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[Synoptic-L] jumbling things up

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  • Richard Richmond
    To all: Clinging to rigidity of thinking that the order of sayings or that a particular saying is unmovable to and in specific events in the Public Ministry of
    Message 1 of 1 , Jul 3, 2005
      To all:

      Clinging to rigidity of thinking that the order of
      sayings or that a particular saying is unmovable to
      and in specific events in the Public Ministry of Jesus
      is why the Synoptic Problem is yet unsolved. This is a
      naïve journalist approach to texts that are not
      photojournalistic. The evangelists were more fluid
      than modern researchers allow. They could jumble
      things up since that is licit as long as the original
      meaning of what Jesus said is not lost, twisted,
      obscured or radically altered giving it an altogether
      different one. It is because of this fluidity that we
      have 4 Gospels with varying versions since each wrote
      to a specific historical situation in the Church
      addressing their own issues and served as
      clarifications of what some mistook the text to mean
      that was written by their predecessor. Unfortunately,
      to modern eyes and minds each appears in conflict and
      contradiction to the other and so we have the Synoptic
      Problem, a misinterpretation of the very nature of the
      Gospels and total darkness on how they were written.

      John I am trying hard to see your logic here. Are we
      dealing with the texts of Matthew, Mark and Luke or
      not? I am not saying anything about what Jesus
      actually did or said. My only concern for this
      discussion is the evidence in hand for the texts of
      the three Synoptics as we have them. It is quite clear
      to me that Mark has not jumbled things up at all. I
      have looked at the text as any scientist would look at
      any ancient text. It is you who seem to jumble things
      up in this explanation. Mark is clear in his narration
      of events. An issue I addressed in the last post. You
      seem to be saying that I cannot read RABDOS as
      shepherd staff in spite of the fact that it was used
      in that very way in the very texts of the Greek Old
      Testament to which Mark connects his narrative. And in
      my last post I demonstrate the same sort of reaction
      response to the text of Mark where Luke has no
      counterpart text for you to say Mark has mirrored.
      Matthew must stand on its on merits against the text
      of Mark. If there is cogency or logic to this post for
      the comparison of the Synoptics it escapes me. If we
      were comparing redaction theories it would be
      different but we are not comparing redaction theories.
      We are comparing extant compilations of artifacts, our
      three Synoptic Gospels. I would posit that we have
      four Gospels because we had four groups that did not
      agree on the history, theology, and ritual involved in
      following Jesus. Again I say when their are many
      theories that present themselves the one less complex
      is usually the correct one. People disagree today,
      they disagreed two thousand years ago and it is safe
      to say they will disagree in the future. John says
      that Jesus carried his cross by himself, using the
      reflexive pronoun against the witness of the Synoptics
      which say that Simon of Cyrene helped him carry the
      cross. I think they disagree. And I do not feel the
      need to harmonize that for my theological ends. I
      cannot test evidence that does not exist. I have the
      Gospels and their source texts; those I can test
      against each other. I believe that doing so is an
      valid and necessary endeavor.


      Rick Richmond.

      Rick Richmond rickr2889@...

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