- The Arabic Diatessaron reads vine . The verse is not commented upon in Ephrem. Best wishes WielandMessage 1 of 4 , May 14, 2010View Source
- ... The basis for this claim is a Persian Harmony of the Gospels edited and translated into Italian by G Messina in 1951 as Diatessaron Persiano . John 15:1Message 2 of 4 , May 15, 2010View Source
> I have come across several websites and books on Google Books that assertThe basis for this claim is a Persian Harmony of the Gospels edited and
> that the Diatessaron renders its parallel to John 15:1 as "I am the tree
> of the fruit of the truth". But all of the English translations I've found
> all say "I am the vine...". None of these websites I have found cite their
> source for this claim. So do any of you folks here know of any manuscript
> of the Diatessaron that says "I am the tree..." as this claim asserts? And
> can you possibly provide any links to translations or pics that I can
> download, etc.?
> Thank you very much for your time.
translated into Italian by G Messina in 1951 as "Diatessaron Persiano".
John 15:1 is translated by Messina as "Io sono l'albero del frutto della
verita" which is equivalent to "I am the tree of the fruit of truth".
Although this Persian Harmony is certainly a translation of an earlier
Syriac Harmony the relation of this Harmony to that of Tatian is unclear.
The order of passages in this Harmony is different from that of Tatian's
Diatessaron but this Harmony undoubtedly contains many specific readings
going back to Tatian.
Evidence from Syriac writers seems to indicate that Tatian's Diatessaron
in John 15:1 read "I am the true Vineyard" or something similar.
See for a discussion (slightly out of date):
Hope this helps.
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- Hi Folks, The late William Lawrence Petersen addressed this, the references is to a Persian version of the Diatessoran. Tatian s Diatessaron: its creation,Message 3 of 4 , May 15, 2010View SourceHi Folks,
The late William Lawrence Petersen addressed this, the references is to a Persian version of the Diatessoran.
Tatian's Diatessaron: its creation, dissemination, significance, and history ...
William Lawrence Petersen
At John 15:1 the Persian Harmony changes "I am the true vine'' to "I am the tree of the fruit of truth," eschewing oenophile
And I think it is fair to say that since the Persian is 2nd or 3rd generation translational-derivative, and relatively minor in the transmissional schema, this would normally get little notice. There is a lot of discussion within that book by Petersen about the enigmatic nature with many unique features of the Persian haromny (one manuscript, written up in the 20th century by Giuseppe Messina in 1943 though known since the 1700s, main discussion begins on p. 259).
I have come across several websites and books on Google Books that assert that the Diatessaron renders its parallel to John 15:1 as "I am the tree of the fruit of the truth". But all of the English translations I've found all say "I am the vine...". None of these websites I have found cite their source for this claim. So do any of you folks here know of any manuscript of the Diatessaron that says "I am the tree..." as this claim asserts?
- misterboswell, A translator s note at John 15:1 in the NET Bible explains the rendering true vine thusly: Ezek 17:5-10 contains vine imagery which refers toMessage 4 of 4 , May 15, 2010View Sourcemisterboswell,
A translator's note at John 15:1 in the NET Bible explains the rendering "true vine" thusly:"Ezek 17:5-10 contains vine imagery which refers to a king of the house of David, Zedekiah, who was set up as king in Judah by Nebuchadnezzar. Zedekiah allied himself to Egypt and broke his covenant with Nebuchadnezzar (and therefore also with God), which would ultimately result in his downfall (17:20-21). Ezek 17:22-24 then describes the planting of a cedar sprig which grows into a lofty tree, a figurative description of Messiah. But it is significant that Messiah himself is not described in Ezek 17 as a vine, but as a cedar tree. The vine imagery here applies to Zedekiah’s disobedience. Jesus’ description of himself as the true vine in John 15:1 ff. is to be seen against this background, but it differs significantly from the imagery surveyed above. It represents new imagery which differs significantly from OT concepts; it appears to be original with Jesus."