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Re: [St.H.Fam.Hist.] Catherine Clingen, William Ridge and Fanny Thomas

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  • John Gardiner
    Hi, Marian. Interested to see you are researching the Greentree family.  Thomas Greentree appears to have owned my greatx4 grandmother, Margaret, who was his
    Message 1 of 19 , Mar 30 10:02 AM
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      Hi, Marian.
       
      Interested to see you are researching the Greentree family.  Thomas Greentree appears to have owned my greatx4 grandmother, Margaret, who was his slave possibly from birth but certainly up until 1823-24 when she was sold to Captain Seale.  By this time, Margaret was also on the verge of marrying my greatx4 grandfather, Samuel Caesar, but it's possible she had already had a number of illegitimate children with Samuel stretching back as far as 1813, plus Thomas Greentree continued to own three slave children - Michael, Sophia and Margaret (Jnr?) - even after Margaret has been sold to Seale.
       
      Just wondered if you had any information you could share on Thomas Greentree and his life.
       
      Many thanks.
       
      John Gardiner 


      From: Marian Press <marian.press@...>
      To: "st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com" <st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Tue, 29 March, 2011 17:21:56
      Subject: RE: [St.H.Fam.Hist.] Catherine Clingen, William Ridge and Fanny Thomas

       

      Andrew:

       

      To get some good (early) histories of St. Helena, try the Internet Archive (http://www.archive.org/) and choose the link to Texts. If you put St Helena in the search box you will be able to read and download full-text, out-of-copyright books.

       

      Marian Press

      Researching GREENTREE, SKOTTOWE on St. Helena

       

       

      From: st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com [mailto:st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ajb500
      Sent: March 29, 2011 10:22 AM
      To: st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [St.H.Fam.Hist.] Catherine Clingen, William Ridge and Fanny Thomas

       

       

      Hi Frank,
      That's another interesting message. I look forward to receiving your Family Tree Maker chart. I must try to obtain a good book on the history of St. Helena so that I can learn more about life on the island in the first half of the nineteenth century.
      Regards,
      Andrew

      --- In st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com, Frank Craig <frankfcraig@...> wrote:
      >
      > Hi Andrew,
      >
      > Yes, I have dug into that area. Fanny was likely of Asian origin. The slaves on
      > the island were either African, Indian or from Madagascar ( a hotch-potch of
      > Africans, Asians and Indians, sailors and traders. I can say that she is likely
      > Indian/East Asian (and not African) as I had a DNA genealogy blood test done and
      > I was 85% European and 15% East Asian with 0% African.
      >
      > I have included all of this in the FamilyTreeMaker chart which I will print off
      > and post today.
      > Regards
      >
      >
      > Frank F Craig

    • Marian Press
      John: Oh dear! This is quite a posting – to hear concrete news about one’s ancestors owning slaves, although I know they did on Saint Helena. I can
      Message 2 of 19 , Apr 1, 2011
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        John: Oh dear! This is quite a posting – to hear concrete news about one’s ancestors owning slaves, although I know they did on Saint Helena.

         

        I can certainly give you information on Thomas Greentree (although there was more than one and we will need to work out which one we are talking about exactly). None of the Thomases were my direct ancestor, but whichever he was he was a close relative of my ancestor, Margaret Greentree.

         

        Can you email me off list at marian.press@... and I can send you information.

         

        Marian

         

        From: st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com [mailto:st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Gardiner
        Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2011 1:02 PM
        To: st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [St.H.Fam.Hist.] Catherine Clingen, William Ridge and Fanny Thomas

         

         

        Hi, Marian.

         

        Interested to see you are researching the Greentree family.  Thomas Greentree appears to have owned my greatx4 grandmother, Margaret, who was his slave possibly from birth but certainly up until 1823-24 when she was sold to Captain Seale.  By this time, Margaret was also on the verge of marrying my greatx4 grandfather, Samuel Caesar, but it's possible she had already had a number of illegitimate children with Samuel stretching back as far as 1813, plus Thomas Greentree continued to own three slave children - Michael, Sophia and Margaret (Jnr?) - even after Margaret has been sold to Seale.

         

        Just wondered if you had any information you could share on Thomas Greentree and his life.

         

        Many thanks.

         

        John Gardiner 

         


        From: Marian Press <marian.press@...>
        To: "st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com" <st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Tue, 29 March, 2011 17:21:56
        Subject: RE: [St.H.Fam.Hist.] Catherine Clingen, William Ridge and Fanny Thomas

         

        Andrew:

         

        To get some good (early) histories of St. Helena, try the Internet Archive (http://www.archive.org/) and choose the link to Texts. If you put St Helena in the search box you will be able to read and download full-text, out-of-copyright books.

         

        Marian Press

        Researching GREENTREE, SKOTTOWE on St. Helena

         

         

        From: st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com [mailto:st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ajb500
        Sent: March 29, 2011 10:22 AM
        To: st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [St.H.Fam.Hist.] Catherine Clingen, William Ridge and Fanny Thomas

         

         

        Hi Frank,
        That's another interesting message. I look forward to receiving your Family Tree Maker chart. I must try to obtain a good book on the history of St. Helena so that I can learn more about life on the island in the first half of the nineteenth century.
        Regards,
        Andrew

        --- In st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com, Frank Craig <frankfcraig@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hi Andrew,
        >
        > Yes, I have dug into that area. Fanny was likely of Asian origin. The slaves on
        > the island were either African, Indian or from Madagascar ( a hotch-potch of
        > Africans, Asians and Indians, sailors and traders. I can say that she is likely
        > Indian/East Asian (and not African) as I had a DNA genealogy blood test done and
        > I was 85% European and 15% East Asian with 0% African.
        >
        > I have included all of this in the FamilyTreeMaker chart which I will print off
        > and post today.
        > Regards
        >
        >
        > Frank F Craig

      • ajb500
        Hi Frank, Thank you very much for the charts which arrived today. It will take me a while to study them all. If William Ridge served as a sergeant in the St.
        Message 3 of 19 , Apr 1, 2011
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          Hi Frank,
          Thank you very much for the charts which arrived today. It will take me a while to study them all.
          If William Ridge served as a sergeant in the St. Helena Artillery (as evidenced by the record of his marriage to Frances Thomas) there are presumably records somewhere of his enlistment and his career. Similarly there should be records of William Clingen's service in the St. Helena regiment. Would these be in the East India Company archives? Have they been indexed? Are any of them searchable online? (I expect not, otherwise you would probably have looked already.)
          I was interested to see that your grandparents were Robert Gregory, son of Henrietta Devlin, and Ellen Connor, daughter of Richard Connor. Janet's grandmother was Mary Ann Elizabeth McDermott, daughter of Alice Devlin and hence Robert Gregory's cousin, and her grandfather was Richard Connor, brother of Ellen.
          Regards,
          Andrew

          --- In st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com, Frank Craig <frankfcraig@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi Andrew,
          >
          > Yes, I have dug into that area. Fanny was likely of Asian origin. The slaves on
          > the island were either African, Indian or from Madagascar ( a hotch-potch of
          > Africans, Asians and Indians, sailors and traders. I can say that she is likely
          > Indian/East Asian (and not African) as I had a DNA genealogy blood test done and
          > I was 85% European and 15% East Asian with 0% African.
          >
          > I have included all of this in the FamilyTreeMaker chart which I will print off
          > and post today.
          > Regards
          >
          >
          > Frank F Craig
        • frankfcraig@yahoo.co.uk
          Hi Andrew, I don t know about the military records but you are right - there is likely material in there to analyse. Good luck with your study! Sent using
          Message 4 of 19 , Apr 1, 2011
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            Hi Andrew,

            I don't know about the military records but you are right - there is likely material in there to analyse.

            Good luck with your study!

            Sent using BlackBerry® from Orange


            From: "ajb500" <ajb500@...>
            Sender: st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Fri, 01 Apr 2011 20:51:35 -0000
            To: <st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com>
            ReplyTo: st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [St.H.Fam.Hist.] William Ridge and William Clingen in the St. Helena Artillery

             

            Hi Frank,
            Thank you very much for the charts which arrived today. It will take me a while to study them all.
            If William Ridge served as a sergeant in the St. Helena Artillery (as evidenced by the record of his marriage to Frances Thomas) there are presumably records somewhere of his enlistment and his career. Similarly there should be records of William Clingen's service in the St. Helena regiment. Would these be in the East India Company archives? Have they been indexed? Are any of them searchable online? (I expect not, otherwise you would probably have looked already.)
            I was interested to see that your grandparents were Robert Gregory, son of Henrietta Devlin, and Ellen Connor, daughter of Richard Connor. Janet's grandmother was Mary Ann Elizabeth McDermott, daughter of Alice Devlin and hence Robert Gregory's cousin, and her grandfather was Richard Connor, brother of Ellen.
            Regards,
            Andrew

            --- In st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com, Frank Craig <frankfcraig@...> wrote:
            >
            > Hi Andrew,
            >
            > Yes, I have dug into that area. Fanny was likely of Asian origin. The slaves on
            > the island were either African, Indian or from Madagascar ( a hotch-potch of
            > Africans, Asians and Indians, sailors and traders. I can say that she is likely
            > Indian/East Asian (and not African) as I had a DNA genealogy blood test done and
            > I was 85% European and 15% East Asian with 0% African.
            >
            > I have included all of this in the FamilyTreeMaker chart which I will print off
            > and post today.
            > Regards
            >
            >
            > Frank F Craig

          • foxhome
            Andrew, You can find the muster rolls for the St Helena infantry and artillery in the British Library Asia, Pacific and African collection (3rd floor) The
            Message 5 of 19 , Apr 2, 2011
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              Andrew, You can find the muster rolls for the St Helena infantry and artillery in the British Library  Asia, Pacific and African collection (3rd floor)

              The indexes are on line at http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/a2a/records.aspx?cat=059-iorlmil_8-1&cid=1-1-1#1-1-1

              Or search on ‘St Helena muster rolls’  on the National Archives web site http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/ and click on

              St Helena Records IOR/L/MIL/13

               

              The volumes handwritten are about 3 ins thick. There is a return for each battalion every quarter year 1789 to 1859

              You can track the career of your ancestor from when he arrived at the island until his discharge. If he received a pension he may be appear in other volumes. The staff at the library are very helpful and will give you lots of help if you ask. If you phone before hand you may be able to order volumes to be ready when you arrive (first time readers will need to get a pass – a quick and easy process). If you order them when you get there it will take 70mins for the items to arrive.

              Try and avoid busy times – Sat mornings, bank hols etc.

               

              Hope this helps

               

              Colin

               

               

               

               

              From: st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com [mailto:st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of ajb500
              Sent: 01 April 2011 21:52
              To: st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: [St.H.Fam.Hist.] William Ridge and William Clingen in the St. Helena Artillery

               

               

              Hi Frank,
              Thank you very much for the charts which arrived today. It will take me a while to study them all.
              If William Ridge served as a sergeant in the St. Helena Artillery (as evidenced by the record of his marriage to Frances Thomas) there are presumably records somewhere of his enlistment and his career. Similarly there should be records of William Clingen's service in the St. Helena regiment. Would these be in the East India Company archives? Have they been indexed? Are any of them searchable online? (I expect not, otherwise you would probably have looked already.)
              I was interested to see that your grandparents were Robert Gregory, son of Henrietta Devlin, and Ellen Connor, daughter of Richard Connor. Janet's grandmother was Mary Ann Elizabeth McDermott, daughter of Alice Devlin and hence Robert Gregory's cousin, and her grandfather was Richard Connor, brother of Ellen.
              Regards,
              Andrew

              --- In st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com, Frank Craig <frankfcraig@...> wrote:
              >
              > Hi Andrew,
              >
              > Yes, I have dug into that area. Fanny was likely of Asian origin. The slaves on
              > the island were either African, Indian or from Madagascar ( a hotch-potch of
              > Africans, Asians and Indians, sailors and traders. I can say that she is likely
              > Indian/East Asian (and not African) as I had a DNA genealogy blood test done and
              > I was 85% European and 15% East Asian with 0% African.
              >
              > I have included all of this in the FamilyTreeMaker chart which I will print off
              > and post today.
              > Regards
              >
              >
              > Frank F Craig

            • ajb500
              Colin, Thank you for the information about the Muster Rolls. I will have to visit the British Library one day to search for William Ridge s and William
              Message 6 of 19 , Apr 4, 2011
              • 0 Attachment
                Colin,
                Thank you for the information about the Muster Rolls. I will have to visit the British Library one day to search for William Ridge's and William Clingen's military records.
                Andrew

                --- In st-helena-genealogy@yahoogroups.com, "foxhome" <colin@...> wrote:
                >
                > Andrew, You can find the muster rolls for the St Helena infantry and
                > artillery in the British Library Asia, Pacific and African collection (3rd
                > floor)
                >
                > The indexes are on line at
                > http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/a2a/records.aspx?cat=059-iorlmil_8-1
                > <http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/a2a/records.aspx?cat=059-iorlmil_8-1&cid
                > =1-1-1#1-1-1> &cid=1-1-1#1-1-1
                >
                > Or search on 'St Helena muster rolls' on the National Archives web site
                > http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/ and click on
                >
                > St Helena Records IOR/L/MIL/13
                >
                >
                >
                > The volumes handwritten are about 3 ins thick. There is a return for each
                > battalion every quarter year 1789 to 1859
                >
                > You can track the career of your ancestor from when he arrived at the island
                > until his discharge. If he received a pension he may be appear in other
                > volumes. The staff at the library are very helpful and will give you lots of
                > help if you ask. If you phone before hand you may be able to order volumes
                > to be ready when you arrive (first time readers will need to get a pass - a
                > quick and easy process). If you order them when you get there it will take
                > 70mins for the items to arrive.
                >
                > Try and avoid busy times - Sat mornings, bank hols etc.
                >
                >
                >
                > Hope this helps
                >
                >
                >
                > Colin
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
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