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displaying svg on IE after 12-31-08

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  • Fuliopen
    Hello, Majority of visitors to my web site are still using the IE browser. I ask them to download the ASV to their computers. I like to know that after 2008,
    Message 1 of 16 , Dec 30, 2008
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      Hello,

      Majority of visitors to my web site are still using the IE browser. I ask them to download the ASV to their computers. I like to know that after 2008, is the ASV still available for downloading? If not, what other technologies I can switch to? Thanks for information in this regard.

      fulio pen




      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Kenneth Nellis
      I believe that IE7 renders SVG. And, although Adobe is dropping support for ASV, I wonder if they will still offer it for download on their site. And, if not,
      Message 2 of 16 , Dec 30, 2008
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        I believe that IE7 renders SVG. And, although Adobe is dropping
        support for ASV, I wonder if they will still offer it for download on
        their site. And, if not, if they will allow others to distribute it.
        �Ken Nellis

        > displaying svg on IE after 12-31-08
        > Posted by: "Fuliopen" fuliopen@... fuliopen
        > Tue Dec 30, 2008 6:55 am (PST)
        >
        > Hello,
        >
        > Majority of visitors to my web site are still using the IE browser.
        > I ask them to download the ASV to their computers. I like to know
        > that after 2008, is the ASV still available for downloading? If
        > not, what other technologies I can switch to? Thanks for
        > information in this regard.
        >
        > fulio pen


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Jeff Schiller
        ... IE6 does not support SVG without a plugin. IE7 does not support SVG without a plugin. IE8 does not support SVG without a plugin. As far as I know, Adobe
        Message 3 of 16 , Dec 30, 2008
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          --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, Kenneth Nellis <nellisks@...>
          wrote:
          >
          > I believe that IE7 renders SVG. And, although Adobe is dropping
          > support for ASV, I wonder if they will still offer it for download on
          > their site. And, if not, if they will allow others to distribute it.
          > —Ken Nellis
          >

          IE6 does not support SVG without a plugin.
          IE7 does not support SVG without a plugin.
          IE8 does not support SVG without a plugin.

          As far as I know, Adobe will still leave the download up after 2008,
          but they will no longer support the Adobe SVG Viewer.

          There are other options in various states: Renesis, MozIE, Flex SVG
          Viewer.

          Regards,
          Jeff

          > > displaying svg on IE after 12-31-08
          > > Posted by: "Fuliopen" fuliopen@... fuliopen
          > > Tue Dec 30, 2008 6:55 am (PST)
          > >
          > > Hello,
          > >
          > > Majority of visitors to my web site are still using the IE browser.
          > > I ask them to download the ASV to their computers. I like to know
          > > that after 2008, is the ASV still available for downloading? If
          > > not, what other technologies I can switch to? Thanks for
          > > information in this regard.
          > >
          > > fulio pen
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
        • Guy Morton
          Tell them to stop using that piece of junk browser and start using something more secure and standards compliant, eg Firefox, Safari, Opera. Any of those is
          Message 4 of 16 , Dec 30, 2008
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            Tell them to stop using that piece of junk browser and start using
            something more secure and standards compliant, eg Firefox, Safari,
            Opera. Any of those is better than IE - by a long shot, and all render
            SVG (though supported features may vary from one to another).

            Guy


            On 31/12/2008, at 1:55 AM, Fuliopen wrote:

            > Hello,
            >
            > Majority of visitors to my web site are still using the IE browser.
            > I ask them to download the ASV to their computers. I like to know
            > that after 2008, is the ASV still available for downloading? If
            > not, what other technologies I can switch to? Thanks for
            > information in this regard.
            >
            > fulio pen
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > -----
            > To unsubscribe send a message to: svg-developers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            > -or-
            > visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/svg-developers and click "edit
            > my membership"
            > ----Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
          • Guy Morton
            By the way, it might interest all to know that based on recent stats for our web app, IE (all versions) has only 55% of the browser market these days. A few
            Message 5 of 16 , Dec 30, 2008
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              By the way, it might interest all to know that based on recent stats
              for our web app, IE (all versions) has only 55% of the browser market
              these days. A few years back it had 85%. I quote this because many
              people, it seems to me, are stuck on the idea that IE hold an
              unassailable position as the world's most used web browser, and
              therefore IE users are somehow right to use it and must be catered to.

              I say PHOOEY to that.

              The world is in fact moving away from IE in favour of Firefox (31% of
              the market) and Safari (10% of the market) so SVG is better supported
              these days than ever before. In fact, SVG is more accessible today
              than Silverlight, and if uptake of FF and Safari and Opera keeps
              increasing at the current rate that should continue to be the case.

              Guy


              On 31/12/2008, at 1:55 AM, Fuliopen wrote:

              > Hello,
              >
              > Majority of visitors to my web site are still using the IE browser.
              > I ask them to download the ASV to their computers. I like to know
              > that after 2008, is the ASV still available for downloading? If
              > not, what other technologies I can switch to? Thanks for
              > information in this regard.
              >
              > fulio pen
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              > ------------------------------------
              >
              > -----
              > To unsubscribe send a message to: svg-developers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              > -or-
              > visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/svg-developers and click "edit
              > my membership"
              > ----Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
              >
              >
            • richard.trigaux
              Hi all, statistics on which browser is actually used can vary very much and are often overinflated. For instance on a webcomic site I have 80%firefox, with IE
              Message 6 of 16 , Dec 31, 2008
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                Hi all,

                statistics on which browser is actually used can vary very much and
                are often overinflated.

                For instance on a webcomic site I have 80%firefox, with IE losing the
                second rank to Opera (IE in THIRD). But on other sites I have more
                classical ratios. On the reverse we have some sites which reject
                Opera users. So there is a clear relation with general politic
                opinions of people and the browser they use, people with advanced
                views supporting new browsers and more corporate-traditionnal minded
                people still supporting IE.

                Stats in Nov 2007, as noted by a script:
                Firefox 388 61%
                IE 192 30%
                Opera 22 3%
                Safari 29 3%

                Stats in Oct 2008
                Firefox 3475 56%
                Opera 1325 21%
                IE 937 15%
                Safari 412 7%

                On a webcomic site I would enjoy very much to welcome IE users with a
                "The browser you are using is obsolete and not standard compliant, so
                it is unable to display this site. Rather use firefox, Opera, etc."

                This would not be good on a commercial site however, where we must
                have to do with our client's ways. But why not "Please try this site
                with a standard compliant browser like Opera or Firefox, and see the
                difference"

                Just a little bemol for this however, so long as there is no support
                for basic functions like sound, download status bars, etc. Still
                waiting for Opera 10 to do so, and some day for the others.
              • Andreas Neumann
                luckily, IE is rapidly loosing marketshare: worlwide: 68% - http://marketshare.hitslink.com/browser-market- share.aspx?qprid=1 in Europe: much lower:
                Message 7 of 16 , Jan 1, 2009
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                  luckily, IE is rapidly loosing marketshare:

                  worlwide: 68% - http://marketshare.hitslink.com/browser-market-
                  share.aspx?qprid=1
                  in Europe: much lower:
                  http://derstandard.at/?url=/?id=1229975289416 (a well-known austrian
                  newspaper - IE is below 50%)
                  http://www.heise.de/newsticker/Marktanteil-von-Firefox-kratzt-an-
                  der-20-Prozent-Marke--/zoom/109877/0 - a well-known computer
                  magazine: IE is below 25%

                  In general the IE marketshare in Europe is much lower than in the US
                  and the rest of the world.

                  Andreas


                  --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, Fuliopen <fuliopen@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hello,
                  >
                  > Majority of visitors to my web site are still using the IE browser.
                  I ask them to download the ASV to their computers. I like to know
                  that after 2008, is the ASV still available for downloading? If not,
                  what other technologies I can switch to? Thanks for information in
                  this regard.
                  >
                  > fulio pen
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                • Fuliopen
                  I still have a question. Why does Adobe discontinue its support for SVG? Is maintenance of the plug-in too expensive, or SVG is defective? Thanks. fulio pen
                  Message 8 of 16 , Jan 1, 2009
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                    I still have a question. Why does Adobe discontinue its support for SVG? Is maintenance of the plug-in too expensive, or SVG is defective? Thanks.

                    fulio pen




                    ________________________________
                    From: Andreas Neumann <a.neumann@...>
                    To: svg-developers@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Thursday, January 1, 2009 9:48:50 AM
                    Subject: [svg-developers] Re: displaying svg on IE after 12-31-08


                    luckily, IE is rapidly loosing marketshare:

                    worlwide: 68% - http://marketshare. hitslink. com/browser- market-
                    share.aspx?qprid= 1
                    in Europe: much lower:
                    http://derstandard. at/?url=/ ?id=122997528941 6 (a well-known austrian
                    newspaper - IE is below 50%)
                    http://www.heise. de/newsticker/ Marktanteil- von-Firefox- kratzt-an-
                    der-20-Prozent- Marke--/zoom/ 109877/0 - a well-known computer
                    magazine: IE is below 25%

                    In general the IE marketshare in Europe is much lower than in the US
                    and the rest of the world.

                    Andreas

                    --- In svg-developers@ yahoogroups. com, Fuliopen <fuliopen@.. .> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hello,
                    >
                    > Majority of visitors to my web site are still using the IE browser.
                    I ask them to download the ASV to their computers. I like to know
                    that after 2008, is the ASV still available for downloading? If not,
                    what other technologies I can switch to? Thanks for information in
                    this regard.
                    >
                    > fulio pen
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >






                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Andreas Neumann
                    they simply do not have an interest in SVG at all - other than perhaps selling more authoring tools for SVG developers. The situation before or after
                    Message 9 of 16 , Jan 2, 2009
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                      they simply do not have an interest in SVG at all - other than
                      perhaps selling more authoring tools for SVG developers.

                      The situation before or after 2008-12-31 is more or less the same.
                      Before and after there was no support and further development.
                      Development more or less stopped back in 2001. Before they maybe
                      would have reacted to security related problems in ASV, after they do
                      not care at all.

                      People simply should forget about Adobe in terms of SVG support. With
                      the buy of Macromedia, management within Adobe changed a lot and they
                      see their future in binary only, proprietary formats. They don't
                      believe in the open nature of the web.

                      Andreas


                      --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, Fuliopen <fuliopen@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > I still have a question. Why does Adobe discontinue its support for
                      SVG? Is maintenance of the plug-in too expensive, or SVG is
                      defective? Thanks.
                      >
                      > fulio pen
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ________________________________
                      > From: Andreas Neumann <a.neumann@...>
                      > To: svg-developers@yahoogroups.com
                      > Sent: Thursday, January 1, 2009 9:48:50 AM
                      > Subject: [svg-developers] Re: displaying svg on IE after 12-31-08
                      >
                      >
                      > luckily, IE is rapidly loosing marketshare:
                      >
                      > worlwide: 68% - http://marketshare. hitslink. com/browser- market-
                      > share.aspx?qprid= 1
                      > in Europe: much lower:
                      > http://derstandard. at/?url=/ ?id=122997528941 6 (a well-known
                      austrian
                      > newspaper - IE is below 50%)
                      > http://www.heise. de/newsticker/ Marktanteil- von-Firefox- kratzt-
                      an-
                      > der-20-Prozent- Marke--/zoom/ 109877/0 - a well-known computer
                      > magazine: IE is below 25%
                      >
                      > In general the IE marketshare in Europe is much lower than in the
                      US
                      > and the rest of the world.
                      >
                      > Andreas
                      >
                      > --- In svg-developers@ yahoogroups. com, Fuliopen <fuliopen@ .>
                      wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Hello,
                      > >
                      > > Majority of visitors to my web site are still using the IE
                      browser.
                      > I ask them to download the ASV to their computers. I like to know
                      > that after 2008, is the ASV still available for downloading? If
                      not,
                      > what other technologies I can switch to? Thanks for information in
                      > this regard.
                      > >
                      > > fulio pen
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      > >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                    • richard.trigaux
                      ... SVG? Is maintenance of the plug-in too expensive, or SVG is defective? Thanks. ... Since they bought macromedia, the creator and owner of flash, they
                      Message 10 of 16 , Jan 2, 2009
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                        --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, Fuliopen <fuliopen@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > I still have a question. Why does Adobe discontinue its support for
                        SVG? Is maintenance of the plug-in too expensive, or SVG is
                        defective? Thanks.
                        >
                        > fulio pen


                        Since they bought macromedia, the creator and owner of flash, they
                        don't have any interest in supporting the SVG. If flash is replaced
                        by SVG, they lose a lucrative market of expensive flash authoring
                        tools. Seems that they do not have the idea od selling SVG authoring
                        tools...
                      • Frank Bruder
                        ... Is that so? Check out Yahoo Music internet radio. Last time I ve seen a list of supported browsers it only worked in MSIE. Right now I only get a your
                        Message 11 of 16 , Jan 2, 2009
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                          --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, "richard.trigaux"
                          <trigaux.richard@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          > This would not be good on a commercial site however, where we must
                          > have to do with our client's ways. But why not "Please try this site
                          > with a standard compliant browser like Opera or Firefox, and see the
                          > difference"
                          >

                          Is that so? Check out Yahoo Music internet radio. Last time I've seen
                          a list of supported browsers it only worked in MSIE. Right now I only
                          get a "your browser is not supported yet" message without a link to a
                          help page or a list of supported browsers, but I suppose it's still IE
                          only. Now they don't even tell users which browser could be used to
                          access the service. So what I'm saying is, whatever you do, at least
                          it can't be worse than that site.
                        • Fuliopen
                          I went to the following web page: http://www.adobe.com/svg/viewer/install/ It seems that ASV is no longer available for download. But if one has already
                          Message 12 of 16 , Jan 2, 2009
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                            I went to the following web page:

                            http://www.adobe.com/svg/viewer/install/

                            It seems that ASV is no longer available for download. But if one has already installed ASV to his computer, he is still able to view SVG. I like to make 100% sure on whether or not the ASV is still available for downloading. If not, I need to urge my visitors to switch to Firefox or Opera. The SVG files in my web site are important in presenting ideas.


                            Thanks for your help.
                            fulio pen


                            ________________________________
                            From: richard.trigaux <trigaux.richard@...>
                            To: svg-developers@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Friday, January 2, 2009 7:05:17 AM
                            Subject: [svg-developers] Re: displaying svg on IE after 12-31-08


                            --- In svg-developers@ yahoogroups. com, Fuliopen <fuliopen@.. .> wrote:
                            >
                            > I still have a question. Why does Adobe discontinue its support for
                            SVG? Is maintenance of the plug-in too expensive, or SVG is
                            defective? Thanks.
                            >
                            > fulio pen

                            Since they bought macromedia, the creator and owner of flash, they
                            don't have any interest in supporting the SVG. If flash is replaced
                            by SVG, they lose a lucrative market of expensive flash authoring
                            tools. Seems that they do not have the idea od selling SVG authoring
                            tools...






                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Guy Morton
                            You didn t look very hard. Try scrolling to the middle of the page...
                            Message 13 of 16 , Jan 2, 2009
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                              You didn't look very hard. Try scrolling to the middle of the page...


                              On 03/01/2009, at 9:58 AM, Fuliopen wrote:

                              > I went to the following web page:
                              >
                              > http://www.adobe.com/svg/viewer/install/
                              >
                              > It seems that ASV is no longer available for download. But if one
                              > has already installed ASV to his computer, he is still able to view
                              > SVG. I like to make 100% sure on whether or not the ASV is still
                              > available for downloading. If not, I need to urge my visitors to
                              > switch to Firefox or Opera. The SVG files in my web site are
                              > important in presenting ideas.
                              >
                              >
                              > Thanks for your help.
                              > fulio pen
                              >
                              >
                              > ________________________________
                              > From: richard.trigaux <trigaux.richard@...>
                              > To: svg-developers@yahoogroups.com
                              > Sent: Friday, January 2, 2009 7:05:17 AM
                              > Subject: [svg-developers] Re: displaying svg on IE after 12-31-08
                              >
                              >
                              > --- In svg-developers@ yahoogroups. com, Fuliopen <fuliopen@.. .>
                              > wrote:
                              >>
                              >> I still have a question. Why does Adobe discontinue its support for
                              > SVG? Is maintenance of the plug-in too expensive, or SVG is
                              > defective? Thanks.
                              >>
                              >> fulio pen
                              >
                              > Since they bought macromedia, the creator and owner of flash, they
                              > don't have any interest in supporting the SVG. If flash is replaced
                              > by SVG, they lose a lucrative market of expensive flash authoring
                              > tools. Seems that they do not have the idea od selling SVG authoring
                              > tools...
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              >
                              >
                              > ------------------------------------
                              >
                              > -----
                              > To unsubscribe send a message to: svg-developers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                              > -or-
                              > visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/svg-developers and click "edit
                              > my membership"
                              > ----Yahoo! Groups Links
                              >
                              >
                              >
                            • richard.trigaux
                              ... must ... site ... the ... seen ... only ... a ... IE ... It is even worse than that, many sites block specifically Opera, for a reason I don t know. And
                              Message 14 of 16 , Jan 2, 2009
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                                --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, "Frank Bruder" <redurbf@...>
                                wrote:
                                >
                                > --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, "richard.trigaux"
                                > <trigaux.richard@> wrote:
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > This would not be good on a commercial site however, where we
                                must
                                > > have to do with our client's ways. But why not "Please try this
                                site
                                > > with a standard compliant browser like Opera or Firefox, and see
                                the
                                > > difference"
                                > >
                                >
                                > Is that so? Check out Yahoo Music internet radio. Last time I've
                                seen
                                > a list of supported browsers it only worked in MSIE. Right now I
                                only
                                > get a "your browser is not supported yet" message without a link to
                                a
                                > help page or a list of supported browsers, but I suppose it's still
                                IE
                                > only. Now they don't even tell users which browser could be used to
                                > access the service. So what I'm saying is, whatever you do, at least
                                > it can't be worse than that site.
                                >

                                It is even worse than that, many sites block specifically Opera, for
                                a reason I don't know. And they don't tell the user, just display an
                                error. Tis problem is well knownd from the Opera staff, I found it on
                                ebay/paypal, Norton, and others. This is absurd, as these sites just
                                lose customers, with no reason. Because of this there is in Opera an
                                option "appear as MSIE" and poof the error disappears magically...

                                At least with my method the user is warned.

                                and on my sites, I allow any browser, just detect the browser to
                                correct its specific mistakes, and assume unknown browsers don't do
                                mistakes.
                              • veiko herne
                                I dont know sites that block opera, however lot of sites like www.ukmusic.com have javascript code that does not show up properly. Veiko
                                Message 15 of 16 , Jan 3, 2009
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                                  I dont know sites that block opera, however lot of sites like www.ukmusic.com have javascript code that does not show up properly.

                                  Veiko

                                  http://veikoh.wordpress.com


                                  --- On Sat, 1/3/09, richard.trigaux <trigaux.richard@...> wrote:

                                  > From: richard.trigaux <trigaux.richard@...>
                                  > Subject: [svg-developers] Re: displaying svg on IE after 12-31-08
                                  > To: svg-developers@yahoogroups.com
                                  > Date: Saturday, January 3, 2009, 7:16 AM
                                  > --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, "Frank
                                  > Bruder" <redurbf@...>
                                  > wrote:
                                  > >
                                  > > --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com,
                                  > "richard.trigaux"
                                  > > <trigaux.richard@> wrote:
                                  > > >
                                  > > >
                                  > > > This would not be good on a commercial site
                                  > however, where we
                                  > must
                                  > > > have to do with our client's ways. But why
                                  > not "Please try this
                                  > site
                                  > > > with a standard compliant browser like Opera or
                                  > Firefox, and see
                                  > the
                                  > > > difference"
                                  > > >
                                  > >
                                  > > Is that so? Check out Yahoo Music internet radio. Last
                                  > time I've
                                  > seen
                                  > > a list of supported browsers it only worked in MSIE.
                                  > Right now I
                                  > only
                                  > > get a "your browser is not supported yet"
                                  > message without a link to
                                  > a
                                  > > help page or a list of supported browsers, but I
                                  > suppose it's still
                                  > IE
                                  > > only. Now they don't even tell users which browser
                                  > could be used to
                                  > > access the service. So what I'm saying is,
                                  > whatever you do, at least
                                  > > it can't be worse than that site.
                                  > >
                                  >
                                  > It is even worse than that, many sites block specifically
                                  > Opera, for
                                  > a reason I don't know. And they don't tell the
                                  > user, just display an
                                  > error. Tis problem is well knownd from the Opera staff, I
                                  > found it on
                                  > ebay/paypal, Norton, and others. This is absurd, as these
                                  > sites just
                                  > lose customers, with no reason. Because of this there is in
                                  > Opera an
                                  > option "appear as MSIE" and poof the error
                                  > disappears magically...
                                  >
                                  > At least with my method the user is warned.
                                  >
                                  > and on my sites, I allow any browser, just detect the
                                  > browser to
                                  > correct its specific mistakes, and assume unknown browsers
                                  > don't do
                                  > mistakes.
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > ------------------------------------
                                  >
                                  > -----
                                  > To unsubscribe send a message to:
                                  > svg-developers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                  > -or-
                                  > visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/svg-developers and
                                  > click "edit my membership"
                                  > ----Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                • richard.trigaux
                                  ... www.ukmusic.com have javascript code that does not show up properly. ... They don t properly block Opera, but they send it unappropriate code, or errors
                                  Message 16 of 16 , Jan 3, 2009
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                                    --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, veiko herne <veiko_h@...>
                                    wrote:
                                    >
                                    > I dont know sites that block opera, however lot of sites like
                                    www.ukmusic.com have javascript code that does not show up properly.
                                    >
                                    > Veiko
                                    >
                                    > http://veikoh.wordpress.com
                                    >
                                    They don't properly block Opera, but they send it unappropriate
                                    code, or errors messages, so that the result is the same. I had the
                                    problem in coming to paypal from an Ebay page. Not a good idea,
                                    though, as opera users are warned, and they think it is the site
                                    which is wrong, not the browser. Although on Norton payment form,
                                    they say "your browser is not safe". But with IE I don't have this
                                    message...
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