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RE: [steiner] Re: Edgar Cayce

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  • Durward Starman
    *******Thank you, Matthew. I d forgotten all about this rather unpleasant fellow. Just looked up his rantings when he was briefly a member of this list. No
    Message 1 of 18 , Jul 10, 2008
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      *******Thank you, Matthew. I'd forgotten all about this rather unpleasant fellow. Just looked up his rantings when he was briefly a member of this list. No wonder you reacted so.
       
          I see no evidence of any singular insight into peoples' past lives, or anything esoteric or spiritual for that matter, in this person. He appears to be just another egotist who is out to twist anthroposophy into something that supports his own opinions, rather similar to the fellow I mentioned who says he's the reincarnation of Edgar Cayce. They're a dime a dozen online here.
       
         I would not place much faith in anything he had to say about Edgar Cayce, or Rudolf Steiner, for that matter. He might have something worthwhile to say, but I would say one would have to critically examine every statement such a person makes for falsehoods.
       
      -starman

      www.DrStarman.com




      To: steiner@yahoogroups.com
      From: tma4cbt@...
      Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 21:35:05 +0000
      Subject: [steiner] Re: Edgar Cayce



      --- In steiner@yahoogroups .com, Durward Starman <DrStarman@.. .> wrote:
      >
      >
      > *******Who is he? I've never heard of him.
      >

      Steven Hale is that psycho pomp you removed from this forum a couple years ago, who joined this forum, it seems, for no other purpose than to clog it up, undermine, and manipulate people like me with his overbearing, ego-centric personality.

      According to my sources, Steve Hale recently accused Starman of being in the mold of the Aryan Nation.  That's just one things he's accused Starman and myself of being.  There are many more lies and falsehoods that pour from this person's mouth.  Mr Hale has made a profession of creating devils and unleashing them through anthroposophical discussion forums.

      Mathew  




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    • happypick2000
      ... I vaguely recall someone of that name although not the particulars. Unfortunately, this world seems to be full of unsavory types, and the best I can say in
      Message 2 of 18 , Jul 10, 2008
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        --- In steiner@yahoogroups.com, "Mathew Morrell" <tma4cbt@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        >
        > --- In steiner@yahoogroups.com, Durward Starman <DrStarman@> wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > *******Who is he? I've never heard of him.
        > >
        >
        >
        >
        > Steven Hale is that psycho pomp you removed from this forum a couple
        > years ago, who joined this forum, it seems, for no other purpose than to
        > clog it up, undermine, and manipulate people like me with his
        > overbearing, ego-centric personality.
        >
        > According to my sources, Steve Hale recently accused Starman of being in
        > the mold of the Aryan Nation. That's just one things he's
        > accused Starman and myself of being. There are many more lies and
        > falsehoods that pour from this person's mouth. Mr Hale has made a
        > profession of creating devils and unleashing them through
        > anthroposophical discussion forums.
        >
        > Mathew
        >
        I vaguely recall someone of that name although not the particulars.
        Unfortunately, this world seems to be full of unsavory types, and the
        best I can say in such cases is to the effect that they will be held
        responsible for any and all actions of theirs, and in a well deserved
        way. I shudder to ponder such fates and can only try to overlook
        harmful events and people while learning from them in the way Steiner
        mentions coming across the dead dog with such beautiful teeth, but I
        fail far too often.

        Blessings,

        Sheila
      • Durward Starman
        *******Sorry for Matthew s temper. But in any gathering of people an angry outburst will happen now and then. It s not a reason for leaving a group. I wonder,
        Message 3 of 18 , Jul 10, 2008
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          *******Sorry for Matthew's temper. But in any gathering of people an angry outburst will happen now and then. It's not a reason for leaving a group.
           
          I wonder, do you belong to an anthroposophical study group? Would you do the same there?

          -starman

          www.DrStarman.com




          To: steiner@yahoogroups.com
          From: john@...
          Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 17:34:15 -0400
          Subject: Re: [steiner] Re: Edgar Cayce



          On Jul 10, 2008, at 4:37 PM, Mathew Morrell wrote:

          I spit on 
          his name and anyone who mentions it in this forum. 

          I'm not interested in spitting or being told what to say here.

          I will try signing myself off. If that doesn't work, please sign me off.

          thanks




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        • carynlouise24
          Interesting reactions – Well it is interesting Mars is the reincarnation of the Old Moon. Explains the `trance state. One thing in life which I cannot
          Message 4 of 18 , Jul 11, 2008
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            Interesting reactions – Well it is interesting Mars is the
            reincarnation of the Old Moon. Explains the `trance' state.

            One thing in life which I cannot stand is when people say `blessings'
            or `God bless you' – like they have this authority to tell God who to
            bless who not to bless!

            Well back to Billy … then



            --- In steiner@yahoogroups.com, Durward Starman <DrStarman@...> wrote:
            >
            >
            > *******Well, I'm sorry but I have to tell you that some of your
            information is woefully inaccurate! You could verify this by doing a
            search online or reading a few books about the Cayce Readings. I'd
            recommend reading a biography of the man first, such as "There Is A
            River" by Tom Sugrue, then look through whatever books of excerpts
            from his psychic readings interest you, like Edgar Cayce on Atlantis,
            Edgar Cayce on Jesus and His Church, etc. You'll find the information
            quite similar to Theosophy and anthroposophy, frequently identical.
            >
            > The objection of Rittlemeyer's was about people claiming to be
            an authority because of who they supposedly were in another life.
            This has nothing to do with telling what other peoples' past lives
            were--- which of course Dr. Steiner also did, so Rittlemeyer's
            criticiism about "claiming authority" on the basis of previous
            incarnations couldn't possibly include. He meant saying 'Well, I was
            so-and-so in a past life and so you should listen to me' (as one poor
            soul currently does who claims to have been Cayce himself, while
            producing no evidence of any abilities in this life). Telling people
            they should study music because they have an unrealized musical gift
            due to having been a musician in ancient Greece, as the Cayce
            Readings might do--- well, that's a completely different thing than
            what Rittlemeyer was talking about, clearly. Dr. Steiner also would
            identify learning disabilities in children as coming from past lives
            and use this knowledge in treatment.
            >
            > Also, the Readings did not identify Cayce as having been
            Pythagoras. He did say that in a past life he was an Egyptian
            initiate unknown to history named Ra Ta, whose memory later became
            mixed in with the mythological Ra. But he didn't claim people should
            listen to him because he was that priest in the time of the building
            of the pyramids. In fact, Cayce didn't ask people to listen to him at
            all, as he was not a teacher like Steiner. He was a freakish case of
            an ordinary-seeming man who, because of his past lives, could go into
            a trance state and connect with the same sources as Blavatsky and
            Steiner. In his trances, he mainly was asked medical questions about
            people who were sick. Other stuff was secondary to him and he wasn't
            sure how much to trust it himself.
            >
            > -starmanwww.DrStarman.com
            >
            >
            >
            > To: steiner@...: carynlouise24@...: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:51:19
            +0000Subject: [steiner] Re: Edgar Cayce
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > The Edgar Cayce's I have read are:The Life Story of JesusThe Origin
            and Destiny of ManRevelationMany Happy Returns My thoughts are:In
            Friedrich Rittelmeyer's `RUDOLF STEINER ENTERS MY LIFE' Friedrich
            writes:`His (Rudolf Steiner) attitude in the Krishnamurti affair
            shows that he regarded it as the greatest occult sin to claim
            authority for anyone on the ground of previous incarnations. In the
            age of the "Consciousness Soul" everyone must appeal with his
            teaching simply and solely to men's own objective sense of truth, and
            convince them purely on the basis of reason'.Edgar Cayce in an
            unconscious state claimed authority for person's previous
            incarnations and this should be a reason for concern. For instance;
            say someone like Edgar Cayce had to say to me `you were Mickey Mouse
            in your previous incarnation' – if I was naïve enough to believe this
            (because I was seeking the fundamental question of life `who am I') I
            would spend the rest of my life prancing around thinking to myself `I
            am Mickey Mouse' and further begin to act, take on the role of,
            Mickey Mouse - only to find when I pass through the portals of death
            I was actually Donald Duck in a previous incarnation and thus wasted
            a whole life in misconception.The age old wisdom comes to mind `Know
            Thyself' through yourself being yourself.Another factor; Edgar Cayce
            has claimed himself to be the great ancient leader Ra and the great
            mathematician Pythagoras in previous lifetimes.As far as I know not
            even Rudolf Steiner would claim to ascertain who he was in previous
            lifetimes in such an open manner; and further the true understanding
            of reincarnation of Initiates is not truly understood by the
            uninitiated.At this point I would like to say; Stephen Hale is
            greatly respected and (in my view) his investigations into the Karmic
            relationships between people is well thought through, done in a very
            concise manner and most importantly in a conscious manner. These
            investigations, on people who have already passed through the
            portals, namely Rudolf Steiner himself, directly proves the above
            writing by Friedrich Rittelmeyer on Rudolf Steiner's view on previous
            incarnations are done with an objective sense of truth based on
            knowledge and reason and is a gift invaluable to anthroposophy.I have
            spent years pondering Edgar Cayce and it is not without undue
            considerations I put this forward.--- In steiner@yahoogroups.com,
            Durward Starman <DrStarman@> wrote:>> > > > To: steiner@:
            Cheeseandsalsa@: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 13:32:21 -0400Subject: Re: [steiner]
            Edgar Cayce> > > > Barbara Handclow who isn't an anthro said that
            Cayce is a member and his father of the masons. She wrote that they
            were of the dark occult brotherhood...I personally do not resonate
            with what he brought to us. > I do agree - a balance is always good
            in communications.Any thoughts ... I wonder what Rudolf Steiner would
            have to say on Edgar Cayce?> > > 1> > .> *******> > > > > > Well, in
            this particular case I can say flatly that the lady is mistaken.
            Neither Cayce nor his father were Masons, I know that from personal
            study and contact with his family and many people who actually knew
            him here in Virginia Beach. He was not a member of anything, and in
            fact didn't know about Theosophy or anything esoteric until he began
            answering questions about such matters in his "readings." He almost
            never remembered anything he said in trance so they had to have a
            stenographer take it all down, and he read what he'd said afterwards
            along with everybody else. He was a simple Christian while awake and
            never joined anything except the local Presbyterian Church here. His
            father was a difficult man whom Edgar didn't get along with very
            well, but he also was not a member of any brotherhood or anything and
            had nothing to do with Edgar Cayce's work most of his life. > > As to
            what you don't resonate with in the Cayce Readings, well there's a
            lot that may be criticized in many ways. I don't know what you've
            read from them. > > Starman>
            __________________________________________________________> It's a
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          • Durward Starman
            ******* Why do you connect this to the planet Mars? I connect the trance state to Saturn, as it s a reversion to the state of consciousness of Ancient Saturn.
            Message 5 of 18 , Jul 11, 2008
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              ******* Why do you connect this to the planet Mars? I connect the trance state to Saturn, as it's a reversion to the state of consciousness of Ancient Saturn.

              -starman

              www.DrStarman.com




              To: steiner@yahoogroups.com
              From: carynlouise24@...
              Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 08:19:09 +0000
              Subject: [steiner] Re: Edgar Cayce


              Interesting reactions – Well it is interesting Mars is the
              reincarnation of the Old Moon. Explains the `trance' state.

              One thing in life which I cannot stand is when people say `blessings'
              or `God bless you' – like they have this authority to tell God who to
              bless who not to bless!

              Well back to Billy … then

              --- In steiner@yahoogroups .com, Durward Starman <DrStarman@. ..> wrote:
              >
              >
              > *******Well, I'm sorry but I have to tell you that some of your
              information is woefully inaccurate! You could verify this by doing a
              search online or reading a few books about the Cayce Readings. I'd
              recommend reading a biography of the man first, such as "There Is A
              River" by Tom Sugrue, then look through whatever books of excerpts
              from his psychic readings interest you, like Edgar Cayce on Atlantis,
              Edgar Cayce on Jesus and His Church, etc. You'll find the information
              quite similar to Theosophy and anthroposophy, frequently identical.
              >
              > The objection of Rittlemeyer' s was about people claiming to be
              an authority because of who they supposedly were in another life.
              This has nothing to do with telling what other peoples' past lives
              were--- which of course Dr. Steiner also did, so Rittlemeyer' s
              criticiism about "claiming authority" on the basis of previous
              incarnations couldn't possibly include. He meant saying 'Well, I was
              so-and-so in a past life and so you should listen to me' (as one poor
              soul currently does who claims to have been Cayce himself, while
              producing no evidence of any abilities in this life). Telling people
              they should study music because they have an unrealized musical gift
              due to having been a musician in ancient Greece, as the Cayce
              Readings might do--- well, that's a completely different thing than
              what Rittlemeyer was talking about, clearly. Dr. Steiner also would
              identify learning disabilities in children as coming from past lives
              and use this knowledge in treatment.
              >
              > Also, the Readings did not identify Cayce as having been
              Pythagoras. He did say that in a past life he was an Egyptian
              initiate unknown to history named Ra Ta, whose memory later became
              mixed in with the mythological Ra. But he didn't claim people should
              listen to him because he was that priest in the time of the building
              of the pyramids. In fact, Cayce didn't ask people to listen to him at
              all, as he was not a teacher like Steiner. He was a freakish case of
              an ordinary-seeming man who, because of his past lives, could go into
              a trance state and connect with the same sources as Blavatsky and
              Steiner. In his trances, he mainly was asked medical questions about
              people who were sick. Other stuff was secondary to him and he wasn't
              sure how much to trust it himself.
              >
              > -starmanwww. DrStarman. com
              >
              >
              >
              > To: steiner@...: carynlouise24@ ...: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:51:19
              +0000Subject: [steiner] Re: Edgar Cayce
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > The Edgar Cayce's I have read are:The Life Story of JesusThe Origin
              and Destiny of ManRevelationMany Happy Returns My thoughts are:In
              Friedrich Rittelmeyer' s `RUDOLF STEINER ENTERS MY LIFE' Friedrich
              writes:`His (Rudolf Steiner) attitude in the Krishnamurti affair
              shows that he regarded it as the greatest occult sin to claim
              authority for anyone on the ground of previous incarnations. In the
              age of the "Consciousness Soul" everyone must appeal with his
              teaching simply and solely to men's own objective sense of truth, and
              convince them purely on the basis of reason'.Edgar Cayce in an
              unconscious state claimed authority for person's previous
              incarnations and this should be a reason for concern. For instance;
              say someone like Edgar Cayce had to say to me `you were Mickey Mouse
              in your previous incarnation' – if I was naïve enough to believe this
              (because I was seeking the fundamental question of life `who am I') I
              would spend the rest of my life prancing around thinking to myself `I
              am Mickey Mouse' and further begin to act, take on the role of,
              Mickey Mouse - only to find when I pass through the portals of death
              I was actually Donald Duck in a previous incarnation and thus wasted
              a whole life in misconception. The age old wisdom comes to mind `Know
              Thyself' through yourself being yourself.Another factor; Edgar Cayce
              has claimed himself to be the great ancient leader Ra and the great
              mathematician Pythagoras in previous lifetimes.As far as I know not
              even Rudolf Steiner would claim to ascertain who he was in previous
              lifetimes in such an open manner; and further the true understanding
              of reincarnation of Initiates is not truly understood by the
              uninitiated. At this point I would like to say; Stephen Hale is
              greatly respected and (in my view) his investigations into the Karmic
              relationships between people is well thought through, done in a very
              concise manner and most importantly in a conscious manner. These
              investigations, on people who have already passed through the
              portals, namely Rudolf Steiner himself, directly proves the above
              writing by Friedrich Rittelmeyer on Rudolf Steiner's view on previous
              incarnations are done with an objective sense of truth based on
              knowledge and reason and is a gift invaluable to anthroposophy. I have
              spent years pondering Edgar Cayce and it is not without undue
              considerations I put this forward.--- In steiner@yahoogroups .com,
              Durward Starman <DrStarman@> wrote:>> > > > To: steiner@:
              Cheeseandsalsa@ : Mon, 7 Jul 2008 13:32:21 -0400Subject: Re: [steiner]
              Edgar Cayce> > > > Barbara Handclow who isn't an anthro said that
              Cayce is a member and his father of the masons. She wrote that they
              were of the dark occult brotherhood. ..I personally do not resonate
              with what he brought to us. > I do agree - a balance is always good
              in communications. Any thoughts ... I wonder what Rudolf Steiner would
              have to say on Edgar Cayce?> > > 1> > .> *******> > > > > > Well, in
              this particular case I can say flatly that the lady is mistaken.
              Neither Cayce nor his father were Masons, I know that from personal
              study and contact with his family and many people who actually knew
              him here in Virginia Beach. He was not a member of anything, and in
              fact didn't know about Theosophy or anything esoteric until he began
              answering questions about such matters in his "readings." He almost
              never remembered anything he said in trance so they had to have a
              stenographer take it all down, and he read what he'd said afterwards
              along with everybody else. He was a simple Christian while awake and
              never joined anything except the local Presbyterian Church here. His
              father was a difficult man whom Edgar didn't get along with very
              well, but he also was not a member of any brotherhood or anything and
              had nothing to do with Edgar Cayce's work most of his life. > > As to
              what you don't resonate with in the Cayce Readings, well there's a
              lot that may be criticized in many ways. I don't know what you've
              read from them. > > Starman>
              ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> It's a
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              > Making the world a better place one message at a time.
              > http://www.imtalkat hon.com/? source=EML_ WLH_Talkathon_ BetterPlace
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            • carynlouise24
              I trace it to the Old Moon stage of clairvoyance for specific corresponding reasons. Arhimanic and his sidekick the untamed Luciferic. We understand during
              Message 6 of 18 , Jul 14, 2008
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                I trace it to the Old Moon stage of clairvoyance for specific
                corresponding reasons. Arhimanic and his sidekick the untamed
                Luciferic. We understand during the Old Moon period the astral body
                was in development and the mineral was not yet included in the human
                body, this was a predominately Luciferic stage.

                In Rudolf Steiner's `Polarities in the Evolution of Mankind' eleven
                lectures given to members of the Anthroposophical Society in
                Stuttgart 5 March to 22 November 1920 pg 108 – we read

                `The Jesuit literature on the material world is much more brilliantly
                written than the works of many others writers on the subject today.
                Father Erich Wasmann's work on ants, for example, is really good, you
                will gain more from reading it than from the pedantic, uninspired
                writings of other scientists. Many more examples could be given.

                The (work of the) Jesuits would be excellent if they confined
                themselves to the material world; it is a deliberate aim (of the
                Jesuits) to use their description of the material world to encourage
                people to associate knowledge with the materialistic aspect of the
                physical world only.

                The intention is to pretend to human minds that the methods used to
                gain knowledge cannot be used to investigate the supersensible
                world. In ancient times Lucifer-dominated individuals suggested that
                human beings would gain mastery of the world if they made use of
                ancient divine knowledge, yet evolution had already gone beyond this
                point.

                Now we have late followers of those people from post-primeval times
                pretending to the world that it is not possible to extend knowledge
                to the supersensible sphere and that knowledge cannot go beyond the
                sense-perceptible world. In those early times the intention had been
                to drug people with supersensible knowledge.

                Now human beings of the same ilk want to use all possible means to
                push humanity into the physical world; they want human beings stuck
                in that world and grasp the supersensible world only with the
                nebulous impulse of faith.

                In post-primeval times the aim had been to inundate humankind with an
                excess of supersensible knowledge. Today those late followers want
                human beings to have less than the right amount of knowledge in this
                sphere. Past intent was to provide supersensible knowledge that was
                no longer appropriate. Present intent is to let people have only
                sense-bound knowledge, making the supersensible world an area where
                every individual may hold whatever views he or she likes.

                What would be the outcome if the group of people to whom we are
                referring were to achieve some kind of victory? These are the people
                who deliberately make a sharp distinction between knowledge and
                belief. There are of course large numbers of easily led people who
                come across the diatribe on the `clear distinction between faith and
                knowledge' and repeat it; they merely repeat it.

                What is all this about? The aim is to do the opposite of what those
                individual in post-primeval times did in their way. In the old days
                the intention was to prevent humanity from descending completely and
                taking up its mission on earth. Today the intention is to keep
                people tied to that mission on earth to prevent their further
                development, for which the earth would provide the basis. The very
                people who are now supporting materialism call
                themselves `spiritualists', or priests of some faith or other,
                representatives of the supersensible world.

                In those ancient times the people offering a life in the spirit that
                was no longer justifiable called themselves materialists. They did
                so from the point of view which I have characterized. Today a large
                number of people who really wish to keep humanity bound to the
                material world call themselves representatives of the spiritual
                world.'

                Page 50

                Think of all the efforts we go to in spiritual science working
                towards anthroposophy to form sufficiently clear ideas; for
                instances, as to how far the things we become aware of in human
                minds, in the form of dreams, may or may not be reflecting the
                truth. As human beings we cannot immediately distinguish truth from
                falsehood when something appears in the course of a dream. The same
                state of mind arises for a congregation when they are told lies by
                people who know those lies will be believed. The soul is brought to
                a state, a mood, by those lies where it becomes the willing tool of
                those desiring power. It is easiest to get people into your power by
                planting illusions in their unsuspecting minds'.




                --- In steiner@yahoogroups.com, Durward Starman <DrStarman@...> wrote:
                >
                >
                > ******* Why do you connect this to the planet Mars? I connect the
                trance state to Saturn, as it's a reversion to the state of
                consciousness of Ancient Saturn.
                > -starman
                > www.DrStarman.com
                >
                >
                >
                > To: steiner@...: carynlouise24@...: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 08:19:09
                +0000Subject: [steiner] Re: Edgar Cayce
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > Interesting reactions – Well it is interesting Mars is the
                reincarnation of the Old Moon. Explains the `trance' state.One thing
                in life which I cannot stand is when people say `blessings' or `God
                bless you' – like they have this authority to tell God who to bless
                who not to bless!Well back to Billy … then --- In
                steiner@yahoogroups.com, Durward Starman <DrStarman@> wrote:>> >
                *******Well, I'm sorry but I have to tell you that some of your
                information is woefully inaccurate! You could verify this by doing a
                search online or reading a few books about the Cayce Readings. I'd
                recommend reading a biography of the man first, such as "There Is A
                River" by Tom Sugrue, then look through whatever books of excerpts
                from his psychic readings interest you, like Edgar Cayce on Atlantis,
                Edgar Cayce on Jesus and His Church, etc. You'll find the information
                quite similar to Theosophy and anthroposophy, frequently identical.>
                > The objection of Rittlemeyer's was about people claiming to be an
                authority because of who they supposedly were in another life. This
                has nothing to do with telling what other peoples' past lives were---
                which of course Dr. Steiner also did, so Rittlemeyer's criticiism
                about "claiming authority" on the basis of previous incarnations
                couldn't possibly include. He meant saying 'Well, I was so-and-so in
                a past life and so you should listen to me' (as one poor soul
                currently does who claims to have been Cayce himself, while producing
                no evidence of any abilities in this life). Telling people they
                should study music because they have an unrealized musical gift due
                to having been a musician in ancient Greece, as the Cayce Readings
                might do--- well, that's a completely different thing than what
                Rittlemeyer was talking about, clearly. Dr. Steiner also would
                identify learning disabilities in children as coming from past lives
                and use this knowledge in treatment.> > Also, the Readings did not
                identify Cayce as having been Pythagoras. He did say that in a past
                life he was an Egyptian initiate unknown to history named Ra Ta,
                whose memory later became mixed in with the mythological Ra. But he
                didn't claim people should listen to him because he was that priest
                in the time of the building of the pyramids. In fact, Cayce didn't
                ask people to listen to him at all, as he was not a teacher like
                Steiner. He was a freakish case of an ordinary-seeming man who,
                because of his past lives, could go into a trance state and connect
                with the same sources as Blavatsky and Steiner. In his trances, he
                mainly was asked medical questions about people who were sick. Other
                stuff was secondary to him and he wasn't sure how much to trust it
                himself.> > -starmanwww.DrStarman.com> > > > To: steiner@:
                carynlouise24@: Thu, 10 Jul 2008 11:51:19 +0000Subject: [steiner] Re:
                Edgar Cayce> > > > > The Edgar Cayce's I have read are:The Life Story
                of JesusThe Origin and Destiny of ManRevelationMany Happy Returns My
                thoughts are:In Friedrich Rittelmeyer's `RUDOLF STEINER ENTERS MY
                LIFE' Friedrich writes:`His (Rudolf Steiner) attitude in the
                Krishnamurti affair shows that he regarded it as the greatest occult
                sin to claim authority for anyone on the ground of previous
                incarnations. In the age of the "Consciousness Soul" everyone must
                appeal with his teaching simply and solely to men's own objective
                sense of truth, and convince them purely on the basis of
                reason'.Edgar Cayce in an unconscious state claimed authority for
                person's previous incarnations and this should be a reason for
                concern. For instance; say someone like Edgar Cayce had to say to me
                `you were Mickey Mouse in your previous incarnation' – if I was naïve
                enough to believe this (because I was seeking the fundamental
                question of life `who am I') I would spend the rest of my life
                prancing around thinking to myself `I am Mickey Mouse' and further
                begin to act, take on the role of, Mickey Mouse - only to find when I
                pass through the portals of death I was actually Donald Duck in a
                previous incarnation and thus wasted a whole life in
                misconception.The age old wisdom comes to mind `Know Thyself' through
                yourself being yourself.Another factor; Edgar Cayce has claimed
                himself to be the great ancient leader Ra and the great mathematician
                Pythagoras in previous lifetimes.As far as I know not even Rudolf
                Steiner would claim to ascertain who he was in previous lifetimes in
                such an open manner; and further the true understanding of
                reincarnation of Initiates is not truly understood by the
                uninitiated.At this point I would like to say; Stephen Hale is
                greatly respected and (in my view) his investigations into the Karmic
                relationships between people is well thought through, done in a very
                concise manner and most importantly in a conscious manner. These
                investigations, on people who have already passed through the
                portals, namely Rudolf Steiner himself, directly proves the above
                writing by Friedrich Rittelmeyer on Rudolf Steiner's view on previous
                incarnations are done with an objective sense of truth based on
                knowledge and reason and is a gift invaluable to anthroposophy.I have
                spent years pondering Edgar Cayce and it is not without undue
                considerations I put this forward.--- In steiner@yahoogroups.com,
                Durward Starman <DrStarman@> wrote:>> > > > To: steiner@:
                Cheeseandsalsa@: Mon, 7 Jul 2008 13:32:21 -0400Subject: Re: [steiner]
                Edgar Cayce> > > > Barbara Handclow who isn't an anthro said that
                Cayce is a member and his father of the masons. She wrote that they
                were of the dark occult brotherhood...I personally do not resonate
                with what he brought to us. > I do agree - a balance is always good
                in communications.Any thoughts ... I wonder what Rudolf Steiner would
                have to say on Edgar Cayce?> > > 1> > .> *******> > > > > > Well, in
                this particular case I can say flatly that the lady is mistaken.
                Neither Cayce nor his father were Masons, I know that from personal
                study and contact with his family and many people who actually knew
                him here in Virginia Beach. He was not a member of anything, and in
                fact didn't know about Theosophy or anything esoteric until he began
                answering questions about such matters in his "readings." He almost
                never remembered anything he said in trance so they had to have a
                stenographer take it all down, and he read what he'd said afterwards
                along with everybody else. He was a simple Christian while awake and
                never joined anything except the local Presbyterian Church here. His
                father was a difficult man whom Edgar didn't get along with very
                well, but he also was not a member of any brotherhood or anything and
                had nothing to do with Edgar Cayce's work most of his life. > > As to
                what you don't resonate with in the Cayce Readings, well there's a
                lot that may be criticized in many ways. I don't know what you've
                read from them. > > Starman>
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