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Re: [steiner] Gurdjieff

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  • Cheeseandsalsa@aol.com
    In a message dated 12/1/2006 1:03:02 P.M. Central Standard Time, tma4cbt@juno.com writes: But what positive reason did Gurdjieff ever bring? What reason de t
    Message 1 of 9 , Dec 2, 2006
      In a message dated 12/1/2006 1:03:02 P.M. Central Standard Time, tma4cbt@... writes:

      But what positive reason did Gurdjieff ever bring?  What reason de't air did he bestow that would inspire his followers to lovingly sacrifice themselves to higher principles?   For love of God?  Love of nation or family?  To sacrifice oneself for humanity?  No, none of these!  The reason de'tair behind Gurdjieff's psychology is to sacrifice ones self for the purpose of never being tired---as absurd as that sounds. 

      In retrospect, it seems, Gurdjieff's followers might have been better advised to have huffed nitrous oxide instead.   

      Haha, well, the power of attention and intention was Gurdjieff's aim I believe.  The worst thing we can do is be passive.  I can sit down to a Steiner lecture or book and passively read the information and waste a WHOLE lot of time.  Or I can be attentive and alive and acknowledge the power of my mind.  Sometimes being attentive needs strengthened.  It is needed for ritual and practice in all sorts.  Whether you are sacrificing a lamb or practicing a concentration exercise.  ~Chantel
    • thepathofthesunflower
      I think James is quite profound and has a wisdom not many people would understand. The burden of knowledge is a yoke. I think James is carrying this yoke and
      Message 2 of 9 , Dec 4, 2006
        I think James is quite profound and has a wisdom not many people
        would understand. The burden of knowledge is a yoke. I think James
        is carrying this yoke and needs support... he has acquired a rare
        insight. I wouldn't mind James being a member here; the least we
        could do is offer friendship.

        Matthew you wrote:
        The problem has to do with Gurdjieff's fundamentally negative
        approach. He begun his philosophy from the standpoint that man is
        trapped in a sort of hypnotic sleep and that only super effort and
        intentional suffering can awaken the slumbering will ..

        I am not familiar with Gurdjieff's work (although after James I have
        a inkling) but what you wrote above I think rings true with Astrology.

        I hope Starman agrees with me here; the philosophy of Astrology
        (although astrology is not a philosophy it is the Divine plan of
        Creation) the principle of Astrology is;

        We each in turn go through the wheel of each Zodiac Sign. Once we
        have accomplished and attained the highest possible note or octave in
        each sign we advance to the next sign. Until we have achieved the
        highest combination of octaves in all the signs and break through the
        Circle of Life.

        We know each Sign has its Ruling Planet and each Sign and Planet has
        a negative or positive state. The negative being the lower nature
        and the positive being the higher nature.

        So in a way we are in a hypnotic sleep unless we awaken our
        slumbering Will/Ego and attain the positive (together with the
        negative to understand or appreciate the positive)the keyword being :
        awake with knowledge in order to break the Wheel of Karma. And it
        done through self effort and self knowledge. We either asleep or we
        are awake.

        Jesus Christ did this. The Risen Man. God's Son as an example for
        us to follow.

        I do believe this 'philosophy' is in accordance to Dr Steiner's work.
        Mediatations on the Signs of the Zodiac by John Jocelyn Rudolf
        Steiner Press being my knowledge of this principle.

        Love
        Caryn
      • thepathofthesunflower
        Chantel wrote: Haha, well, the power of attention and intention was Gurdjieff s aim I believe. The worst thing we can do is be passive. I can sit down to a
        Message 3 of 9 , Dec 4, 2006
          Chantel wrote:
          Haha, well, the power of attention and intention was Gurdjieff's aim
          I believe. The worst thing we can do is be passive. I can sit down
          to a Steiner lecture or book and passively read the information and
          waste a WHOLE lot of time. Or I can be attentive and alive and
          acknowledge the power of my mind. Sometimes being attentive needs
          strengthened. It is needed for ritual and practice in all sorts.
          Whether you are sacrificing a lamb or practicing a concentration
          exercise. ~Chantel


          Hi Chantel hope you are well :)

          Rudolf Steiner shared his knowledge with us as a huge gift to
          humanity. Self-knowledge in Spiritual Affairs is extremely
          important. So when someones says I visted you in your sleep you can
          say (thanks to Dr Steiner) .. the science is not correct. In order
          for you to visit me I have to perceive you inside me and in turn
          express outwardly your form from what I perceived you to be.

          They might be doing this but with the correct spiritual science
          knowledge it may be understood correctly and then the one realises
          there are check and balances. Thanks to Dr Steiner the knowledge
          very important.

          Basic example but many similiar areas Dr Steiner's work corrects
          untruths purely because of the science.

          Also, we cannot read in the spiritual worlds - we take in visual
          picture forms but actually reading of words is not able. The Doctor
          explains this to us. So while in Earth it is important to read as
          much as we can so we take this information with us into the spritual
          worlds and have a better understanding of the worlds around us.

          My thoughts
          Caryn
        • Nina
          ... Dear Caryn, Used to have that book. In conclusion to According to Luke , Dr. Steiner spoke of the meaning of the fundamental words, Peace in human hearts
          Message 4 of 9 , Dec 5, 2006
            --- In steiner@yahoogroups.com, "thepathofthesunflower"
            <thepathofthesunflower@...> wrote:
            >> God's Son as an example for us to follow.
            >I do believe this 'philosophy' is in accordance to Dr Steiner's work.
            > Mediatations on the Signs of the Zodiac by John Jocelyn Rudolf
            > Steiner Press being my knowledge of this principle
            > Love Caryn
            Dear Caryn,
            Used to have that book.
            In conclusion to "According to Luke", Dr. Steiner spoke of the meaning
            of the fundamental words,"Peace in human hearts in whom goodwill
            dwells."
            "More than any other document, the Luke Gospel, if fully understood,
            fills human souls with the warm love that allows peace to dwell on
            earth as the most exquisite reflection of divine mysteries."
            Earlier he gave,
            "Until individuals are fully illumined by self-awareness, until they
            can distinquish between good and evil, from within the I,their
            earlier, original nature is visible through the veil of later
            degradation. Only the childlike element in modern human beings
            preserves a remnant of human nature as it was before we succombed to
            the influence of Luciferic beings."
            Recently found Starman's "East Meets West" articles. The one "Various
            Thoughts:The Fourth Dimension, Astroposophy" is very informative. He
            mentions astrologer Robert Powell( has series,one title on
            reincarnation). Have you seen his books? Starman also mentions Willi
            Sucher, whose works at the time of his 2003 article, were not
            available. SteinerbooksCatalog03/04 has his Cosmic Christianity.NINA
          • thepathofthesunflower
            Hi Nina Hope you are well - we went a bit quite didn t we! I haven t read Robert Powell but will look out for it. I loved what you said : Peace in human
            Message 5 of 9 , Dec 5, 2006
              Hi Nina

              Hope you are well - we went a bit quite didn't we!
              I haven't read Robert Powell but will look out for it.

              I loved what you said : "Peace in human hearts in whom goodwill
              dwells."

              A wonderful affirmative thought for the day :)

              Love and Light
              Caryn
            • Nina
              ... ... Enjoy your holiday Caryn! When I read your history, thought you d like these books: Christian Hermetic Astrology:The Star
              Message 6 of 9 , Dec 6, 2006
                --- In steiner@yahoogroups.com, "thepathofthesunflower"
                <thepathofthesunflower@...>
                > I haven't read Robert Powell but will look out for it...Caryn
                Enjoy your holiday Caryn!
                When I read your history, thought you'd like these books:
                Christian Hermetic Astrology:The Star of Magi and the Life of Christ
                Hermetic Astrology,vol.1, Astrology and Reincarnation
                Hermetic Astrology,vol.2, Astrological Biography(significance of time
                fr conception to birth considered in relation to the unfolding of
                human biography in seven-year cycles.)
                Your peaceful radiance is an inspiration. NINA
              • thepathofthesunflower
                ... Those books sound wonderful - thanks so much Nina. Your gentle wisdom is beautiful and appreciated. Much love Caryn
                Message 7 of 9 , Dec 7, 2006
                  --- In steiner@yahoogroups.com, "Nina" <emeraldnina@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > --- In steiner@yahoogroups.com, "thepathofthesunflower"
                  > <thepathofthesunflower@>
                  > > I haven't read Robert Powell but will look out for it...Caryn
                  > Enjoy your holiday Caryn!
                  > When I read your history, thought you'd like these books:
                  > Christian Hermetic Astrology:The Star of Magi and the Life of Christ
                  > Hermetic Astrology,vol.1, Astrology and Reincarnation
                  > Hermetic Astrology,vol.2, Astrological Biography(significance of time
                  > fr conception to birth considered in relation to the unfolding of
                  > human biography in seven-year cycles.)
                  > Your peaceful radiance is an inspiration. NINA
                  >
                  Those books sound wonderful - thanks so much Nina.
                  Your gentle wisdom is beautiful and appreciated.

                  Much love
                  Caryn
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