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Re: [textualcriticism] Freer Gospels (W 032)

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  • Timothy Arthur Brown
    Hi Michael, Published photos of W 032 are to be found in a 1912 publication, a collotype facsimile edited by Henry A. Sanders entitled _Facsimile of the
    Message 1 of 26 , Feb 1, 2005
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      Hi Michael,

      Published photos of W 032 are to be found in a 1912 publication, a
      collotype facsimile edited by Henry A. Sanders entitled _Facsimile of
      the Washington Manuscript of the Gospels_. The images I've posted are
      scans from this publication. Any major university or seminary that
      existed in 1912 is likely to still have a copy of this facsimile in
      their collection as Charles Freer (buyer of the Freer MSS in 1906 and,
      later, the founder of the Smithsonian's Freer Gallery of Art) funded
      this publication personally and presented copies as gifts to major
      institutions of learning around the world.

      New imaging work has been done over the past few years, but none of this
      work has yet been published.

      T. A. Brown
      Franconia, New Hampshire USA


      Michael Theophilos wrote:

      >
      >
      > Does anyone know if there are published photographs of the 5th C
      > Freer Gospels? Or for that matter, diplomatic transcriptions? I
      > would be interested to
      > know where Timothy Arthur Brown obtained the pics of the colophon in
      > Mt, Lk and Jn.
      >
      > Kind regards
      >
      > Michael
      > Oxford, UK.
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
      > ADVERTISEMENT
      > Children International
      >
      > Would you give Hope to a Child in need?
      >
      > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129d9aif1/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107360452/A=2535374/R=0/SIG=142trf8s4/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=872&s=f&hostName=Children%20International>
      >
      >
      > · Click Here to meet a Girl
      > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129d9aif1/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107360452/A=2535374/R=1/SIG=142trf8s4/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=872&s=f&hostName=Children%20International>
      > And Give Her Hope
      >
      >
      > · Click Here to meet a Boy
      > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129d9aif1/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107360452/A=2535374/R=2/SIG=1424c63em/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=871&s=m&hostName=Children%20International>
      > And Change His Life
      >
      > Learn More
      > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129d9aif1/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107360452/A=2535374/R=3/SIG=1424c63em/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=871&s=m&hostName=Children%20International>
      >
      >
      >
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    • Timothy Arthur Brown
      Hello Ron, You are correct in thinking that an SBL publication (on CD) has been planned to coincide with the 2006 SBL annual meetings in Washington, DC. I am
      Message 2 of 26 , Feb 1, 2005
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        Hello Ron,

        You are correct in thinking that an SBL publication (on CD) has been
        planned to coincide with the 2006 SBL annual meetings in
        Washington, DC. I am not, however, a representative of the SBL and more
        detail would probably have to be offered by an SBL official, perhaps
        Patrick Durusau.

        T. A. Brown
        Franconia, New Hampshire USA



        Minton, Ron wrote:

        >
        > I may be wrong, but I think this is to be published in conjunction
        > with the
        > 100th anniv. of the Smithsonian in a year or two when ETS and SBL come to
        > DC.
        >
        > Ron Minton
        >
        > -----Original Message-----
        > From: Michael Theophilos
        > [mailto:michael.theophilos@...]
        > Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2005 10:18 AM
        > To: textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: [textualcriticism] Freer Gospels (W 032)
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Does anyone know if there are published photographs of the 5th C
        > Freer Gospels? Or for that matter, diplomatic transcriptions? I would be
        > interested to
        > know where Timothy Arthur Brown obtained the pics of the colophon in
        > Mt, Lk
        > and Jn.
        >
        > Kind regards
        >
        > Michael
        > Oxford, UK.
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
        > ADVERTISEMENT
        > Children International
        >
        > Would you give Hope to a Child in need?
        >
        > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129b13g8l/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107364912/A=2535374/R=0/SIG=142trf8s4/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=872&s=f&hostName=Children%20International>
        >
        >
        > · Click Here to meet a Girl
        > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129b13g8l/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107364912/A=2535374/R=1/SIG=142trf8s4/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=872&s=f&hostName=Children%20International>
        > And Give Her Hope
        >
        >
        > · Click Here to meet a Boy
        > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129b13g8l/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107364912/A=2535374/R=2/SIG=1424c63em/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=871&s=m&hostName=Children%20International>
        > And Change His Life
        >
        > Learn More
        > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129b13g8l/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107364912/A=2535374/R=3/SIG=1424c63em/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=871&s=m&hostName=Children%20International>
        >
        >
        >
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      • malcolm robertson
        Dear Michael, Wieland posted a link to St. Mark s Gospel from the Freer collection awhile back. I m not sure whether you know of it or not. Here it is again.
        Message 3 of 26 , Feb 2, 2005
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          Dear Michael,
           
          Wieland posted a link to St. Mark's Gospel from the Freer collection awhile back.  I'm not sure whether you know of it or not.  Here it is again.
           
           
          With best regards,
           
          Malcolm
            

          Michael Theophilos <michael.theophilos@...> wrote:


          Does anyone know if there are published photographs of the 5th C
          Freer Gospels?  Or for that matter, diplomatic transcriptions?  I would be interested to
          know where Timothy Arthur Brown obtained the pics of the colophon in Mt, Lk and Jn.

          Kind regards

          Michael
          Oxford, UK.










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        • Timothy Arthur Brown
          Hi Michael, After responding to your question about published photographs, I reread your message and noticed that you also asked about transcriptions. Bruce
          Message 4 of 26 , Feb 2, 2005
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            Hi Michael,

            After responding to your question about published photographs, I reread
            your message and noticed that you also asked about transcriptions.

            Bruce Prior and I are working on full transcriptions and collations of
            two of the Washington MSS at this moment -- The Gospels MS, about which
            you've inquired, and the Deuteronomy/Joshua MS. Both transcriptions are
            scheduled for publication by the 2006 SBL meetings in Washington, DC.

            These transcriptions follow the layout of the original manuscripts
            closely. We have even taken pains to measure and represent the spaces
            which the scribe has often used to separate phrases. Word spacing has
            been added for clarity, however, and whenever it has been necessary to
            use editorial judgments, an explanation appears in the footnotes.

            T. A. Brown
            Franconia, New Hampshire USA


            Michael Theophilos wrote:

            >
            >
            > Does anyone know if there are published photographs of the 5th C
            > Freer Gospels? Or for that matter, diplomatic transcriptions? I
            > would be interested to
            > know where Timothy Arthur Brown obtained the pics of the colophon in
            > Mt, Lk and Jn.
            >
            > Kind regards
            >
            > Michael
            > Oxford, UK.
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
            > ADVERTISEMENT
            > Children International
            >
            > Would you give Hope to a Child in need?
            >
            > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129d9aif1/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107360452/A=2535374/R=0/SIG=142trf8s4/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=872&s=f&hostName=Children%20International>
            >
            >
            > · Click Here to meet a Girl
            > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129d9aif1/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107360452/A=2535374/R=1/SIG=142trf8s4/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=872&s=f&hostName=Children%20International>
            > And Give Her Hope
            >
            >
            > · Click Here to meet a Boy
            > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129d9aif1/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107360452/A=2535374/R=2/SIG=1424c63em/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=871&s=m&hostName=Children%20International>
            > And Change His Life
            >
            > Learn More
            > <http://us.ard.yahoo.com/SIG=129d9aif1/M=332618.5923862.6999529.2152211/D=groups/S=1706113926:HM/EXP=1107360452/A=2535374/R=3/SIG=1424c63em/*http://children.780net.com/qry/CICHildselect.taf?_function=childSearch&ETTFMRS_BHST_ID=871&s=m&hostName=Children%20International>
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            > * To visit your group on the web, go to:
            > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/textualcriticism/
            >
            > * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
            > textualcriticism-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            > <mailto:textualcriticism-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>
            >
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            > Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>.
            >
            >
          • mr.scrivener
            ... Dear Mr. Brown: In this message (last year), you mentioned publishing transcriptions of Codex W, as well as a possible new Facsimile edition available on
            Message 5 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
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              --------------------
              Dear Mr. Brown:

              In this message (last year), you mentioned publishing transcriptions
              of Codex W, as well as a possible new Facsimile edition available on
              disk by the '2006 SBL Meetings..'. Well, its June 2006, and I was
              wondering how your projects are coming along.

              ----------------------
              Also, is anyone aware of the following website, which claims to have
              discovered 'seals' or 'signatures' of the scribes who wrote Codex W
              (the Gospel mss)?

              http://www.washington-codex.org/woodard_kodex_article_1.htm

              Although the site makes many wild claims, and dates the Gospel Codex
              W too early, surely just the existance of these 'seals' at the
              beginning and end of each gospel in the codex require a thorough
              investigation and proper explanation.

              Any ideas?

              Curiosity is killing me here...
              Eeyore



              ------------------------------
              --- In textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Arthur Brown
              <t.a.brown@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              > Hi Michael,
              >
              > After responding to your question about published photographs, I
              reread
              > your message and noticed that you also asked about transcriptions.
              >
              > Bruce Prior and I are working on full transcriptions and collations
              of
              > two of the Washington MSS at this moment -- The Gospels MS, about
              which
              > you've inquired, and the Deuteronomy/Joshua MS. Both
              transcriptions are
              > scheduled for publication by the 2006 SBL meetings in Washington,
              DC.
              >
              > These transcriptions follow the layout of the original manuscripts
              > closely. We have even taken pains to measure and represent the
              spaces
              > which the scribe has often used to separate phrases. Word spacing
              has
              > been added for clarity, however, and whenever it has been necessary
              to
              > use editorial judgments, an explanation appears in the footnotes.
              >
              > T. A. Brown
              > Franconia, New Hampshire USA
              >
              >
            • Peter M. Head
              ... Yes this is a fantastic discovery. ... Peter M. Head, PhD Sir Kirby Laing Senior Lecturer in New Testament Tyndale House 36 Selwyn Gardens Cambridge CB3
              Message 6 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
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                >
                >Also, is anyone aware of the following website, which claims to have
                >discovered 'seals' or 'signatures' of the scribes who wrote Codex W
                >(the Gospel mss)?
                >
                >http://www.washington-codex.org/woodard_kodex_article_1.htm
                >
                >Although the site makes many wild claims, and dates the Gospel Codex
                >W too early, surely just the existance of these 'seals' at the
                >beginning and end of each gospel in the codex require a thorough
                >investigation and proper explanation.

                Yes this is a fantastic discovery.


                >

                Peter M. Head, PhD
                Sir Kirby Laing Senior Lecturer in New Testament
                Tyndale House
                36 Selwyn Gardens
                Cambridge CB3 9BA
                01223 566601
              • Peter M. Head
                OED: Fantastic: Existing only in imagination; proceeding merely from imagination; fabulous, imaginary, unreal (obs.). b. In mod. use, of alleged reasons,
                Message 7 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
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                  OED: Fantastic:


                  Existing only in imagination; proceeding merely from imagination;
                  fabulous, imaginary, unreal (obs.). b. In mod. use, of alleged
                  reasons, fears, etc.: Perversely or irrationally imagined.





                  Peter M. Head, PhD
                  Sir Kirby Laing Senior Lecturer in New Testament
                  Tyndale House
                  36 Selwyn Gardens
                  Cambridge CB3 9BA
                  01223 566601
                • George F Somsel
                  It WOULD BE fantastic. if true. The question is whether these claims can be independently verified by others. When I encounter rather extreme claims, it
                  Message 8 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
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                    It WOULD BE fantastic. if true.  The question is whether these claims can be independently verified by others.  When I encounter rather extreme claims, it tends to taint my ablity to put much credence in the rest of what is said therein.  I would say that it is first necessary for a recognized scholar to look at the evidence and either confirm or debunk these claims.
                     
                    ___________

                    "Peter M. Head" <pmh15@...> wrote:

                    >
                    >Also, is anyone aware of the following website, which claims to have
                    >discovered 'seals' or 'signatures' of the scribes who wrote Codex W
                    >(the Gospel mss)?
                    >
                    >http://www.washingt on-codex. org/woodard_ kodex_article_ 1.htm
                    >
                    >Although the site makes many wild claims, and dates the Gospel Codex
                    >W too early, surely just the existance of these 'seals' at the
                    >beginning and end of each gospel in the codex require a thorough
                    >investigation and proper explanation.

                    Yes this is a fantastic discovery.

                    >

                    Peter M. Head, PhD
                    Sir Kirby Laing Senior Lecturer in New Testament
                    Tyndale House
                    36 Selwyn Gardens
                    Cambridge CB3 9BA
                    01223 566601




                    george
                    gfsomsel
                    _________

                    __________________________________________________
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                  • Peter Williams
                    It s a fantastic phantasm. ... Peter Williams Senior Lecturer in New Testament Deputy Head of School of Divinity, History and Philosophy University of Aberdeen
                    Message 9 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
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                      It's a fantastic phantasm.

                      George:

                      >It WOULD BE fantastic. if true.
                      >
                      >"Peter M. Head" <pmh15@...> wrote:
                      >>
                      >>Yes this is a fantastic discovery.


                      ------------
                      Peter Williams
                      Senior Lecturer in New Testament
                      Deputy Head of School of Divinity, History and Philosophy
                      University of Aberdeen
                      p.j.williams@...
                    • George F Somsel
                      That is, of course, one use of the term -- I believe the original meaning. Since, however, words do have various meanings, I m glad that you clarified your
                      Message 10 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
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                        That is, of course, one use of the term -- I believe the original meaning.  Since, however, words do have various meanings, I'm glad that you clarified your meaning.  I would tend to think that this is fantastic in the original sense of the term.  I would nevertheless like to know just what it is he's looking at in regard to the "seals", etc.  [Always be suspicious in a field such as this when someone begins by noting that no previous scholar ever saw 'X.'  Usually no other scholar saw it because it isn't there.  Interpreting a known item in a different fashion is an entirely different matter.
                         
                        ______________


                        "Peter M. Head" <pmh15@...> wrote:
                        OED: Fantastic:

                        Existing only in imagination; proceeding merely from imagination;
                        fabulous, imaginary, unreal (obs.). b. In mod. use, of alleged
                        reasons, fears, etc.: Perversely or irrationally imagined.

                        Peter M. Head, PhD
                        Sir Kirby Laing Senior Lecturer in New Testament
                        Tyndale House
                        36 Selwyn Gardens
                        Cambridge CB3 9BA
                        01223 566601




                        george
                        gfsomsel
                        _________

                        __________________________________________________
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                        Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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                      • William Warren
                        The web site looks like an attempt to push an agenda more than a place where evidence would be presented that would be reliable (as seen in the diatribe
                        Message 11 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
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                          The web site looks like an attempt to push an agenda more than a place where evidence would be presented that would be reliable (as seen in the diatribe against a school in Oklahoma).  While the claim may need to be examined, I would think a more adequate answer could be found in the presentations at SBL on Codex W this November, where several studies of the ms. are being presented.


                          paz, 


                          Bill Warren

                          Director of the Center for New Testament Textual Studies

                          Landrum P. Leavell, II, Professor of New Testament and Greek

                          New Orleans Baptist Theological Seminary



                          On Jun 7, 2006, at 4:02 AM, mr.scrivener wrote:

                          --------------------
                          Dear Mr. Brown:

                          In this message (last year), you mentioned publishing transcriptions
                          of Codex W, as well as a possible new Facsimile edition available on
                          disk by the '2006 SBL Meetings..'. Well, its June 2006, and I was
                          wondering how your projects are coming along.

                          ----------------------
                          Also, is anyone aware of the following website, which claims to have
                          discovered 'seals' or 'signatures' of the scribes who wrote Codex W
                          (the Gospel mss)?

                          http://www.washington-codex.org/woodard_kodex_article_1.htm

                          Although the site makes many wild claims, and dates the Gospel Codex
                          W too early, surely just the existance of these 'seals' at the
                          beginning and end of each gospel in the codex require a thorough
                          investigation and proper explanation.

                          Any ideas?

                          Curiosity is killing me here...
                          Eeyore

                          ------------------------------
                          --- In textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Arthur Brown
                          <t.a.brown@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          > Hi Michael,
                          >
                          > After responding to your question about published photographs, I
                          reread
                          > your message and noticed that you also asked about transcriptions.
                          >
                          > Bruce Prior and I are working on full transcriptions and collations
                          of
                          > two of the Washington MSS at this moment -- The Gospels MS, about
                          which
                          > you've inquired, and the Deuteronomy/Joshua MS. Both
                          transcriptions are
                          > scheduled for publication by the 2006 SBL meetings in Washington,
                          DC.
                          >
                          > These transcriptions follow the layout of the original manuscripts
                          > closely. We have even taken pains to measure and represent the
                          spaces
                          > which the scribe has often used to separate phrases. Word spacing
                          has
                          > been added for clarity, however, and whenever it has been necessary
                          to
                          > use editorial judgments, an explanation appears in the footnotes.
                          >
                          > T. A. Brown
                          > Franconia, New Hampshire USA
                          >
                          >


                          =
                        • Tommy Wasserman
                          I have come across a large number of scribal peculiarities through the years. Here are two which someone might help me with: 1) in an MS the final AMHN (in
                          Message 12 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
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                            I have come across a large number of scribal peculiarities through the
                            years. Here are two which someone might help me with:

                            1) in an MS the final AMHN (in Jude) is written backwards on three
                            lines:

                            HN
                            M
                            A

                            Has anyone seen anything similar?

                            2) In some minuscule MSS there is a sign in the margin, •/•, plus a
                            reading. I interpret the sign as an "obelus periestigmenos." The
                            question is whether this sign has the same function over time, i.e. in
                            the early uncials and in the minuscules, respectively. In short, I am
                            not sure if it unequivocally refers to a correction of the text (or
                            might be a reference to an alternative reading).

                            Any ideas?

                            With regards

                            Tommy Wasserman
                            Centre for Theology and Religious Studies
                            Lund University
                            Sweden
                          • Timothy Arthur Brown
                            Hello, Bruce Prior and I are in the process of finishing up pre-press work on the Freer Gospels transcription now. You can expect to see an edition available
                            Message 13 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
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                              Hello,

                              Bruce Prior and I are in the process of finishing up pre-press work on the Freer Gospels transcription now.  You can expect to see an edition available at this year's SBL annual meeting in Washington, DC.  The new images I alluded to are, as far as I know, still intended for public release this November as well.  The newest images are those taken by the Freer/Sackler photography department and I think it's safe to assume that this image library will be published by the Freer/Sackler Gallery itself.

                              And now concerning Woodard's "Kodex W". . . Bruce and I first learned of Woodard's theories a couple of years ago.  The claims are wild, but we agreed that such claims, regardless how unbelievable, ought not be automatically rejected simply because they do not conform to our current understanding of the manuscript.  We had at our disposal the tools and access necessary to examine these claims, so we decided to do so.  We were in contact with Lee Woodard by phone and by e-mail and we each had a copy of his book.  Becoming thus fully informed of his claims, we examined high resolution images of the relevant parts of the codex and were unable to substantiate any of Woodard's theories.  Since this examination, I have had opportunity to access the original at the Freer Gallery and must still conclude that Woodard's ideas are without merit.

                              Sincerely,

                              T. A. Brown
                              Franconia, New Hampshire  USA



                              mr.scrivener wrote:

                              ------------ --------
                              Dear Mr. Brown:

                              In this message (last year), you mentioned publishing transcriptions
                              of Codex W, as well as a possible new Facsimile edition available on
                              disk by the '2006 SBL Meetings..'. Well, its June 2006, and I was
                              wondering how your projects are coming along.

                              ------------ --------- -
                              Also, is anyone aware of the following website, which claims to have
                              discovered 'seals' or 'signatures' of the scribes who wrote Codex W
                              (the Gospel mss)?

                              http://www.washingt on-codex. org/woodard_ kodex_article_ 1.htm

                              Although the site makes many wild claims, and dates the Gospel Codex
                              W too early, surely just the existance of these 'seals' at the
                              beginning and end of each gospel in the codex require a thorough
                              investigation and proper explanation.

                              Any ideas?

                              Curiosity is killing me here...
                              Eeyore

                              ------------ --------- ---------
                              --- In textualcriticism@ yahoogroups. com, Timothy Arthur Brown
                              <t.a.brown@. ..> wrote:
                              >
                              >
                              > Hi Michael,
                              >
                              > After responding to your question about published photographs, I
                              reread
                              > your message and noticed that you also asked about transcriptions.
                              >
                              > Bruce Prior and I are working on full transcriptions and collations
                              of
                              > two of the Washington MSS at this moment -- The Gospels MS, about
                              which
                              > you've inquired, and the Deuteronomy/ Joshua MS. Both
                              transcriptions are
                              > scheduled for publication by the 2006 SBL meetings in Washington,
                              DC.
                              >
                              > These transcriptions follow the layout of the original manuscripts
                              > closely. We have even taken pains to measure and represent the
                              spaces
                              > which the scribe has often used to separate phrases. Word spacing
                              has
                              > been added for clarity, however, and whenever it has been necessary
                              to
                              > use editorial judgments, an explanation appears in the footnotes.
                              >
                              > T. A. Brown
                              > Franconia, New Hampshire USA
                              >
                              >


                            • George F Somsel
                              What about the alleged upside down Aramaic text. Is there anything there to which he might refer or is this made up out of whole cloth? _____________ Timothy
                              Message 14 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
                              • 0 Attachment
                                What about the alleged upside down Aramaic text.  Is there anything there to which he might refer or is this made up out of whole cloth?
                                 
                                _____________

                                Timothy Arthur Brown <t.a.brown@...> wrote:
                                Hello,

                                Bruce Prior and I are in the process of finishing up pre-press work on the Freer Gospels transcription now.  You can expect to see an edition available at this year's SBL annual meeting in Washington, DC.  The new images I alluded to are, as far as I know, still intended for public release this November as well.  The newest images are those taken by the Freer/Sackler photography department and I think it's safe to assume that this image library will be published by the Freer/Sackler Gallery itself.

                                And now concerning Woodard's "Kodex W". . . Bruce and I first learned of Woodard's theories a couple of years ago.  The claims are wild, but we agreed that such claims, regardless how unbelievable, ought not be automatically rejected simply because they do not conform to our current understanding of the manuscript.  We had at our disposal the tools and access necessary to examine these claims, so we decided to do so.  We were in contact with Lee Woodard by phone and by e-mail and we each had a copy of his book.  Becoming thus fully informed of his claims, we examined high resolution images of the relevant parts of the codex and were unable to substantiate any of Woodard's theories.  Since this examination, I have had opportunity to access the original at the Freer Gallery and must still conclude that Woodard's ideas are without merit.

                                Sincerely,

                                T. A. Brown
                                Franconia, New Hampshire  USA



                                mr.scrivener wrote:
                                ------------ --------
                                Dear Mr. Brown:

                                In this message (last year), you mentioned publishing transcriptions
                                of Codex W, as well as a possible new Facsimile edition available on
                                disk by the '2006 SBL Meetings..'. Well, its June 2006, and I was
                                wondering how your projects are coming along.

                                ------------ --------- -
                                Also, is anyone aware of the following website, which claims to have
                                discovered 'seals' or 'signatures' of the scribes who wrote Codex W
                                (the Gospel mss)?

                                http://www.washingt on-codex. org/woodard_ kodex_article_ 1.htm

                                Although the site makes many wild claims, and dates the Gospel Codex
                                W too early, surely just the existance of these 'seals' at the
                                beginning and end of each gospel in the codex require a thorough
                                investigation and proper explanation.

                                Any ideas?

                                Curiosity is killing me here...
                                Eeyore

                                ------------ --------- ---------
                                --- In textualcriticism@ yahoogroups. com, Timothy Arthur Brown
                                <t.a.brown@. ..> wrote:
                                >
                                >
                                > Hi Michael,
                                >
                                > After responding to your question about published photographs, I
                                reread
                                > your message and noticed that you also asked about transcriptions.
                                >
                                > Bruce Prior and I are working on full transcriptions and collations
                                of
                                > two of the Washington MSS at this moment -- The Gospels MS, about
                                which
                                > you've inquired, and the Deuteronomy/ Joshua MS. Both
                                transcriptions are
                                > scheduled for publication by the 2006 SBL meetings in Washington,
                                DC.
                                >
                                > These transcriptions follow the layout of the original manuscripts
                                > closely. We have even taken pains to measure and represent the
                                spaces
                                > which the scribe has often used to separate phrases. Word spacing
                                has
                                > been added for clarity, however, and whenever it has been necessary
                                to
                                > use editorial judgments, an explanation appears in the footnotes.
                                >
                                > T. A. Brown
                                > Franconia, New Hampshire USA
                                >
                                >





                                george
                                gfsomsel
                                _________

                                __________________________________________________
                                Do You Yahoo!?
                                Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
                                http://mail.yahoo.com

                              • Kent Clarke
                                I saw that one coming Peter...hahaha Kent Kent D. Clarke (Ph.D. Bristol) Associate Professor of Religious Studies Department of Religious Studies Seal-Kap
                                Message 15 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Re: [textualcriticism] Re: Freer Gospels (W 032) I saw that one coming Peter...hahaha

                                  Kent


                                  Kent D. Clarke (Ph.D. Bristol)
                                  Associate Professor of Religious Studies
                                  Department of Religious Studies
                                  Seal-Kap House
                                  Trinity Western University
                                  7600 Glover Road
                                  Langley, BC
                                  V2Y 1Y1
                                  Canada




                                  On 6/7/06 2:45 AM, "Peter M. Head" <pmh15@...> wrote:


                                   
                                   

                                  OED: Fantastic:

                                  Existing only in imagination; proceeding merely from imagination;
                                  fabulous, imaginary, unreal (obs.).    b. In mod. use, of alleged
                                  reasons, fears, etc.: Perversely or irrationally imagined.

                                  Peter M. Head, PhD
                                  Sir Kirby Laing Senior Lecturer in New Testament
                                  Tyndale House
                                  36 Selwyn Gardens
                                  Cambridge CB3 9BA
                                  01223 566601

                                   
                                      

                                • Timothy Arthur Brown
                                  Dear George, Bruce and I were unable to substantiate even a single one of Woodard s claims. T. A. Brown Franconia, New Hampshire USA
                                  Message 16 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Dear George,

                                    Bruce and I were unable to substantiate even a single one of Woodard's claims.

                                    T. A. Brown
                                    Franconia, New Hampshire  USA



                                    George F Somsel wrote:
                                    What about the alleged upside down Aramaic text.  Is there anything there to which he might refer or is this made up out of whole cloth?
                                     
                                    _____________

                                    Timothy Arthur Brown <t.a.brown@...> wrote:
                                    Hello,

                                    Bruce Prior and I are in the process of finishing up pre-press work on the Freer Gospels transcription now.  You can expect to see an edition available at this year's SBL annual meeting in Washington, DC.  The new images I alluded to are, as far as I know, still intended for public release this November as well.  The newest images are those taken by the Freer/Sackler photography department and I think it's safe to assume that this image library will be published by the Freer/Sackler Gallery itself.

                                    And now concerning Woodard's "Kodex W". . . Bruce and I first learned of Woodard's theories a couple of years ago.  The claims are wild, but we agreed that such claims, regardless how unbelievable, ought not be automatically rejected simply because they do not conform to our current understanding of the manuscript.  We had at our disposal the tools and access necessary to examine these claims, so we decided to do so.  We were in contact with Lee Woodard by phone and by e-mail and we each had a copy of his book.  Becoming thus fully informed of his claims, we examined high resolution images of the relevant parts of the codex and were unable to substantiate any of Woodard's theories.  Since this examination, I have had opportunity to access the original at the Freer Gallery and must still conclude that Woodard's ideas are without merit.

                                    Sincerely,

                                    T. A. Brown
                                    Franconia, New Hampshire  USA



                                    mr.scrivener wrote:
                                    ------------ --------
                                    Dear Mr. Brown:

                                    In this message (last year), you mentioned publishing transcriptions
                                    of Codex W, as well as a possible new Facsimile edition available on
                                    disk by the '2006 SBL Meetings..'. Well, its June 2006, and I was
                                    wondering how your projects are coming along.

                                    ------------ --------- -
                                    Also, is anyone aware of the following website, which claims to have
                                    discovered 'seals' or 'signatures' of the scribes who wrote Codex W
                                    (the Gospel mss)?

                                    http://www.washingt on-codex. org/woodard_ kodex_article_ 1.htm

                                    Althoug h the site makes many wild claims, and dates the Gospel Codex
                                    W too early, surely just the existance of these 'seals' at the
                                    beginning and end of each gospel in the codex require a thorough
                                    investigation and proper explanation.

                                    Any ideas?

                                    Curiosity is killing me here...
                                    Eeyore

                                    ------------ --------- ---------
                                    --- In textualcriticism@ yahoogroups. com, Timothy Arthur Brown
                                    <t.a.brown@. ..> wrote:
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > Hi Michael,
                                    >
                                    > After responding to your question about published photographs, I
                                    reread
                                    > your message and noticed that you also asked about transcriptions.
                                    >
                                    > Bruce Prior and I are working on full transcriptions and collations
                                    of
                                    > two of the Washington MSS at this moment -- The Gospels MS, about
                                    which
                                    > you've inquired, and the Deuteronomy/ Joshua MS. Both
                                    transcriptions are
                                    > scheduled for publication by the 2006 SBL meetings in Washington,
                                    DC.
                                    >
                                    > These transcriptions follow the layout of the original manuscripts
                                    > closely. We have even taken pains to measure and represent the
                                    spaces
                                    > which the scribe has often used to separate phrases. Word spacing
                                    has
                                    > been added for clarity, however, and whenever it has been necessary
                                    to
                                    > use editorial judgments, an explanation appears in the footnotes.
                                    >
                                    > T. A. Brown
                                    > Franconia, New Hampshire USA
                                    >
                                    >





                                    george
                                    gfsomsel
                                    _________

                                    __________________________________________________
                                    Do You Yahoo!?
                                    Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
                                    http://mail.yahoo.com


                                  • mr.scrivener
                                    Greetings Mr Wasserman: I have two leads for you: (1) the Jude inscription looks painfully like the Egyptian practice found in Christian Magic amulets and
                                    Message 17 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      Greetings Mr Wasserman:

                                      I have two leads for you:

                                      (1) the Jude inscription looks painfully like the Egyptian practice
                                      found in 'Christian Magic' amulets and small scrolls. I suggest you
                                      start with the two following books as an introduction to the subject:

                                      Ancient Christian Magic (Coptic texts of ritual power) Edited by
                                      Meyer & Smith (Harper Collins 1994), and

                                      Medicine, Miracle & Magic in NT Times by H.C. Kee.(Cambridge UP 1986-
                                      1990)

                                      Also useful might be:
                                      Paganism & Christianity 100-425 C.E. A Sourcebook Macmullen & Lane

                                      The writing of religious texts backwards or in patterns was very
                                      common throughout Egypt and the Aegean in the period.

                                      (2) Studying Vaticanus I have come to the conclusion that the 'NT'
                                      Obelisk (the one you describe is a lemniscus =dot/dot)has a variety
                                      of uses but mostly as a generic indicator of an accidental omission
                                      corrected in the margin. there is a good introduction to the changes
                                      in meaning over periods and places here:

                                      http://www.christianforums.com/t2994963-asterisk-and-obelus-three-
                                      different-usages.html





                                      --- In textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com, Tommy Wasserman <tomwas@...>
                                      wrote:
                                      >
                                      > I have come across a large number of scribal peculiarities through
                                      the
                                      > years. Here are two which someone might help me with:
                                      >
                                      > 1) in an MS the final AMHN (in Jude) is written backwards on three
                                      > lines:
                                      >
                                      > HN
                                      > M
                                      > A
                                      >
                                      > Has anyone seen anything similar?
                                      >
                                      > 2) In some minuscule MSS there is a sign in the margin, •/•, plus a
                                      > reading. I interpret the sign as an "obelus periestigmenos." The
                                      > question is whether this sign has the same function over time, i.e.
                                      in
                                      > the early uncials and in the minuscules, respectively. In short, I
                                      am
                                      > not sure if it unequivocally refers to a correction of the text (or
                                      > might be a reference to an alternative reading).
                                      >
                                      > Any ideas?
                                      >
                                      > With regards
                                      >
                                      > Tommy Wasserman
                                      > Centre for Theology and Religious Studies
                                      > Lund University
                                      > Sweden
                                      >
                                    • mr.scrivener
                                      Dear Mr. Brown: Thank you for your prompt reply: However, you seem to have left an ambiguity - Mr Woodward s ideas may be without merit, but are the marks just
                                      Message 18 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        Dear Mr. Brown:

                                        Thank you for your prompt reply:
                                        However, you seem to have left an ambiguity -
                                        Mr Woodward's ideas may be without merit,
                                        but are the marks just dust specks, imperfections in the photos,
                                        or actual scribal scribbles, whatever their meaning?
                                        Could you clarify?

                                        Still perplexed,
                                        Eeyore.

                                        --- In textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com, Timothy Arthur Brown
                                        <t.a.brown@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > Hello,
                                        >
                                        > Bruce Prior and I are in the process of finishing up pre-press work
                                        on
                                        > the Freer Gospels transcription now. You can expect to see an
                                        edition
                                        > available at this year's SBL annual meeting in Washington, DC. The
                                        new
                                        > images I alluded to are, as far as I know, still intended for
                                        public
                                        > release this November as well. The newest images are those taken
                                        by the
                                        > Freer/Sackler photography department and I think it's safe to
                                        assume
                                        > that this image library will be published by the Freer/Sackler
                                        Gallery
                                        > itself.
                                        >
                                        > And now concerning Woodard's "Kodex W". . . Bruce and I first
                                        learned of
                                        > Woodard's theories a couple of years ago. The claims are wild, but
                                        we
                                        > agreed that such claims, regardless how unbelievable, ought not be
                                        > automatically rejected simply because they do not conform to our
                                        current
                                        > understanding of the manuscript. We had at our disposal the tools
                                        and
                                        > access necessary to examine these claims, so we decided to do so.
                                        We
                                        > were in contact with Lee Woodard by phone and by e-mail and we each
                                        had
                                        > a copy of his book. Becoming thus fully informed of his claims, we
                                        > examined high resolution images of the relevant parts of the codex
                                        and
                                        > were unable to substantiate any of Woodard's theories. Since this
                                        > examination, I have had opportunity to access the original at the
                                        Freer
                                        > Gallery and must still conclude that Woodard's ideas are without
                                        merit.
                                        >
                                        > Sincerely,
                                        >
                                        > T. A. Brown
                                        > Franconia, New Hampshire USA
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > mr.scrivener wrote:
                                        >
                                        > > --------------------
                                        > > Dear Mr. Brown:
                                        > >
                                        > > In this message (last year), you mentioned publishing
                                        transcriptions
                                        > > of Codex W, as well as a possible new Facsimile edition available
                                        on
                                        > > disk by the '2006 SBL Meetings..'. Well, its June 2006, and I was
                                        > > wondering how your projects are coming along.
                                        > >
                                        > > ----------------------
                                        > > Also, is anyone aware of the following website, which claims to
                                        have
                                        > > discovered 'seals' or 'signatures' of the scribes who wrote Codex
                                        W
                                        > > (the Gospel mss)?
                                        > >
                                        > > http://www.washington-codex.org/woodard_kodex_article_1.htm
                                        > > <http://www.washington-codex.org/woodard_kodex_article_1.htm>
                                        > >
                                        > > Although the site makes many wild claims, and dates the Gospel
                                        Codex
                                        > > W too early, surely just the existance of these 'seals' at the
                                        > > beginning and end of each gospel in the codex require a thorough
                                        > > investigation and proper explanation.
                                        > >
                                        > > Any ideas?
                                        > >
                                        > > Curiosity is killing me here...
                                        > > Eeyore
                                        > >
                                        > > ------------------------------
                                        >
                                      • Jack Kilmon
                                        ... From: Peter M. Head To: Sent: Wednesday, June 07, 2006 4:45 AM Subject: Re: [textualcriticism] Re:
                                        Message 19 of 26 , Jun 7, 2006
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          ----- Original Message -----
                                          From: "Peter M. Head" <pmh15@...>
                                          To: <textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com>
                                          Sent: Wednesday, June 07, 2006 4:45 AM
                                          Subject: Re: [textualcriticism] Re: Freer Gospels (W 032)


                                          > OED: Fantastic:
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > Existing only in imagination; proceeding merely from imagination;
                                          > fabulous, imaginary, unreal (obs.). b. In mod. use, of alleged
                                          > reasons, fears, etc.: Perversely or irrationally imagined.


                                          I think the word is used more often now in its colloquial shift meaning
                                          "excellent" or good beyond expectation.

                                          Jack Kilmon
                                        • Wieland Willker
                                          ... I think in Vaticanus it represents a correction. In Vaticanus also exists a wavy sign (vertical ~) which might indicate an explanation of some kind:
                                          Message 20 of 26 , Jun 8, 2006
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            Tommy Wasserman wrote:
                                            > 2) In some minuscule MSS there is a sign in the margin, •/•,
                                            > plus a reading.

                                            I think in Vaticanus it represents a correction.

                                            In Vaticanus also exists a wavy sign (vertical ~) which might indicate an explanation of some kind:
                                            http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/Vaticanus/dittographies.html
                                            (image on the right)

                                            Just for completeness sake, in Vaticanus also another sign appears once:
                                            http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/Vaticanus/wordorder.html


                                            Best wishes
                                            Wieland
                                            <><
                                            ------------------------------------------------
                                            Wieland Willker, Bremen, Germany
                                            mailto:willker@...-bremen.de
                                            http://www.uni-bremen.de/~wie
                                            Textcritical commentary:
                                            http://www.uni-bremen.de/~wie/TCG/index.html
                                          • Tommy Wasserman
                                            ... Thank you mr. scrivener (is that your real name?). Sorry I was not clear - the MS in question is a medieval Greek continuous-text minuscule with no other
                                            Message 21 of 26 , Jun 8, 2006
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              mr.scrivener wrote:

                                              >
                                              > Greetings Mr Wasserman:
                                              >
                                              > I have two leads for you:
                                              >
                                              > (1) the Jude inscription looks painfully like the Egyptian practice
                                              > found in 'Christian Magic' amulets and small scrolls.

                                              Thank you mr. scrivener (is that your real name?). Sorry I was not
                                              clear - the MS in question is a medieval Greek continuous-text
                                              minuscule with no other signs of "magic" use whatsoever, a subject of
                                              which I am otherwise quite familiar with.

                                              > I suggest you
                                              >
                                              > (2) Studying Vaticanus I have come to the conclusion that the 'NT'
                                              > Obelisk (the one you describe is a lemniscus =dot/dot)has a variety
                                              > of uses but mostly as a generic indicator of an accidental omission
                                              > corrected in the margin. there is a good introduction to the changes
                                              > in meaning over periods and places here:

                                              I found the following information about the symbol in "Transformed Into
                                              His Image" in Grace Theological Journal 2.2 (Fall 1981) 230-31 which
                                              made me hesitat to equal the function to that in the early uncials:

                                              A partial explanation of the symbol is given by Diogenes
                                              Laertius (iii, 66). He names and describes the use of various signs in a
                                              text of Plato; in regard to this sign he says: "the obelos
                                              periestigmenos is for random
                                              rejections (of passages)." Nowhere has ↓ been found among literary
                                              papyri of Classical
                                              authors.

                                              The use of both signs, however, is frequent in Biblical and
                                              Christian papyri. Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Vaticanus demonstrate
                                              the frequent use of both signs, sometimes together and sometimes
                                              separately, but always where a correction has been made. When
                                              used together, ↓ stands in the margin and •/•. marks the precise place
                                              in
                                              the line for the correction.

                                              Henry A. Sanders notes the use of •/•. in some biblical manuscripts
                                              dated to the fourth or early fifth century, marking the location
                                              of the omission and then repeated in the margin giving the words to
                                              be supplied.

                                              An exact parallel to P.Rob. inv. 28 is described in P. Tura, where ↓
                                              and •/•. stand together in the margin at the beginning of the part to be
                                              supplied.

                                              A somewhat later function of •/• is described by Isidore (A.D. 602-
                                              36), bishop of Seville (1.21): Lemniscus, id est, virgula inter geminos
                                              punctos jacens, opponitur in his locis, quae sacrae Scripturae
                                              interpretes
                                              eadem sensu, sed diversis sermonibus transtulerent, "The
                                              lemniscus, that is a stick lying between two points, is placed in those
                                              places which the interpreters of Holy Scriptures transcribe in the
                                              same sense, but with different expressions."

                                              end of citation

                                              With regards

                                              Tommy Wasserman
                                              Centre for Theology and Religious Studies
                                              Lund University
                                              Sweden
                                            • Timothy Arthur Brown
                                              Hello, The claims that Woodard makes are so numerous that a full response would require more attention than his ideas deserve. To answer you generally, some
                                              Message 22 of 26 , Jun 8, 2006
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                Hello,

                                                The claims that Woodard makes are so numerous that a full response would require more attention than his ideas deserve.  To answer you generally, some of what Woodard is seeing is offset, that is, ink which has cross-printed from the facing page; in other instances he is reading things into mere stains in the parchment; sometimes he's attributing special significance to the quite typical scribal decorations of a colophon; and he even finds minute hidden messages in the ragged shapes of letters that have suffered the effects of time and use.

                                                I hope it is clear that Bruce Prior and I investigated Woodard's claims because we feel responsible to consult secondary sources in our work and, for the sake of thoroughness, needed to make a careful, open-minded examination of Woodard's work as well.  As it turns out, Woodard's work proved unworthy of the time we invested in it.

                                                If you would like more detail, you could purchase Woodard's book (though I dislike the idea of giving him undue encouragement) and then purchase the new set of images which will hopefully be made available before the end of the year.  This will enable you to examine his claims yourself.

                                                Yours sincerely,

                                                T. A. Brown
                                                Franconia, New Hampshire  USA



                                                mr.scrivener wrote:

                                                Dear Mr. Brown:

                                                Thank you for your prompt reply:
                                                However, you seem to have left an ambiguity -
                                                Mr Woodward's ideas may be without merit,
                                                but are the marks just dust specks, imperfections in the photos,
                                                or actual scribal scribbles, whatever their meaning?
                                                Could you clarify?

                                                Still perplexed,
                                                Eeyore.

                                                --- In textualcriticism@ yahoogroups. com, Timothy Arthur Brown
                                                <t.a.brown@. ..> wrote:
                                                >
                                                > Hello,
                                                >
                                                > Bruce Prior and I are in the process of finishing up pre-press work
                                                on
                                                > the Freer Gospels transcription now. You can expect to see an
                                                edition
                                                > available at this year's SBL annual meeting in Washington, DC. The
                                                new
                                                > images I alluded to are, as far as I know, still intended for
                                                public
                                                > release this November as well. The newest images are those taken
                                                by the
                                                > Freer/Sackler photography department and I think it's safe to
                                                assume
                                                > that this image library will be published by the Freer/Sackler
                                                Gallery
                                                > itself.
                                                >
                                                > And now concerning Woodard's "Kodex W". . . Bruce and I first
                                                learned of
                                                > Woodard's theories a couple of years ago. The claims are wild, but
                                                we
                                                > agreed that such claims, regardless how unbelievable, ought not be
                                                > automatically rejected simply because they do not conform to our
                                                current
                                                > understanding of the manuscript. We had at our disposal the tools
                                                and
                                                > access necessary to examine these claims, so we decided to do so.
                                                We
                                                > were in contact with Lee Woodard by phone and by e-mail and we each
                                                had
                                                > a copy of his book. Becoming thus fully informed of his claims, we
                                                > examined high resolution images of the relevant parts of the codex
                                                and
                                                > were unable to substantiate any of Woodard's theories. Since this
                                                > examination, I have had opportunity to access the original at the
                                                Freer
                                                > Gallery and must still conclude that Woodard's ideas are without
                                                merit.
                                                >
                                                > Sincerely,
                                                >
                                                > T. A. Brown
                                                > Franconia, New Hampshire USA
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > mr.scrivener wrote:
                                                >
                                                > > ------------ --------
                                                > > Dear Mr. Brown:
                                                > >
                                                > > In this message (last year), you mentioned publishing
                                                transcriptions
                                                > > of Codex W, as well as a possible new Facsimile edition available
                                                on
                                                > > disk by the '2006 SBL Meetings..'. Well, its June 2006, and I was
                                                > > wondering how your projects are coming along.
                                                > >
                                                > > ------------ --------- -
                                                > > Also, is anyone aware of the following website, which claims to
                                                have
                                                > > discovered 'seals' or 'signatures' of the scribes who wrote Codex
                                                W
                                                > > (the Gospel mss)?
                                                > >
                                                > > http://www.washingt on-codex. org/woodard_ kodex_article_ 1.htm
                                                > > <http://www.washingt on-codex. org/woodard_ kodex_article_ 1.htm>
                                                > >
                                                > > Although the site makes many wild claims, and dates the Gospel
                                                Codex
                                                > > W too early, surely just the existance of these 'seals' at the
                                                > > beginning and end of each gospel in the codex require a thorough
                                                > > investigation and proper explanation.
                                                > >
                                                > > Any ideas?
                                                > >
                                                > > Curiosity is killing me here...
                                                > > Eeyore
                                                > >
                                                > > ------------ --------- ---------
                                                >


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