Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

3562Re: [textualcriticism] Re: Russian textual tradition variants in Jude

Expand Messages
  • Tommy Wasserman
    Dec 31, 1969
    • 0 Attachment
      Malcolm,

      for the record, the reference to Z is not a manuscript, but 2544Z means
      that the reading is present in 2544 and that it may be an additional
      reading (written in the margin or sometimes supralinearly).

      I do believe Jude is prior to 2 Peter. I devote one chapter in my
      dissertation to the subject. (And then comes a chapter on textual
      harmonization between the two letters.)

      And, finally, concerning v. 19 it seems to me that the Greek
      APODIORIZONTES (a hapax legomenon) understood as "separate" seem to
      demand the pronoun hEAUTOUS ("themselves") present in many MSS, and the
      additional emendation you refer to seems to provide a natural
      reference as to what they were separating themselves from (the unity of
      the faith, cf. v. 3). However, the verb without object can also be
      translated "cause division."

      With regards

      Tommy Wasserman

      4 mar 2008 kl. 01.22 skrev mjriii2003:

      > Dear Tommy,
      >
      > Thanks Tommy. I am aware of your doctoral efforts and their
      > circumference.
      >
      > Mss 2544 and Z would more closely resemble the Russian adverbial
      > rendering in the translation I have been reading.
      >
      > The harmonization from 2 Peter 2:16 seems probable. On another note,
      > I wonder, do you think Jude was written before or after 2 Peter?:-)
      >
      > I agree that the likelihood of other uncollated mss containing these
      > last two variants is slim, but I still can't come to the confidence
      > that the textual transmission is without a Vorlage for either, esp
      > since the testimony surrounding the efforts of Cyril and Methodius is
      > so sparce.
      >
      > Thanks again,
      >
      > Malcolm
      > _____________
      >
      > --- In textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com, Tommy Wasserman <tomwas@...>
      > wrote:
      > >
      > > Dear Malcolm,
      > >
      > > I should tell you that I collated all the Greek continuous-text
      > > manuscripts containing the Epistle of Jude, some 520 + ca. 40
      > > lectionaries, so there is little chance that there is anything
      > lying
      > > there in uncollated Greek manuscripts anyway.
      > >
      > > Now to the remaining two verses - thank you for providing an
      > English
      > > translation:
      > >
      > > v. 16: "dishonestly and lawlessly".
      > > This addition does reflect some Greek manuscripts that have the
      > > addition TH ASEBEIA KAI TH PARANOMIA (459 1838 1842 1846ZV); 467
      > reads
      > > TH ASEBEIA KAI PARANOMIA; 2544Z reads EN ASEBEIA KAI ANOMIA
      > >
      > > Z = correction or additional reading
      > > V = videtur
      > >
      > > The peculiar emendation was possibly influenced by the remotely
      > similar
      > > phrase in v. 18 where EPIQUMIA is further specified, and possibly
      > also
      > > by the passage in 2 Pet 2:16.
      > >
      > > v. 19: "from the unity of the faith"
      > > This addition I have not found in any Greek MSS.
      > >
      > > Good luck!
      > >
      > > Tommy Wasserman
      > >
      > >
      > > 3 mar 2008 kl. 15.57 skrev mjriii2003:
      > >
      > > > Dear Tommy,
      > > >
      > > > The words in question in the last to verses translate
      > > > respectively "dishonestly and lawlessly" and "from the unity of
      > the
      > > > faith."
      > > >
      > > > I see that I failed to pose my question clearly to begin with.
      > What
      > > > I was looking for was not the "known, already collated"
      > information
      > > > that NA27, you or NTTF would provide but perhaps a recent
      > collated
      > > > discovery not yet released.
      > > >
      > > > It still is my hunch that the glosses are explanatory and expland
      > > > upon the text's meaning itself. The Russian translation that I've
      > > > been reading deviates from the Synodal version in these and other
      > > > points.
      > > >
      > > > The shroud of darkness that still encircles the extent of the
      > Slavic
      > > > textual tradition was one of my main interests in this question
      > to
      > > > begin with. If these words are texually transmitted from earlier
      > > > Greek or Latin mss, then the proof is still pending, lying in the
      > > > still as yet remaining uncollated texts.
      > > >
      > > > Thanks again for your willingness to respond.
      > > >
      > > > Malcolm
      > > > ______________
      > > >
      > > > --- In textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com, Tommy Wasserman
      > <tomwas@>
      > > > wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > > Dear Malcolm,
      > > > >
      > > > > okay. Perhaps I also need an English translation! But I can try
      > > > with my
      > > > > limited knowledge of Slavic languages...
      > > > >
      > > > > v. 14, there are several witnesses that add AGGELWN to v. 14,
      > > > including
      > > > > some early, e.g., P72 01 044 et al. I see it as an explanatory
      > > > gloss.
      > > > > For an extensive comment, see my dissertation, The Epistle of
      > Jude:
      > > > Its
      > > > > Text and Transmission, p. 299-300.
      > > > >
      > > > > v. 15: Does "slovax" mean words? The insertion of LOGWN has
      > early
      > > > and
      > > > > widespread attestation, e.g., 01 04 33 81 1739 et al, see my
      > > > > dissertation p. 305-307.
      > > > >
      > > > > v. 16: Can you translate that in as literal English as
      > possible?
      > > > >
      > > > > v. 19: Can you translate this too?
      > > > >
      > > > > With regards
      > > > >
      > > > > Tommy
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > 1 mar 2008 kl. 20.47 skrev mjriii2003:
      > > > >
      > > > > > Ok Tommy, here's the transcription:
      > > > > >
      > > > > > vs 14 angelof
      > > > > > vs 15 slovax
      > > > > > vs 16 nechestivo i bezzakonno
      > > > > > vs 19 ot edinstva very
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Malcolm
      > > > > >
      > > > > > -----------
      > > > > >
      > > > > > --- In textualcriticism@yahoogroups.com, Tommy Wasserman
      > > > <tomwas@>
      > > > > > wrote:
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Dear Malcolm,
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > my problem is that I cannot see what you have written -
      > > > perhaps my
      > > > > > > e-mailsoftware does not support your font. Can you do a
      > > > > > transcription
      > > > > > > please and I will try to answer.
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > Tommy Wasserman
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > 28 feb 2008 kl. 17.39 skrev mjriii2003:
      > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > Greetings all,
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > My question is specific. Does anyone have knowledge of
      > any
      > > > Greek
      > > > > > or
      > > > > > > > Latin mss which contain the following explanatory words
      > in
      > > > the
      > > > > > epistle
      > > > > > > > of Jude:
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > Àíãåëîâ (vs 14)
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > ñëoâàõ (vs 15)
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > íå÷åñòèâî è áåççàêîííî (vs 16)
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > îò åäèíñòâà âåðû (vs 19)
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > Thanks,
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > > Malcolm
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > > >
      > > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > >
      >
      >
      >
    • Show all 13 messages in this topic