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Re: OT: [terrencemalick] Gender issues

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  • Christina Lui
    ... You proved my point with the Matthew Shepard example. So are you saying that since Shephard was murdered for being gay, men and women should conform to
    Message 1 of 89 , Sep 1, 2002
      On Thu, 29 Aug 2002, Angela Havel wrote:

      > > My approach is postmodern. Just because one is
      > > "biologically male"
      > > doesn't mean that one's identity is "masculine."
      >
      > Maybe so, but look at what happens to men who stray
      > from the norm, e.g. Matthew Shepard.

      You proved my point with the Matthew Shepard example. So are you saying
      that since Shephard was murdered for being gay, men and women should
      conform to gender laws or be prepared to pay the price?

      > It was those Greek philosophers who started the notion
      > that men only were worthy of formal academic
      > instruction, wasn't it?

      Plato actually says women, shock horror, can be philosopher kings and can,
      gasp, rule over men!

      > Yeah, women have been attending universities for about
      > 80 years now, so there's no stopping us there, but
      > there's still many areas where the unspoken rule is
      > that women are not welcome--certain military
      > establishments, for example.

      Yes, because gender laws dictate that men and women have different
      behaviour codes, should behave according to those codes and be punished
      when they violate them. Would you agree that the military is no place for
      a woman because it doesn't suit her "nature"?

      > We can discuss all we want about the social constructs
      > and theories, and I've read *Gender Trouble* by the
      > way, but I'm more interested in what really happens in
      > people's lives, day to day, regarding gender issues.

      Primarily I'm interested in talking about films on this list.

      Secondarily, I find the theory/practice divide worth deconstructing.
      Always. Theory can help us make sense of practice, practice can revise
      theory, theory is practice.

      I
      > find in my own life that when I display "masculine"
      > ways of thinking, speaking, and/or acting (and some of
      > this is just my normal personality, some of it is
      > probably a conscious bid to fit the masculine mold of
      > the achiever), it gets me labeled as a "dyke" by some
      > people. When people are name-calling in a knee-jerk
      > reaction like that, there's little respect for the
      > individual.

      I wouldn't respect people who call other people names, either.

      > Okay, this reiterates a point I believe that
      > Filippidis article "On Malick's Subjects" makes....

      Oh, does he now?

      > You mean by "gender law" the statement "Just because
      > one is
      > > 'biologically male'
      > > doesn't mean that one's identity is 'masculine'"?
      > (And vice versa).

      Nope. Gender laws dictate that men and women have separate norms of
      behaviour. A woman's place is in the home/kitchen/bedroom. A man's place
      is in the opposite. Etc. Most feminists are gender outlaws because they
      argue for the rights of men and women, but women particularly, to do
      whatever they want. Women want to study at university? Men want to take
      family leave at the office to take care of the new baby? Great.

      Okay, that's obvious, but I'm
      > particularly interested in revealing the problems that
      > arise when one doesn't choose to conform to their
      > biological gender's "rules". Instead of the academic
      > theories, I'd like to read actual case studies of men
      > and women who step out of their accepted gender roles
      > and what obstacles they encounter. It makes me want to
      > go back to college, research and write on it myself,
      > in fact. But then I don't have to go back to college
      > to do that, huh?

      No, you can just talk to your local librarian. I recommend the books of
      Cynthia Enloe because she writes about real cases, real work and real
      women in an international perspective: microelectronics women workers in
      Malaysia, sex trade workers in the Philippines.
    • cine-sin
      Christina wrote: Have I said how brilliant the score is for Signs? I wouldn t sit around and listen to it at home, but it s very effective and does quite a bit
      Message 89 of 89 , Sep 2, 2002
        Christina wrote:
        Have I said how brilliant the score is for Signs? I wouldn't sit
        around and listen to it at home, but it's very effective and does
        quite a bit of the work in the film.

        __________________________________________________________
        Rochelle says:

        I previously stated that I wouldn't sit around and listen to JNH's
        scores for 'Sixth Sense' and 'Unbreakable' on a whole sitting. I
        think I'll have another go.

        The score for 'Signs' is very goood and currently on its 3rd
        consecutive spin. The 'Hands of Fate' cues are absolutely stunning.

        Rochelle
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