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Re: [steiner] colors

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  • DRStarman2001@aol.com
    In a message dated 11/6/2002 1:16:57 PM Eastern Standard Time, ... *******Here is the opinion of an anthroposophical art therapist friend of mine: Green is the
    Message 1 of 16 , Nov 6, 2002
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      In a message dated 11/6/2002 1:16:57 PM Eastern Standard Time, kaalsasa@... writes:



      Could someone tell me about colors?  My son has loved dark green for
      a long time.  He is 8.  Karen Jo


      *******Here is the opinion of an anthroposophical art therapist friend of mine:

      Green is the color of incarnation. We stand in the middle of the heavens and the earth, connecting the cosmos to the earth. So we come from God, through the sun, and come here on earth through the Son, and through the "viridian green". We connect into the earth in all greens. So when you say that he loves the dark green,  it could mean that he is deeply incarnated into the earth already.  This sounds like a healthy indication for him..My question would be, is it a nice clean green?  A healthy looking green?  Look at the colors of nature, they're all different shades of green. And the greens of nature connect us to the earth. So congratulations on a good job! It sounds like he is on the earth standing on his own two feet.

      Dr. Starman

      http://www.DrStarman.net
    • kaalsasa@aol.com
      Thanks. That s great to hear. *K*
      Message 2 of 16 , Nov 6, 2002
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        Thanks.  That's great to hear.  *K*
      • golden3000997@cs.com
        Hello! I read Dr. Starman s answer and it is a very good one. However, there are many things to consider when interpreting color effects. You said for a long
        Message 3 of 16 , Nov 7, 2002
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          Hello!

          I read Dr. Starman's answer and it is a very good one. However, there are
          many things to consider when interpreting color effects. You said "for a long
          time" and your son is only 8. If he showed a preference at a very young age,
          he might have been responding to the "after image" rather than the color
          itself. Take a white sheet of paper and place or draw a small shape of dark
          green on it. Look at it for about 1 minute, then shift your gaze to the white
          part of the paper. What color do you see? That's the after image and all
          colors do the same thing. There was an artist in the 60's who painted the
          American Flag in green and orange for the same reason. Young children are
          most strongly affected by the after image, and this can be used to good
          effect by parents if they are aware of it. Rudolf Steiner went into great
          depth about the Four Temperaments in the education of children from 7 to 14
          and there is a lot of material about color influences. In children younger
          than 7, the temperaments are not necessarily used as an educational tool, but
          you can certainly see the tendencies in the individual. Many anthropop
          parents dress their little cholerics in red!!! If you don't see why, let me
          know how familiar you are with the 4 temperaments in child development and if
          you need more info. And for the color - do the after image test.

          Of course, every child is a very complex riddle and there are hundreds of
          factors to consider when trying to understand one individual - temperament,
          astrology, heredity, genetics, early experiences, past life experiences,
          cultural influences, family influences and sometimes just the "....what
          the???...." factor!!!

          Green is lovely, so is red, yellow, blue, orange, purple, pink, white, black,
          brown, aqua, ad infinitum! What are your preferences? What colors predominate
          in your home? Your clothes? Have you ever taken a Steiner oriented watercolor
          painting class? Has your son? Is he in a Waldorf School? If so, perhaps you
          would like to discuss this orientation with his teacher.

          I am curious, though - it must be a very stong influence in his life and in
          your family for it to be important enough for you to seek answers about.
          Would you like to say anything more about its significance for you?

          Let me know if you need reading material references. Please try the little
          "experiment" yourself. And best wishes!

          Christine
        • Lutz Baar
          Hi Christine! Thanks for your report on colors! A wounderful contribution to this list - the kind one (hopes) to find when reading an anthroposophical list.
          Message 4 of 16 , Nov 7, 2002
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            Hi Christine!

            Thanks for your report on colors! A wounderful contribution to this
            list - the kind one (hopes) to find when reading an anthroposophical
            list.

            Since you care about colors - have you visited my page with colored
            planetary seals?

            http://www.antropos.org/siegel.htm

            Regards, Lutz

            PS. Ever thought of moving to Sweden?


            --- In steiner@y..., golden3000997@c... wrote:
            > Hello!
            >
            > I read Dr. Starman's answer and it is a very good one. However,
            there are
            > many things to consider when interpreting color effects. ... ...
          • LilOleMiss
            Lutz, thank you for sharing this - it is incredibly beautiful!!!!!!!! Sheila Lutz wrote: Since you care about colors - have you visited my page with colored
            Message 5 of 16 , Nov 7, 2002
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              Lutz, thank you for sharing this - it is incredibly beautiful!!!!!!!!
              Sheila
              Lutz wrote:
              Since you care about colors - have you visited my page with colored
              planetary seals?

              http://www.antropos.org/siegel.htm

            • Pacbay
              Can we get an English translation of the copy of this site??? jeff ... From: LilOleMiss To: steiner@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 10:07 AM
              Message 6 of 16 , Nov 7, 2002
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                Can we get an English translation of the copy of this site???
                 
                jeff
                ----- Original Message -----
                Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 10:07 AM
                Subject: Re: [steiner] Re: colors

                Lutz, thank you for sharing this - it is incredibly beautiful!!!!!!!!
                Sheila
                Lutz wrote:
                Since you care about colors - have you visited my page with colored
                planetary seals?

                http://www.antropos.org/siegel.htm


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              • DRStarman2001@aol.com
                *******I didn t mention the complimentary color because that is only true up to the change of teeth, about age 6, and the child is 8. But thanks for bringing
                Message 7 of 16 , Nov 7, 2002
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                  *******I didn't mention the complimentary color because that is only true up to the change of teeth, about age 6, and the child is 8. But thanks for bringing it up.
                  -starman

                  Hello!

                  I read Dr. Starman's answer and it is a very good one. However, there are
                  many things to consider when interpreting color effects. You said "for a long
                  time" and your son is only 8. If he showed a preference at a very young age,
                  he might have been responding to the "after image" rather than the color
                  itself. Take a white sheet of paper and place or draw a small shape of dark
                  green on it. Look at it for about 1 minute, then shift your gaze to the white
                  part of the paper. What color do you see? That's the after image and all
                  colors do the same thing. There was an artist in the 60's who painted the
                  American Flag in green and orange for the same reason. Young children are
                  most strongly affected by the after image, and this can be used to good
                  effect by parents if they are aware of it. Rudolf Steiner went into great
                  depth about the Four Temperaments in the education of children from 7 to 14
                  and there is a lot of material about color influences. In children younger
                  than 7, the temperaments are not necessarily used as an educational tool, but
                  you can certainly see the tendencies in the individual. Many anthropop
                  parents dress their little cholerics in red!!! If you don't see why, let me
                  know how familiar you are with the 4 temperaments in child development and if
                  you need more info. And for the color - do the after image test.

                  Of course, every child is a very complex riddle and there are hundreds of
                  factors to consider when trying to understand one individual - temperament,
                  astrology, heredity, genetics, early experiences, past life experiences,
                  cultural influences, family influences and sometimes just the "....what
                  the???...." factor!!!

                  Green is lovely, so is red, yellow, blue, orange, purple, pink, white, black,
                  brown, aqua, ad infinitum! What are your preferences? What colors predominate
                  in your home? Your clothes? Have you ever taken a Steiner oriented watercolor
                  painting class? Has your son? Is he in a Waldorf School? If so, perhaps you
                  would like to discuss this orientation with his teacher.

                  I am curious, though - it must be a very stong influence in his life and in
                  your family for it to be important enough for you to seek answers about.
                  Would you like to say anything more about its significance for you?

                  Let me know if you need reading material references. Please try the little
                  "experiment" yourself. And best wishes!

                  Christine



                  http://www.DrStarman.net
                • golden3000997@cs.com
                  Hello Lutz, Thank you for your thumbs up . I did see the seals and I downloaded your wonderful animation. I would love to have the single shots, too if
                  Message 8 of 16 , Nov 7, 2002
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                    Hello Lutz,
                    Thank you for your "thumbs up". I did see the seals and I downloaded your
                    wonderful animation. I would love to have the single shots, too if possible.
                    We drew the seals freehand during my Foundation Year in Spring Valley. That
                    was 1976-77 and it was called "Threefold Center for Adult Education" then. My
                    primary teacher, who we followed out to Fair Oaks, was Rene Querido. We drew
                    the seals underthe tutelage of a wonderful British veteran Waldorf teacher, a
                    Mr. Mann. We weren't allowed to trace or use any device except a pie wedge
                    cardboard template since dividing a circle into equal 7th's is a bit tricky.
                    I finished all of the seals except Venus. It is something that I either need
                    to do before I die, or I think I'll be condemned to come back as a Waldorf
                    teacher again ! ; )

                    Seeing the seals transmute is a powerful experience. I suppose in an age of
                    more fully developed clairvoyance, or just ordinary imagination, one could
                    conjure the metamorphosis in one's own mind (probably the whole point) but
                    being a "bear of very little brain" I hadn't yet gotten it!

                    Blessings,
                    Christine
                  • eurythmy
                    Dear Christine, I think I met him many times as my neighbour and in anthroposophical meetings. He was called for eons Moocky Mann and did design a bit of
                    Message 9 of 16 , Nov 8, 2002
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                      Dear Christine,
                      I think I met him many times as my neighbour and in anthroposophical meetings. He was called for eons Moocky Mann and did design a bit of Michael Hal school buildings etc. in Sussex. He thought he was responsible of his forms in front of the spiritual world and was extremely committed. His house was full of furniture's and adornment, lamp shades etc he did himself.
                      at the end of his life with his wife Liselotte man he translated the Calendar of the Soul.
                      ----- Original Message -----
                      Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:35 AM
                      Subject: Re: [steiner] Re: colors

                      Hello Lutz,
                      Thank you for your "thumbs up". I did see the seals and I downloaded your
                      wonderful animation. I would love to have the single shots, too if possible.
                      We drew the seals freehand during my Foundation Year in Spring Valley. That
                      was 1976-77 and it was called "Threefold Center for Adult Education" then. My
                      primary teacher, who we followed out to Fair Oaks, was Rene Querido. We drew
                      the seals underthe tutelage of a wonderful British veteran Waldorf teacher, a
                      Mr. Mann. We weren't allowed to trace or use any device except a pie wedge
                      cardboard template since dividing a circle into equal 7th's is a bit tricky.
                      I finished all of the seals except Venus. It is something that I either need
                      to do before I die, or I think I'll be condemned to come back as a Waldorf
                      teacher again ! ;  )

                      Seeing the seals transmute is a powerful experience. I suppose in an age of
                      more fully developed clairvoyance, or just ordinary imagination, one could
                      conjure the metamorphosis in one's own mind (probably the whole point) but
                      being a "bear of very little brain" I hadn't yet gotten it!

                      Blessings,
                      Christine

                      Post to steiner@egroups.com

                      To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                      steiner-unsubscribe@egroups.com

                      Search the archives of the group at:
                      http://www.esotericlinks.com/egroupsearch.html

                      Recommended books by Rudolf Steiner at:
                      http://www.esotericlinks.com/steinerbooks.html



                      Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                    • golden3000997@cs.com
                      I was very fortunate that I found Rudolf Steiner at Threefold Farm at the age of 16 (1972) and there were many wonderful people there through the time I lived
                      Message 10 of 16 , Nov 8, 2002
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                        I was very fortunate that I found Rudolf Steiner at Threefold Farm at the age of 16 (1972) and there were many wonderful people there through the time I lived in Spring Valley who were in their 60s, 70s, and even 80s and 90s! I was a rebellious and troubled teen, but my soul knew absolutely that everything they had to share was precious. I took every word to heart. And one of the most important aspects of my relationship with them all, including Alan Howard, Charlotte Parker, Irene Ellis and many whose names I forgot, but whose faces and spirits still shine brightly within me, was their absolutely non-judgemental approach to this wild child. They were absolute in their knowledge of how such and such should be done - what in our liberal age would be considered "dogmatic" - but in their personal approach, they were very accepting. If I had ever felt criticized or condemned for my lifestyle, I may have turned away, but my older guardian angels were always interested in the light they seemed to see within me and not much concerned with the darkness. I can't even express how much this has meant to me through the years.

                        When I paint with my children in Kindergarten, every paint jar and water jar is sparkling clean, the mood is hushed and I hand out each brush one by one and don't let go of it until the child (or adult) says "Thank you". I remember how surprised some of the other trainees were when Irene Ellis did this with us, but I loved it and knew that it was the true way. Within the true form, there is absolute freedom. And I have the most amazing and glorious watercolor paintings from my children to prove it.

                        Our present time has everything so confused. We are not supposed to say "You must do it this way." Yet we continually criticize and condemn the results. For example, in my office I sit right next to a single mom with a 5 year old boy (named Angel). She and I talk about children and education, but I try to be gentle in my Waldorf approach. She recently went to a parent-teacher conference and was told that Angel didn't draw very well!!!! Oh boy!! I looked at one of his drawings and there were three classic pre-change of teeth ladder forms! His drawings were energetic and positive and totally on target. To judge whether or not a five year old can draw "well" is totally absurd. Yet parents used to have a little trouble from time to time in the fact that I only gave the children in my Kindergarten four colors of block crayons (in separate baskets and cleaned regularly). I would have to sit with the parents and let them play with the crayons themselves to see how beautifully all of the other colors revealed themselves. I included "gold" or a yellow-orange because light yellow is hard to create a form with. The children, of course, never seemed to have any difficulties with it. During all of my years of teaching Kindergarten, we went every day from Story time to Crayon Drawing (except on Friday, which was a little upside down because of Watercolor Painting). I did not make the children tell me about their drawing, although I listened happily if they offered to. I put their name and date in the corner and at Christmas and at the end of the year, I bound them into a book which the child gave to his or her parents as a gift. Later, I had the parents bring in the book and I went through it with them, explaining changes in the child's development that one can see so clearly through the months.

                        I may have digressed a bit, but your phrase that Mr. Mann felt "responsible for his forms in front of the spiritual world" almost has me crying. If only more people could feel that way about their work and have something so precious within their souls, what a world it would be.

                        "eurythmy" <eurythmy@...> wrote:

                        >Dear Christine,
                        >I think I met him many times as my neighbour and in anthroposophical meetings. He was called for eons Moocky Mann and did design a bit of Michael Hal school buildings etc. in Sussex. He thought he was responsible of his forms in front of the spiritual world and was extremely committed. His house was full of furniture's and adornment, lamp shades etc he did himself.
                        >at the end of his life with his wife Liselotte man he translated the Calendar of the Soul.
                        >  ----- Original Message -----
                        >  From: golden3000997@...
                        >  To: steiner@yahoogroups.com
                        >  Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 12:35 AM
                        >  Subject: Re: [steiner] Re: colors
                        >
                        >
                        >  Hello Lutz,
                        >  Thank you for your "thumbs up". I did see the seals and I downloaded your
                        >  wonderful animation. I would love to have the single shots, too if possible.
                        >  We drew the seals freehand during my Foundation Year in Spring Valley. That
                        >  was 1976-77 and it was called "Threefold Center for Adult Education" then. My
                        >  primary teacher, who we followed out to Fair Oaks, was Rene Querido. We drew
                        >  the seals underthe tutelage of a wonderful British veteran Waldorf teacher, a
                        >  Mr. Mann. We weren't allowed to trace or use any device except a pie wedge
                        >  cardboard template since dividing a circle into equal 7th's is a bit tricky.
                        >  I finished all of the seals except Venus. It is something that I either need
                        >  to do before I die, or I think I'll be condemned to come back as a Waldorf
                        >  teacher again ! ;  )
                        >
                        >  Seeing the seals transmute is a powerful experience. I suppose in an age of
                        >  more fully developed clairvoyance, or just ordinary imagination, one could
                        >  conjure the metamorphosis in one's own mind (probably the whole point) but
                        >  being a "bear of very little brain" I hadn't yet gotten it!
                        >
                        >  Blessings,
                        >  Christine
                        >
                        >  Post to steiner@egroups.com
                        >
                        >  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                        >  steiner-unsubscribe@egroups.com
                        >
                        >  Search the archives of the group at:
                        >  http://www.esotericlinks.com/egroupsearch.html
                        >
                        >  Recommended books by Rudolf Steiner at:
                        >  http://www.esotericlinks.com/steinerbooks.html
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
                        >
                        >
                      • DRStarman2001@aol.com
                        In a message dated 11/8/2002 12:43:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, ... ******Charlotte Parker was as close to an angel as I ve ever met. She would be horrified at
                        Message 11 of 16 , Nov 8, 2002
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                          In a message dated 11/8/2002 12:43:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, golden3000997@... writes:



                          I was very fortunate that I found Rudolf Steiner at Threefold Farm at the age of 16 (1972) and there were many wonderful people there through the time I lived in Spring Valley who were in their 60s, 70s, and even 80s and 90s! I was a rebellious and troubled teen, but my soul knew absolutely that everything they had to share was precious. I took every word to heart. And one of the most important aspects of my relationship with them all, including Alan Howard, Charlotte Parker, Irene Ellis and many whose names I forgot....


                          ******Charlotte Parker was as close to an angel as I've ever met. She would be horrified at hearing such flattery, of course. ;->

                          Dr. Starman

                          http://www.DrStarman.net
                        • Julie Heynssens
                          I d like to introduce myself (sorry if this gets long, there is a bit of self-discovery in this process)… My name is Julie. I have been interested in
                          Message 12 of 16 , Nov 8, 2002
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                            I'd like to introduce myself (sorry if this gets long,
                            there is a bit of self-discovery in this process)�

                            My name is Julie. I have been interested in Waldorf
                            Education for about 6 months. I was looking for ways
                            to help my two mildly learning disabled and talented
                            children. At the time, I was working with both of
                            them on rhythmic memory, spelling, and math drills.
                            These drills seemed to awaken a part of their brain
                            that had been dulled by too much information and not
                            enough time to discover what it all means.

                            About that time I found a mention of Waldorf Education
                            on a website, and I started to investigate on my own.
                            I found a lot of wonderful articles about how Waldorf
                            Education guides children by letting them develop
                            their potential. They use knitting, baking,
                            woodcarving, and many other hands-on skills to develop
                            perseverance and a sense of accomplishment in young
                            children. I felt very peaceful and less rushed when I
                            was studying the Waldorf curriculum. I began to
                            wonder if this approach to education would be the best
                            for my artistically gifted, melancholic,
                            compassionate, but mathematically and spelling
                            challenged daughter.

                            Next, I discovered Dan Dugan and PLANS. At first, I
                            was put off by some of his criticisms, but slowly
                            began to realize the shallowness of his arguments. He
                            was upset by any mention of God in any school. There
                            were others that were upset by any mention of the
                            "wrong" God in any school. They used obscure passages
                            that were written by Steiner to "prove" that Waldorf
                            Schools were racist or that they only taught medieval
                            knowledge. I was persuaded to investigate Waldorf
                            further when a read a speech give by Eugene Schwartz
                            at Sunbridge College that addressed many of the
                            criticisms of Dugan.

                            Since that time, I have read a couple of books. The
                            first was a collection of essays called "Waldorf
                            Schools, Upper Grades and High School". I am normally
                            a fast reader, but it took me several months to read
                            this book. I would read an essay (or half and essay)
                            and would have to stop to think about what I had just
                            read, to absorb its meaning. Sometimes it took days
                            for the full meaning to sink in before I was ready for
                            more.

                            Now I am reading a book on the Temperaments that I
                            picked up at the local Anthroposophical bookstore. I
                            was extremely impatient with this book at first. I
                            knew what I wanted to know from this book, but I just
                            couldn't skim it and find what I was looking for. So
                            I actually sat down and read it. Then I got to a
                            passage about a painting of Christ that had Matthew,
                            Mark, Luke, and John surrounding him and how the four
                            temperaments was reflected in these four Apostles. I
                            was completely amazed. I would never have been able
                            to comprehend all the subtleties of meaning in that
                            passage unless I had spent the time to actually read
                            the book. So much that of the information that we are
                            expected to ingest for life in this modern world is
                            "junk food" for the brain that deserves to be skimmed.
                            The Anthroposophical works that I have come across
                            deserve to be read.

                            I am also reading a book by Georg Unger on
                            "Forming Concepts in Physics". That book I haven't
                            been able to pick up for a month because I am still
                            wrestling with the philosophical implications of
                            Quantum Mechanics. I should be able to get back to
                            that one soon.

                            I've been hanging out around Highland Hall and the
                            local bookstore for a few months now and have been
                            enjoying the conversation immensely. We are planning
                            on enrolling Gwen in the 9th grade at Highland Hall
                            next fall and I am rounding up the resources and time
                            that I need to start their teacher training in
                            January.

                            Have Fun,

                            Julie


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