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Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological Profile?

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  • Perri Lee
    I don t think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take negative energy off others. Chuck
    Message 1 of 29 , Apr 26, 2007
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      I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take negative energy off others.

      Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: Has anyone seen or know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
      Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio of her
      and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an incredibly
      complex person!






      Perri Lee Leuthard



      ---------------------------------
      Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
      Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • nutsaboutclara
      To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study on Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film viewers, especially since most
      Message 2 of 29 , Apr 26, 2007
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        To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study on
        Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
        viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film fans
        at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
        community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In fact,
        there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about
        Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.

        -Dario.


        --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, Perri Lee
        <cheaptrickaz@...> wrote:
        >
        > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it
        and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
        negative energy off others.
        >
        > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: Has anyone seen or
        know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
        > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio of
        her
        > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an incredibly
        > complex person!
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Perri Lee Leuthard
        >
        >
        >
        > ---------------------------------
        > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
        > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • SMILEYJEN1@JUNO.COM
        She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is that she was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if she allowed herself to
        Message 3 of 29 , Apr 26, 2007
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          She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is that she
          was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if she
          allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers. She
          followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things, only to strip
          her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing theme in
          her life - she would never be complacent again.

          Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
          Jennifer ^_^



          On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
          <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> writes:
          To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study on
          Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
          viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film fans
          at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
          community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In fact,
          there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about
          Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.

          -Dario.

          --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, Perri Lee
          <cheaptrickaz@...> wrote:
          >
          > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it
          and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
          negative energy off others.
          >
          > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: Has anyone seen or
          know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
          > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio of
          her
          > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an incredibly
          > complex person!
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > Perri Lee Leuthard
          >
          >
          >
          > ---------------------------------
          > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
          > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • nutsaboutclara
          Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think her troubles were that
          Message 4 of 29 , Apr 27, 2007
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            Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
            with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think her
            troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
            attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As Brooksie
            herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were more
            in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
            their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.

            -Dario.


            --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, SMILEYJEN1@...
            wrote:
            >
            > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is that
            she
            > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if she
            > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers. She
            > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things, only to
            strip
            > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
            theme in
            > her life - she would never be complacent again.
            >
            > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
            > Jennifer ^_^
            >
            >
            >
            > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
            > <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> writes:
            > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study on
            > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
            > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
            fans
            > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
            > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In fact,
            > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about
            > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
            >
            > -Dario.
            >
            > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, Perri Lee
            > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
            > >
            > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it
            > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
            > negative energy off others.
            > >
            > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
            > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
            > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio of
            > her
            > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an incredibly
            > > complex person!
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Perri Lee Leuthard
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > ---------------------------------
            > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
            > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
            > >
            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            > >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
          • Anita M
            True, she pretty much said she “raised herself.” There are several reasons she didn’t want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we’ll never know.
            Message 5 of 29 , Apr 27, 2007
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              True, she pretty much said she “raised herself.” There are several reasons
              she didn’t want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we’ll never know.



              AM





              _____

              From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
              [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
              nutsaboutclara
              Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:34 PM
              To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological Profile?



              Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
              with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think her
              troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
              attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As Brooksie
              herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were more
              in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
              their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.

              -Dario.

              --- In thenewcovenoflouise
              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
              SMILEYJEN1@...
              wrote:
              >
              > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is that
              she
              > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if she
              > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers. She
              > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things, only to
              strip
              > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
              theme in
              > her life - she would never be complacent again.
              >
              > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
              > Jennifer ^_^
              >
              >
              >
              > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
              > <no_reply@yahoogroup <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com> s.com> writes:
              > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study on
              > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
              > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
              fans
              > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
              > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In fact,
              > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about
              > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
              >
              > -Dario.
              >
              > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
              <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
              Perri Lee
              > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
              > >
              > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it
              > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
              > negative energy off others.
              > >
              > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
              > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
              > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio of
              > her
              > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an incredibly
              > > complex person!
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Perri Lee Leuthard
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > ---------------------------------
              > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
              > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Chuck Golden
              Thanks for the great discussion, everybody, I just joined the group and you seem like my kind of people. As originally mentioned, I m in my third reading of
              Message 6 of 29 , Apr 28, 2007
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                Thanks for the great discussion, everybody, I just joined the group
                and you seem like my kind of people. As originally mentioned, I'm in
                my third reading of Barry Paris's bio of her. It doesn't usually take
                very long to figure out a person. Whether you interact with them in
                person or read about them (with enough detail), you can normally put
                them into one or two catagories. Not Louise Brooks, at least with me
                so far. I'll be fourty-seven in a month or so, and I've dealt with
                thousands of people by now. I enjoy histories and biographies and
                have read a great many of both. Nobody I know or have studies so
                intrigues and disturbs me like Louise.

                Small-town girl, aesthete, great dancer, unbelievably well-read,
                articulate, undisciplined, sexually abused, emotionally abused,
                neglected, great actor, promiscuous, prostitute, Catholic,
                self-destructive, the list goes on and on. She was a high school
                dropout who was able to write like a professional at age seventeen,
                and did so. She had no formal acting training that I knew of, but at
                twenty-one she was Lulu. She was most likely of genious mentality but
                throughout her life she systematically did everything possible to
                destroy herself. She was such a complex, complex person.

                Like most everyone, I fully believe that her biggest problems sprang
                from her upbringing. You can't overstate the emotional damage brought
                onto a child by parental neglect and sexual abuse, and Louise suffered
                both of them. I can't help but wonder what she would have been like
                if her mother had shown her even a modicom of affection and hadn't
                blamed her when Louise told her mother at age nine for being raped by
                Mr. Flowers. I also believe, because she said as much when she was
                old, that she only wanted to be a dancer. The one thing in her life
                to which she had given focused and committed attention was her studies
                at Denishawn, and I think that her getting so viciously dismissed from
                the group at seventeen fractured something in her psyche that never
                healed. I could go on for hour. Ask my wife, she'll tell you. :o)

                Louise was wonderful. Disturbing, but wonderful. I wonder if I'd
                have liked her.
              • Perri Lee
                has anyone heard when Neve Cambell is going to get started on filming Louise s bio. I read she bought the rights and wanted to star in it. I hope she gets on
                Message 7 of 29 , Apr 28, 2007
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                  has anyone heard when Neve Cambell is going to get started on filming Louise's bio. I read she bought the rights and wanted to star in it. I hope she gets on with it before she gets too old

                  Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: Thanks for the great discussion, everybody, I just joined the group
                  and you seem like my kind of people. As originally mentioned, I'm in
                  my third reading of Barry Paris's bio of her. It doesn't usually take
                  very long to figure out a person. Whether you interact with them in
                  person or read about them (with enough detail), you can normally put
                  them into one or two catagories. Not Louise Brooks, at least with me
                  so far. I'll be fourty-seven in a month or so, and I've dealt with
                  thousands of people by now. I enjoy histories and biographies and
                  have read a great many of both. Nobody I know or have studies so
                  intrigues and disturbs me like Louise.

                  Small-town girl, aesthete, great dancer, unbelievably well-read,
                  articulate, undisciplined, sexually abused, emotionally abused,
                  neglected, great actor, promiscuous, prostitute, Catholic,
                  self-destructive, the list goes on and on. She was a high school
                  dropout who was able to write like a professional at age seventeen,
                  and did so. She had no formal acting training that I knew of, but at
                  twenty-one she was Lulu. She was most likely of genious mentality but
                  throughout her life she systematically did everything possible to
                  destroy herself. She was such a complex, complex person.

                  Like most everyone, I fully believe that her biggest problems sprang
                  from her upbringing. You can't overstate the emotional damage brought
                  onto a child by parental neglect and sexual abuse, and Louise suffered
                  both of them. I can't help but wonder what she would have been like
                  if her mother had shown her even a modicom of affection and hadn't
                  blamed her when Louise told her mother at age nine for being raped by
                  Mr. Flowers. I also believe, because she said as much when she was
                  old, that she only wanted to be a dancer. The one thing in her life
                  to which she had given focused and committed attention was her studies
                  at Denishawn, and I think that her getting so viciously dismissed from
                  the group at seventeen fractured something in her psyche that never
                  healed. I could go on for hour. Ask my wife, she'll tell you. :o)

                  Louise was wonderful. Disturbing, but wonderful. I wonder if I'd
                  have liked her.






                  Perri Lee Leuthard



                  ---------------------------------
                  Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                  Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Anita M
                  She was a self-made woman, as you described. That’s what makes her so admirable to me – that she got so far starting with so little. But she was every bit
                  Message 8 of 29 , Apr 29, 2007
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                    She was a self-made woman, as you described. That’s what makes her so
                    admirable to me – that she got so far starting with so little. But she was
                    every bit as tragic as Marilyn Monroe, IMO; she never truly overcame her
                    inner ‘demons’ so she sabotaged herself and drove away anyone who got close
                    to her. I’d like to know the whole story of her dismissal from Denishawn.
                    I’d read that she drank heavily and often didn’t show up for rehearsals.
                    Today we have help for kids with drinking/drug problems, anti-social
                    behavior, victims of abuse, etc. Unfortunately, such programs didn’t exist
                    then.



                    I’ve just joined the group, too, and have read only “Lulu in Hollywood” and
                    whatever I can find on the net. I also have the “Biography” special on DVD.
                    I see that Barry Paris’ bio is a must.



                    (Neve Campbell certainly looks the part!)



                    Anita M.
                  • Chuck Golden
                    Anita, She wasn t quite the fully-fledged hellion yet when she was kicked off the Denishawn team, but she was well on her way. She went to New York with a
                    Message 9 of 29 , Apr 30, 2007
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                      Anita,

                      She wasn't quite the fully-fledged hellion yet when she was kicked
                      off the Denishawn team, but she was well on her way. She went to New
                      York with a chaperone at first, but she quickly graduated from paying
                      student to paid troupe member with lots of travel involved. Barry
                      Paris doesn't say much if anything about the chaperone when Louise
                      was picked up as a regular. Likely she went home to Kansas soon
                      thereafter. On the road, she was required to be above moral and
                      social reproach, but she wasn't always. She was the subject of a lot
                      of rumors and her reputation soured. She was evidently sneaking
                      around to clubs and not coming back to the room until wake-up time.
                      Being an incredible dancer, however, her pecadillos were overlooked
                      for the most part. She toured, and starred, with the troupe for two
                      seasons, getting harder and harder to manage all the time, more
                      independent, more stubborn, fuller and fuller of herself. Finally,
                      she came into a group meeting late and the boss gave her the heave-ho
                      in front of everybody. Not so much as a word of caution is ever
                      mentioned as I recalled. She just crossed the line once too many
                      times and got the boot. Ruth St. Denis gave told her she was being
                      dismissed because she wanted the world on a silver salver. Soon
                      after that, she was dancing in Scandals and later Zeigfield, that's
                      when she really started racing the party engine. Hope this helps!

                      And do get the Barry Paris book, you'll love it.



                      --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                      <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > She was a self-made woman, as you described. That's what makes her
                      so
                      > admirable to me – that she got so far starting with so little. But
                      she was
                      > every bit as tragic as Marilyn Monroe, IMO; she never truly
                      overcame her
                      > inner `demons' so she sabotaged herself and drove away anyone who
                      got close
                      > to her. I'd like to know the whole story of her dismissal from
                      Denishawn.
                      > I'd read that she drank heavily and often didn't show up for
                      rehearsals.
                      > Today we have help for kids with drinking/drug problems, anti-social
                      > behavior, victims of abuse, etc. Unfortunately, such programs
                      didn't exist
                      > then.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > I've just joined the group, too, and have read only "Lulu in
                      Hollywood" and
                      > whatever I can find on the net. I also have the "Biography" special
                      on DVD.
                      > I see that Barry Paris' bio is a must.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > (Neve Campbell certainly looks the part!)
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Anita M.
                      >
                    • Perri Lee
                      In one of her bio s she was quoted as saying I love to drink and fuck she was quite the party girl. I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall the
                      Message 10 of 29 , Apr 30, 2007
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                        In one of her bio's she was quoted as saying "I love to drink and fuck" she was quite the party girl. I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall the afternoon her and Charlie Chaplin and another woman was in a hotel room all after noon and was drinking and Louise doing the Charleston..That was a story in one of the bio's . Happy reading

                        Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: Anita,

                        She wasn't quite the fully-fledged hellion yet when she was kicked
                        off the Denishawn team, but she was well on her way. She went to New
                        York with a chaperone at first, but she quickly graduated from paying
                        student to paid troupe member with lots of travel involved. Barry
                        Paris doesn't say much if anything about the chaperone when Louise
                        was picked up as a regular. Likely she went home to Kansas soon
                        thereafter. On the road, she was required to be above moral and
                        social reproach, but she wasn't always. She was the subject of a lot
                        of rumors and her reputation soured. She was evidently sneaking
                        around to clubs and not coming back to the room until wake-up time.
                        Being an incredible dancer, however, her pecadillos were overlooked
                        for the most part. She toured, and starred, with the troupe for two
                        seasons, getting harder and harder to manage all the time, more
                        independent, more stubborn, fuller and fuller of herself. Finally,
                        she came into a group meeting late and the boss gave her the heave-ho
                        in front of everybody. Not so much as a word of caution is ever
                        mentioned as I recalled. She just crossed the line once too many
                        times and got the boot. Ruth St. Denis gave told her she was being
                        dismissed because she wanted the world on a silver salver. Soon
                        after that, she was dancing in Scandals and later Zeigfield, that's
                        when she really started racing the party engine. Hope this helps!

                        And do get the Barry Paris book, you'll love it.

                        --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                        <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > She was a self-made woman, as you described. That's what makes her
                        so
                        > admirable to me – that she got so far starting with so little. But
                        she was
                        > every bit as tragic as Marilyn Monroe, IMO; she never truly
                        overcame her
                        > inner `demons' so she sabotaged herself and drove away anyone who
                        got close
                        > to her. I'd like to know the whole story of her dismissal from
                        Denishawn.
                        > I'd read that she drank heavily and often didn't show up for
                        rehearsals.
                        > Today we have help for kids with drinking/drug problems, anti-social
                        > behavior, victims of abuse, etc. Unfortunately, such programs
                        didn't exist
                        > then.
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > I've just joined the group, too, and have read only "Lulu in
                        Hollywood" and
                        > whatever I can find on the net. I also have the "Biography" special
                        on DVD.
                        > I see that Barry Paris' bio is a must.
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > (Neve Campbell certainly looks the part!)
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Anita M.
                        >






                        Perri Lee Leuthard



                        ---------------------------------
                        Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                        Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • nutsaboutclara
                        I don t think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that accompanies success
                        Message 11 of 29 , Apr 30, 2007
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                          I don't think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity
                          more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that
                          accompanies success sometimes. But, that's just a thought of mine.

                          -Dario.


                          --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                          <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > True, she pretty much said she "raised herself." There are several
                          reasons
                          > she didn't want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we'll
                          never know.
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > AM
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > _____
                          >
                          > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                          > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                          > nutsaboutclara
                          > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:34 PM
                          > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                          > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological Profile?
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
                          > with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think
                          her
                          > troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
                          > attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As
                          Brooksie
                          > herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were
                          more
                          > in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
                          > their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.
                          >
                          > -Dario.
                          >
                          > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                          > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                          brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                          > SMILEYJEN1@
                          > wrote:
                          > >
                          > > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is
                          that
                          > she
                          > > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if she
                          > > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers. She
                          > > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things, only
                          to
                          > strip
                          > > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
                          > theme in
                          > > her life - she would never be complacent again.
                          > >
                          > > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
                          > > Jennifer ^_^
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
                          > > <no_reply@yahoogroup <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com> s.com>
                          writes:
                          > > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study on
                          > > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
                          > > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
                          > fans
                          > > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
                          > > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In
                          fact,
                          > > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about
                          > > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
                          > >
                          > > -Dario.
                          > >
                          > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                          > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                          brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                          > Perri Lee
                          > > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
                          > > >
                          > > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew it
                          > > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
                          > > negative energy off others.
                          > > >
                          > > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
                          > > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
                          > > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio of
                          > > her
                          > > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an
                          incredibly
                          > > > complex person!
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > > Perri Lee Leuthard
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > >
                          > > > ---------------------------------
                          > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                          > > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                          > > >
                          > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          > > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          > >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                        • nutsaboutclara
                          WHOOPS!!!!! I meant emptiness. Sorry, folks! -Dario. ... several ... Profile? ... she ... She ... only ... on ... about ... it ... of
                          Message 12 of 29 , May 5, 2007
                          • 0 Attachment
                            WHOOPS!!!!! I meant "emptiness." Sorry, folks!

                            -Dario.


                            --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, nutsaboutclara
                            <no_reply@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > I don't think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity
                            > more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that
                            > accompanies success sometimes. But, that's just a thought of mine.
                            >
                            > -Dario.
                            >
                            >
                            > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                            > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                            > >
                            > > True, she pretty much said she "raised herself." There are
                            several
                            > reasons
                            > > she didn't want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we'll
                            > never know.
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > AM
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > _____
                            > >
                            > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                            > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                            > > nutsaboutclara
                            > > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:34 PM
                            > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                            > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological
                            Profile?
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
                            > > with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think
                            > her
                            > > troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
                            > > attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As
                            > Brooksie
                            > > herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were
                            > more
                            > > in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
                            > > their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.
                            > >
                            > > -Dario.
                            > >
                            > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                            > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                            > brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                            > > SMILEYJEN1@
                            > > wrote:
                            > > >
                            > > > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is
                            > that
                            > > she
                            > > > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if
                            she
                            > > > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers.
                            She
                            > > > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things,
                            only
                            > to
                            > > strip
                            > > > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
                            > > theme in
                            > > > her life - she would never be complacent again.
                            > > >
                            > > > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
                            > > > Jennifer ^_^
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
                            > > > <no_reply@yahoogroup <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com> s.com>
                            > writes:
                            > > > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study
                            on
                            > > > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
                            > > > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
                            > > fans
                            > > > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
                            > > > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In
                            > fact,
                            > > > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING
                            about
                            > > > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
                            > > >
                            > > > -Dario.
                            > > >
                            > > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                            > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                            > brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                            > > Perri Lee
                            > > > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
                            > > > >
                            > > > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew
                            it
                            > > > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
                            > > > negative energy off others.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
                            > > > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
                            > > > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio
                            of
                            > > > her
                            > > > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an
                            > incredibly
                            > > > > complex person!
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Perri Lee Leuthard
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > > > ---------------------------------
                            > > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                            > > > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            > > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > >
                            > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            > > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            > >
                            >
                          • olive_e_thomas
                            The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her book club Louise would likely
                            Message 13 of 29 , May 5, 2007
                            • 0 Attachment
                              The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                              personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                              book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                              success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                            • Anita M
                              I can understand that, and I wouldn’t blame her, either. Anita M. Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult that you do. -
                              Message 14 of 29 , May 6, 2007
                              • 0 Attachment
                                I can understand that, and I wouldn’t blame her, either.



                                Anita M.



                                "Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult
                                that you do." - Elizabeth Goudge

                                _____

                                From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                                olive_e_thomas
                                Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2007 10:27 PM
                                To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



                                The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...





                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • Anita M
                                No worries; we know what you meant ;-) Anita M. Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult that you do. - Elizabeth Goudge
                                Message 15 of 29 , May 6, 2007
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  No worries; we know what you meant ;-)



                                  Anita M.



                                  "Love is not something wonderful that you feel; it is something difficult
                                  that you do." - Elizabeth Goudge

                                  _____

                                  From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                  [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                                  nutsaboutclara
                                  Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2007 11:38 AM
                                  To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                  Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



                                  WHOOPS!!!!! I meant "emptiness." Sorry, folks!

                                  -Dario.

                                  --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                                  <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                                  nutsaboutclara
                                  <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > I don't think she feared success; I think she hated its intensity
                                  > more than anything else. Plus, she hated, I think, the empty that
                                  > accompanies success sometimes. But, that's just a thought of mine.
                                  >
                                  > -Dario.
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                                  <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                                  "Anita M"
                                  > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                                  > >
                                  > > True, she pretty much said she "raised herself." There are
                                  several
                                  > reasons
                                  > > she didn't want to succeed, some we can guess at and some we'll
                                  > never know.
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > AM
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > _____
                                  > >
                                  > > From: thenewcovenoflouise
                                  <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com
                                  > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouise
                                  <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com]
                                  On Behalf Of
                                  > > nutsaboutclara
                                  > > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 12:34 PM
                                  > > To: thenewcovenoflouise
                                  <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com
                                  > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psycological
                                  Profile?
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > Yes she was, Jennifer. A fascinating person, indeed. Yes, I agree
                                  > > with you that Brooksie was a bit afraid of success, but, I think
                                  > her
                                  > > troubles were that both of her parents didn't give her enough
                                  > > attention that they should have to her and her siblings. As
                                  > Brooksie
                                  > > herself said one time, just to paraphrase her, her parents were
                                  > more
                                  > > in love with each other than with their kids. They prefered that
                                  > > their childern, or "squaling brats" fend for themselves.
                                  > >
                                  > > -Dario.
                                  > >
                                  > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                                  > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  > brooks@yahoogroups. <mailto:brooks%40yahoogroups.com> com,
                                  > > SMILEYJEN1@
                                  > > wrote:
                                  > > >
                                  > > > She is a most fascinating creature. My own amateur opinion is
                                  > that
                                  > > she
                                  > > > was afraid of success; more specifically, what would happen if
                                  she
                                  > > > allowed herself to be happy with it. Think back to Mr Flowers.
                                  She
                                  > > > followed a friendly face that promised her pleasant things,
                                  only
                                  > to
                                  > > strip
                                  > > > her of her childhood in return. This seemed to be a prevailing
                                  > > theme in
                                  > > > her life - she would never be complacent again.
                                  > > >
                                  > > > Yes, I was a psych minor in college,
                                  > > > Jennifer ^_^
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > > On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 17:56:30 -0000 nutsaboutclara
                                  > > > <no_reply@yahoogroup <mailto:no_reply%40yahoogroups.com> s.com>
                                  > writes:
                                  > > > To the both of you, there has never been a psychological study
                                  on
                                  > > > Louise Brooks, because she is virtually unknown to most film
                                  > > > viewers, especially since most film viewers are NOT silent film
                                  > > fans
                                  > > > at all. It's a very tiny community, the silent film viewing
                                  > > > community, but a very fierce and loyal bunch, to be sure. In
                                  > fact,
                                  > > > there are many silent film fans who know ABSOLUTELY NOTHING
                                  about
                                  > > > Brooksie, which is a bit shocking.
                                  > > >
                                  > > > -Dario.
                                  > > >
                                  > > > --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                                  > > <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com>
                                  > brooks@yahoogroups. <mailto:brooks%40yahoogroups.com> com,
                                  > > Perri Lee
                                  > > > <cheaptrickaz@> wrote:
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > I don't think she was that complex. She was hot and she knew
                                  it
                                  > > > and was a player that fully enjoyed life and refused to take
                                  > > > negative energy off others.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@> wrote: Has anyone seen or
                                  > > > know of any sort of psycological profile on Louise
                                  > > > > Brooks? I'm in my third straight reading of Barry Paris' bio
                                  of
                                  > > > her
                                  > > > > and I find her to be psycologically baffling. What an
                                  > incredibly
                                  > > > > complex person!
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > Perri Lee Leuthard
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > ---------------------------------
                                  > > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                                  > > > > Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                                  > > > >
                                  > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  > > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  > > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > >
                                  > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  > >
                                  >





                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • Chuck Golden
                                  I think you ve hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it s evident that she had to be in
                                  Message 16 of 29 , May 6, 2007
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    I think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                                    through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident that
                                    she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but in
                                    control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster piece "The
                                    Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to the
                                    top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                                    from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without her
                                    knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                                    ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite the
                                    increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                                    excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                                    involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                    wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation where
                                    she couldn't be 100% in control of it.

                                    Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out there?
                                    Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls far
                                    from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something as
                                    simple as that.


                                    --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                    <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                    > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                    > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                    > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                    >
                                  • Perri Lee
                                    I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades she was
                                    Message 17 of 29 , May 6, 2007
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed with the twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee

                                      Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: I think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                                      through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident that
                                      she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but in
                                      control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster piece "The
                                      Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to the
                                      top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                                      from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without her
                                      knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                                      ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite the
                                      increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                                      excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                                      involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                      wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation where
                                      she couldn't be 100% in control of it.

                                      Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out there?
                                      Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls far
                                      from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something as
                                      simple as that.

                                      --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                      <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                      > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                      > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                      > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                      >






                                      Perri Lee Leuthard



                                      ---------------------------------
                                      Don't pick lemons.
                                      See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • Anita M
                                      I m not sure that public knowledge of her escapades would have bothered her. She never appeared to be embarrassed about anything she did, nor cared what anyone
                                      Message 18 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        I'm not sure that public knowledge of her escapades would have bothered her.
                                        She never appeared to be embarrassed about anything she did, nor cared what
                                        anyone else thought of her. I think it was a 100% control issue.



                                        Anita M.

                                        _____

                                        From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                        [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Perri Lee
                                        Sent: Sunday, May 06, 2007 1:35 PM
                                        To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                        Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



                                        I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to
                                        publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades
                                        she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed with the
                                        twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee

                                        Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@yahoo. <mailto:bagnoli2%40yahoo.com> com> wrote: I
                                        think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality. All through
                                        the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident that she had to be
                                        in control - not so much in control of the people but in control of the
                                        situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster piece "The Girl in the Black
                                        Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to the top of the public
                                        consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word from him that he'd been out
                                        on the West Coast discussing (without her knowing it) a bio-pic with a major
                                        Hollywood director. She went ballistic, refused any thought of letting the
                                        film be done (despite the increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off
                                        forever. She excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project
                                        that involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                        wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation where she
                                        couldn't be 100% in control of it.

                                        Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out there?
                                        Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls far from
                                        the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something as simple as
                                        that.

                                        --- In thenewcovenoflouise
                                        <mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks%40yahoogroups.com> brooks@yahoogroups.com,
                                        olive_e_thomas
                                        <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of personal
                                        control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her book club Louise
                                        would likely refuse on the grounds any success would "belong" to Oprah and
                                        not to her...
                                        >

                                        Perri Lee Leuthard

                                        ---------------------------------
                                        Don't pick lemons.
                                        See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      • Chuck Golden
                                        Perri Lee, She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn t publish her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the sexual
                                        Message 19 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          Perri Lee,

                                          She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't publish
                                          her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                          sexual beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                          potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted to her priest
                                          in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she wanted a drink
                                          and when she read about sex she got excited. So she opted not to
                                          publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable young women.
                                          On the one hand, she wouldn't renounce her lifestyle (standing toe-to-
                                          toe with her priest), on the other hand she was concerned about
                                          having young girls see her habits and lifestyle as desirable and
                                          exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant contradictions of
                                          Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a proof
                                          of her brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                                          being anything but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.

                                          I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs of
                                          her region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                          was mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                          attended a Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough
                                          to evidently have a fling with an older man in the church before
                                          moving to Manhatten), and for ten years as a Catholic between 1954
                                          and 1964 in New York. I certainly don't see either of them as being
                                          twisted in either location. Except for the Catholic period, I think
                                          Louise's attitude towards religion was ambivalence rather than
                                          antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring that she left the
                                          Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of note in her
                                          little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she
                                          had a statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                          religious beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that
                                          opinion.

                                          Cheers!


                                          --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, Perri Lee
                                          <cheaptrickaz@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not
                                          want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all
                                          the escapades she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was
                                          also mixed with the twisted religious beliefs of her region and her
                                          day. Perri Lee
                                          >
                                          > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: I think you've hit on
                                          one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                                          > through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident
                                          that
                                          > she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but
                                          in
                                          > control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster
                                          piece "The
                                          > Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to
                                          the
                                          > top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                                          > from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without
                                          her
                                          > knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                                          > ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite
                                          the
                                          > increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                                          > excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                                          > involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                          > wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation
                                          where
                                          > she couldn't be 100% in control of it.
                                          >
                                          > Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out
                                          there?
                                          > Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls
                                          far
                                          > from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something
                                          as
                                          > simple as that.
                                          >
                                          > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                          > <no_reply@> wrote:
                                          > >
                                          > > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                          > > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                          > > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                          > > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                          > >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > Perri Lee Leuthard
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > ---------------------------------
                                          > Don't pick lemons.
                                          > See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                                          >
                                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          >
                                        • Perri Lee
                                          I still beleive that the reason she did not publish was some how tied to the twisted religious moral thing. It is why I feel she did not write and it still is
                                          Message 20 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            I still beleive that the reason she did not publish was some how tied to the twisted religious moral thing. It is why I feel she did not write and it still is the same thing and reason why people and persons hold themselves back today. But of course this is getting to be too large of a subject for this group. thanks

                                            Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: Perri Lee,

                                            She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't publish
                                            her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                            sexual beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                            potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted to her priest
                                            in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she wanted a drink
                                            and when she read about sex she got excited. So she opted not to
                                            publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable young women.
                                            On the one hand, she wouldn't renounce her lifestyle (standing toe-to-
                                            toe with her priest), on the other hand she was concerned about
                                            having young girls see her habits and lifestyle as desirable and
                                            exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant contradictions of
                                            Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a proof
                                            of her brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                                            being anything but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.

                                            I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs of
                                            her region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                            was mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                            attended a Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough
                                            to evidently have a fling with an older man in the church before
                                            moving to Manhatten), and for ten years as a Catholic between 1954
                                            and 1964 in New York. I certainly don't see either of them as being
                                            twisted in either location. Except for the Catholic period, I think
                                            Louise's attitude towards religion was ambivalence rather than
                                            antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring that she left the
                                            Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of note in her
                                            little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she
                                            had a statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                            religious beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that
                                            opinion.

                                            Cheers!

                                            --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, Perri Lee
                                            <cheaptrickaz@...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not
                                            want to publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all
                                            the escapades she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was
                                            also mixed with the twisted religious beliefs of her region and her
                                            day. Perri Lee
                                            >
                                            > Chuck Golden <bagnoli2@...> wrote: I think you've hit on
                                            one of THE major aspects of her personality. All
                                            > through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident
                                            that
                                            > she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but
                                            in
                                            > control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster
                                            piece "The
                                            > Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to
                                            the
                                            > top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                                            > from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without
                                            her
                                            > knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                                            > ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite
                                            the
                                            > increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                                            > excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                                            > involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                            > wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation
                                            where
                                            > she couldn't be 100% in control of it.
                                            >
                                            > Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out
                                            there?
                                            > Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls
                                            far
                                            > from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something
                                            as
                                            > simple as that.
                                            >
                                            > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                            > <no_reply@> wrote:
                                            > >
                                            > > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                            > > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                            > > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                            > > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                            > >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > Perri Lee Leuthard
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > ---------------------------------
                                            > Don't pick lemons.
                                            > See all the new 2007 cars at Yahoo! Autos.
                                            >
                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            >






                                            Perri Lee Leuthard



                                            ---------------------------------
                                            Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
                                            Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • Anita M
                                            IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect to underage girls, who (judging from my own experience) are impressionable and most likely to
                                            Message 21 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect to underage
                                              girls, who (judging from my own experience) are impressionable and most
                                              likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my life, illegal
                                              drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew people who bought
                                              into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her adventures
                                              and saying at the end “don’t do what I did,” (which seldom carries any
                                              weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.



                                              Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day “spilling
                                              the sexual beans” could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If you ever
                                              have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which celebrities are
                                              doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you want to see
                                              them or not.)



                                              Anita M.



                                              _____

                                              From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                              [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                              Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                              To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                              Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological Profile?



                                              Perri Lee,

                                              She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't publish her
                                              biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the sexual
                                              beans and that she had concerns about what this could potentially do to
                                              influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s that when
                                              she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she read about sex she
                                              got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for
                                              impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't renounce her
                                              lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other hand she was
                                              concerned about having young girls see her habits and lifestyle as desirable
                                              and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant contradictions of
                                              Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a proof of her
                                              brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on being anything
                                              but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.

                                              I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs of her
                                              region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion was
                                              mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she attended a
                                              Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to evidently have
                                              a fling with an older man in the church before moving to Manhatten), and for
                                              ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I certainly don't
                                              see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except for the
                                              Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was ambivalence
                                              rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring that she left
                                              the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of note in her
                                              little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she had a
                                              statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the religious
                                              beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.

                                              Cheers!

                                              >
                                              > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not want to
                                              publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the escapades
                                              she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed with the
                                              twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee





                                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            • nutsaboutclara
                                              That s quite true, Olive. Brooksie always wanted to control the situation, so that she could be the center of attention. It was that way at home, when she
                                              Message 22 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                That's quite true, Olive. Brooksie always wanted to control the
                                                situation, so that she could be the center of attention. It was that
                                                way at home, when she and her mother bickered, and it continued well
                                                into adulthood. She was her own marching band, which turned a lot of
                                                people off, that's for sure.

                                                -Dario.


                                                --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                                <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                                >
                                                > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                                > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                                > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                                > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                                >
                                              • nutsaboutclara
                                                She was a very willful person, Chuck; it was her way and nothing else. Clara Bow was like that to an extent, but she was outgoing and cheerful towards all
                                                Message 23 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                                                • 0 Attachment
                                                  She was a very willful person, Chuck; it was her way and nothing
                                                  else. Clara Bow was like that to an extent, but she was outgoing and
                                                  cheerful towards all that met Clara. But Brooksie was moody,
                                                  taciturn at times, and an intelectual snob, who thought that she was
                                                  above everyone when it came film(film history, film making, actors &
                                                  actresses, etc.), literature, politics, sex, male/female
                                                  relationships, etc. And, very opinionated. But, I love her for it,
                                                  because she would be who she was if she wasn't that in the first
                                                  place. I marvel at her strong sense of independence. That made her
                                                  stand out more than her contemporaries.

                                                  -Dario.



                                                  --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Chuck Golden"
                                                  <bagnoli2@...> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > I think you've hit on one of THE major aspects of her personality.
                                                  All
                                                  > through the Paris bio, especially towards the end, it's evident
                                                  that
                                                  > she had to be in control - not so much in control of the people but
                                                  in
                                                  > control of the situation. Ken Tynan wrote the blockbuster
                                                  piece "The
                                                  > Girl in the Black Helmet" for the New Yorker which shot her back to
                                                  the
                                                  > top of the public consciousness. Not long afterwards, she got word
                                                  > from him that he'd been out on the West Coast discussing (without
                                                  her
                                                  > knowing it) a bio-pic with a major Hollywood director. She went
                                                  > ballistic, refused any thought of letting the film be done (despite
                                                  the
                                                  > increased fame and money), and cut Ken Tynan off forever. She
                                                  > excoriated him for having the temerity of discussing a project that
                                                  > involved her behind her back. The evident botton line is that she
                                                  > wouldn't agree to putting herself and her story in a situation
                                                  where
                                                  > she couldn't be 100% in control of it.
                                                  >
                                                  > Now, as to why she was so much that way... any psycologists out
                                                  there?
                                                  > Certainly, she was her mother's daughter and the apple seldom falls
                                                  far
                                                  > from the tree. But she was far too complex for it to be something
                                                  as
                                                  > simple as that.
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                                  > <no_reply@> wrote:
                                                  > >
                                                  > > The way I look at it she was more concerned about the loss of
                                                  > > personal control. Like if Oprah had tried to put her book in her
                                                  > > book club Louise would likely refuse on the grounds any
                                                  > > success would "belong" to Oprah and not to her...
                                                  > >
                                                  >
                                                • olive_e_thomas
                                                  I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of child-care in that respect). My guess is
                                                  Message 24 of 29 , May 7, 2007
                                                  • 0 Attachment
                                                    I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                                    children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                                    child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                                    ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed little
                                                    brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                                    selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and it
                                                    was easier to torch than try and rewrite...

                                                    It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of one
                                                    whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                                    went.

                                                    But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                                    words that just don't seem to go together...

                                                    --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                                    <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                                                    >
                                                    > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect
                                                    to underage
                                                    > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                                    impressionable and most
                                                    > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my life,
                                                    illegal
                                                    > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                                    people who bought
                                                    > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                                    adventures
                                                    > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                                    carries any
                                                    > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day
                                                    "spilling
                                                    > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If
                                                    you ever
                                                    > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                                    celebrities are
                                                    > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                                    want to see
                                                    > them or not.)
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    > Anita M.
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    > _____
                                                    >
                                                    > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                    Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                                    > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                                    > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                    > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                                    Profile?
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    > Perri Lee,
                                                    >
                                                    > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                                    publish her
                                                    > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                                    sexual
                                                    > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                                    potentially do to
                                                    > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s
                                                    that when
                                                    > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                                    read about sex she
                                                    > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                                    concern for
                                                    > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                                    renounce her
                                                    > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other hand
                                                    she was
                                                    > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                                    lifestyle as desirable
                                                    > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                                    contradictions of
                                                    > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                                    proof of her
                                                    > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on being
                                                    anything
                                                    > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                                    >
                                                    > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs
                                                    of her
                                                    > region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                                    was
                                                    > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                                    attended a
                                                    > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                                    evidently have
                                                    > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                                    Manhatten), and for
                                                    > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                                    certainly don't
                                                    > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                                    for the
                                                    > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was
                                                    ambivalence
                                                    > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                                    that she left
                                                    > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                                    note in her
                                                    > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think she
                                                    had a
                                                    > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                                    religious
                                                    > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                                    >
                                                    > Cheers!
                                                    >
                                                    > >
                                                    > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did not
                                                    want to
                                                    > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the
                                                    escapades
                                                    > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed
                                                    with the
                                                    > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    >
                                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                    >
                                                  • nutsaboutclara
                                                    HEAR, HEAR!!! Discriminatory would probably be a better word for what Brooksie was all about, in respect to people, art, literature, etc. You hit the nail on
                                                    Message 25 of 29 , May 9, 2007
                                                    • 0 Attachment
                                                      HEAR, HEAR!!! Discriminatory would probably be a better word for
                                                      what Brooksie was all about, in respect to people, art, literature,
                                                      etc. You hit the nail on the head perfectly, Olive. Kudos!

                                                      -Dario.


                                                      --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                                      <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                                      >
                                                      > I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                                      > children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                                      > child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                                      > ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed
                                                      little
                                                      > brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                                      > selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and
                                                      it
                                                      > was easier to torch than try and rewrite...
                                                      >
                                                      > It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of
                                                      one
                                                      > whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                                      > went.
                                                      >
                                                      > But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                                      > words that just don't seem to go together...
                                                      >
                                                      > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                                      > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                                                      > >
                                                      > > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect
                                                      > to underage
                                                      > > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                                      > impressionable and most
                                                      > > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my
                                                      life,
                                                      > illegal
                                                      > > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                                      > people who bought
                                                      > > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                                      > adventures
                                                      > > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                                      > carries any
                                                      > > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day
                                                      > "spilling
                                                      > > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If
                                                      > you ever
                                                      > > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                                      > celebrities are
                                                      > > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                                      > want to see
                                                      > > them or not.)
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > > Anita M.
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > > _____
                                                      > >
                                                      > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                      > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                      > Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                                      > > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                                      > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                      > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                                      > Profile?
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > > Perri Lee,
                                                      > >
                                                      > > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                                      > publish her
                                                      > > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                                      > sexual
                                                      > > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                                      > potentially do to
                                                      > > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s
                                                      > that when
                                                      > > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                                      > read about sex she
                                                      > > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                                      > concern for
                                                      > > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                                      > renounce her
                                                      > > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other
                                                      hand
                                                      > she was
                                                      > > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                                      > lifestyle as desirable
                                                      > > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                                      > contradictions of
                                                      > > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                                      > proof of her
                                                      > > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                                                      being
                                                      > anything
                                                      > > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                                      > >
                                                      > > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs
                                                      > of her
                                                      > > region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                                      > was
                                                      > > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                                      > attended a
                                                      > > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                                      > evidently have
                                                      > > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                                      > Manhatten), and for
                                                      > > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                                      > certainly don't
                                                      > > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                                      > for the
                                                      > > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was
                                                      > ambivalence
                                                      > > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                                      > that she left
                                                      > > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                                      > note in her
                                                      > > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think
                                                      she
                                                      > had a
                                                      > > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                                      > religious
                                                      > > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                                      > >
                                                      > > Cheers!
                                                      > >
                                                      > > >
                                                      > > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did
                                                      not
                                                      > want to
                                                      > > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the
                                                      > escapades
                                                      > > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed
                                                      > with the
                                                      > > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > >
                                                      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                      > >
                                                      >
                                                    • Anita M.
                                                      Now I m confused. Chuck said She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn t publish her biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling
                                                      Message 26 of 29 , May 9, 2007
                                                      • 0 Attachment
                                                        Now I'm confused.

                                                        Chuck said "She said several times that one of the reasons she
                                                        wouldn't publish her biography was that to do it properly would mean
                                                        spilling all the sexual beans and that she had concerns about what
                                                        this could potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted to
                                                        her priest in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she
                                                        wanted a drink and when she read about sex she got excited. So she
                                                        opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable
                                                        young women."

                                                        But then, some people say one thing one day and the opposite another
                                                        day - maybe a way to hold onto a little privacy.

                                                        Anita M.


                                                        --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                                        <no_reply@...> wrote:
                                                        >
                                                        > I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                                        > children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                                        > child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                                        > ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed
                                                        little
                                                        > brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                                        > selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and it
                                                        > was easier to torch than try and rewrite...
                                                        >
                                                        > It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of
                                                        one
                                                        > whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                                        > went.
                                                        >
                                                        > But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                                        > words that just don't seem to go together...
                                                        >
                                                        > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                                        > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                                                        > >
                                                        > > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in respect
                                                        > to underage
                                                        > > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                                        > impressionable and most
                                                        > > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my
                                                        life,
                                                        > illegal
                                                        > > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                                        > people who bought
                                                        > > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                                        > adventures
                                                        > > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                                        > carries any
                                                        > > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her day
                                                        > "spilling
                                                        > > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it. (If
                                                        > you ever
                                                        > > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                                        > celebrities are
                                                        > > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                                        > want to see
                                                        > > them or not.)
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > > Anita M.
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > > _____
                                                        > >
                                                        > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                        > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                        > Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                                        > > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                                        > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                        > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                                        > Profile?
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > > Perri Lee,
                                                        > >
                                                        > > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                                        > publish her
                                                        > > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all the
                                                        > sexual
                                                        > > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                                        > potentially do to
                                                        > > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-50s
                                                        > that when
                                                        > > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                                        > read about sex she
                                                        > > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                                        > concern for
                                                        > > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                                        > renounce her
                                                        > > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other
                                                        hand
                                                        > she was
                                                        > > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                                        > lifestyle as desirable
                                                        > > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                                        > contradictions of
                                                        > > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                                        > proof of her
                                                        > > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on being
                                                        > anything
                                                        > > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                                        > >
                                                        > > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions beliefs
                                                        > of her
                                                        > > region and her day". The only periods in her life where religion
                                                        > was
                                                        > > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                                        > attended a
                                                        > > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                                        > evidently have
                                                        > > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                                        > Manhatten), and for
                                                        > > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                                        > certainly don't
                                                        > > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                                        > for the
                                                        > > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion was
                                                        > ambivalence
                                                        > > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                                        > that she left
                                                        > > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                                        > note in her
                                                        > > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think
                                                        she
                                                        > had a
                                                        > > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                                        > religious
                                                        > > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                                        > >
                                                        > > Cheers!
                                                        > >
                                                        > > >
                                                        > > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did
                                                        not
                                                        > want to
                                                        > > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all the
                                                        > escapades
                                                        > > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also mixed
                                                        > with the
                                                        > > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > >
                                                        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                        > >
                                                        >
                                                      • olive_e_thomas
                                                        Some clue as to her reasoning might be found in her comments after turning down Playboy magazine for a writing job all they want is (an article about) tits
                                                        Message 27 of 29 , May 9, 2007
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                                                          Some clue as to her reasoning might be found in her comments
                                                          after turning down Playboy magazine for a writing job "all they
                                                          want is (an article about) tits and free-fucking for men."

                                                          --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M."
                                                          <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                                                          >
                                                          > Now I'm confused.
                                                          >
                                                          > Chuck said "She said several times that one of the reasons
                                                          she
                                                          > wouldn't publish her biography was that to do it properly would
                                                          mean
                                                          > spilling all the sexual beans and that she had concerns about
                                                          what
                                                          > this could potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted
                                                          to
                                                          > her priest in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking
                                                          she
                                                          > wanted a drink and when she read about sex she got excited.
                                                          So she
                                                          > opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for
                                                          impressionable
                                                          > young women."
                                                          >
                                                          > But then, some people say one thing one day and the opposite
                                                          another
                                                          > day - maybe a way to hold onto a little privacy.
                                                          >
                                                          > Anita M.
                                                          >
                                                          >
                                                        • nutsaboutclara
                                                          Brooksie was trying to protect herself from what others said about her. She never did trust people whom she met and later talked trash about her. Brooksie
                                                          Message 28 of 29 , May 12, 2007
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                                                            Brooksie was trying to protect herself from what others said about
                                                            her. She never did trust people whom she met and later talked trash
                                                            about her. Brooksie was one tough egg to crack, that's for sure.

                                                            -Dario.


                                                            --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M."
                                                            <Woodsy@...> wrote:
                                                            >
                                                            > Now I'm confused.
                                                            >
                                                            > Chuck said "She said several times that one of the reasons she
                                                            > wouldn't publish her biography was that to do it properly would
                                                            mean
                                                            > spilling all the sexual beans and that she had concerns about what
                                                            > this could potentially do to influence young girls. She admitted
                                                            to
                                                            > her priest in the mid-50s that when she read about drinking she
                                                            > wanted a drink and when she read about sex she got excited. So she
                                                            > opted not to publish her memoirs out of concern for impressionable
                                                            > young women."
                                                            >
                                                            > But then, some people say one thing one day and the opposite
                                                            another
                                                            > day - maybe a way to hold onto a little privacy.
                                                            >
                                                            > Anita M.
                                                            >
                                                            >
                                                            > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, olive_e_thomas
                                                            > <no_reply@> wrote:
                                                            > >
                                                            > > I doubt that Louise had much concern for ruining the morals of
                                                            > > children (she seemed more from the WC Fields school of
                                                            > > child-care in that respect). My guess is - assuming she really
                                                            > > ever wrote a full memoir - she just didn't like the snot-nosed
                                                            > little
                                                            > > brat she came off sounding like in print and opted for a more
                                                            > > selective approach. Or the final result just looks like crap and
                                                            it
                                                            > > was easier to torch than try and rewrite...
                                                            > >
                                                            > > It could also be that she opted for little set pieces instead of
                                                            > one
                                                            > > whole go so that she could improve her writing skills as she
                                                            > > went.
                                                            > >
                                                            > > But "social responsibilty" and "Louise Brooks" are two sets of
                                                            > > words that just don't seem to go together...
                                                            > >
                                                            > > --- In thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com, "Anita M"
                                                            > > <Woodsy@> wrote:
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > > IMO she was being socially responsible; particularly in
                                                            respect
                                                            > > to underage
                                                            > > > girls, who (judging from my own experience) are
                                                            > > impressionable and most
                                                            > > > likely to seek out those kinds of stories. At that point in my
                                                            > life,
                                                            > > illegal
                                                            > > > drug use and being an underachiever was glorified. I knew
                                                            > > people who bought
                                                            > > > into that and regretted it later. Instead of writing about her
                                                            > > adventures
                                                            > > > and saying at the end "don't do what I did," (which seldom
                                                            > > carries any
                                                            > > > weight if ever) she chose not to tell at all.
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > > Whether it mattered to her or not Brooksie knew that in her
                                                            day
                                                            > > "spilling
                                                            > > > the sexual beans" could ruin a career; today it enhances it.
                                                            (If
                                                            > > you ever
                                                            > > > have to stand in line in a grocery store, you know which
                                                            > > celebrities are
                                                            > > > doing what because the tabloids are in plain sight whether you
                                                            > > want to see
                                                            > > > them or not.)
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > > Anita M.
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > > _____
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > > From: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                            > > > [mailto:thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com] On
                                                            > > Behalf Of Chuck Golden
                                                            > > > Sent: Monday, May 07, 2007 8:06 AM
                                                            > > > To: thenewcovenoflouisebrooks@yahoogroups.com
                                                            > > > Subject: Re: [The New Coven of Louise Brooks] Psychological
                                                            > > Profile?
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > > Perri Lee,
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > > She said several times that one of the reasons she wouldn't
                                                            > > publish her
                                                            > > > biography was that to do it properly would mean spilling all
                                                            the
                                                            > > sexual
                                                            > > > beans and that she had concerns about what this could
                                                            > > potentially do to
                                                            > > > influence young girls. She admitted to her priest in the mid-
                                                            50s
                                                            > > that when
                                                            > > > she read about drinking she wanted a drink and when she
                                                            > > read about sex she
                                                            > > > got excited. So she opted not to publish her memoirs out of
                                                            > > concern for
                                                            > > > impressionable young women. On the one hand, she wouldn't
                                                            > > renounce her
                                                            > > > lifestyle (standing toe-to-toe with her priest), on the other
                                                            > hand
                                                            > > she was
                                                            > > > concerned about having young girls see her habits and
                                                            > > lifestyle as desirable
                                                            > > > and exciting. Therein lies one of the many apparant
                                                            > > contradictions of
                                                            > > > Louise Brooks. In fact, it's not so much a contradiction as a
                                                            > > proof of her
                                                            > > > brutal, flint-like honesty. I am what I am, I don't plan on
                                                            being
                                                            > > anything
                                                            > > > but what I am, and you don't want to be what I am.
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > > I'm not sure what you mean about the "twisted religions
                                                            beliefs
                                                            > > of her
                                                            > > > region and her day". The only periods in her life where
                                                            religion
                                                            > > was
                                                            > > > mentioned was a very short period in her mid-teens when she
                                                            > > attended a
                                                            > > > Protestant church (in Wichita and staying just long enough to
                                                            > > evidently have
                                                            > > > a fling with an older man in the church before moving to
                                                            > > Manhatten), and for
                                                            > > > ten years as a Catholic between 1954 and 1964 in New York. I
                                                            > > certainly don't
                                                            > > > see either of them as being twisted in either location. Except
                                                            > > for the
                                                            > > > Catholic period, I think Louise's attitude towards religion
                                                            was
                                                            > > ambivalence
                                                            > > > rather than antagonism. Interestingly, despite her declaring
                                                            > > that she left
                                                            > > > the Church in 1964, when she died one of the few things of
                                                            > > note in her
                                                            > > > little apartment was a crucifix at the end of her bed. I think
                                                            > she
                                                            > > had a
                                                            > > > statue of the Virgin on her dresser as well. If she saw the
                                                            > > religious
                                                            > > > beliefs of her day as twisted she never hinted at that opinion.
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > > Cheers!
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > > >
                                                            > > > > I have to add one more thing to all of this. I think she did
                                                            > not
                                                            > > want to
                                                            > > > publish her own bio or let anyone else do it because of all
                                                            the
                                                            > > escapades
                                                            > > > she was involved in aka party girl. I think this was also
                                                            mixed
                                                            > > with the
                                                            > > > twisted religious beliefs of her region and her day. Perri Lee
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > >
                                                            > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                                            > > >
                                                            > >
                                                            >
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