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Royse and Swanson on Lk 3:22 in P75

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  • socius72
    Hi all, I need some assitance. In James Royse s book Scribal Habits in Early Greek NT Papyri he lists PNEUMA (not TO PNEUMA) as a singular reading in Lk 3:22
    Message 1 of 8 , Oct 8, 2010
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      Hi all,

      I need some assitance. In James Royse's book "Scribal Habits in Early Greek NT Papyri" he lists PNEUMA (not TO PNEUMA) as a singular reading in Lk 3:22 of P75. However, Reuben Swanson's NT Gk MSS edition of Luke shows that the article is also missing in 1346*. Royse notes that he has utilized Swanson's edition (p. 65). Has Royse missed 1346* here? Should the variant not be regarded singular? At best it maybe sub-singular? Or has Swanson erred in his reference to 1346*?

      Thanks for your assistance,
      Joe
    • David Robert Palmer
      Hi Joe, Manuscript 1346 in Swanson is a typographical error; it should read 346. I would say P. 75 has a different reading from 346, as the reading of the
      Message 2 of 8 , Oct 9, 2010
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        Hi Joe,
         
        Manuscript 1346 in Swanson is a typographical error; it should read 346. 
         
        I would say P. 75 has a different reading from 346, as the reading of the latter is TON OURANON PNEUMA instead of PNEUMA as found in P. 75.
         
        David Robert Palmer
         
        From: socius72
         

        I need some assitance. In James Royse's book "Scribal Habits in Early Greek NT Papyri" he lists PNEUMA (not TO PNEUMA) as a singular reading in Lk 3:22 of P75. However, Reuben Swanson's NT Gk MSS edition of Luke shows that the article is also missing in 1346*. Royse notes that he has utilized Swanson's edition (p. 65). Has Royse missed 1346* here? Should the variant not be regarded singular? At best it maybe sub-singular? Or has Swanson erred in his reference to 1346*?

        Thanks for your assistance,
        Joe

      • socius72
        Thanks David, Just to clarify, should 1346 always read 346 in Swanson, or is the typographical error only on this occassion at Lk 3:22? In regards to the
        Message 3 of 8 , Oct 11, 2010
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          Thanks David,
          Just to clarify, should 1346 always read 346 in Swanson, or is the typographical error only on this occassion at Lk 3:22?

          In regards to the reading of Lk 3:22, Royse's point is that PNEUMA does not come with the article and therefore represents a singular reading (p. 661). However, MS 346, though adding TON OURANON, still has PNEUMA, in PNEUMA TO AGION, the subject of the clause, without the article. My impression is that Royse missed this. Or, for some reason, wasn't confident of the reading in 346?

          Joe

          --- In textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com, "David Robert Palmer" <davekanaka@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi Joe,
          >
          > Manuscript 1346 in Swanson is a typographical error; it should read 346.
          >
          > I would say P. 75 has a different reading from 346, as the reading of the latter is TON OURANON PNEUMA instead of PNEUMA as found in P. 75.
          >
          > David Robert Palmer
          >
          >
          > From: socius72
          >
          > I need some assitance. In James Royse's book "Scribal Habits in Early Greek NT Papyri" he lists PNEUMA (not TO PNEUMA) as a singular reading in Lk 3:22 of P75. However, Reuben Swanson's NT Gk MSS edition of Luke shows that the article is also missing in 1346*. Royse notes that he has utilized Swanson's edition (p. 65). Has Royse missed 1346* here? Should the variant not be regarded singular? At best it maybe sub-singular? Or has Swanson erred in his reference to 1346*?
          >
          > Thanks for your assistance,
          > Joe
          >
        • David Robert Palmer
          Hi Joe. In Swanson, 1346 should be 346 in every instance; the other gospels too. MS 346 is part of Family 13, so its reading is given when it differs from the
          Message 4 of 8 , Oct 11, 2010
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            Hi Joe.
             
            In Swanson, 1346 should be 346 in every instance; the other gospels too.  MS 346 is part of Family 13, so its reading is given when it differs from the family.
             
            I’m going to study the article issue further.
             
            David Robert Palmer
            From: socius72
            Sent: Monday, October 11, 2010 4:32 AM
            Subject: [textualcriticism] Re: Royse and Swanson on Lk 3:22 in P75
             
             

            Thanks David,
            Just to clarify, should 1346 always read 346 in Swanson, or is the typographical error only on this occassion at Lk 3:22?

            In regards to the reading of Lk 3:22, Royse's point is that PNEUMA does not come with the article and therefore represents a singular reading (p. 661). However, MS 346, though adding TON OURANON, still has PNEUMA, in PNEUMA TO AGION, the subject of the clause, without the article. My impression is that Royse missed this. Or, for some reason, wasn't confident of the reading in 346?

            Joe

            --- In mailto:textualcriticism%40yahoogroups.com, "David Robert Palmer" <davekanaka@...> wrote:

            >
            > Hi
            Joe,
            >
            > Manuscript 1346 in Swanson is a typographical error; it
            should read 346.
            >
            > I would say P. 75 has a different reading
            from 346, as the reading of the latter is TON OURANON PNEUMA instead of PNEUMA as found in P. 75.
            >
            > David Robert Palmer
            >
            >
            > From: socius72
            >
            > I need some assitance. In James
            Royse's book "Scribal Habits in Early Greek NT Papyri" he lists PNEUMA (not TO PNEUMA) as a singular reading in Lk 3:22 of P75. However, Reuben Swanson's NT Gk MSS edition of Luke shows that the article is also missing in 1346*. Royse notes that he has utilized Swanson's edition (p. 65). Has Royse missed 1346* here? Should the variant not be regarded singular? At best it maybe sub-singular? Or has Swanson erred in his reference to 1346*?
            >
            > Thanks for your
            assistance,
            > Joe
            >

          • Wieland Willker
            346 is online at the VMR. For your convenience I have uploaded the specific passage here: http://img11.myimg.de/346Lk32230346x01720INTc4ae7.jpg Swanson has it
            Message 5 of 8 , Oct 12, 2010
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              346 is online at the VMR.

              For your convenience I have uploaded the specific passage here:

              http://img11.myimg.de/346Lk32230346x01720INTc4ae7.jpg

               

              Swanson has it correct.

              346* reads TON OUNON PMA TO AGION

              "N OUNON" is canceled by two backslashes \ above the letters.

              Geerlings notes this, too.

               

              Best wishes

                  Wieland

                  <><

              --------------------------

              Wieland Willker, Bremen, Germany

              http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie

              Textcritical commentary:

              http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/TCG/

            • socius72
              Hi Wieland, When I click the link I get a 403- Forbidden page. thanks, Joe [EDIT: Well, those hosts ... try this:
              Message 6 of 8 , Oct 12, 2010
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                Hi Wieland,
                When I click the link I get a "403- Forbidden" page.
                thanks,
                Joe

                [EDIT: Well, those hosts ...
                try this:
                http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/4104/346lk32230346x01720intf.jpg
                or this:
                http://picfront.de/d/7SHF

                Best wishes
                Wieland]


                --- In textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com, "Wieland Willker" <wie@...> wrote:
                >
                > 346 is online at the VMR.
                >
                > For your convenience I have uploaded the specific passage here:
                >
                > http://img11.myimg.de/346Lk32230346x01720INTc4ae7.jpg
                >
                >
                >
                > Swanson has it correct.
                >
                > 346* reads TON OUNON PMA TO AGION
                >
                > "N OUNON" is canceled by two backslashes \ above the letters.
                >
                > Geerlings notes this, too.
                >
                >
                >
                > Best wishes
                >
                > Wieland
                >
                > <><
                >
                > --------------------------
                >
                > Wieland Willker, Bremen, Germany
                >
                > http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie
                >
                > Textcritical commentary:
                >
                > http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/TCG/
                >
              • socius72
                Thanks Wieland, Can see it now. Seems Royse was correct not to follow Swanson here JOe
                Message 7 of 8 , Oct 15, 2010
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                  Thanks Wieland,
                  Can see it now. Seems Royse was correct not to follow Swanson here
                  JOe

                  --- In textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com, "socius72" <crepuscule30@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hi Wieland,
                  > When I click the link I get a "403- Forbidden" page.
                  > thanks,
                  > Joe
                  >
                  > [EDIT: Well, those hosts ...
                  > try this:
                  > http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/4104/346lk32230346x01720intf.jpg
                  > or this:
                  > http://picfront.de/d/7SHF
                  >
                  > Best wishes
                  > Wieland]
                  >
                  >
                  > --- In textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com, "Wieland Willker" <wie@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > 346 is online at the VMR.
                  > >
                  > > For your convenience I have uploaded the specific passage here:
                  > >
                  > > http://img11.myimg.de/346Lk32230346x01720INTc4ae7.jpg
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Swanson has it correct.
                  > >
                  > > 346* reads TON OUNON PMA TO AGION
                  > >
                  > > "N OUNON" is canceled by two backslashes \ above the letters.
                  > >
                  > > Geerlings notes this, too.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Best wishes
                  > >
                  > > Wieland
                  > >
                  > > <><
                  > >
                  > > --------------------------
                  > >
                  > > Wieland Willker, Bremen, Germany
                  > >
                  > > http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie
                  > >
                  > > Textcritical commentary:
                  > >
                  > > http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/TCG/
                  > >
                  >
                • Daniel Buck
                  Not sure if anyone else noted it or not, but there s also a strikethrough over N OUNON. This is NS for OURANON, right? There s an overline above NON. Daniel
                  Message 8 of 8 , Oct 20, 2010
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                    Not sure if anyone else noted it or not, but there's also a strikethrough over N OUNON.
                    This is NS for OURANON, right? There's an overline above NON.

                    Daniel Buck


                    > > Swanson has it correct.
                     346* reads TON OUNON PMA TO AGION
                      "N OUNON" is canceled by two backslashes \ above the letters.<<


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