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Re: Strange problem with embedded SVG + ...

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  • jterheijden
    Hi. I m not an expert on all this, but I notices a double ... Maybe this works?: function track(evt) {
    Message 1 of 9 , Jun 3, 2002
      Hi. I'm not an expert on all this, but I notices a double <body>...
      Maybe this works?:

      <html>
      <head>
      <script language="javascript">
      function track(evt)
      {
      divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
      }
      </script>
      </head>
      <body>
      <table border=1>
      <tr>
      <td>
      <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300" type="image/svg-xml"
      src="rect.svg">
      </td>
      </tr>
      <tr>
      <td>
      <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
      </td>
      </tr>
      </table>
      </body>
      </html>

      This might be stupid...

      - John van Terheijden

      --- In svg-developers@y..., "Graeme Coutts" <gecoutts@r...> wrote:
      > I am experiencing a problem when I <embed> an SVG file. This is
      most likely
      > not an SVG issue, maybe a IE HTML thing but I think that some
      SVGers could
      > help.
      >
      > I have a simple SVG file which triggers the mousemove event. The
      idea is to
      > display the client coords to the user:
      >
      > <?xml version="1.0"?>
      > <svg width="100%" height="100%" onmousemove="track(evt)">
      > <rect x="0" y="0" height="100%" width="100%" fill="red"/>
      > </svg>
      >
      > First look at this HTML file:
      >
      > <html>
      > <body>
      > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300" type="image/svg-xml"
      > src="rect.svg">
      > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
      > <body>
      > <script language="javascript">
      > function track(evt)
      > {
      > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
      > }
      > </script>
      > </html>
      >
      > Everything works great with the cursor position being displayed
      real-time to
      > the user. Now I wish to add a <table> element to neatly format the
      <embed>
      > and <div>:
      >
      > <html>
      > <body>
      > <table border=1>
      > <tr>
      > <td>
      > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300"
      type="image/svg-xml"
      > src="rect.svg">
      > </td>
      > </tr>
      > <tr>
      > <td>
      > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
      > </td>
      > </tr>
      > </table>
      > <body>
      > <script language="javascript">
      > function track(evt)
      > {
      > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
      > }
      > </script>
      > </html>
      >
      > You will now notice that the real-time tracking is lost. The
      coordinates are
      > only updated when the mouse leaves the SVG area. However to test to
      see if
      > the track is being called I added the following line to the track
      function:
      >
      > window.status = "evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
      >
      > This will show that the track is being called as the browser status
      bar
      > correctly shows the cursor position. So when we wrap the <embed>
      and <div>
      > with a <table> this introduces this strange problem. I am using
      IE6, ASV3,
      > Windows2000.
      >
      > Anyone care to explain this?
      >
      >
      > Gec.
    • Michael Bierman
      As an aside, the mime type should be type= image/svg+xml . Are you trying to display the mouse coordinates in HTML? Why not display them in SVG as well? I am
      Message 2 of 9 , Jun 3, 2002
        As an aside, the mime type should be type="image/svg+xml".

        Are you trying to display the mouse coordinates in HTML? Why not display
        them in SVG as well? I am thinking along the lines of
        http://www.adobe.com/svg/demos/drag.html

        Michael

        > -----Original Message-----
        > From: jterheijden [mailto:john@...]
        > Sent: Monday, June 03, 2002 1:26 PM
        > To: svg-developers@yahoogroups.com
        > Subject: [svg-developers] Re: Strange problem with embedded SVG +
        > <table>...
        >
        >
        > Hi. I'm not an expert on all this, but I notices a double <body>...
        > Maybe this works?:
        >
        > <html>
        > <head>
        > <script language="javascript">
        > function track(evt)
        > {
        > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
        > }
        > </script>
        > </head>
        > <body>
        > <table border=1>
        > <tr>
        > <td>
        > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300" type="image/svg-xml"
        > src="rect.svg">
        > </td>
        > </tr>
        > <tr>
        > <td>
        > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
        > </td>
        > </tr>
        > </table>
        > </body>
        > </html>
        >
        > This might be stupid...
        >
        > - John van Terheijden
        >
        > --- In svg-developers@y..., "Graeme Coutts" <gecoutts@r...> wrote:
        > > I am experiencing a problem when I <embed> an SVG file. This is
        > most likely
        > > not an SVG issue, maybe a IE HTML thing but I think that some
        > SVGers could
        > > help.
        > >
        > > I have a simple SVG file which triggers the mousemove event. The
        > idea is to
        > > display the client coords to the user:
        > >
        > > <?xml version="1.0"?>
        > > <svg width="100%" height="100%" onmousemove="track(evt)">
        > > <rect x="0" y="0" height="100%" width="100%" fill="red"/>
        > > </svg>
        > >
        > > First look at this HTML file:
        > >
        > > <html>
        > > <body>
        > > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300" type="image/svg-xml"
        > > src="rect.svg">
        > > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
        > > <body>
        > > <script language="javascript">
        > > function track(evt)
        > > {
        > > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
        > > }
        > > </script>
        > > </html>
        > >
        > > Everything works great with the cursor position being displayed
        > real-time to
        > > the user. Now I wish to add a <table> element to neatly format the
        > <embed>
        > > and <div>:
        > >
        > > <html>
        > > <body>
        > > <table border=1>
        > > <tr>
        > > <td>
        > > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300"
        > type="image/svg-xml"
        > > src="rect.svg">
        > > </td>
        > > </tr>
        > > <tr>
        > > <td>
        > > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
        > > </td>
        > > </tr>
        > > </table>
        > > <body>
        > > <script language="javascript">
        > > function track(evt)
        > > {
        > > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
        > > }
        > > </script>
        > > </html>
        > >
        > > You will now notice that the real-time tracking is lost. The
        > coordinates are
        > > only updated when the mouse leaves the SVG area. However to test to
        > see if
        > > the track is being called I added the following line to the track
        > function:
        > >
        > > window.status = "evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
        > >
        > > This will show that the track is being called as the browser status
        > bar
        > > correctly shows the cursor position. So when we wrap the <embed>
        > and <div>
        > > with a <table> this introduces this strange problem. I am using
        > IE6, ASV3,
        > > Windows2000.
        > >
        > > Anyone care to explain this?
        > >
        > >
        > > Gec.
      • honnen_martin
        ... most likely ... SVGers could ... idea is to ... You need a closing not a opening one. And consider defining a section and putting the
        Message 3 of 9 , Jun 3, 2002
          --- In svg-developers@y..., "Graeme Coutts" <gecoutts@r...> wrote:
          > I am experiencing a problem when I <embed> an SVG file. This is
          most likely
          > not an SVG issue, maybe a IE HTML thing but I think that some
          SVGers could
          > help.
          >
          > I have a simple SVG file which triggers the mousemove event. The
          idea is to
          > display the client coords to the user:
          >
          > <?xml version="1.0"?>
          > <svg width="100%" height="100%" onmousemove="track(evt)">
          > <rect x="0" y="0" height="100%" width="100%" fill="red"/>
          > </svg>
          >
          > First look at this HTML file:
          >
          > <html>
          > <body>
          > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300" type="image/svg-xml"
          > src="rect.svg">
          > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
          > <body>

          You need a closing </body> not a opening one.
          And consider defining a <head> section and putting the <script> into
          that head.

          > <script language="javascript">
          > function track(evt)
          > {
          > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
          > }
          > </script>
          > </html>
          >
          > Everything works great with the cursor position being displayed
          real-time to
          > the user. Now I wish to add a <table> element to neatly format the
          <embed>
          > and <div>:
          >
          > <html>
          > <body>
          > <table border=1>
          > <tr>
          > <td>
          > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300"
          type="image/svg-xml"
          > src="rect.svg">
          > </td>
          > </tr>
          > <tr>
          > <td>
          > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
          > </td>
          > </tr>
          > </table>
          > <body>

          Again you have a opening <body> where you should have a closing
          </body>
          > <script language="javascript">
          > function track(evt)
          > {
          > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
          > }
          > </script>
          > </html>
          >
          > You will now notice that the real-time tracking is lost. The
          coordinates are
          > only updated when the mouse leaves the SVG area. However to test
          to see if
          > the track is being called I added the following line to the track
          function:
          >
          > window.status = "evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
          >
          > This will show that the track is being called as the browser
          status bar
          > correctly shows the cursor position. So when we wrap the <embed>
          and <div>
          > with a <table> this introduces this strange problem. I am using
          IE6, ASV3,
          > Windows2000.
          >
          > Anyone care to explain this?
          >
          >
          > Gec.
        • Graeme Coutts
          Sorry the second body was a typing error...should read Gec. ... From: jterheijden To: Sent: Monday,
          Message 4 of 9 , Jun 3, 2002
            Sorry the second body was a typing error...should read </body>

            Gec.

            ----- Original Message -----
            From: "jterheijden" <john@...>
            To: <svg-developers@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Monday, June 03, 2002 11:25 PM
            Subject: [svg-developers] Re: Strange problem with embedded SVG + <table>...


            > Hi. I'm not an expert on all this, but I notices a double <body>...
            > Maybe this works?:
            >
            > <html>
            > <head>
            > <script language="javascript">
            > function track(evt)
            > {
            > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
            > }
            > </script>
            > </head>
            > <body>
            > <table border=1>
            > <tr>
            > <td>
            > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300" type="image/svg-xml"
            > src="rect.svg">
            > </td>
            > </tr>
            > <tr>
            > <td>
            > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
            > </td>
            > </tr>
            > </table>
            > </body>
            > </html>
            >
            > This might be stupid...
            >
            > - John van Terheijden
            >
            > --- In svg-developers@y..., "Graeme Coutts" <gecoutts@r...> wrote:
            > > I am experiencing a problem when I <embed> an SVG file. This is
            > most likely
            > > not an SVG issue, maybe a IE HTML thing but I think that some
            > SVGers could
            > > help.
            > >
            > > I have a simple SVG file which triggers the mousemove event. The
            > idea is to
            > > display the client coords to the user:
            > >
            > > <?xml version="1.0"?>
            > > <svg width="100%" height="100%" onmousemove="track(evt)">
            > > <rect x="0" y="0" height="100%" width="100%" fill="red"/>
            > > </svg>
            > >
            > > First look at this HTML file:
            > >
            > > <html>
            > > <body>
            > > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300" type="image/svg-xml"
            > > src="rect.svg">
            > > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
            > > <body>
            > > <script language="javascript">
            > > function track(evt)
            > > {
            > > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
            > > }
            > > </script>
            > > </html>
            > >
            > > Everything works great with the cursor position being displayed
            > real-time to
            > > the user. Now I wish to add a <table> element to neatly format the
            > <embed>
            > > and <div>:
            > >
            > > <html>
            > > <body>
            > > <table border=1>
            > > <tr>
            > > <td>
            > > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300"
            > type="image/svg-xml"
            > > src="rect.svg">
            > > </td>
            > > </tr>
            > > <tr>
            > > <td>
            > > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
            > > </td>
            > > </tr>
            > > </table>
            > > <body>
            > > <script language="javascript">
            > > function track(evt)
            > > {
            > > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
            > > }
            > > </script>
            > > </html>
            > >
            > > You will now notice that the real-time tracking is lost. The
            > coordinates are
            > > only updated when the mouse leaves the SVG area. However to test to
            > see if
            > > the track is being called I added the following line to the track
            > function:
            > >
            > > window.status = "evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
            > >
            > > This will show that the track is being called as the browser status
            > bar
            > > correctly shows the cursor position. So when we wrap the <embed>
            > and <div>
            > > with a <table> this introduces this strange problem. I am using
            > IE6, ASV3,
            > > Windows2000.
            > >
            > > Anyone care to explain this?
            > >
            > >
            > > Gec.
            >
            >
            >
            > -----
            > To unsubscribe send a message to:
            svg-developers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            > -or-
            > visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/svg-developers and click "edit my
            membership"
            > ----
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
            >
            >
          • Graeme Coutts
            Thanks for the mime correction. Yes I am trying to to display the mouse coordinates in HTML. My plan was to eventually show the mouse coordinates of both the
            Message 5 of 9 , Jun 3, 2002
              Thanks for the mime correction.

              Yes I am trying to to display the mouse coordinates in HTML. My plan was to
              eventually show the mouse coordinates of both the ASV client and the SVG
              canvas (world). I had not considered using SVG to display the resultant
              coordinates and I guess that this would circumvent my problem.

              Still be nice to understand my problem with HTML though...

              Gec.


              ----- Original Message -----
              From: "Michael Bierman" <mbier@...>
              To: <svg-developers@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Monday, June 03, 2002 11:47 PM
              Subject: RE: [svg-developers] Re: Strange problem with embedded SVG +
              <table>...


              > As an aside, the mime type should be type="image/svg+xml".
              >
              > Are you trying to display the mouse coordinates in HTML? Why not display
              > them in SVG as well? I am thinking along the lines of
              > http://www.adobe.com/svg/demos/drag.html
              >
              > Michael
              >
              > > -----Original Message-----
              > > From: jterheijden [mailto:john@...]
              > > Sent: Monday, June 03, 2002 1:26 PM
              > > To: svg-developers@yahoogroups.com
              > > Subject: [svg-developers] Re: Strange problem with embedded SVG +
              > > <table>...
              > >
              > >
              > > Hi. I'm not an expert on all this, but I notices a double <body>...
              > > Maybe this works?:
              > >
              > > <html>
              > > <head>
              > > <script language="javascript">
              > > function track(evt)
              > > {
              > > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
              > > }
              > > </script>
              > > </head>
              > > <body>
              > > <table border=1>
              > > <tr>
              > > <td>
              > > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300" type="image/svg-xml"
              > > src="rect.svg">
              > > </td>
              > > </tr>
              > > <tr>
              > > <td>
              > > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
              > > </td>
              > > </tr>
              > > </table>
              > > </body>
              > > </html>
              > >
              > > This might be stupid...
              > >
              > > - John van Terheijden
              > >
              > > --- In svg-developers@y..., "Graeme Coutts" <gecoutts@r...> wrote:
              > > > I am experiencing a problem when I <embed> an SVG file. This is
              > > most likely
              > > > not an SVG issue, maybe a IE HTML thing but I think that some
              > > SVGers could
              > > > help.
              > > >
              > > > I have a simple SVG file which triggers the mousemove event. The
              > > idea is to
              > > > display the client coords to the user:
              > > >
              > > > <?xml version="1.0"?>
              > > > <svg width="100%" height="100%" onmousemove="track(evt)">
              > > > <rect x="0" y="0" height="100%" width="100%" fill="red"/>
              > > > </svg>
              > > >
              > > > First look at this HTML file:
              > > >
              > > > <html>
              > > > <body>
              > > > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300" type="image/svg-xml"
              > > > src="rect.svg">
              > > > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
              > > > <body>
              > > > <script language="javascript">
              > > > function track(evt)
              > > > {
              > > > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
              > > > }
              > > > </script>
              > > > </html>
              > > >
              > > > Everything works great with the cursor position being displayed
              > > real-time to
              > > > the user. Now I wish to add a <table> element to neatly format the
              > > <embed>
              > > > and <div>:
              > > >
              > > > <html>
              > > > <body>
              > > > <table border=1>
              > > > <tr>
              > > > <td>
              > > > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300"
              > > type="image/svg-xml"
              > > > src="rect.svg">
              > > > </td>
              > > > </tr>
              > > > <tr>
              > > > <td>
              > > > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
              > > > </td>
              > > > </tr>
              > > > </table>
              > > > <body>
              > > > <script language="javascript">
              > > > function track(evt)
              > > > {
              > > > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
              > > > }
              > > > </script>
              > > > </html>
              > > >
              > > > You will now notice that the real-time tracking is lost. The
              > > coordinates are
              > > > only updated when the mouse leaves the SVG area. However to test to
              > > see if
              > > > the track is being called I added the following line to the track
              > > function:
              > > >
              > > > window.status = "evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
              > > >
              > > > This will show that the track is being called as the browser status
              > > bar
              > > > correctly shows the cursor position. So when we wrap the <embed>
              > > and <div>
              > > > with a <table> this introduces this strange problem. I am using
              > > IE6, ASV3,
              > > > Windows2000.
              > > >
              > > > Anyone care to explain this?
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > Gec.
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > -----
              > To unsubscribe send a message to:
              svg-developers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              > -or-
              > visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/svg-developers and click "edit my
              membership"
              > ----
              >
              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
              >
              >
            • Graeme Coutts
              The second was a typo and should read . I tried to put the script in a but still the problem exists. Gec. ... From: honnen_martin
              Message 6 of 9 , Jun 3, 2002
                The second <body> was a typo and should read </body>. I tried to put the
                script in a <head></head> but still the problem exists.

                Gec.

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: "honnen_martin" <Martin.Honnen@...>
                To: <svg-developers@yahoogroups.com>
                Sent: Tuesday, June 04, 2002 12:16 AM
                Subject: [svg-developers] Re: Strange problem with embedded SVG + <table>...


                > --- In svg-developers@y..., "Graeme Coutts" <gecoutts@r...> wrote:
                > > I am experiencing a problem when I <embed> an SVG file. This is
                > most likely
                > > not an SVG issue, maybe a IE HTML thing but I think that some
                > SVGers could
                > > help.
                > >
                > > I have a simple SVG file which triggers the mousemove event. The
                > idea is to
                > > display the client coords to the user:
                > >
                > > <?xml version="1.0"?>
                > > <svg width="100%" height="100%" onmousemove="track(evt)">
                > > <rect x="0" y="0" height="100%" width="100%" fill="red"/>
                > > </svg>
                > >
                > > First look at this HTML file:
                > >
                > > <html>
                > > <body>
                > > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300" type="image/svg-xml"
                > > src="rect.svg">
                > > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
                > > <body>
                >
                > You need a closing </body> not a opening one.
                > And consider defining a <head> section and putting the <script> into
                > that head.
                >
                > > <script language="javascript">
                > > function track(evt)
                > > {
                > > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
                > > }
                > > </script>
                > > </html>
                > >
                > > Everything works great with the cursor position being displayed
                > real-time to
                > > the user. Now I wish to add a <table> element to neatly format the
                > <embed>
                > > and <div>:
                > >
                > > <html>
                > > <body>
                > > <table border=1>
                > > <tr>
                > > <td>
                > > <embed id="graphic" width="300" height="300"
                > type="image/svg-xml"
                > > src="rect.svg">
                > > </td>
                > > </tr>
                > > <tr>
                > > <td>
                > > <div id="divTrack">0,0</div>
                > > </td>
                > > </tr>
                > > </table>
                > > <body>
                >
                > Again you have a opening <body> where you should have a closing
                > </body>
                > > <script language="javascript">
                > > function track(evt)
                > > {
                > > divTrack.innerHTML = evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
                > > }
                > > </script>
                > > </html>
                > >
                > > You will now notice that the real-time tracking is lost. The
                > coordinates are
                > > only updated when the mouse leaves the SVG area. However to test
                > to see if
                > > the track is being called I added the following line to the track
                > function:
                > >
                > > window.status = "evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
                > >
                > > This will show that the track is being called as the browser
                > status bar
                > > correctly shows the cursor position. So when we wrap the <embed>
                > and <div>
                > > with a <table> this introduces this strange problem. I am using
                > IE6, ASV3,
                > > Windows2000.
                > >
                > > Anyone care to explain this?
                > >
                > >
                > > Gec.
                >
                >
                >
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              • Jim Ley
                Graeme Coutts ... are ... if ... ... ASV3, ... It s almost certainly down to the way IE optimises redrawing of the screen,
                Message 7 of 9 , Jun 4, 2002
                  "Graeme Coutts" <gecoutts@...>
                  > You will now notice that the real-time tracking is lost. The coordinates
                  are
                  > only updated when the mouse leaves the SVG area. However to test to see
                  if
                  > the track is being called I added the following line to the track
                  function:
                  >
                  > window.status = "evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
                  >
                  > This will show that the track is being called as the browser status bar
                  > correctly shows the cursor position. So when we wrap the <embed> and
                  <div>
                  > with a <table> this introduces this strange problem. I am using IE6,
                  ASV3,
                  > Windows2000.
                  >
                  > Anyone care to explain this?

                  It's almost certainly down to the way IE optimises redrawing of the
                  screen, by changing the innerHTML of the content of a table cell, the
                  table redrawing is delayed as it's a very expensive operation.

                  You're only changing text content, there is absolutely no reason to use
                  innerHTML.

                  You're not using tabular data, why are you using a table - use CSS, you'll
                  get the same better presentation and you won't have the problem.

                  Jim.
                • Graeme Coutts
                  Thanks for the advice. I will be avoiding in the future. Gec. ... From: Jim Ley To: Sent:
                  Message 8 of 9 , Jun 4, 2002
                    Thanks for the advice. I will be avoiding <table> in the future.

                    Gec.

                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: "Jim Ley" <jim@...>
                    To: <svg-developers@yahoogroups.com>
                    Sent: Tuesday, June 04, 2002 2:14 PM
                    Subject: Re: [svg-developers] Strange problem with embedded SVG + <table>...


                    > "Graeme Coutts" <gecoutts@...>
                    > > You will now notice that the real-time tracking is lost. The coordinates
                    > are
                    > > only updated when the mouse leaves the SVG area. However to test to see
                    > if
                    > > the track is being called I added the following line to the track
                    > function:
                    > >
                    > > window.status = "evt.getClientX() + "," + evt.getClientY();
                    > >
                    > > This will show that the track is being called as the browser status bar
                    > > correctly shows the cursor position. So when we wrap the <embed> and
                    > <div>
                    > > with a <table> this introduces this strange problem. I am using IE6,
                    > ASV3,
                    > > Windows2000.
                    > >
                    > > Anyone care to explain this?
                    >
                    > It's almost certainly down to the way IE optimises redrawing of the
                    > screen, by changing the innerHTML of the content of a table cell, the
                    > table redrawing is delayed as it's a very expensive operation.
                    >
                    > You're only changing text content, there is absolutely no reason to use
                    > innerHTML.
                    >
                    > You're not using tabular data, why are you using a table - use CSS, you'll
                    > get the same better presentation and you won't have the problem.
                    >
                    > Jim.
                    >
                    >
                    >
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