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Re: interview with EYE and Yoshimi at the AV club

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  • Joe Janecek
    ... large (and sometimes regionally-clustered) cities, so neither are really expanding their audiences by number anymore, just playing to the existing fans.
    Message 1 of 11 , May 13, 2008
      >but now they each limit their total USA appearances to just a few very
      large (and sometimes regionally-clustered) cities, so neither are
      really expanding their audiences by number anymore, just playing to the
      existing fans. This is truly a shame.<

      Yes, the bigger problem is that ticket sales do not pay for the tours
      here in the US for the international acts. Even WB, back in the day,
      had trouble bringing a band over for a long run, as it was very
      expensive. Now those days are certainly past, as labels won't spend the
      cash unless they get a specific ROI- return on investment.

      When Boredoms were on the first part of Lollapalooza 94, the only way
      the deal could be done was if Boredoms gave up their portion of the
      Lolla t-shirt for which every band received money. That money helped
      alongside the funds the label also chipped in. It was a once in a
      lifetime opportunity for Boredoms to get that slot, so it was worth it.
      Having Kurt Cobain and similar musicians as fans certainly helped too.
      (BTW, part 2 of that Lolla tour featured Green Day in that opening
      slot, just as the band was getting huge - but I digress.)

      Now, Boredoms are on Vice or Thrill Jockey (SR 9), labels that tend to
      give little monetary tour support. Tour support just isn't in the
      vocabulary of the indie labels, as it's rarely recouped against album
      sales. Sadly, passion alone cannot move a band and tour bus from city
      to city.

      Also, their booking agent, Windish Agency, has to be very selective
      give the available tour window the band has available. They need
      guaranteed money that makes sense for the tour at hand. Do I wish Bore
      could do 30 dates? Sure. But the band probably has just a few weeks in
      reality, and yes, regionally-clustered shows make travel more
      affordable.

      When you mention "playing to the existing fans" - well, I disagree
      there. It's your duty as a music fan, as a BORE fan, to pack up the
      station wagon with your friends and make them experience Boredoms. Hey,
      Bore made it to America for you, can't you drag some friends across
      state lines to see them?

      The current music business environment has changed the game for
      marginal bands and labels, and the future remains uncertain. At least
      America is inexpensive for most bands compared to years past with the
      current exchange rates. Maybe more will take up the offer to come the
      the USA.

      cheers,
      joe
    • alterego100usa
      Yes, it has become prohibitive for bands to make the trip physically these days. I was seriously going to try for Philadelphia or DC, made several direct
      Message 2 of 11 , May 13, 2008
        Yes, it has become prohibitive for bands to make the trip physically
        these days. I was seriously going to try for Philadelphia or DC, made
        several direct inquiries, but venues in both cities put tickets on
        sale extremely close to the event dates, and with my work, I had to
        know some absolutes, like concert dates and ticket availability, to
        be able to free up the time. Websites for both of those venues
        finally only listed the concerts a matter of a few weeks or so before
        the shows. Lodging in those cases would not have been a problem at
        all, as I have close family in that region. A smaller-scale analogy
        can be applied with the talented local musicians I know, many of whom
        play in a cycle of venues in front of generally identical small
        groups of fans. I do go to see them each on occasion (or when
        grouped, as is most often, in package shows) but they're also
        personal friends of mine, so I see them anyway and get their CDs
        free, etc. They often see the same faces when they play because it's
        so difficult for these musicians to get to play additional venues
        with owners who aren't corrupt or disinterested. Because of this (in
        part), their live audience does not really expand unless they can
        expand their territory of coverage. A group like Boredoms has an
        exceptional live performance approach that I believe would really
        expand their audience to very rewarding proportions IF others could
        be exposed to that art. That's where that investment toward
        touring/A&R/etc. can pay off quickly. I would've seen them this year
        if those venues had simply advertised tickets a reasonable length of
        time before the concerts, but that has nothing to do with Boredoms,
        just poor advertising. Even if they'd played Toronto, I would've been
        there; maybe that could be considered next time around?--- In
        theboredoms@yahoogroups.com, Joe Janecek <joejanecek@...> wrote:
        >
        > >but now they each limit their total USA appearances to just a few
        very
        > large (and sometimes regionally-clustered) cities, so neither are
        > really expanding their audiences by number anymore, just playing to
        the
        > existing fans. This is truly a shame.<
        >
        > Yes, the bigger problem is that ticket sales do not pay for the
        tours
        > here in the US for the international acts. Even WB, back in the day,
        > had trouble bringing a band over for a long run, as it was very
        > expensive. Now those days are certainly past, as labels won't spend
        the
        > cash unless they get a specific ROI- return on investment.
        >
        > When Boredoms were on the first part of Lollapalooza 94, the only
        way
        > the deal could be done was if Boredoms gave up their portion of the
        > Lolla t-shirt for which every band received money. That money helped
        > alongside the funds the label also chipped in. It was a once in a
        > lifetime opportunity for Boredoms to get that slot, so it was worth
        it.
        > Having Kurt Cobain and similar musicians as fans certainly helped
        too.
        > (BTW, part 2 of that Lolla tour featured Green Day in that opening
        > slot, just as the band was getting huge - but I digress.)
        >
        > Now, Boredoms are on Vice or Thrill Jockey (SR 9), labels that tend
        to
        > give little monetary tour support. Tour support just isn't in the
        > vocabulary of the indie labels, as it's rarely recouped against
        album
        > sales. Sadly, passion alone cannot move a band and tour bus from
        city
        > to city.
        >
        > Also, their booking agent, Windish Agency, has to be very selective
        > give the available tour window the band has available. They need
        > guaranteed money that makes sense for the tour at hand. Do I wish
        Bore
        > could do 30 dates? Sure. But the band probably has just a few weeks
        in
        > reality, and yes, regionally-clustered shows make travel more
        > affordable.
        >
        > When you mention "playing to the existing fans" - well, I disagree
        > there. It's your duty as a music fan, as a BORE fan, to pack up the
        > station wagon with your friends and make them experience Boredoms.
        Hey,
        > Bore made it to America for you, can't you drag some friends across
        > state lines to see them?
        >
        > The current music business environment has changed the game for
        > marginal bands and labels, and the future remains uncertain. At
        least
        > America is inexpensive for most bands compared to years past with
        the
        > current exchange rates. Maybe more will take up the offer to come
        the
        > the USA.
        >
        > cheers,
        > joe
        >
      • almurphy56
        we would all wish to see a bigger tour, but i think, given the realities of touring today, boredoms have done a good job at bringing in new fans, i mean, 77
        Message 3 of 11 , May 19, 2008
          we would all wish to see a bigger tour, but i think, given the
          realities of touring today, boredoms have done a good job at bringing
          in new fans, i mean, 77 last summer is a case in point. that was
          certainly not existing boredoms fans. that was the shit to see! i came
          up from virginia for it, and was totally blown away at the response to
          the event. i guess we can thank this new world of internet hype and
          blogs and shit for that. i see it as kind of bittersweet that boredoms
          have been sucked into the blogosphere and all that, on the one hand
          its great for expanding an audience, but of course there's all the
          internet bullshit and short attention spans that i see all over
          message boards (like the av club one i just read)that i hate to see my
          favorite band getting sucked into. so i think it is the right way to
          go to spread the word to your friends, other people, in person. the
          internet these days is a lion's den, people's attention spans get
          shorter by the minute.
          also, boredoms have kind of had a zeppelin-esque approach to touring,
          which, with fewer and more centralized shows in the states, has the
          effect of making them more anticipated, memorable and talked-about
          events. but yes, i agree, bad promotion squashes that approach pretty
          quick.
          anyway, pointless post. but it's definitely the best to bring people
          to a show. i brought 2 of my friends to boadrum, and their heads were
          blown 20 miles into the sky just like that.




          --- In theboredoms@yahoogroups.com, alterego100usa <no_reply@...> wrote:
          >
          > Yes, it has become prohibitive for bands to make the trip physically
          > these days. I was seriously going to try for Philadelphia or DC, made
          > several direct inquiries, but venues in both cities put tickets on
          > sale extremely close to the event dates, and with my work, I had to
          > know some absolutes, like concert dates and ticket availability, to
          > be able to free up the time. Websites for both of those venues
          > finally only listed the concerts a matter of a few weeks or so before
          > the shows. Lodging in those cases would not have been a problem at
          > all, as I have close family in that region. A smaller-scale analogy
          > can be applied with the talented local musicians I know, many of whom
          > play in a cycle of venues in front of generally identical small
          > groups of fans. I do go to see them each on occasion (or when
          > grouped, as is most often, in package shows) but they're also
          > personal friends of mine, so I see them anyway and get their CDs
          > free, etc. They often see the same faces when they play because it's
          > so difficult for these musicians to get to play additional venues
          > with owners who aren't corrupt or disinterested. Because of this (in
          > part), their live audience does not really expand unless they can
          > expand their territory of coverage. A group like Boredoms has an
          > exceptional live performance approach that I believe would really
          > expand their audience to very rewarding proportions IF others could
          > be exposed to that art. That's where that investment toward
          > touring/A&R/etc. can pay off quickly. I would've seen them this year
          > if those venues had simply advertised tickets a reasonable length of
          > time before the concerts, but that has nothing to do with Boredoms,
          > just poor advertising. Even if they'd played Toronto, I would've been
          > there; maybe that could be considered next time around?--- In
          > theboredoms@yahoogroups.com, Joe Janecek <joejanecek@> wrote:
          > >
          > > >but now they each limit their total USA appearances to just a few
          > very
          > > large (and sometimes regionally-clustered) cities, so neither are
          > > really expanding their audiences by number anymore, just playing to
          > the
          > > existing fans. This is truly a shame.<
          > >
          > > Yes, the bigger problem is that ticket sales do not pay for the
          > tours
          > > here in the US for the international acts. Even WB, back in the day,
          > > had trouble bringing a band over for a long run, as it was very
          > > expensive. Now those days are certainly past, as labels won't spend
          > the
          > > cash unless they get a specific ROI- return on investment.
          > >
          > > When Boredoms were on the first part of Lollapalooza 94, the only
          > way
          > > the deal could be done was if Boredoms gave up their portion of the
          > > Lolla t-shirt for which every band received money. That money helped
          > > alongside the funds the label also chipped in. It was a once in a
          > > lifetime opportunity for Boredoms to get that slot, so it was worth
          > it.
          > > Having Kurt Cobain and similar musicians as fans certainly helped
          > too.
          > > (BTW, part 2 of that Lolla tour featured Green Day in that opening
          > > slot, just as the band was getting huge - but I digress.)
          > >
          > > Now, Boredoms are on Vice or Thrill Jockey (SR 9), labels that tend
          > to
          > > give little monetary tour support. Tour support just isn't in the
          > > vocabulary of the indie labels, as it's rarely recouped against
          > album
          > > sales. Sadly, passion alone cannot move a band and tour bus from
          > city
          > > to city.
          > >
          > > Also, their booking agent, Windish Agency, has to be very selective
          > > give the available tour window the band has available. They need
          > > guaranteed money that makes sense for the tour at hand. Do I wish
          > Bore
          > > could do 30 dates? Sure. But the band probably has just a few weeks
          > in
          > > reality, and yes, regionally-clustered shows make travel more
          > > affordable.
          > >
          > > When you mention "playing to the existing fans" - well, I disagree
          > > there. It's your duty as a music fan, as a BORE fan, to pack up the
          > > station wagon with your friends and make them experience Boredoms.
          > Hey,
          > > Bore made it to America for you, can't you drag some friends across
          > > state lines to see them?
          > >
          > > The current music business environment has changed the game for
          > > marginal bands and labels, and the future remains uncertain. At
          > least
          > > America is inexpensive for most bands compared to years past with
          > the
          > > current exchange rates. Maybe more will take up the offer to come
          > the
          > > the USA.
          > >
          > > cheers,
          > > joe
          > >
          >
        • alterego100usa
          Glad for your posting. I m not opposed to traveling for an event, but was just counting on the venues to advertise ticket availability more than 3 or 4 weeks
          Message 4 of 11 , May 29, 2008
            Glad for your posting. I'm not opposed to traveling for an event, but
            was just counting on the venues to advertise ticket availability more
            than 3 or 4 weeks prior to the event itself. Typically, in the music-
            rich Detroit area, even many small club gigs are advertised a couple
            of months earlier, and some bigger concerts are promoted 6 months or
            so earlier. And I'm still wondering why Boredoms couldn't ahve played
            Toronto, which is not all that far from here, and obviously a major
            city.-- In theboredoms@yahoogroups.com, "almurphy56" <almurphy56@...>
            wrote:
            >
            > we would all wish to see a bigger tour, but i think, given the
            > realities of touring today, boredoms have done a good job at
            bringing
            > in new fans, i mean, 77 last summer is a case in point. that was
            > certainly not existing boredoms fans. that was the shit to see! i
            came
            > up from virginia for it, and was totally blown away at the response
            to
            > the event. i guess we can thank this new world of internet hype and
            > blogs and shit for that. i see it as kind of bittersweet that
            boredoms
            > have been sucked into the blogosphere and all that, on the one hand
            > its great for expanding an audience, but of course there's all the
            > internet bullshit and short attention spans that i see all over
            > message boards (like the av club one i just read)that i hate to see
            my
            > favorite band getting sucked into. so i think it is the right way to
            > go to spread the word to your friends, other people, in person. the
            > internet these days is a lion's den, people's attention spans get
            > shorter by the minute.
            > also, boredoms have kind of had a zeppelin-esque approach to
            touring,
            > which, with fewer and more centralized shows in the states, has the
            > effect of making them more anticipated, memorable and talked-about
            > events. but yes, i agree, bad promotion squashes that approach
            pretty
            > quick.
            > anyway, pointless post. but it's definitely the best to bring people
            > to a show. i brought 2 of my friends to boadrum, and their heads
            were
            > blown 20 miles into the sky just like that.
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > --- In theboredoms@yahoogroups.com, alterego100usa <no_reply@>
            wrote:
            > >
            > > Yes, it has become prohibitive for bands to make the trip
            physically
            > > these days. I was seriously going to try for Philadelphia or DC,
            made
            > > several direct inquiries, but venues in both cities put tickets
            on
            > > sale extremely close to the event dates, and with my work, I had
            to
            > > know some absolutes, like concert dates and ticket availability,
            to
            > > be able to free up the time. Websites for both of those venues
            > > finally only listed the concerts a matter of a few weeks or so
            before
            > > the shows. Lodging in those cases would not have been a problem
            at
            > > all, as I have close family in that region. A smaller-scale
            analogy
            > > can be applied with the talented local musicians I know, many of
            whom
            > > play in a cycle of venues in front of generally identical small
            > > groups of fans. I do go to see them each on occasion (or when
            > > grouped, as is most often, in package shows) but they're also
            > > personal friends of mine, so I see them anyway and get their CDs
            > > free, etc. They often see the same faces when they play because
            it's
            > > so difficult for these musicians to get to play additional venues
            > > with owners who aren't corrupt or disinterested. Because of this
            (in
            > > part), their live audience does not really expand unless they can
            > > expand their territory of coverage. A group like Boredoms has an
            > > exceptional live performance approach that I believe would really
            > > expand their audience to very rewarding proportions IF others
            could
            > > be exposed to that art. That's where that investment toward
            > > touring/A&R/etc. can pay off quickly. I would've seen them this
            year
            > > if those venues had simply advertised tickets a reasonable length
            of
            > > time before the concerts, but that has nothing to do with
            Boredoms,
            > > just poor advertising. Even if they'd played Toronto, I would've
            been
            > > there; maybe that could be considered next time around?--- In
            > > theboredoms@yahoogroups.com, Joe Janecek <joejanecek@> wrote:
            > > >
            > > > >but now they each limit their total USA appearances to just a
            few
            > > very
            > > > large (and sometimes regionally-clustered) cities, so neither
            are
            > > > really expanding their audiences by number anymore, just
            playing to
            > > the
            > > > existing fans. This is truly a shame.<
            > > >
            > > > Yes, the bigger problem is that ticket sales do not pay for the
            > > tours
            > > > here in the US for the international acts. Even WB, back in the
            day,
            > > > had trouble bringing a band over for a long run, as it was very
            > > > expensive. Now those days are certainly past, as labels won't
            spend
            > > the
            > > > cash unless they get a specific ROI- return on investment.
            > > >
            > > > When Boredoms were on the first part of Lollapalooza 94, the
            only
            > > way
            > > > the deal could be done was if Boredoms gave up their portion of
            the
            > > > Lolla t-shirt for which every band received money. That money
            helped
            > > > alongside the funds the label also chipped in. It was a once in
            a
            > > > lifetime opportunity for Boredoms to get that slot, so it was
            worth
            > > it.
            > > > Having Kurt Cobain and similar musicians as fans certainly
            helped
            > > too.
            > > > (BTW, part 2 of that Lolla tour featured Green Day in that
            opening
            > > > slot, just as the band was getting huge - but I digress.)
            > > >
            > > > Now, Boredoms are on Vice or Thrill Jockey (SR 9), labels that
            tend
            > > to
            > > > give little monetary tour support. Tour support just isn't in
            the
            > > > vocabulary of the indie labels, as it's rarely recouped against
            > > album
            > > > sales. Sadly, passion alone cannot move a band and tour bus
            from
            > > city
            > > > to city.
            > > >
            > > > Also, their booking agent, Windish Agency, has to be very
            selective
            > > > give the available tour window the band has available. They need
            > > > guaranteed money that makes sense for the tour at hand. Do I
            wish
            > > Bore
            > > > could do 30 dates? Sure. But the band probably has just a few
            weeks
            > > in
            > > > reality, and yes, regionally-clustered shows make travel more
            > > > affordable.
            > > >
            > > > When you mention "playing to the existing fans" - well, I
            disagree
            > > > there. It's your duty as a music fan, as a BORE fan, to pack up
            the
            > > > station wagon with your friends and make them experience
            Boredoms.
            > > Hey,
            > > > Bore made it to America for you, can't you drag some friends
            across
            > > > state lines to see them?
            > > >
            > > > The current music business environment has changed the game for
            > > > marginal bands and labels, and the future remains uncertain. At
            > > least
            > > > America is inexpensive for most bands compared to years past
            with
            > > the
            > > > current exchange rates. Maybe more will take up the offer to
            come
            > > the
            > > > the USA.
            > > >
            > > > cheers,
            > > > joe
            > > >
            > >
            >
          • joejanecek
            ... Ahh, good one. My guess is that it has to do with visa issues. The band has to pay someone in the US to process their work permits and visas, so they can
            Message 5 of 11 , May 29, 2008
              --- In theboredoms@yahoogroups.com, alterego100usa <no_reply@...> wrote:
              >
              > And I'm still wondering why Boredoms couldn't ahve played
              > Toronto, which is not all that far from here, and obviously a major
              > city.

              Ahh, good one. My guess is that it has to do with visa issues. The band has to pay someone
              in the US to process their work permits and visas, so they can earn money legally from the
              music they play in the US. Not certain about the Canadian rules, but there's probably some
              similarity.

              Point is, the extra cost of any visa or work permits required probably doesn't make a Toronto
              gig likely, unless they could do 3-4 or more Canadian shows, and being Canada, those would
              be quite far apart, probably. Plus, customs clearance of the gear into Canada, then back into
              the US, could add to the headaches.

              cheers,
              joe
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