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Re: Monthly cyclical variation in male fitness?

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  • John Kiely
    [This message from John Kiely didn t get through to the list for some reason. If you send a message that doesn t appear within a day, contact me directly
    Message 1 of 5 , Nov 21, 2009
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      [This message from John Kiely didn't get through to the list for some
      reason. If you send a message that doesn't appear within a day, contact me
      directly about it either via the site or via will@.... Note that
      you have to be a member to post to the list, although I can post it in your
      name otherwise. -Will]

      Hi Steven & Will

      Both the original post and Steven's response are certainly intriguing. I
      suspect I am about to go off on a tangent, I hope not too far off-topic, and
      would certainly value members thoughts, comments, and perspectives, it is a
      complex area which I don't think the sports science community has adequately
      explored as yet.

      Firstly, it is interesting to note that eminent periodisation theorists have
      tended to congregate (roughly) around a 4 week training block duration,
      although the rationales provided by the 3 theorists for settling on a 4 week
      phase duration are seemingly very different. Also, if we look at the
      justifications offered for utilising 4 week blocks, they do seem
      speculative, even unlikely, from a modern scientific perspective.

      However, let's assume that there is an ideal (and stable) phase duration,
      and let's assume it is 4 weeks, give or take a couple of days either side.
      This knowledge is of little value unless training can be synchronised with
      the key underpinning biological events. In other words, knowing the
      duration of a critical biological cycle is of little practical use unless
      'quality' training can be entrained with phases of 'high readiness', and
      'easy' training, or rest, can be paired with phases of 'low readiness',
      within the context of the overall cycle duration.

      Although periodisation theorists have variously, and vigorously, championed
      different planning structures this core problem persists, i.e. how do I know
      when to commence training to coincide with the 'start' of the critical
      biological cycle? Furthermore, as all the figures mentioned (in Steven's
      quoting of the 3 periodisation experts) are 'rough' estimates, then surely
      there will be substantial drift over the course of even a few weeks. You
      may somehow manage to perfectly synchronise biological cycles and training
      on day 1, but a short few weeks later there will have been substantial
      divergence between biological readiness and the training prescription plan.
      The end result being that, unless there is an effective means of regularly
      re-calibrating biology and training, then the training process will
      inevitably be sub-optimally efficient.

      Also worth noting in relation to the original posting is that while it may
      well be the case that there is an underpinning biological cycle of
      predictable duration and stability, it is also feasible that there may have
      been extrinsic environmental rhythms influencing training performance. For
      example, female partners cycle, work-&/or academic stress, and cycles of
      light and dark exposure, have all been demonstrated to effect testosterone
      release in males*, with presumably a consequent effect on training
      performance. Accordingly, there may have been a hidden, but subtly
      influential, external cycle (of roughly 4 weeks in duration) that impacted
      on 'psycho-socio-physiological' training readiness. Such findings may be
      worth considering as illustrations that biological cycles are subject to
      perturbation from multiple sources and will oscillate accordingly in a
      chaotic fashion. Again, the relevance to the topic at hand is that it would
      seem an impossible task to pre-plan a training scheme that would efficiently
      marry training design to an underpinning biological cycle.

      Another related thought; the example from the New Scientist question
      outlines a relatively straight-forward training plan. The same basic
      session performed on a consistent basis ad infinitum. The means of applying
      overload, and whether or not there was a focus on progression (as opposed to
      a focus solely on regular healthy activity), are unclear. In more complex
      training schedules the periodic trends observed in the rhythmical
      oscillation of training performance might not be so readily detectable.
      For example, if training run distance, and intensity, vary regularly
      throughout the training year then could you detect subtle periodic
      fluctuations in training performance?

      And so, one interpretation of the data presented in the New Scientist post
      is as a re-affirmation of the criticality of collating training-related
      data, and the regular, periodic review of this information. Are there
      apparent trends? If so, how can training be best organised to take advantage
      of periodic peaks and to off-set risk in periodic troughs? If such trends
      can be identified, then such a route may offer a more insightful and
      effective means of managing training programmes than is currently on offer
      through the various 'pre-packaged' periodisation schemes.

      Accordingly, for me at least, the critical issue does not relate to any
      concept of an 'ideal' phase duration. As already mentioned, I would think
      it unlikely that there is a universal 'best fit' for all individuals, for
      all 'fitness' components, for all training histories, for all genetic
      inheritances , and regardless of changing environmental stressors. Instead,
      the key question that comes to mind when considering Will's original post
      relates to traditional planning paradigms. Has the dominant Soviet training
      planning legacy finally outlived its usefulness? Pedagogically-,
      mathematically-derived training structures, while seemingly 'logical', and
      perhaps providing psychological 'security', bear little relation to the
      underpinning human biology, i.e. 'the map is not the territory'.
      Alternatively, can data collection, appropriate use of new technology,
      retrospective trend analysis, and enhanced conceptual understanding, lead to
      newer, more effective means of controlling and prescribing physical
      preparation programmes?

      Just a thought.

      Regards
      John Kiely, UK Athletics, Birmingham, UK
      jkiely@...
      *If anyone is interested in references, let me know.
    • Steven Plisk
      John, You re right about the rationale for the ~4 week rule of thumb differing between various sources. The implementation seems to vary quite a bit too.
      Message 2 of 5 , Nov 23, 2009
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        John,

        You're right about the rationale for the ~4 week rule of thumb differing between various sources. The implementation seems to vary quite a bit too. Matveyev's concept involved wave-like periodization; whereas Verkhoshansky's approach involves more abrupt "blocks" (Viru and Zatsiorsky both support the latter method as well, at least for advanced athletes).

        That's an oversimplification, but it's interesting that a monthly structure shows up in these different systems. There is plenty of disagreementon other issuesbetween some of these folks.

        Other than AtkoViru's ideas on training effect involution, much of the evidence for this guideline seems to be empirical. Or at the very least, it's not thoroughly documented in the literature that's available in English. Hopefully some members of the group can share additional insights here.

        In any case - empiricism is the proving ground where so many lines of study (and eventual principles) are generated. Some things just seem to work better than others. The challenge is to figure out why and how.

        You bring up many other great points as well. The notion of coinciding training loads with biological cycles is particularly interesting. In my experience, I had to make some compromises by back-engineering the cycles from one or more target date(s) a team needed to be prepared for. It is rarely a simple problem!


        Regards,

        Steven Plisk
        Excelsior Sports •Shelton CT (USA)
        www.excelsiorsports.com
        Prepare To Be A Champion!
      • TJACMC@aol.com
        Hello All, I am just curious as to what type of analysis one would use to determine if there is any periodicity in an athlete s performance. Would it be
        Message 3 of 5 , Dec 1, 2009
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          Hello All,
           
          I am just curious as to what type of analysis one would use to determine if there is any periodicity in an athlete's performance. 
           
          Would it be appropriate to run an FFT on a power-of-two dataset of daily performance and then look for peaks in the power spectral density function?
           
          Is there a preferred way looking for periodicity in data that might be heavily influenced by other factors, such as, recent performance and environmental conditions?
           
          Ted Andresen
          ST. Petersburg, Florida, USA
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