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s'Kerry

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  • Br. Ron
    This is just my opinion and good folks can disagree. Qabala is a wonderful spiritual tool because it reveals the location of spiritual shadows. Let s apply
    Message 1 of 14 , Oct 14, 2004
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      This is just my opinion and good folks can disagree.
       
      Qabala is a wonderful spiritual tool because it reveals
      the location of spiritual shadows.
       
      Let's apply this to American politics.
       
      John Kerry to be not only and opportunistic machine
      but a full blown traitor....both in the 70s and now.

      First, look into his face. It doesn't take a Cagliostro to see
      he only occasionally departs from the haunting image of 'just
      another genderless, talking head.'
       
      Clever?...Yes....to the point of demagoguery but more importantly
      he lacks that essential soul quality associated with a vulnerable
      conscience. Kerry seems blissfully free of both passion and heart,
      Bereft of any genuine 'fire in the belly' he lives up to the
      Qabalistic term
      'qliphoth'.....which is but a shell.

      Kerry gets his juice from professional victims and survives
      politically by simple negativity and doubt...by making all things
      pertaining to the US an "error."

      His opportunistic grandstanding in the Seventies torpedoed our
      "might for right" and served to lead to the wholesale
      slaughter of nearly a million Vietnamese after the war...to say
      nothing of setting up Pol Pot's evil rampage in Cambodia.

      Had we been truly the UNITED States in winning that conflict,
      there would have been far fewer human casualties and we would
      have established a bright bastion of freedom in Indochina.
      (A case in point is what we saw taking root this weekend in Afghanistan,
      sporting endless lines of men and women risking life and limb to get
      to vote...... for the first time ever!)

      Regardless of the rampant left wing cynicism, this war
      aint all just about money and oil. It is not even about Iraq or
      the Middle East. It's a cosmic power grab chronicled in the texts of
      every major religion,... albeit by different names.

      There are parasitic forces tempting us from our bravery
      and degrading our duty; our heavenly mandate of sacrifice and
      promulgation of  'Good' performed in manly and knightly ways.
      If this vampirism succeeds, all Life on Earth will cease.

      As a man, I see ridding the world of parasitic tyranny is a
      chivalrous duty. Chivalry is a religion not unlike the Samurai.
      But "Might for Right" is a creed grasped only by practitioners
      of TRUE self sacrificial Love, a concept for which the political left
      gives lip service but has absolutely no grasp.

      Kerry cannot win. ....He MUST NOT win.

      Fortunately, Americans are ultimately driven by an innate sense of right
      and wrong. I trust us to distinguish between the verbose, reflected specter
      of 'lunar light' in contrast to the real thing. True Beings of Light demonstrate
      Spirit and self reliance, not social dependency. They display the self generating
      Solar Light emanating from yes, the Sun of God.

      Remember King Arthur had an effeminate offspring like our slick
      friend. Mordred was massaged, oiled and pussified daily by his
      mother, Morgan LeFay. This lunar witch was Arthur's sister
      with whom he slept. Mordred, the incestual offspring of this union,
      ultimately brought down Arthur's solar kingdom which in truth was
      initiated by the Christos.

      This archetypal gender battle repeating itself once again
      on the stage of American and global politics. The I-Ching has a
      hexagram ('KUN...The Receptive...with a moving line at the top)
      which says:
          "In the top place the Yin (female) element should yield to the light.
          If it attempts to maintain a position to which it is not entitled
          and to rule instead of serving, it draws down on itself the anger
          of the strong. A struggle ensues in which it is overthrown,
          with injury, however, to both sides. Therefore, it is a sign
          that in unnatural contest both primal powers (Male and Female)
          suffer injury."

      This gender confusion of Yang in relation to Yin is symbolized in
      every religion including the story in Genesis with Adam disconnecting
      from his Reason..his Oversoul in order to follow Eve's impulsive Nature
      worship.

      This sounds sexist...but it isn't. Nor am I suggesting
      the masculine principle is somehow 'better' than the feminine.
      It's just that each has it's appropriate place within ourselves
      and within cosmic order.
      It simply means that Reason should guide impulse and emotion
      in each of us.... at all times. Reason is "The Head of the House"

      Kerry is a Massachusetts 'dandy' who has doubtless been
      circumcised with pinking shears.

      His politics and demeanor are much like his manicure...
      slick...polished and preened strictly for public approval.

      A glib wordsmith he is, a knightly warrior he aint....

      If he ever did rescue the king's maiden daughter, he
      would not have done it for Chivalry ...nor even because it was the
      right thing to do. He would have done it to win the king's daughter
      .........and to latch onto his estate.

      Behold Mordred!

      This terrorist thing upon us now is VERY huge.
      It may not live up to Rudolph Steiner's 'War of All Against All'
      but there definitely is a global religious Jihad/Crusade afoot and it is
      also cosmic. It is the struggle between the forces of civilization .....
      .....and Chaos itself.

      Remember the 'Never Ending Story?'  This drama is unfolding again.
      "The 'Nothing'" approaches and there are two options left to us:
      1. Fight without quarter.
      2. Deny it and choose "peace at any price."
       
      I for one, choose the former because the latter is the
      sure recipe for "short term pleasure, long term pain."

      Hairspray and a razor cuts somehow lose their meaning when
      adorning a severed head.

      Br. Ron
    • LilOleMissy@SBCglobal.net
      Thank you, Br. Ron! You have stated truth. Sheila Br. Ron wrote: This is just my opinion and good folks can disagree. Qabala is a wonderful spiritual tool
      Message 2 of 14 , Oct 14, 2004
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        Thank you, Br. Ron! You have stated truth.

        Sheila

        Br. Ron wrote:
         
        This is just my opinion and good folks can disagree.
         
        Qabala is a wonderful spiritual tool because it reveals
        the location of spiritual shadows.
         
        Let's apply this to American politics.
         
        John Kerry to be not only and opportunistic machine
        but a full blown traitor....both in the 70s and now.

        First, look into his face. It doesn't take a Cagliostro to see
        he only occasionally departs from the haunting image of 'just
        another genderless, talking head.'
         
        Clever?...Yes....to the point of demagoguery but more importantly
        he lacks that essential soul quality associated with a vulnerable
        conscience. Kerry seems blissfully free of both passion and heart,
        Bereft of any genuine 'fire in the belly' he lives up to the
        Qabalistic term
        'qliphoth'.....which is but a shell.

        Kerry gets his juice from professional victims and survives
        politically by simple negativity and doubt...by making all things
        pertaining to the US an "error."

        His opportunistic grandstanding in the Seventies torpedoed our
        "might for right" and served to lead to the wholesale
        slaughter of nearly a million Vietnamese after the war...to say
        nothing of setting up Pol Pot's evil rampage in Cambodia.

        Had we been truly the UNITED States in winning that conflict,
        there would have been far fewer human casualties and we would
        have established a bright bastion of freedom in Indochina.
        (A case in point is what we saw taking root this weekend in Afghanistan,
        sporting endless lines of men and women risking life and limb to get
        to vote...... for the first time ever!)

        Regardless of the rampant left wing cynicism, this war
        aint all just about money and oil. It is not even about Iraq or
        the Middle East. It's a cosmic power grab chronicled in the texts of
        every major religion,... albeit by different names.

        There are parasitic forces tempting us from our bravery
        and degrading our duty; our heavenly mandate of sacrifice and
        promulgation of  'Good' performed in manly and knightly ways.
        If this vampirism succeeds, all Life on Earth will cease.

        As a man, I see ridding the world of parasitic tyranny is a
        chivalrous duty. Chivalry is a religion not unlike the Samurai.
        But "Might for Right" is a creed grasped only by practitioners
        of TRUE self sacrificial Love, a concept for which the political left
        gives lip service but has absolutely no grasp.

        Kerry cannot win. ....He MUST NOT win.

        Fortunately, Americans are ultimately driven by an innate sense of right
        and wrong. I trust us to distinguish between the verbose, reflected specter
        of 'lunar light' in contrast to the real thing. True Beings of Light demonstrate
        Spirit and self reliance, not social dependency. They display the self generating
        Solar Light emanating from yes, the Sun of God.

        Remember King Arthur had an effeminate offspring like our slick
        friend. Mordred was massaged, oiled and pussified daily by his
        mother, Morgan LeFay. This lunar witch was Arthur's sister
        with whom he slept. Mordred, the incestual offspring of this union,
        ultimately brought down Arthur's solar kingdom which in truth was
        initiated by the Christos.

        This archetypal gender battle repeating itself once again
        on the stage of American and global politics. The I-Ching has a
        hexagram ('KUN...The Receptive...with a moving line at the top)
        which says:
            "In the top place the Yin (female) element should yield to the light.
            If it attempts to maintain a position to which it is not entitled
            and to rule instead of serving, it draws down on itself the anger
            of the strong. A struggle ensues in which it is overthrown,
            with injury, however, to both sides. Therefore, it is a sign
            that in unnatural contest both primal powers (Male and Female)
            suffer injury."

        This gender confusion of Yang in relation to Yin is symbolized in
        every religion including the story in Genesis with Adam disconnecting
        from his Reason..his Oversoul in order to follow Eve's impulsive Nature
        worship.

        This sounds sexist...but it isn't. Nor am I suggesting
        the masculine principle is somehow 'better' than the feminine.
        It's just that each has it's appropriate place within ourselves
        and within cosmic order.
        It simply means that Reason should guide impulse and emotion
        in each of us.... at all times. Reason is "The Head of the House"

        Kerry is a Massachusetts 'dandy' who has doubtless been
        circumcised with pinking shears.

        His politics and demeanor are much like his manicure...
        slick...polished and preened strictly for public approval.

        A glib wordsmith he is, a knightly warrior he aint....

        If he ever did rescue the king's maiden daughter, he
        would not have done it for Chivalry ...nor even because it was the
        right thing to do. He would have done it to win the king's daughter
        .........and to latch onto his estate.

        Behold Mordred!

        This terrorist thing upon us now is VERY huge.
        It may not live up to Rudolph Steiner's 'War of All Against All'
        but there definitely is a global religious Jihad/Crusade afoot and it is
        also cosmic. It is the struggle between the forces of civilization .....
        .....and Chaos itself.

        Remember the 'Never Ending Story?'  This drama is unfolding again.
        "The 'Nothing'" approaches and there are two options left to us:
        1. Fight without quarter.
        2. Deny it and choose "peace at any price."
         
        I for one, choose the former because the latter is the
        sure recipe for "short term pleasure, long term pain."

        Hairspray and a razor cuts somehow lose their meaning when
        adorning a severed head.

        Br. Ron


      • Social Artist
        My goodness, Br. Ron. You have some interesting points, and your exposition is certainly dramatic; however, it is my recollection that political discussions
        Message 3 of 14 , Oct 14, 2004
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          My goodness, Br. Ron. You have some interesting
          points, and your exposition is certainly dramatic;
          however, it is my recollection that political
          discussions in this forum were to be avoided. In the
          end, it seems to me that the scariest part of today's
          political landscape is the apathetic nature of the
          American people, who more and more spend the length of
          their days eating canned foods off of plastic plates
          in front of the television instead of raising their
          children and organizing social events with their
          neighbors. This is the reason a fellow like Kerry is
          up for the presidency. It's not as though the guy had
          to burn down the Reichstag.



          --- "Br. Ron" <rlloyd@...> wrote:

          >
          > This is just my opinion and good folks can disagree.
          >
          > Qabala is a wonderful spiritual tool because it
          > reveals
          > the location of spiritual shadows.
          >
          > Let's apply this to American politics.
          >
          > John Kerry to be not only and opportunistic machine
          > but a full blown traitor....both in the 70s and now.
          >
          >
          > First, look into his face. It doesn't take a
          > Cagliostro to see
          > he only occasionally departs from the haunting image
          > of 'just
          > another genderless, talking head.'
          >
          > Clever?...Yes....to the point of demagoguery but
          > more importantly
          > he lacks that essential soul quality associated with
          > a vulnerable
          > conscience. Kerry seems blissfully free of both
          > passion and heart,
          > Bereft of any genuine 'fire in the belly' he lives
          > up to the Qabalistic term
          > 'qliphoth'.....which is but a shell.
          >
          > Kerry gets his juice from professional victims and
          > survives
          > politically by simple negativity and doubt...by
          > making all things
          > pertaining to the US an "error."
          >
          > His opportunistic grandstanding in the Seventies
          > torpedoed our
          > "might for right" and served to lead to the
          > wholesale
          > slaughter of nearly a million Vietnamese after the
          > war...to say
          > nothing of setting up Pol Pot's evil rampage in
          > Cambodia.
          >
          > Had we been truly the UNITED States in winning that
          > conflict,
          > there would have been far fewer human casualties and
          > we would
          > have established a bright bastion of freedom in
          > Indochina.
          > (A case in point is what we saw taking root this
          > weekend in Afghanistan,
          > sporting endless lines of men and women risking life
          > and limb to get
          > to vote...... for the first time ever!)
          >
          > Regardless of the rampant left wing cynicism, this
          > war
          > aint all just about money and oil. It is not even
          > about Iraq or
          > the Middle East. It's a cosmic power grab chronicled
          > in the texts of
          > every major religion,... albeit by different names.
          >
          > There are parasitic forces tempting us from our
          > bravery
          > and degrading our duty; our heavenly mandate of
          > sacrifice and
          > promulgation of 'Good' performed in manly and
          > knightly ways.
          >
          > If this vampirism succeeds, all Life on Earth will
          > cease.
          >
          > As a man, I see ridding the world of parasitic
          > tyranny is a
          > chivalrous duty. Chivalry is a religion not unlike
          > the Samurai.
          > But "Might for Right" is a creed grasped only by
          > practitioners
          > of TRUE self sacrificial Love, a concept for which
          > the political left
          > gives lip service but has absolutely no grasp.
          >
          > Kerry cannot win. ....He MUST NOT win.
          >
          > Fortunately, Americans are ultimately driven by an
          > innate sense of right
          > and wrong. I trust us to distinguish between the
          > verbose, reflected specter
          > of 'lunar light' in contrast to the real thing. True
          > Beings of Light demonstrate
          > Spirit and self reliance, not social dependency.
          > They display the self generating
          > Solar Light emanating from yes, the Sun of God.
          >
          > Remember King Arthur had an effeminate offspring
          > like our slick
          > friend. Mordred was massaged, oiled and pussified
          > daily by his
          > mother, Morgan LeFay. This lunar witch was Arthur's
          > sister
          > with whom he slept. Mordred, the incestual offspring
          > of this union,
          > ultimately brought down Arthur's solar kingdom which
          > in truth was
          > initiated by the Christos.
          >
          > This archetypal gender battle repeating itself once
          > again
          > on the stage of American and global politics. The
          > I-Ching has a
          > hexagram ('KUN...The Receptive...with a moving line
          > at the top)
          > which says:
          > "In the top place the Yin (female) element
          > should yield to the light.
          > If it attempts to maintain a position to which
          > it is not entitled
          > and to rule instead of serving, it draws down on
          > itself the anger
          > of the strong. A struggle ensues in which it is
          > overthrown,
          > with injury, however, to both sides. Therefore,
          > it is a sign
          > that in unnatural contest both primal powers
          > (Male and Female)
          > suffer injury."
          >
          > This gender confusion of Yang in relation to Yin is
          > symbolized in
          > every religion including the story in Genesis with
          > Adam disconnecting
          > from his Reason..his Oversoul in order to follow
          > Eve's impulsive Nature
          > worship.
          >
          > This sounds sexist...but it isn't. Nor am I
          > suggesting
          > the masculine principle is somehow 'better' than the
          > feminine.
          > It's just that each has it's appropriate place
          > within ourselves
          > and within cosmic order.
          >
          > It simply means that Reason should guide impulse and
          > emotion
          > in each of us.... at all times. Reason is "The Head
          > of the House"
          >
          > Kerry is a Massachusetts 'dandy' who has doubtless
          > been
          > circumcised with pinking shears.
          >
          > His politics and demeanor are much like his
          > manicure...
          > slick...polished and preened strictly for public
          > approval.
          >
          > A glib wordsmith he is, a knightly warrior he
          > aint....
          >
          > If he ever did rescue the king's maiden daughter, he
          >
          > would not have done it for Chivalry ...nor even
          > because it was the
          > right thing to do. He would have done it to win the
          > king's daughter
          > .........and to latch onto his estate.
          >
          > Behold Mordred!
          >
          > This terrorist thing upon us now is VERY huge.
          > It may not live up to Rudolph Steiner's 'War of All
          > Against All'
          > but there definitely is a global religious
          > Jihad/Crusade afoot and it is
          > also cosmic. It is the struggle between the forces
          > of civilization .....
          > .....and Chaos itself.
          >
          > Remember the 'Never Ending Story?' This drama is
          > unfolding again.
          > "The 'Nothing'" approaches and there are two options
          > left to us:
          > 1. Fight without quarter.
          > 2. Deny it and choose "peace at any price."
          >
          > I for one, choose the former because the latter is
          > the
          > sure recipe for "short term pleasure, long term
          > pain."
          >
          > Hairspray and a razor cuts somehow lose their
          > meaning when
          > adorning a severed head.
          >
          > Br. Ron
          >




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        • Social Artist
          I pondered this following this afternoon and decided to put it on the forum. Per the third paragraph of this e-mail, if you have knowledge of instances when
          Message 4 of 14 , Oct 14, 2004
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            I pondered this following this afternoon and decided
            to put it on the forum. Per the third paragraph of
            this e-mail, if you have knowledge of instances when
            Steiner discussed the motivation for Jesus's weeping,
            I'd be most interested in learning of them.

            Whether or not the death of an innocent child is
            warranted in the hunt for the guilty is a matter of
            deepest concern for the person who truly values each
            individual's right to life. The laws of the United
            States were formed with an underlying belief that it
            is better a guilty man be set free than an innocent
            man be unjustly deprived of the rights guaranteed by
            our Constitution, the right to life most definitely
            included. At some point, a time must be found when
            humanity with a clear intellect, warmed by the beating
            heart and strengthened by a mighty will, will conquer
            without the destruction of human lives and homes.
            This will be a time when the power of gentle healing
            will replace the power of guns and bullets in subduing
            the blackest of motivations.

            I wonder if this is one of the reasons Jesus wept:
            the realization of the number of those who would be
            tortured and killed in His name through all these
            centuries. That is a cross to bear. Even the
            realization that such happenings are perhaps necessary
            in the course of this evolution would provide little
            comfort to the compassionate heart.

            -George



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          • Mathew Morrell
            I m always impressed by how Br Ron formulates his thoughts. Very poetic and thoughtful. Social_Artist made some good points as well. I too am waiting for the
            Message 5 of 14 , Oct 14, 2004
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              I'm always impressed by how Br Ron formulates his thoughts. Very
              poetic and thoughtful.

              Social_Artist made some good points as well. I too am waiting for
              the day when gentle healing, not bullets, is capable of subduing the
              blackest motivations. However I think that day is a long way off.
              True evil exists. True sociopathic personalities who have no regard
              for humanity walk among us. And they can't be subdued with "gentle
              healing," just as the Nazi's couldn't, or Genghis Khan. They only
              respect one thing. Power.

              Thank goodness the World War II generation had this knowingness
              within them. Had they not, Social Artist would be a lamp shade or
              he would be speaking German.


              Mathew Morrell
              www.kcpost.net
            • LilOleMissy@SBCglobal.net
              Mathew Morrell wrote: I m always impressed by how Br Ron formulates his thoughts. Very poetic and thoughtful. Social_Artist made some good points as well. I
              Message 6 of 14 , Oct 14, 2004
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                Mathew Morrell wrote:

                I'm always impressed by how Br Ron formulates his thoughts.  Very
                poetic and thoughtful.

                Social_Artist made some good points as well.  I too am waiting for
                the day when gentle healing, not bullets, is capable of subduing the
                blackest motivations.  However I think that day is a long way off. 
                True evil exists.  True sociopathic personalities who have no regard
                for humanity walk among us.  And they can't be subdued with "gentle
                healing," just as the Nazi's couldn't, or Genghis Khan.  They only
                respect one thing.  Power. 

                Thank goodness the World War II generation had this knowingness
                within them.  Had they not, Social Artist would be a lamp shade or
                he would be speaking German.    


                Mathew Morrell
                www.kcpost.net

                Interesting thoughts here and well expressed. I'm sitting in front of the TV as every American is while trying to balance my plastic tray of goodness knows WHAT can THAT "food" came out of, ignoring my children ["I don't care if you DO descend down into the Monterey Canyon in that Rov - just take your oceanography junk and lemme be, OK?!"], hiding from neighbors who, like me, of course lack any incentive to form neighborly groups, anyway, since all I want to do right now is concentrate on Steiner's warnings contained in his "Apocolyptic" Lectures to the Priests describing just these very times. Seems to me Steiner warned us to the effect that "scarcely 1/4th of the new millenium shall have passed before..." - oh, well, everyone can read it for themselves since as an American I can't leave the TV or my plastic tray of goodness-knows-what inedible gunk came out of that can - let alone...[yawn...] um - now WHAT is it about the name/word SOCIAL that reminds me of Socialism=Liberalism=Kerry? Heavens to Betsy - NOW I have to think! [shudder...] - maybe we SHOULD have Kerry as president and get his impending horror in the Asuras' name started NOW! Gee, it's SO difficult to know WHAT to do, but no doubt I'll be instructed in my
                duties
                by the wise council of - um - lack of freedom of thought?

                Cheers, since worse - uh - better, uh huh BETTER Kerry days are ahead! WOOOOHOOOO,

                Sheila








              • Social Artist
                True sociopaths not only respect power but also crave it and find strength wherever it is being unleashed, both from the left and the right. I m curious and
                Message 7 of 14 , Oct 15, 2004
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                  True sociopaths not only respect power but also crave
                  it and find strength wherever it is being unleashed,
                  both from the left and the right.

                  I'm curious and optomistic about the outcome of
                  today's events. Realizing a democratic nation through
                  the unleashing of awesome deadly force from an
                  external party in a place that has no experience
                  living within a democratic society is something that
                  hasn't worked too well in recent memory. Though I do
                  believe it's possible and have much hope and belief
                  that it will happen, this battle is far from over.
                  The outcome of these events is not yet sealed, and it
                  would be foolish not to proceed with caution before
                  announcing total victory with bravado.

                  Overall, these conversations don't play well on the
                  Internet. These dialogues would be different if we
                  were able to have them face to face in the same room.
                  Try as we may, it's easy for the written word to be
                  taken out of context and misunderstood with shades of
                  meaning lost in the translation. My last posts have
                  been taken as an endorsement of Kerry, which was most
                  certainly not intended. Were I known in this forum as
                  more than another blip in the chat room, this would
                  probably be evident, as it is to those who do know me.

                  Even my choice of a screen name, Social Artist, was
                  construed as a proof of support for the socialist
                  system. I was endorsing social unity by suggesting
                  the formation of neighborhood gatherings, but not
                  socialist enconomic theory. Br. Ron stated that if
                  the United States were truly united in the fight in
                  Vietnam that there would have been a very different
                  outcome. Along those lines, seeing that our country
                  is not altogether united during this conflict should
                  give one pause when considering the potential outcome
                  this time around.

                  I had intended to relate that if more people in this
                  country were to work harder at thinking for themselves
                  instead of abstaining from making difficult choices,
                  then a candidate like John Kerry would quite likely
                  not be as popular. Br. Ron's post is proof of this.
                  He took the time to analyze what he had experienced
                  and formed his own reasoned opinion on the matter. I
                  haven't seen much reasoned analysis that makes a
                  strong case for Kerry as a candidate. If there were
                  more people who got their news analysis from
                  individual sources such as Br. Ron than the singular
                  John Stewart, I'd like to believe we'd be better off.

                  Ridiculing other's expressions of thought in sloppy,
                  sarcastic and cynical ways is a poor method of
                  commanding respect and should be avoided in
                  educational forums. Politics! It prompts us to
                  behave in unusual ways.

                  These are horrible and painful times with one
                  worldwide fire fight after another over the past
                  century. It's not a sign of fatal weakness for one to
                  take time to connect with the pain in this world and
                  respect those who are risking everything for a better
                  way of life further down the line.

                  In case there's any confusion, this is not intended as
                  an endorsement of government sponsored healthcare.

                  -George



                  --- "LilOleMissy@..."
                  <lilolemissy@...> wrote:


                  ---------------------------------
                  Mathew Morrell wrote:
                  I'm always impressed by how Br Ron formulates his
                  thoughts. Very
                  poetic and thoughtful.

                  Social_Artist made some good points as well. I too am
                  waiting for
                  the day when gentle healing, not bullets, is capable
                  of subduing the
                  blackest motivations. However I think that day is a
                  long way off.
                  True evil exists. True sociopathic personalities who
                  have no regard
                  for humanity walk among us. And they can't be subdued
                  with "gentle
                  healing," just as the Nazi's couldn't, or Genghis
                  Khan. They only
                  respect one thing. Power.

                  Thank goodness the World War II generation had this
                  knowingness
                  within them. Had they not, Social Artist would be a
                  lamp shade or
                  he would be speaking German.


                  Mathew Morrell
                  www.kcpost.net

                  Interesting thoughts here and well expressed. I'm
                  sitting in front ofthe TV as every American is while
                  trying to balance my plastic tray ofgoodness knows
                  WHAT can THAT "food" came out of, ignoring my
                  children["I don't care if you DO descend down into the
                  Monterey Canyon in thatRov - just take your
                  oceanography junk and lemme be, OK?!"], hidingfrom
                  neighbors who, like me, of course lack any incentive
                  to formneighborly groups, anyway, since all I want to
                  do right now isconcentrate on Steiner's warnings
                  contained in his "Apocolyptic"Lectures to the Priests
                  describing just these very times. Seems to meSteiner
                  warned us to the effect that "scarcely 1/4th of the
                  newmillenium shall have passed before..." - oh, well,
                  everyone can read itfor themselves since as an
                  American I can't leave the TV or my plastictray of
                  goodness-knows-what inedible gunk came out of that can
                  - letalone...[yawn...] um - now WHAT is it about the
                  name/word SOCIAL thatreminds me of
                  Socialism=Liberalism=Kerry? Heavens to Betsy - NOW I
                  haveto think! [shudder...] - maybe we SHOULD have
                  Kerry as president andget his impending horror in the
                  Asuras' name started NOW! Gee, it's SOdifficult to
                  know WHAT to do, but no doubt I'll be instructed in my
                  duties by the wise council of - um - lack of freedom
                  of thought?

                  Cheers, since worse - uh - better, uh huh BETTER Kerry
                  days are ahead!WOOOOHOOOO,

                  Sheila










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                • eyecueco@netscape.net
                  ... So who are you calling a sociopath? This term covers a large continuum and gets thrown around a lot in and up on people inappropriately. For instance,
                  Message 8 of 14 , Oct 15, 2004
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Social Artist <social_artist@...> wrote:

                    >True sociopaths not only respect power but also crave
                    >it and find strength wherever it is being unleashed,
                    >both from the left and the right.

                    So who are you calling a sociopath? This term covers
                    a large continuum and gets thrown around a lot in and
                    up on people inappropriately. For instance, Hitler was
                    not a sociopath, but Charlie Manson is.

                    >
                    >I'm curious and optomistic about the outcome of
                    >today's events.  Realizing a democratic nation through
                    >the unleashing of awesome deadly force from an
                    >external party in a place that has no experience
                    >living within a democratic society is something that
                    >hasn't worked too well in recent memory.


                    Guess you have not kept up with what is happening in Afganistan.
                    Kaul is no longer a capitol of silence and street beatings of women
                    for  not having their berka on straight, Girls are now going to school,
                    the soccer field there is now used for athletic games instead of public
                    executions (throats slit).

                    If you are only watching John Steward and or the MSM no wonder
                    you seem confused.

                    It is so very sad that there are so very few like Br. Ron.  So many
                    don't get it that we are in another world war.  What is especially
                    disappointing to me personally is to have discovered, since 9-11
                    that the mindset of so many who consider themselves anthroposophists
                    is that of left-wing socialism. Socialism is deadly to the developing
                    ego consciousness.
                     
                    We are not in the 6th epoch yet.
                    The conquering by the sword for the greater good is still a necessity
                    in these times, just as it was when Alexander unleased his
                    "awesome deadly force" across most of the known world, and
                    King Arthur unleased "awesome deadly force" throughout
                    Britain .

                    You might possibly consider reading something of Victor
                    David Hanson (victorhanson.com).   He knows a thing or two
                    about both the classic world, a lot about warfare, and has
                    something intelligent to say about the state of things today.
                    He's not an anthropop, but, it is interesting to discover that
                    he says essentially the same thing, from a secular voice,
                    that Johannes Walter Stein said, (i.e., that this confrontation
                    with the East at the end of the 20th Century) is a battle that
                    must be won if the world is to progress onward rather than fall
                    back into a tragic dark age.  

                    One of the sorriest points missed by the bleeding heart liberal in his
                    or her blinding, thought-stopping hatred for 'Dubya' is that the time
                    has come for the East to be brought into the 21st Century, and if the
                    current campaign against the Islamic terrorist, (which I am absolutely
                    convinced is the repetition of the Battle of Salamis predicted by Stein)
                    meets with failure, then the chance for the East to move on from tribal,
                    group ego consciousness will be lost, with the gravest of consequences
                    for the West and civilization in general.

                    It is really important for those who call themselves anthopops to remember
                    that these conflicts arise first in the higher worlds, and are then played
                    out down here below in this sad, broken domain.  It's not nice, it even
                    sucks, but, that's the game and the one that we are stuck in for a long
                    time to come. (Another reference to ponder is Trithemius and what he
                    tells us about what happens during the Time Reign of the various
                    archangels).

                    Paulina

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                  • Social Artist
                    Pauline- I got the word sociopath from Mr. Morrell s posting. His words were: True sociopathic personalities who have no regard for humanity walk among us.
                    Message 9 of 14 , Oct 15, 2004
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Pauline-

                      I got the word "sociopath" from Mr. Morrell's posting.
                      His words were:

                      "True sociopathic personalities who have no regard for
                      humanity walk among us. And they can't be subdued
                      with "gentle healing," just as the Nazi's couldn't, or
                      Genghis Khan. They only respect one thing. Power."

                      I was not intending to contradict Mr. Morrell's
                      statements with my own by responding to it. As you
                      demonstrate, sociopath was not the best word which
                      could have been used in relation to the Nazis and
                      Genghis Khan.

                      I said specifically that I was "curious and optomistic
                      about today's events." I was not disregarding the
                      current state of affairs in Afganistan by stating that
                      we are not yet out of the woods. Recent history has
                      shown that our task is difficult, which is something
                      we've all been saying in one form or another. Stating
                      that we have our work cut out for us is not the same
                      as saying we're doomed to failure or that the work
                      isn't worthy of completion.

                      I don't appreciate being directly attacked on what I
                      have said without a full understanding of my position.
                      In emphasizing caution, I am not encouraging defeat
                      or retreat in this struggle.

                      I'm saddened to see that little can come in the way of
                      elevated discourse in regard to current events in this
                      forum. I don't believe that I've contradicted Br.
                      Ron's statements in any way by my postings, and yet
                      others see fit to attack me for perceived views that I
                      do not hold. It is a wise thing to be careful to be
                      sure the attacks we make on one another are reasoned
                      and justified and not a reaction to a perceived threat
                      that may not exist.

                      I enjoy experiencing other people's passions and
                      positions on these serious issues. I'm thankful
                      you've opened yourselves up to me without knowing much
                      about me at all, allowing me to see where you're
                      coming from. Some of us are stuck in our good ways
                      and have a tendency to get a little worked up, but I
                      value what I read on the site and work to grasp what
                      people are writing as best I can, even when I'm not
                      sure I completely understand or agree with everything
                      that I'm reading, and even when the responses I
                      receive to my posts are intended to be hurtful or
                      demeaning in a way that my original posts were not. I
                      am convinced that some of the nastier tones in the
                      broader dialogue could have been avoided without
                      losing the intended point.

                      After all, I'm not the guy on the street shouting
                      antiwar statements at the rally of the Socialist
                      Party. Despite what some have insinuated, I'm really
                      not. I'm just struggling to learn what other's
                      opinions are on these matters and explore new sources
                      of information. I'm coming to the forum as an eager
                      student, not an electronic terrorist.

                      I hope I've made a little sense through all this.
                      George




                      > >I'm curious and optomistic about the outcome of
                      > >today's events. �Realizing a democratic nation
                      > through
                      > >the unleashing of awesome deadly force from an
                      > >external party in a place that has no experience
                      > >living within a democratic society is something
                      > that
                      > >hasn't worked too well in recent memory.
                      >
                      >
                      > Guess you have not kept up with what is happening in
                      > Afganistan.
                      > Kaul is no longer a capitol of silence and street
                      > beatings of women
                      > for� not having their berka on straight, Girls are
                      > now going to school,
                      > the soccer field there is now used for athletic
                      > games instead of public
                      > executions (throats slit).
                      >
                      > If you are only watching John Steward and or the MSM
                      > no wonder
                      > you seem confused.
                      >
                      > It is so very sad that there are so very few like
                      > Br. Ron. �So many
                      > don't get it that we are in another world war. �What
                      > is especially
                      > disappointing to me personally is to have
                      > discovered, since 9-11
                      > that the mindset of so many who consider themselves
                      > anthroposophists
                      > is that of left-wing socialism. Socialism is deadly
                      > to the developing
                      > ego consciousness.
                      > �
                      > We are not in the 6th epoch yet.
                      > The conquering by the sword for the greater good is
                      > still a necessity
                      > in these times, just as it was when Alexander
                      > unleased his
                      > "awesome deadly force" across most of the known
                      > world, and
                      > King Arthur unleased "awesome deadly force"
                      > throughout
                      > Britain .
                      >
                      > You might possibly consider reading something of
                      > Victor
                      > David Hanson (victorhanson.com). � He knows a thing
                      > or two
                      > about both the classic world, a lot about warfare,
                      > and has
                      > something intelligent to say about the state of
                      > things today.
                      > He's not an anthropop, but, it is interesting to
                      > discover that
                      > he says essentially the same thing, from a secular
                      > voice,
                      > that Johannes Walter Stein said, (i.e., that this
                      > confrontation
                      > with the East at the end of the 20th Century) is a
                      > battle that
                      > must be won if the world is to progress onward
                      > rather than fall
                      > back into a tragic dark age. �
                      >
                      > One of the sorriest points missed by the bleeding
                      > heart liberal in his
                      > or her blinding, thought-stopping hatred for
                      > 'Dubya' is that the time
                      > has come for the East to be brought into the 21st
                      > Century, and if the
                      > current campaign against the Islamic terrorist,
                      > (which I am absolutely
                      > convinced is the repetition of the Battle of Salamis
                      > predicted by Stein)
                      > meets with failure, then the chance for the East to
                      > move on from tribal,
                      > group ego consciousness will be lost, with the
                      > gravest of consequences
                      > for the West and civilization in general.
                      >
                      > It is really important for those who call themselves
                      > anthopops to remember
                      > that these conflicts arise first in the higher
                      > worlds, and are then played
                      > out down here below in this sad, broken domain.
                      > �It's not nice, it even
                      > sucks, but, that's the game and the one that we are
                      > stuck in for a long
                      > time to come. (Another reference to ponder is
                      > Trithemius and what he
                      > tells us about what happens during the Time Reign of
                      > the various
                      > archangels).
                      >
                      > Paulina
                      >
                      >
                      __________________________________________________________________
                      > Switch to Netscape Internet Service.
                      > As low as $9.95 a month -- Sign up today at
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                      >
                      > Netscape. Just the Net You Need.
                      >
                      > New! Netscape Toolbar for Internet Explorer
                      > Search from anywhere on the Web and block those
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                      > http://channels.netscape.com/ns/search/install.jsp
                      >




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                    • DoctorStarman@aol.com
                      In a message dated 10/14/2004 5:54:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ... ******* I know of the most famous case. The shortest verse of the Bible is Jesus wept
                      Message 10 of 14 , Oct 18, 2004
                      • 0 Attachment
                        In a message dated 10/14/2004 5:54:35 PM Eastern Daylight Time, social_artist@... writes:

                        I pondered this following this afternoon and decided
                        to put it on the forum.  Per the third paragraph of
                        this e-mail, if you have knowledge of instances when
                        Steiner discussed the motivation for Jesus's weeping,
                        I'd be most interested in learning of them.


                        ******* I know of the most famous case. The shortest verse of the Bible is "Jesus wept" ----at the raising of Lazarus. It was said that way to draw attention to the fact that the Christ was doing something special: through his love for the man Lazarus, he was initiating him, just as the initiates in olden times used the power of love to keep a candidate alive as they separated his etheric body from his physical one, in memory of which the initiate was afterwards known as "the Loved One." This man, Lazarus, later became the apostle John, always referred to as the disciple the Lord "loved."

                        -starman
                        www.DrStarman.net
                      • DoctorStarman@aol.com
                        ... *******Well, my memory goes back to Japan in 1945. I d say the US did a pretty good job of transforming that completely undemocratic nation after using
                        Message 11 of 14 , Oct 18, 2004
                        • 0 Attachment
                          social_artist@... writes:
                          True sociopaths not only respect power but also crave
                          it and find strength wherever it is being unleashed,
                          both from the left and the right.
                          I'm curious and optomistic about the outcome of
                          today's events.  Realizing a democratic nation through
                          the unleashing of awesome deadly force from an
                          external party in a place that has no experience
                          living within a democratic society is something that
                          hasn't worked too well in recent memory...


                          *******Well, my memory goes back to Japan in 1945. I'd say the US did a pretty good job of transforming that completely undemocratic nation after using deadly force to overwhelm it. Its women, for instance, had as little freedom as those in Afghanistan and Iraq did until this year.

                             I think we need to remember that freedom is the "zeitgeist" or spirit of the age, being able to act freely out of your intuition of the right thing to do. Even if group-souls of nations have no tradition of freedom of religion, self-government, etc., the yearning of all human beings in our time is to be free, and the Zeitgeist is far more powerful than the Archangels of each country. If we work with that yearning, give people the means to determine their own lives,  it will succeed sooner or later.


                              I'dsay we're at the start of a Third World War the past 3 years, one that will last at least as long as the Cold War, a generation or two. But as long as we stay on the side of peoples' demand for freedom, we'll win.
                          -starman
                          www.DrStarman.net
                        • DoctorStarman@aol.com
                          ... *******It s the reason why I have not been very active with the Society in the US, and not at all with the Social Science section, despite being a
                          Message 12 of 14 , Oct 18, 2004
                          • 0 Attachment


                            >I'm curious and optomistic about the outcome of
                            >today's events.  Realizing a democratic nation through
                            >the unleashing of awesome deadly force from an
                            >external party in a place that has no experience
                            >living within a democratic society is something that
                            >hasn't worked too well in recent memory.

                            eyecueco@... writes:
                            Guess you have not kept up with what is happening in Afganistan.
                            Kaul is no longer a capitol of silence and street beatings of women
                            for  not having their berka on straight, Girls are now going to school,
                            the soccer field there is now used for athletic games instead of public
                            executions (throats slit).
                            If you are only watching John Steward and or the MSM no wonder
                            you seem confused.
                            It is so very sad that there are so very few like Br. Ron.  So many
                            don't get it that we are in another world war.  What is especially
                            disappointing to me personally is to have discovered, since 9-11
                            that the mindset of so many who consider themselves anthroposophists
                            is that of left-wing socialism. Socialism is deadly to the developing
                            ego consciousness....


                            *******It's the reason why I have not been very active with the Society in the US, and not at all with the Social Science section, despite being a professor of the social sciences: the leftist bias. Socialism is a materialistic-thought-based illusion that anyone on the spiritual path must see through eventually. That so many anthroposophists were rabid leftists was depressing to me when I first found it to be so in the 1980s, and only showed me that they had not really gotten anywhere on the Path yet.



                            You might possibly consider reading something of Victor
                            David Hanson (victorhanson.com).  He knows a thing or two
                            about both the classic world, a lot about warfare, and  has
                            something intelligent to say about the state of things today.
                            He's not an anthropop, but, it is interesting to discover that
                            he says essentially the same thing, from a secular voice,
                            that Johannes Walter Stein said,  (i.e., that this confrontation
                            with the East at the end of the 20th Century) is a battle that
                            must be won if the world is to progress onward rather than fall
                            back into a tragic dark age. 
                            One  of the sorriest points missed by the bleeding heart liberal in his
                            or her blinding,  thought-stopping hatred for 'Dubya' is that the time
                            has come for the East to be brought into the 21st Century, and if the
                            current campaign against the Islamic terrorist, (which I am absolutely 
                            convinced is the repetition of the Battle of Salamis predicted by Stein)
                            meets with failure, then the chance for the East to move on from tribal,
                            group ego consciousness will be lost, with the gravest of consequences
                            for the West and civilization in general.
                            It is really important for those who call themselves anthopops to remember
                            that these conflicts arise first in the higher worlds, and are then played
                            out down here below in this sad, broken domain.  It's not nice, it even
                            sucks, but, that's the game and the one that we are stuck in for a long
                            time to come.  (Another reference to ponder is Trithemius and what he
                            tells us about what happens during the Time Reign of the various
                            archangels).
                            Paulina


                            ********As a matter of fact, by Thithemius von Spondheim's 343-year cycles (which Steiner pointed to), a replay or repeat of the Battle of Salamis, which is to say a catclysmic confrontation between the inividuality-denying East and the individual-affirming West, was forecast for either Sept. 2000 or Sept. 2001, depending how you calculate.
                            -starman
                            www.DrStarman.net
                          • DoctorStarman@aol.com
                            In a message dated 10/14/2004 5:44:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ... *******Well, it s election time, and Steiner did have a lot to say about the practical
                            Message 13 of 14 , Oct 18, 2004
                            • 0 Attachment
                              In a message dated 10/14/2004 5:44:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time, social_artist@... writes:


                              My goodness, Br. Ron.  You have some interesting
                              points, and your exposition is certainly dramatic;
                              however, it is my recollection that political
                              discussions in this forum were to be avoided.  In the
                              end, it seems to me that the scariest part of today's
                              political landscape is the apathetic nature of the
                              American people, who more and more spend the length of
                              their days eating canned foods off of plastic plates
                              in front of the television instead of raising their
                              children and organizing social events with their
                              neighbors.  This is the reason a fellow like Kerry is
                              up for the presidency.  It's not as though the guy had
                              to burn down the Reichstag.


                              *******Well, it's election time, and Steiner did have a lot to say about the practical world of organizing society. I just fear that allowing political discussions will degenerate into arguments and, as they say, creat "much heat but little light."

                                  It's amazing how people studying the same material can so easily come to the conclusion that it supports their opinion that one of two candidates is the Devil, while others say the exact same thing is equally clear about his opponent! It all only shows that people haven't really digested the teaching about the Mystery of Evil, that there are two devils. Of any two candidates, I'm sure a case could be made how either of them would advance the cause of evil, because there are two opposite causes of evil.

                              -starman
                              www.DrStarman.net
                            • Renee Lattimore
                              Thanks for giving such a eloquent message. On the eve of this election, I have confidence that right will win. Renee Lattimore Br. Ron
                              Message 14 of 14 , Nov 1, 2004
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Thanks for giving such a eloquent message.  On the eve of this election, I have confidence that right will win.
                                 
                                Renee Lattimore

                                "Br. Ron" <rlloyd@...> wrote:
                                 
                                This is just my opinion and good folks can disagree.
                                 
                                Qabala is a wonderful spiritual tool because it reveals
                                the location of spiritual shadows.
                                 
                                Let's apply this to American politics.
                                 
                                John Kerry to be not only and opportunistic machine
                                but a full blown traitor....both in the 70s and now.

                                First, look into his face. It doesn't take a Cagliostro to see
                                he only occasionally departs from the haunting image of 'just
                                another genderless, talking head.'
                                 
                                Clever?...Yes....to the point of demagoguery but more importantly
                                he lacks that essential soul quality associated with a vulnerable
                                conscience. Kerry seems blissfully free of both passion and heart,
                                Bereft of any genuine 'fire in the belly' he lives up to the
                                Qabalistic term
                                'qliphoth'.....which is but a shell.

                                Kerry gets his juice from professional victims and survives
                                politically by simple negativity and doubt...by making all things
                                pertaining to the US an "error."

                                His opportunistic grandstanding in the Seventies torpedoed our
                                "might for right" and served to lead to the wholesale
                                slaughter of nearly a million Vietnamese after the war...to say
                                nothing of setting up Pol Pot's evil rampage in Cambodia.

                                Had we been truly the UNITED States in winning that conflict,
                                there would have been far fewer human casualties and we would
                                have established a bright bastion of freedom in Indochina.
                                (A case in point is what we saw taking root this weekend in Afghanistan,
                                sporting endless lines of men and women risking life and limb to get
                                to vote...... for the first time ever!)

                                Regardless of the rampant left wing cynicism, this war
                                aint all just about money and oil. It is not even about Iraq or
                                the Middle East. It's a cosmic power grab chronicled in the texts of
                                every major religion,... albeit by different names.

                                There are parasitic forces tempting us from our bravery
                                and degrading our duty; our heavenly mandate of sacrifice and
                                promulgation of  'Good' performed in manly and knightly ways.
                                If this vampirism succeeds, all Life on Earth will cease.

                                As a man, I see ridding the world of parasitic tyranny is a
                                chivalrous duty. Chivalry is a religion not unlike the Samurai.
                                But "Might for Right" is a creed grasped only by practitioners
                                of TRUE self sacrificial Love, a concept for which the political left
                                gives lip service but has absolutely no grasp.

                                Kerry cannot win. ....He MUST NOT win.

                                Fortunately, Americans are ultimately driven by an innate sense of right
                                and wrong. I trust us to distinguish between the verbose, reflected specter
                                of 'lunar light' in contrast to the real thing. True Beings of Light demonstrate
                                Spirit and self reliance, not social dependency. They display the self generating
                                Solar Light emanating from yes, the Sun of God.

                                Remember King Arthur had an effeminate offspring like our slick
                                friend. Mordred was massaged, oiled and pussified daily by his
                                mother, Morgan LeFay. This lunar witch was Arthur's sister
                                with whom he slept. Mordred, the incestual offspring of this union,
                                ultimately brought down Arthur's solar kingdom which in truth was
                                initiated by the Christos.

                                This archetypal gender battle repeating itself once again
                                on the stage of American and global politics. The I-Ching has a
                                hexagram ('KUN...The Receptive...with a moving line at the top)
                                which says:
                                    "In the top place the Yin (female) element should yield to the light.
                                    If it attempts to maintain a position to which it is not entitled
                                    and to rule instead of serving, it draws down on itself the anger
                                    of the strong. A struggle ensues in which it is overthrown,
                                    with injury, however, to both sides. Therefore, it is a sign
                                    that in unnatural contest both primal powers (Male and Female)
                                    suffer injury."

                                This gender confusion of Yang in relation to Yin is symbolized in
                                every religion including the story in Genesis with Adam disconnecting
                                from his Reason..his Oversoul in order to follow Eve's impulsive Nature
                                worship.

                                This sounds sexist...but it isn't. Nor am I suggesting
                                the masculine principle is somehow 'better' than the feminine.
                                It's just that each has it's appropriate place within ourselves
                                and within cosmic order.
                                It simply means that Reason should guide impulse and emotion
                                in each of us.... at all times. Reason is "The Head of the House"

                                Kerry is a Massachusetts 'dandy' who has doubtless been
                                circumcised with pinking shears.

                                His politics and demeanor are much like his manicure...
                                slick...polished and preened strictly for public approval.

                                A glib wordsmith he is, a knightly warrior he aint....

                                If he ever did rescue the king's maiden daughter, he
                                would not have done it for Chivalry ...nor even because it was the
                                right thing to do. He would have done it to win the king's daughter
                                .........and to latch onto his estate.

                                Behold Mordred!

                                This terrorist thing upon us now is VERY huge.
                                It may not live up to Rudolph Steiner's 'War of All Against All'
                                but there definitely is a global religious Jihad/Crusade afoot and it is
                                also cosmic. It is the struggle between the forces of civilization .....
                                .....and Chaos itself.

                                Remember the 'Never Ending Story?'  This drama is unfolding again.
                                "The 'Nothing'" approaches and there are two options left to us:
                                1. Fight without quarter.
                                2. Deny it and choose "peace at any price."
                                 
                                I for one, choose the former because the latter is the
                                sure recipe for "short term pleasure, long term pain."

                                Hairspray and a razor cuts somehow lose their meaning when
                                adorning a severed head.

                                Br. Ron


                                Post to steiner@egroups.comSearch the archives of the group at:
                                http://www.esotericlinks.com/egroupsearch.html

                                Recommended books by Rudolf Steiner at:
                                http://www.esotericlinks.com/steinerbooks.html

                                ommended books by Rudolf Steiner at:
                                http://www.esotericlinks.com/steinerbooks.html





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