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Deep Impact model question

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  • GoFlight
    Hi all, I have begun to model the Deep Impact probe (yes I put my Cassini on the sideline for now). My Observatory is having a representative come in and give
    Message 1 of 9 , Mar 13, 2005
      Hi all,

      I have begun to model the Deep Impact probe (yes I put my Cassini on the sideline for now). My Observatory is having a representative come in and give a lecture on it on Mar. 19 and I was silly thinking I could have the model ready by then... but thats another story. Now I guess I'm just building it for myself. While I have been following the group
      (sorry Art) ; ) and making my probes 1:24, I "cheated" and just used the paper model as a template which is 1:22. But I already have questions.

      First tho I would like to thank Bob S. for helping out the mathematically challenged (me) on how his anntenna formula on Excel works. As I don't have a lathe I'm going to have to think up something else for making my antenna ...
      But anyway there are 2 pics of the model in Files under "Go Flights Deep Impact." The first is of the bus, and instrument pallet in 2 parts. The second is a closep of the pallet with the parts just stacked up. As according to the pics the bus is covered in a black wrapper, and the instrumants in gold I'm not worried about the seams too much.

      Now my questions - the circular shape on the pallet, which I just realized stands proud of the surface has a design boldly printed on the paper model part (pic 3) but on the real craft (pic 4) I had the play with the gama correct a lot just to have the design show up. Does anyone know what this is? Is it individuals parts to a cover or ...?

      My second question is about the S-band antenna. Is it tiled in two directions? It looks clear that the antenna is at an angle along the wide side, but is it also tilted on the short side as well? I hope that didn't sound stupid. I couldn't really tell from the ref. pics I have. TIA for all help.

      Kevin


      ----- Original Message -----
      From: KITMACHER, GARY H. (JSC-OX) (NASA)
      To: space-modelers@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: 3/13/2005 9:39:45 AM
      Subject: RE: [space-modelers] How about a 1:32 Papaer Saturn...?


      It is easily done.
      Use a graphics printer that prints on 36, 48 or 72 inch wide rolls of paper.

      You can find these at copy companies (eg Kinko's), architectural or
      engineering
      firms, etc.
      I generally use spray mount to mount the printed sheet onto cardstock such
      as
      poster board.
      Use corrugated cardboard cut from boxes to form bulkheads and other framing.
      You can enlarge (or reduce) virtually any paper model to any desired scale.


      -----Original Message-----
      From: tim@... [mailto:tim@...] On Behalf Of ygroups@...
      Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2005 5:27 AM
      To: space-modelers@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: [space-modelers] How about a 1:32 Papaer Saturn...?



      Guys, how big a deal is it to make a 1:32 Saturn V by scaling up the 1:48
      paper models?

      I just love the idea of mounting a Mongram 1:32 CSM on top of such a
      stack...

      I guess we are talking about big paper printing or a lot of page-tiling,
      but is this possible?

      If anyone can give a qucik run-thru on the issues I would appreciate it!

      Thx - Tim.

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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    • Schorry, Robert E.
      ... From: GoFlight [mailto:goflight@earthlink.net] Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2005 3:44 PM To: space-modelers@yahoogroups.com Subject: [space-modelers] Deep
      Message 2 of 9 , Mar 14, 2005
        ----Original Message-----
        From: GoFlight [mailto:goflight@...]
        Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2005 3:44 PM
        To: space-modelers@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [space-modelers] Deep Impact model question

        ---> I have put some pics into a folder named "Deep Impact reference"
        in the Files.

        Now my questions - the circular shape on the pallet, which I just
        realized stands proud of the surface has a design boldly printed on the
        paper model part (pic 3) but on the real craft (pic 4) I had the play
        with the gama correct a lot just to have the design show up. Does anyone
        know what this is? Is it individuals parts to a cover or ...?

        ---> The picture IM2.jpg shows the instrument module under a test.
        IM2gamma.jpg is the same with the gamma lowered, showing the pattern
        clearly. Looks like the it arises from milling the surface down,
        leaving the lines and triangles. Does it do anything, or is it just the
        whim of the designer? Do not know.

        My second question is about the S-band antenna. Is it til t ed in two
        directions? It looks clear that the antenna is at an angle along the
        wide side, but is it also tilted on the short side as well? I hope that
        didn't sound stupid. I couldn't really tell from the ref. pics I have.
        TIA for all help.

        Kevin

        ---> The picture di_flyby1.jpg shows a CAD drawing, showing the S-band
        mounted on the side, and oriented perpendicular to the solar cells.
        Picture S-band,jpg appears to show the S-band with the bottom edge
        parallel to the bus bottom, although since the bus is a pentagon, it's
        hard to tell. This picture also was taken on the launcher, so the solar
        cells are folded back to the bus, thusly confusing things. The paper
        model plans for the bus, also shows the S-band with the lower edge
        parallel to the bus top and bottom.

        Rob



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • GoFlight
        Thanks once again Rob for bailing me out. After looking at your images I found another image of that circular object and *I Think* it turns out to be a grill!
        Message 3 of 9 , Mar 15, 2005
          Thanks once again Rob for bailing me out.
          After looking at your images I found another image of that circular object and *I Think* it turns out to be a grill! The Ball Aerospace website lists it as a radiator or the IR Detectorhttp://www.ballaerospace.com/di_inst_hri.html (scroll to the bottom). I added the pic I found to your Deep Impact References folder. There's no way I'm careful enuff to carve out that design. So I guess I'll just color the piece a very light gray and "try" to mimic the design with white paint.

          That S- band is giving me the fits. To me some images have the bottom edge parallel, but on others it looks like the side close to the instruments are higher. As you mentioned it must be the optical illusion caused by the shape of the bus. Since we both see it parallel, thats how I'll do it.
          Thanks.


          Kevin


          ----- Original Message -----
          From: Schorry, Robert E.
          To: space-modelers@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: 3/14/2005 9:30:18 AM
          Subject: RE: [space-modelers] Deep Impact model question


          ----Original Message-----
          From: GoFlight [mailto:goflight@...]
          Sent: Sunday, March 13, 2005 3:44 PM
          To: space-modelers@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [space-modelers] Deep Impact model question

          ---> I have put some pics into a folder named "Deep Impact reference"
          in the Files.

          Now my questions - the circular shape on the pallet, which I just
          realized stands proud of the surface has a design boldly printed on the
          paper model part (pic 3) but on the real craft (pic 4) I had the play
          with the gama correct a lot just to have the design show up. Does anyone
          know what this is? Is it individuals parts to a cover or ...?

          ---> The picture IM2.jpg shows the instrument module under a test.
          IM2gamma.jpg is the same with the gamma lowered, showing the pattern
          clearly. Looks like the it arises from milling the surface down,
          leaving the lines and triangles. Does it do anything, or is it just the
          whim of the designer? Do not know.

          My second question is about the S-band antenna. Is it til t ed in two
          directions? It looks clear that the antenna is at an angle along the
          wide side, but is it also tilted on the short side as well? I hope that
          didn't sound stupid. I couldn't really tell from the ref. pics I have.
          TIA for all help.

          Kevin

          ---> The picture di_flyby1.jpg shows a CAD drawing, showing the S-band
          mounted on the side, and oriented perpendicular to the solar cells.
          Picture S-band,jpg appears to show the S-band with the bottom edge
          parallel to the bus bottom, although since the bus is a pentagon, it's
          hard to tell. This picture also was taken on the launcher, so the solar
          cells are folded back to the bus, thusly confusing things. The paper
          model plans for the bus, also shows the S-band with the lower edge
          parallel to the bus top and bottom.

          Rob



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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        • Schorry, Robert E.
          Ah-ha! Great detective work Kevin! The thrill of the hunt... No if someone was really good with photoetch, that would be perfect (something I want to try
          Message 4 of 9 , Mar 15, 2005
            Ah-ha! Great detective work Kevin! The thrill of the hunt...

            No if someone was really good with photoetch, that would be perfect
            (something I want to try someday).

            As for that pesky S-band, make you're best guess. No one "out here" in
            model land will ever know (unless they designed the little bugger).

            Rob.

            -----Original Message-----
            From: GoFlight [mailto:goflight@...]
            Sent: Tuesday, March 15, 2005 1:08 PM
            To: space-modelers@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: RE: [space-modelers] Deep Impact model question


            Thanks once again Rob for bailing me out. After looking at your
            images I found another image of that circular object and *I Think* it
            turns out to be a grill! The Ball Aerospace website lists it as a
            radiator or the IR detector
            http://www.ballaerospace.com/di_inst_hri.html (scroll to the
            bottom). I added the pic I found to your Deep Impact References folder.
            There's no way I'm careful enuff to carve out that design. So I guess
            I'll just color the piece a very light gray and "try" to mimic the
            design with white paint.

            That S- band is giving me the fits. To me some images have the
            bottom edge parallel, but on others it looks like the side close to the
            instruments are higher. As you mentioned it must be the optical illusion
            caused by the shape of the bus. Since we both see it parallel, thats how
            I'll do it.
            Thanks.

            Kevin





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Robert Schorry
            For the DeeP Imapct High Resolution telescope I found that in 1:24 scale it would be about 17 mm (.669 inch) in diameter. I have been rescaling the 1/22 scale
            Message 5 of 9 , Mar 25, 2005
              For the DeeP Imapct High Resolution telescope I found that in 1:24
              scale it would be about 17 mm (.669 inch) in diameter. I have been
              rescaling the 1/22 scale paper model as a reference.

              That is not exactly a stock size at the hobby shop. I found,
              however, a K&S brass tube that is 21/32 inch (.656 inch) in
              diameter. That's only a difference of .013 inch (0.33 mm), which is
              pretty darn close. With some foil on the outside, it will be
              perfect.

              The tube is K&S stock number 144, and I paid $2.99 at my local mom
              and pop shop.

              Rob
            • GoFlight
              Hey Rob, You re starting to scare me. I went out this past weekend and bought the same exact 21/32 brass tube. I ve included pics of the still not quite
              Message 6 of 9 , Mar 25, 2005
                Hey Rob,
                You're starting to scare me. I went out this past weekend and bought the same exact 21/32 brass tube.

                I've included pics of the still not quite finished science pallet (including the HRI tube) ; ) Most of the pieces are there. I have to cover a few in styrene, and it needs paint and the gold foil. The 2 parts in the back will be part of the star finders. You'll see in the second pic that I wasn't too concerned out my seams since they will be covered in foil. Seams to be see are the best I can do. <shrug> I'm currently trying to figure out what I can find/make for the funnel shapes of the star finders.
                The new pics are in my Deep Imapct file under the 2 MVC titles. Any and all critiques are welcomed.
                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/space-modelers/files/Go%20Flight%27s%20Deep%20Impact/

                In regard to the bus. It seems to be covered in black plastic. Is that just for here on contaminated earth or is it part of a thermal shield? Should I get black foil, or paint plastic film? Or, should the plastic be removed and have it be firm walled like how the card model looks. Anyone have a guess?


                Kev


                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Robert Schorry
                To: space-modelers@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: 3/25/2005 12:35:51 PM
                Subject: [space-modelers] Re: Deep Impact model question



                For the DeeP Imapct High Resolution telescope I found that in 1:24
                scale it would be about 17 mm (.669 inch) in diameter. I have been
                rescaling the 1/22 scale paper model as a reference.

                That is not exactly a stock size at the hobby shop. I found,
                however, a K&S brass tube that is 21/32 inch (.656 inch) in
                diameter. That's only a difference of .013 inch (0.33 mm), which is
                pretty darn close. With some foil on the outside, it will be
                perfect.

                The tube is K&S stock number 144, and I paid $2.99 at my local mom
                and pop shop.

                Rob






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                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • arthur krull
                You BOTH are starting to scare me! :-D Hey, lookin good, Kev! Looking forward to seeing it done. Art ... bought the same exact 21/32 brass tube. ...
                Message 7 of 9 , Mar 25, 2005
                  You BOTH are starting to scare me! :-D

                  Hey, lookin' good, Kev!

                  Looking forward to seeing it done.

                  Art

                  --- In space-modelers@yahoogroups.com, "GoFlight" <goflight@e...>
                  wrote:
                  > Hey Rob,
                  > You're starting to scare me. I went out this past weekend and
                  bought the same exact 21/32 brass tube.
                  >
                  > I've included pics of the still not quite finished science pallet
                  (including the HRI tube) ; ) Most of the pieces are there. I have
                  to cover a few in styrene, and it needs paint and the gold foil. The
                  2 parts in the back will be part of the star finders. You'll see in
                  the second pic that I wasn't too concerned out my seams since they
                  will be covered in foil. Seams to be see are the best I can do.
                  <shrug> I'm currently trying to figure out what I can find/make for
                  the funnel shapes of the star finders.
                  > The new pics are in my Deep Imapct file under the 2 MVC titles.
                  Any and all critiques are welcomed.
                  > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/space-modelers/files/Go%20Flight%27s%
                  20Deep%20Impact/
                  >
                  > In regard to the bus. It seems to be covered in black plastic. Is
                  that just for here on contaminated earth or is it part of a thermal
                  shield? Should I get black foil, or paint plastic film? Or, should
                  the plastic be removed and have it be firm walled like how the card
                  model looks. Anyone have a guess?
                  >
                  >
                  > Kev
                  >
                  >
                  > ----- Original Message -----
                  > From: Robert Schorry
                  > To: space-modelers@yahoogroups.com
                  > Sent: 3/25/2005 12:35:51 PM
                  > Subject: [space-modelers] Re: Deep Impact model question
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > For the DeeP Imapct High Resolution telescope I found that in 1:24
                  > scale it would be about 17 mm (.669 inch) in diameter. I have
                  been
                  > rescaling the 1/22 scale paper model as a reference.
                  >
                  > That is not exactly a stock size at the hobby shop. I found,
                  > however, a K&S brass tube that is 21/32 inch (.656 inch) in
                  > diameter. That's only a difference of .013 inch (0.33 mm), which
                  is
                  > pretty darn close. With some foil on the outside, it will be
                  > perfect.
                  >
                  > The tube is K&S stock number 144, and I paid $2.99 at my local mom
                  > and pop shop.
                  >
                  > Rob
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                  > ADVERTISEMENT
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                  > To visit your group on the web, go to:
                  > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/space-modelers/
                  >
                  > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
                  > space-modelers-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  >
                  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
                  Service.
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Robert Schorry
                  Biologists talk about organisims having parallel evolution, where they have similar features although they are far separated. Dare I say parallel madness???
                  Message 8 of 9 , Mar 26, 2005
                    Biologists talk about organisims having parallel evolution, where
                    they have similar features although they are far separated.

                    Dare I say parallel madness??? :-) or better yet, great modelers
                    think alike!

                    The star tracker light shields (cones) I was going to make by
                    stretch forming heated styrene over a pencil point. Makes dandy
                    little pointy things. I'll probably use .015 inch styrene, and make
                    dran sure I don't get to close to the candle flame!

                    The spacecraft bus has black "foil" on it. The photos of the final
                    buildup and on the launcher show the same thing. Probably a type of
                    low emmisivity material to minimize radiation of heat. I was
                    thinking about using good old house hold aluminum foil, using Micro-
                    Scale foil adhesive, and painting it a flat black. I like to use
                    Polly Scale "Midnight Black." It think it's the blackest flat black
                    I've ever seen.

                    Kevin, if you wanted to smooth your seams, you could use Testors
                    putty and then sand, if you need filler. Or use a drop of Zap-A-Gap
                    CA. Let it set for thirty seconds and then sand. If you wait too
                    long, the CA becomes harder then the plastic and you can't sand it.

                    If you just want it smoother, get some foam sanding sticks from the
                    supermarket (look in the manicure aisle). They carry grades from
                    coarse to superfine.

                    Rob

                    --- In space-modelers@yahoogroups.com, "arthur krull" <nartco@s...>
                    wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    > You BOTH are starting to scare me! :-D
                    >
                    > Hey, lookin' good, Kev!
                    >
                    > Looking forward to seeing it done.
                    >
                    > Art
                    >
                    > --- In space-modelers@yahoogroups.com, "GoFlight" <goflight@e...>
                    > wrote:
                    > > Hey Rob,
                    > > You're starting to scare me. I went out this past weekend and
                    > bought the same exact 21/32 brass tube.
                    > >
                    > > I've included pics of the still not quite finished science
                    pallet
                    > (including the HRI tube) ; ) Most of the pieces are there. I
                    have
                    > to cover a few in styrene, and it needs paint and the gold foil.
                    The
                    > 2 parts in the back will be part of the star finders. You'll see
                    in
                    > the second pic that I wasn't too concerned out my seams since they
                    > will be covered in foil. Seams to be see are the best I can do.
                    > <shrug> I'm currently trying to figure out what I can find/make
                    for
                    > the funnel shapes of the star finders.
                    > > The new pics are in my Deep Imapct file under the 2 MVC titles.
                    > Any and all critiques are welcomed.
                    > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/space-modelers/files/Go%20Flight%
                    27s%
                    > 20Deep%20Impact/
                    > >
                    > > In regard to the bus. It seems to be covered in black plastic.
                    Is
                    > that just for here on contaminated earth or is it part of a
                    thermal
                    > shield? Should I get black foil, or paint plastic film? Or, should
                    > the plastic be removed and have it be firm walled like how the
                    card
                    > model looks. Anyone have a guess?
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Kev
                    > > ----- Original Message -----
                    > > From: Robert Schorry
                    > > To: space-modelers@yahoogroups.com
                    > > Sent: 3/25/2005 12:35:51 PM
                    > > Subject: [space-modelers] Re: Deep Impact model question
                    >
                    > > For the Deep Impact High Resolution telescope I found that in
                    1:24
                    > > scale it would be about 17 mm (.669 inch) in diameter. I have
                    > been
                    > > rescaling the 1/22 scale paper model as a reference.
                    > >
                    > > That is not exactly a stock size at the hobby shop. I found,
                    > > however, a K&S brass tube that is 21/32 inch (.656 inch) in
                    > > diameter. That's only a difference of .013 inch (0.33 mm),
                    which is pretty darn close. With some foil on the outside, it will
                    be perfect.
                    > >
                    > > The tube is K&S stock number 144, and I paid $2.99 at my local
                    mom and pop shop.
                  • GoFlight
                    Rob, Maybe we were twins a few years apart that were separated by Carney folk? ; ) Thanks for your continued help. If the craft turns out well, I ll have to
                    Message 9 of 9 , Mar 27, 2005
                      Rob,
                      Maybe we were twins a few years apart that were separated by Carney folk? ; ) Thanks for your continued help. If the craft turns out well, I'll have to dedicate it to you. hehe

                      I was wondering about the black thermal shield. I actually saw the pic you put up of DI in the shroud before, but with so many images spread over so many websites, I had forgotten it. I have a ton of other pics but I never thought I needed that one when I first started collecting ref. pix..

                      One thing I realized after showing my science pallet to y'all is that I found yet another photo showing the paper model and therefore my model is WRONG as far as the MRI. It's not a simple (if not lopsided) "T", the cross member is taller than the rest of the long section, and the little stud in the back angles back. That doesn't make sense? Nope. I added a pic to the reference folder for it (entitled new30.jpg) . Another thing is that I never noticedbefore are 2 debris shields. I'll have to rework the MRI and add those shields.

                      Thanks too for the tip on the seams. A year or so ago a member of my modeling club, NJIPMS, (who has since left to take a job with Fine Scale Modeler Mag - lucky stiff) let us in on his secret for smooth seams during a workshop: Porc-A-Filler. It's a porcelain chip filler used to repair chips in stoves fridges etc... It's semi liquid and incredibly fine grained. Many times all you need to do fill the seam using an old paint brush, then wipe a damp Q-Tip along the seam just as it's drying for a nice result. Many of us have been using this exclusively.


                      Art,
                      Thanks for the compliments, bro! I'm on a roll with it, and it seems to be going together easier than my Cassini (I'm beginning to think I bit off more than I can chew with that craft). I still like going back, for inspiration, to the pics you sent me and to the Tech Mages page where you're EXCELLENT Cassini antenna is still proudly displayed. As a fellow Tech Mage (no?) you need to have one-zero put your pics in the real space pages at SSM.

                      I appreciate you guys taking the time to look my DI over and let me know what you think.


                      Kevin


                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: Robert Schorry
                      To: space-modelers@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: 3/26/2005 9:51:22 AM
                      Subject: [space-modelers] Re: Deep Impact model question



                      Biologists talk about organisims having parallel evolution, where
                      they have similar features although they are far separated.

                      Dare I say parallel madness??? :-) or better yet, great modelers
                      think alike!

                      The star tracker light shields (cones) I was going to make by
                      stretch forming heated styrene over a pencil point. Makes dandy
                      little pointy things. I'll probably use .015 inch styrene, and make
                      dran sure I don't get to close to the candle flame!

                      The spacecraft bus has black "foil" on it. The photos of the final
                      buildup and on the launcher show the same thing. Probably a type of
                      low emmisivity material to minimize radiation of heat. I was
                      thinking about using good old house hold aluminum foil, using Micro-
                      Scale foil adhesive, and painting it a flat black. I like to use
                      Polly Scale "Midnight Black." It think it's the blackest flat black
                      I've ever seen.

                      Kevin, if you wanted to smooth your seams, you could use Testors
                      putty and then sand, if you need filler. Or use a drop of Zap-A-Gap
                      CA. Let it set for thirty seconds and then sand. If you wait too
                      long, the CA becomes harder then the plastic and you can't sand it.

                      If you just want it smoother, get some foam sanding sticks from the
                      supermarket (look in the manicure aisle). They carry grades from
                      coarse to superfine.

                      Rob




                      --- In space-modelers@yahoogroups.com, "arthur krull" <nartco@s...>
                      wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      > You BOTH are starting to scare me! :-D
                      >
                      > Hey, lookin' good, Kev!
                      >
                      > Looking forward to seeing it done.
                      >
                      > Art
                      >

                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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