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Re: [svg-developers] Corel Smart Graphics Studio: what do you think?

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  • AndrewWatt2001@aol.com
    In a message dated 31/05/2003 22:35:22 GMT Daylight Time, ... Russ, It s been a few months now since I first used SG Studio. ... SG Studio is a useful tool. In
    Message 1 of 11 , Jun 1, 2003
      In a message dated 31/05/2003 22:35:22 GMT Daylight Time,
      rchaffin@... writes:

      > Has anyone downloaded and used Corel's new IDE called Smart Graphics
      > Studio?

      Russ,

      It's been a few months now since I first used SG Studio.

      > What do you think about this product?

      SG Studio is a useful tool. In my view it's the best tool currently publicly
      available for creating SVG which is "data driven". It's certainly the best
      tool that I have seen.

      It's designed to make SVG accessible to those who aren't necessarily fully up
      to speed with all of SVG 1.0. And, in my view, it does a good job of that.

      Being a novice in the > SVG world, I'm seriously thinking of buying this
      > product if it helps
      > me to learn and develop SVG applications faster.

      It's probably quite a useful tool to help you learn SVG, although it isn't
      primarily designed as a learning tool. When you add a new SVG element in the
      Document Tree, for example, you can see the commonly used attributes for that
      element in the Attributes window. That can quickly give you a good feel for the
      basic characteristics of the commonly used SVG elements. If you want a complete
      list of attributes for an element then you can toggle that view on in the
      Attribute window too.

      It has a basic but decent code editor. Personally I would like code
      highlighting of errors in the code editor, which isn't there in version 1.0. But the
      code that SG Studio produces for simple graphics is very clean. I would also
      like to see, in version 2.0, a tabbed interface to the viewer and the code
      editor, like the interface in Jasc's WebDraw. I find that a really helpful way to
      work. The collapsible Code Editor isn't bad, but not quite so elegant in my
      view.

      There are a few bugs in SG Studio, which impact when you hand code. For
      example, if you add style to a <text> element in the Code Editor then the text is
      displayed correctly but the Attributes window doesn't update.

      In my experience SG Studio is stable. I haven't experienced any crashes.

      SG Studio doesn't cover all of SVG - only those parts that seemed to Corel
      most likely to be useful to dynamic data-driven graphics. [If somebody added
      more of SVG than I realised was in there, then I apologise. :) ]

      As someone else mentioned in another reply to your question you might not
      want to use SG Studio to create all your SVG. You might use CorelDraw 11 or a CAD
      package or (soon) Visio 2003 or whatever to produce the SVG diagram(s). Then
      use SG Studio to add the dynamic stuff and the data driven stuff afterwards.

      The help files for SG Studio are, in my view, pretty good. There are also
      quite a number of tutorials etc online which you can download. So if you work
      through all that material it will give you a pretty healthy start.

      I found the Process Builder took a bit of getting used to when I first saw
      it. But if you are using it regularly it begins to become second nature.

      There is also a newsgroup for users of SG Studio.
      news server: cnews.corel.com (I hope I remembered it correctly)
      newsgroup: corel.enterprise.smartgraphics

      I don't think the newsgroup has been publicly announced yet but quite a few
      Corel staff have already posted responses to questions posted there, so you
      should be able to get good support there, I expect.

      Does anyone have any > valid reason why I shouldn't? (besides being a
      > windows-only platform)
      >

      I don't know of any reason why you should avoid buying SG Studio. That
      assumes that you have already made a decision to use SVG which is dynamic and data
      driven. Yes, most/all of what SG Studio does *can* be hand coded. SG Studio
      makes the whole process less demanding for those developers who are not already
      familiar with SVG, JavaScript and data access.

      I hope that helps.

      Andrew Watt

      > Thanks for your input!
      >
      > Russ Chaffin
      > Regional Web Manager
      > USDA Forest Service, Southern Region
      > Atlanta, GA
      >

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • neumannandreas
      To be honest - I did not have enough time yet to give it a thourough testing. But it seems very promising. Esp. issues like the complex GUI-elements are very
      Message 2 of 11 , Jun 2, 2003
        To be honest - I did not have enough time yet to give it a thourough
        testing.

        But it seems very promising. Esp. issues like the complex GUI-elements
        are very interesting (selection lists, sliders, etc.) - Also the
        concepts of the query builder seem to be very powerful.

        While this tool is of course not aimed at designers (CorelDRAW,
        Designer or Adobe Illustrator help for that), it looks very useful to
        design and implement SVG based webservices.

        When they presented a first, rough prototype at last year's SVG.Open
        conference in Zurich, I thought - yes, this is the tool that would
        help experienced SVG developers to speed up their development. And it
        still looks like that.

        I am thinking about buying it and using it for teaching at our
        institute.

        I only hope that they will better integrate with Linux/Unix, Apache,
        MySQL/PostgreSQL and Perl/PHP in the future. This is the
        infrastructure that about two thirds of the webservers in the world
        have at hand. I hope Corel won't ignore that fact. But yes, supporting
        .net is not bad either, .net/c# seems to be an elegant platform, even
        more if it will be available on Linux with the Mono project.

        Andreas

        PS: I will give more feedback on Corel Smart Graphics, after I have
        more experience working with it.

        --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, "Russell Chaffin" <rchaffin@m..
        .> wrote:
        > Has anyone downloaded and used Corel's new IDE called Smart Graphics
        > Studio? What do you think about this product? Being a novice in the
        > SVG world, I'm seriously thinking of buying this product if it helps
        > me to learn and develop SVG applications faster. Does anyone have
        any
        > valid reason why I shouldn't? (besides being a windows-only
        platform)
        >
        > Thanks for your input!
        >
        > Russ Chaffin
        > Regional Web Manager
        > USDA Forest Service, Southern Region
        > Atlanta, GA
      • rjwilliam2000
        Re the Server (from Corel), The Smart Graphics Platform is actually completely open so we do not force anyone to deploy any of the parts they don t deem core
        Message 3 of 11 , Jun 2, 2003
          Re the Server (from Corel),

          The Smart Graphics Platform is actually completely open so we do not
          force anyone to deploy any of the parts they don't deem core to thier
          enterprise/government IT goals.

          Briefly
          -Any viewer will do. All of the dSVG elements have been tested in
          ASV and CSV. If you want one point of tech support then our viewer
          is a better choice.
          -Any environment for producing native SVG assets will do (just be
          careful of proprietary elements introduced into the SVG OR cut them
          out in notepad)
          -Corel Developer SG outputs 2 XSLT files and an assembly file. So,
          if you are able to set the inputs up in any environment then you can
          deploy on the server of your choice. I would be happy to get anyone
          in touch with our support to learn how to do this.
          - The only part that you will not be able to take advantage of is
          Process Builder. This component will reduce your time and effort
          versus writing ASP by tenfold at a minimum. However, for those who
          want to code - code away!

          AND finally, please feel free to contact me directly at any time. I
          cannot discuss product plans (including server platforms) under
          development. We may already support the server you want to deploy to
          but are not yet ready to release it commercially.

          Thanks,
          -Rob Williamson
          Product Manager, Corel Smart Graphics Studio
          613-728-0826x1960









          --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, "Ronan Oger" <ronan@r...>
          wrote:
          > Don't you need the Smart Graphics Server to generate the smart
          (data-driven)
          > graphics?
          >
          > The Smart Graphics Server specification says that it requires a MS
          IIS
          > webserver. This may be a problem for many people unable or
          unwilling to
          > purchase MS products for their core web infrastructure.
          >
          > Ronan
          >
          > >-----Original Message-----
          > >From: Rick Bullotta [mailto:Rick.Bullotta@l...]
          > >Sent: Sunday, June 01, 2003 1:02 PM
          > >To: svg-developers@yahoogroups.com
          > >Subject: Re: [svg-developers] Corel Smart Graphics Studio: what do
          you
          > >think?
          > >
          > >
          > >It is also important to note that Smart Graphics is not intended
          > >to be the exclusive or even primary drawing/authoring environment
          > >for your SVG Graphics. This is where Corel Draw and Designer are
          > >targeted. Rather, it is intended to "bring the SVG to life" by
          > >adding UI controls, dynamic behaviors, and data-driven behaviors.
          > >
          > >---- svg-developers@yahoogroups.com wrote:
          > >> Russell,
          > >>
          > >> I've received a review copy of Smart Graphics from Corel. I'm
          > >still trying
          > >> to understand it all -- it's a very rich platform, but it is also
          > >> extraordinarily complex. I hope to have a review of it
          > >> for builder.com within a few days, and will forward it to the
          group.
          > >>
          > >> -- Kurt
          > >> ----- Original Message -----
          > >> From: "Russell Chaffin" <rchaffin@m...>
          > >> To: <svg-developers@yahoogroups.com>
          > >> Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2003 2:34 PM
          > >> Subject: [svg-developers] Corel Smart Graphics Studio: what do
          you think?
          > >>
          > >>
          > >> > Has anyone downloaded and used Corel's new IDE called Smart
          Graphics
          > >> > Studio? What do you think about this product? Being a novice
          in the
          > >> > SVG world, I'm seriously thinking of buying this product if it
          helps
          > >> > me to learn and develop SVG applications faster. Does anyone
          have any
          > >> > valid reason why I shouldn't? (besides being a windows-only
          platform)
          > >> >
          > >> > Thanks for your input!
          > >> >
          > >> > Russ Chaffin
          > >> > Regional Web Manager
          > >> > USDA Forest Service, Southern Region
          > >> > Atlanta, GA
          > >> >
          > >> >
          > >> >
          > >> > -----
          > >> > To unsubscribe send a message to:
          > >> svg-developers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          > >> > -or-
          > >> > visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/svg-developers and
          click "edit my
          > >> membership"
          > >> > ----
          > >> >
          > >> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          > > >
          > > >
          > > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > -----
          > > To unsubscribe send a message to:
          > svg-developers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          > > -or-
          > > visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/svg-developers and
          click "edit my
          > membership"
          > > ----
          > >
          > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          > -----
          > To unsubscribe send a message to: svg-developers-
          unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          > -or-
          > visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/svg-developers and click "edit
          my
          > membership"
          > ----
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        • Robin Berjon
          ... How complex is the assembly file? You make it sound like it would be trivial to make SG work in AxKit (and I guess Cocoon, though it s quite a bit less
          Message 4 of 11 , Jun 2, 2003
            rjwilliam2000 wrote:
            > Re the Server (from Corel),
            >
            > Briefly
            > -Corel Developer SG outputs 2 XSLT files and an assembly file. So,
            > if you are able to set the inputs up in any environment then you can
            > deploy on the server of your choice. I would be happy to get anyone
            > in touch with our support to learn how to do this.

            How complex is the assembly file? You make it sound like it would be trivial to
            make SG work in AxKit (and I guess Cocoon, though it's quite a bit less flexible).

            > - The only part that you will not be able to take advantage of is
            > Process Builder. This component will reduce your time and effort
            > versus writing ASP by tenfold at a minimum.

            Cool, but then what would not? ;)

            --
            Robin Berjon <robin.berjon@...>
            Research Engineer, Expway http://expway.fr/
            7FC0 6F5F D864 EFB8 08CE 8E74 58E6 D5DB 4889 2488
          • Russell Chaffin
            Yes, of course. I m thinking of investing in CorelDRAW as opposed to purchasing Illustrator. I currently and older version of Freehand. Most of the reviews
            Message 5 of 11 , Jun 2, 2003
              Yes, of course. I'm thinking of investing in CorelDRAW as opposed to
              purchasing Illustrator. I currently and older version of Freehand.
              Most of the reviews I've read seem to indicate that CorelDraw is more
              user-friendly and intuitive to use than Adobe's or Macromedia's
              product. And it also seems that CorelDRAW 11 has more support for SVG
              format than Freehand (maybe at least for now).

              Corel seems to be betting their future on XML-based applications like
              SVG, so I would expect rather strong support for their SVG products,
              especially since they now have the lead in developing this IDE.

              Russ Chaffin
              Regional Web Manager
              USDA Forest Service, Southern Region
              Atlanta, GA



              --- In svg-developers@yahoogroups.com, Rick Bullotta
              <Rick.Bullotta@l...> wrote:
              > It is also important to note that Smart Graphics is not intended to
              be the exclusive or even primary drawing/authoring environment for
              your SVG Graphics. This is where Corel Draw and Designer are
              targeted. Rather, it is intended to "bring the SVG to life" by
              adding UI controls, dynamic behaviors, and data-driven behaviors.
              >
              > ---- svg-developers@yahoogroups.com wrote:
              > > Russell,
              > >
              > > I've received a review copy of Smart Graphics from Corel. I'm
              still trying
              > > to understand it all -- it's a very rich platform, but it is also
              > > extraordinarily complex. I hope to have a review of it
              > > for builder.com within a few days, and will forward it to the
              group.
              > >
              > > -- Kurt
              > > ----- Original Message -----
              > > From: "Russell Chaffin" <rchaffin@m...>
              > > To: <svg-developers@yahoogroups.com>
              > > Sent: Saturday, May 31, 2003 2:34 PM
              > > Subject: [svg-developers] Corel Smart Graphics Studio: what do
              you think?
              > >
              > >
              > > > Has anyone downloaded and used Corel's new IDE called Smart
              Graphics
              > > > Studio? What do you think about this product? Being a novice in
              the
              > > > SVG world, I'm seriously thinking of buying this product if it
              helps
              > > > me to learn and develop SVG applications faster. Does anyone
              have any
              > > > valid reason why I shouldn't? (besides being a windows-only
              platform)
              > > >
              > > > Thanks for your input!
              > > >
              > > > Russ Chaffin
              > > > Regional Web Manager
              > > > USDA Forest Service, Southern Region
              > > > Atlanta, GA
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > -----
              > > > To unsubscribe send a message to:
              > > svg-developers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              > > > -or-
              > > > visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/svg-developers and
              click "edit my
              > > membership"
              > > > ----
              > > >
              > > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
              http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > -----
              > > To unsubscribe send a message to: svg-developers-
              unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              > > -or-
              > > visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/svg-developers and
              click "edit my membership"
              > > ----
              > >
              > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
              http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
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