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Re: [Star Trek Books] OT: Author Orson Scott Card Blasts Star Trek

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  • Scott
    Honestly reading both Comments I beleive Orson Scott Card is entitled to his own opinion...I think the way he said it unnerved me a bit and non suprising how
    Message 1 of 6 , May 3, 2005
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      Honestly reading both Comments I beleive Orson Scott Card is entitled to his own opinion...I think the way he said it unnerved me a bit and non suprising how much of a utter *censored* hes acting about this. I have no control over his statement so he can say what he wants.
      Many Authors he happened to name either knew Gene Roddenberry as a freind a passing consultant or wrote some wonderful Stories(the most memorable) for him on a show that left a impression on so many so he lost his point there.

      A good example On a chance meeting Issac Asminov met Gene prior to the First Airing Of TOS and really enjoyed "Where No Man's gone Before." at a local Science Fiction Convention.(the first meeting actually had Roddenberry telling Asminov to Shut up while he had the pilot on. Roddentberry had no knowledge he just insulted his idol After the incident they both were good freinds.)

      I feel TOS is technically a bit stronger in storytelling than any other Trek. And had more a wow factor and was taken more seroiusly by the Science Fiction Community.Because most of TV Science Fiction was really kid stuff by that time. Trek broke that mold.

      I thinks this little commentary stems from differences between Hollywood and talemted Science Fiction Writers.

      Rick Berman For example and thank god he actually admitted this he is not a "Futurist" like Roddenberry was. Its Uhh Very debatebul what he is... and I dont want to be mean and have no intrest in starting a bashing thread.
      (Ok this is the part of the part where you must fill in the blank with your own thoughts and you can keep to yourselves. lol)

      Honeslty its very rare you have somoene with Roddenberry's calibur and apreaciation for Science Fiction breaking into hollywood. I would put him in the same category as Rod Sterling. Both were creative anthology writers and producers. Both Very Succesful with thier own followings.
      Card went for the jugalar and went to the source and was a bit uncalled for.And sorta forty years too late to gripe about.

      For me their really hasn't been a wonderful relationship between Hollywood and the Science Fiction Author Community at all for quite a long time. So honeslty his Commentary really isnt suprising some authors have blasted every Trek Series out there. And they have blasted anything on thats remotly Sceince Fiction on TV or film.
      And this is'nt any different.
      Their has been to much mistrust with the the handeling of their own material and over 80 percent of the people who give the money out to these TV Shows and films just either dont get Science Fiction or dont care. To them its all this
      $$$$.Deniro Moulah MONEY

      Frankly they dont read it..To them they dont have to understand it. They want to know how much money is it going to make. and how much does it cost? more importantly.
      Unless a book author dies I could guarentee their will be a movie ...Their going after the people who dont read novels and no Clue what its about. Every adapatation is going to be off regardless.... and how can you be ticked off when your dead? The Autho can be the most vocal person out there,

      Unless the author or the author's estate has at least worked with these people and thats rare in itself and theirs a small chance it comes out succesfully. I feel their has been quite a few. And Hollywood is starting to realize it.

      That grudge between authors and the studios isnt going to go away overnight. And Star Trek and many other others are Studio shows.

      The authors have been either unhappy with the adaptions or downright disgusted trying to find any loophole to get out of it as it rewritten and chopped to pieces and will become so unlike their work. Arent Books in competiton of getting readers to read...With People who watch TV?
      Bradbury and Ellison have had thier problems with the system and have been disgusted by some shape or form with people who have changed their work. Like so many writers out there. Most are still very apprehnsive of doing this.

      People have been known to do both.
      (where in a Reading Group that happens to watch these shows so its going to be a little one sided isnt it?)

      With Genre shows not drawing reality show audeinces is it any real surprise? I feel his comparison to Lost can really mask itself without being labelled as a Science Fiction show. Not one guide I have has listed it as Science Fiction show.They list it around my neck of the woods as a Drama...
      I'm not putting down the show for People who like it. Not my cup of tea However If you like it GREAT.

      Hollywood as far as the beancounters are concerned cant stand Creative Novel writers. Some really are talented to work withen the system and both can work together. I dont think any diversity has hit Card and so many like him at all. So theirs defiantly at least some resentment. And that Article pretty much proves that.

      Alot of Science Fiction authors have their own disdain for certain shows...I cant really recollect how many. Some more outspoken than others... but really so what?
      How much we care to our own individual taste and leave at that and not turn everything into l out fight with words.

      I disagree on Jill Sherwins last comments however.
      After the last 10 years possibly longer and what I have observed on Online BBS's on some points the Concept of IDIC is going to take some time. And some major maturity withen its fanbase. My observation at the Conventions fans tended to be happy clams. Calm ,passive and passioante fans. Probably by DS9 I noticed some were getting a tad irritated though and it has grown.
      Obvoiusly were human not utopian humans on Star Trek.

      The so called rest "might" help patch things up. Were allowed to disagree as long as its civil.
      If "We preach" but we must also "practice" that Concept and that should be for the ENTIRE Trek Community not just for a select few. Were all outsiders we tend to forget that and over contreversial subjects I think we can agree sometimes its gotten WAY out of hand.

      If they dont like it So what? Smile and leave it alone.. Hows this effect my enjoyment of what I watch or read? Nothing at all.

      Peace,
      Scott




      Jackie Bundy <msferengi@...> wrote:
      Did anyone else see the Orson Scott Card editoral in
      today's LA Times?

      http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-card3may03,0,6007802.story?coll=la-news-comment-opinions

      The two times I've had occassion to meet Mr. Card he
      struck me as a bit of a snob but these is fighting
      words!

      I noticed it didn't take some long to respond. Here's
      Jill Sherwin's response:

      http://www.writergroupie.com/columns/cardtrekcolumn.htm

      Thoughts and comments anyone?

      Jackie


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    • Staci Hapdock
      Actually, though I ve never met the guy, this does seem rather like classic Card to me. When he is good, he is very, very good, but when he s bad he s
      Message 2 of 6 , May 4, 2005
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        Actually, though I've never met the guy, this does seem rather like classic Card to me. When he is good, he is very, very good, but when he's bad he's abysmal.


        Jackie Bundy <msferengi@...> wrote:
        Did anyone else see the Orson Scott Card editoral in
        today's LA Times?

        http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-card3may03,0,6007802.story?coll=la-news-comment-opinions

        The two times I've had occassion to meet Mr. Card he
        struck me as a bit of a snob but these is fighting
        words!

        I noticed it didn't take some long to respond. Here's
        Jill Sherwin's response:

        http://www.writergroupie.com/columns/cardtrekcolumn.htm

        Thoughts and comments anyone?

        Jackie


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      • April Payne
        Well stated, Scott. april Scott wrote: Honestly reading both Comments I beleive Orson Scott Card is entitled to his own opinion...I
        Message 3 of 6 , May 4, 2005
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          Well stated, Scott.

          april

          Scott <scott_vela@...> wrote:
          Honestly reading both Comments I beleive Orson Scott Card is entitled to his own opinion...I think the way he said it unnerved me a bit and non suprising how much of a utter *censored* hes acting about this. I have no control over his statement so he can say what he wants.
          Many Authors he happened to name either knew Gene Roddenberry as a freind a passing consultant or wrote some wonderful Stories(the most memorable) for him on a show that left a impression on so many so he lost his point there.

          A good example On a chance meeting Issac Asminov met Gene prior to the First Airing Of TOS and really enjoyed "Where No Man's gone Before." at a local Science Fiction Convention.(the first meeting actually had Roddenberry telling Asminov to Shut up while he had the pilot on. Roddentberry had no knowledge he just insulted his idol After the incident they both were good freinds.)

          I feel TOS is technically a bit stronger in storytelling than any other Trek. And had more a wow factor and was taken more seroiusly by the Science Fiction Community.Because most of TV Science Fiction was really kid stuff by that time. Trek broke that mold.

          I thinks this little commentary stems from differences between Hollywood and talemted Science Fiction Writers.

          Rick Berman For example and thank god he actually admitted this he is not a "Futurist" like Roddenberry was. Its Uhh Very debatebul what he is... and I dont want to be mean and have no intrest in starting a bashing thread.
          (Ok this is the part of the part where you must fill in the blank with your own thoughts and you can keep to yourselves. lol)

          Honeslty its very rare you have somoene with Roddenberry's calibur and apreaciation for Science Fiction breaking into hollywood. I would put him in the same category as Rod Sterling. Both were creative anthology writers and producers. Both Very Succesful with thier own followings.
          Card went for the jugalar and went to the source and was a bit uncalled for.And sorta forty years too late to gripe about.

          For me their really hasn't been a wonderful relationship between Hollywood and the Science Fiction Author Community at all for quite a long time. So honeslty his Commentary really isnt suprising some authors have blasted every Trek Series out there. And they have blasted anything on thats remotly Sceince Fiction on TV or film.
          And this is'nt any different.
          Their has been to much mistrust with the the handeling of their own material and over 80 percent of the people who give the money out to these TV Shows and films just either dont get Science Fiction or dont care. To them its all this
          $$$$.Deniro Moulah MONEY

          Frankly they dont read it..To them they dont have to understand it. They want to know how much money is it going to make. and how much does it cost? more importantly.
          Unless a book author dies I could guarentee their will be a movie ...Their going after the people who dont read novels and no Clue what its about. Every adapatation is going to be off regardless.... and how can you be ticked off when your dead? The Autho can be the most vocal person out there,

          Unless the author or the author's estate has at least worked with these people and thats rare in itself and theirs a small chance it comes out succesfully. I feel their has been quite a few. And Hollywood is starting to realize it.

          That grudge between authors and the studios isnt going to go away overnight. And Star Trek and many other others are Studio shows.

          The authors have been either unhappy with the adaptions or downright disgusted trying to find any loophole to get out of it as it rewritten and chopped to pieces and will become so unlike their work. Arent Books in competiton of getting readers to read...With People who watch TV?
          Bradbury and Ellison have had thier problems with the system and have been disgusted by some shape or form with people who have changed their work. Like so many writers out there. Most are still very apprehnsive of doing this.

          People have been known to do both.
          (where in a Reading Group that happens to watch these shows so its going to be a little one sided isnt it?)

          With Genre shows not drawing reality show audeinces is it any real surprise? I feel his comparison to Lost can really mask itself without being labelled as a Science Fiction show. Not one guide I have has listed it as Science Fiction show.They list it around my neck of the woods as a Drama...
          I'm not putting down the show for People who like it. Not my cup of tea However If you like it GREAT.

          Hollywood as far as the beancounters are concerned cant stand Creative Novel writers. Some really are talented to work withen the system and both can work together. I dont think any diversity has hit Card and so many like him at all. So theirs defiantly at least some resentment. And that Article pretty much proves that.

          Alot of Science Fiction authors have their own disdain for certain shows...I cant really recollect how many. Some more outspoken than others... but really so what?
          How much we care to our own individual taste and leave at that and not turn everything into l out fight with words.

          I disagree on Jill Sherwins last comments however.
          After the last 10 years possibly longer and what I have observed on Online BBS's on some points the Concept of IDIC is going to take some time. And some major maturity withen its fanbase. My observation at the Conventions fans tended to be happy clams. Calm ,passive and passioante fans. Probably by DS9 I noticed some were getting a tad irritated though and it has grown.
          Obvoiusly were human not utopian humans on Star Trek.

          The so called rest "might" help patch things up. Were allowed to disagree as long as its civil.
          If "We preach" but we must also "practice" that Concept and that should be for the ENTIRE Trek Community not just for a select few. Were all outsiders we tend to forget that and over contreversial subjects I think we can agree sometimes its gotten WAY out of hand.

          If they dont like it So what? Smile and leave it alone.. Hows this effect my enjoyment of what I watch or read? Nothing at all.

          Peace,
          Scott




          Jackie Bundy <msferengi@...> wrote:
          Did anyone else see the Orson Scott Card editoral in
          today's LA Times?

          http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-card3may03,0,6007802.story?coll=la-news-comment-opinions

          The two times I've had occassion to meet Mr. Card he
          struck me as a bit of a snob but these is fighting
          words!

          I noticed it didn't take some long to respond. Here's
          Jill Sherwin's response:

          http://www.writergroupie.com/columns/cardtrekcolumn.htm

          Thoughts and comments anyone?

          Jackie


          ---------------------------------
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        • asyle
          ... http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-card3may03,0,6007802.story?coll=la-news-comment-opinions ...
          Message 4 of 6 , May 5, 2005
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            --- April Payne <april_anastasia@...> wrote:
            > Well, I used to respect Orson Scott Card, lol.
            > Sounds an awful lot like sour grapes to me. Star
            > Trek made it, when other so-called hard-core science
            > fiction didn't. And oddly enough, I'd say Firefly
            > has all the energy and verve the orginal Trek has.
            > So, what's up with that?
            >
            > I smell bias in the air, don't you? *wink
            >
            > april
            >
            > Jackie Bundy <msferengi@...> wrote:
            > Did anyone else see the Orson Scott Card editoral in
            > today's LA Times?
            >
            >
            http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-card3may03,0,6007802.story?coll=la-news-comment-opinions
            >
            > The two times I've had occassion to meet Mr. Card he
            > struck me as a bit of a snob but these is fighting
            > words!
            >
            > I noticed it didn't take some long to respond.
            > Here's
            > Jill Sherwin's response:
            >
            >
            http://www.writergroupie.com/columns/cardtrekcolumn.htm
            >
            > Thoughts and comments anyone?
            >
            > Jackie
            >
            >
            > ---------------------------------
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            > To visit your group on the web, go to:
            > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/startrekbooks/
            >
            > To unsubscribe from this group, send an
            > email to:
            > startrekbooks-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the
            > Yahoo! Terms of Service.
            >
            >
            > __________________________________________________
            > Do You Yahoo!?
            > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
            > protection around
            > http://mail.yahoo.com
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been
            > removed]
            >
            >



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