her
                                                        > > > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other
                                                        > hand
                                                        > > she was
                                                        > > > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                                        > > lifestyle as desirable
                                                        > > > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                                        > > contradictions of
                                                        > > > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                                        > > proof of her
                                                        > > > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                                                        being
                                                        > > anything
                                                        > > > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions
                                                        beliefs
                                                        > > of her
                                                        > > > region and her day". The only periods in her life where
                                                        religion
                                                        > > was
                                                        > > > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                                        > > attended a
                                                        > > > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                                        > > evidently have
                                                        > > > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                                        > > Manhatten), and for
                                                        > > > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                                        > > certainly don't
                                                        > > > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                                        > > for the
                                                        > > > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion
                                                        was
                                                        > > ambivalence
                                                        > > > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                                        > > that she left
                                                        > > > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                                        > > note in her
                                                        > > > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think
                                                        > she
                                                        > > had a
                                                        > > > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                                        > > religious
                                                        > > > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > Cheers!
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > >
                                                        > > > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did
                                                        > not
                                                        > > want to
                                                        > > > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all
                                                        the
                                                        > > escapades
                                                        > > > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also
                                                        mixed
                                                        > > with the
                                                        > > > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                        > > >
                                                        > >
                                                        >
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