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Re: [southbend10k] South Bend 9A/10K UMD questions on V belt and quest ion on xfeed assembly bearing

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  • guycad@netzero.com
    Thanks for the info on Boston Gear catalog.Machining is not an issue. For my 10K I rebuilt most of the cross slide screw, keeping only the gear portion. I
    Message 1 of 3 , Mar 3, 2013
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      Thanks for the info on Boston Gear catalog.
      Machining is not an issue.  For my 10K I rebuilt most of the cross slide screw, keeping only the gear portion.
       
      I started scraping V ways on the saddle last night.  This becomes my master template for the bed ways.
       
      Guy Cadrin


      ---------- Original Message ----------
      From: "Jim B." <btdtrf@...>
      To: southbend10k@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [southbend10k] South Bend 9A/10K UMD questions on V belt and question on xfeed assembly bearing
      Date: Sat, 02 Mar 2013 22:51:13 -0500

       

      >Does anybody have a bearing No for substitute?

      Guy.
      The bearings you need are made by Boston Gear.
      The are the same OD and ID but are just a bit thicker. You will need to machine something to use them.
      There are two notes in the files section on converting both the cross and compound dials. The part number should be in thse notes. I did not find them.
      If they are not there I can search the BG catalog. BG only sells through distributors. MSC is one.
      Let me know if you find them. I have used them on my 405 and Heavy 10.

      I believe Grizzly has originals. Ted (Latheman2) may also have some.



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    • guycad@netzero.com
      Thank you for the info on the bearing. I will drop by at General Bearing sometimes this week.With regards to telescopic taper attachment, I don t intend on
      Message 2 of 3 , Mar 3, 2013
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        Thank you for the info on the bearing.  I will drop by at General Bearing sometimes this week.
        With regards to telescopic taper attachment, I don't intend on building it.  I already have a taper attachment on my 10K rear drive.  (It will just move from one lathe to the other.)   The 10K is already a large dial fitted unit. This gives me all dimensions.  I already have two spare cross feed bushing assemblies and many spare cross feed screws.  The feed screw fitted on this lathe is, I believe the hardened and ground screws that were fitted on the tool room version (based on model Number CL8344ZD) so I want to keep the feed screw portion.  (for my other 10K, I cut a new acme screw and nut.  Somebody lent me the tap and I have a valenite threading ho;der with 10TPI acme insert... it made a very nice job)  I already have a used large dial for xfeed.  I won't strip out a 10K that was rebuilt as new.  The only components I want to rob is the V belt pulleys and it is where I have an issue
         
        I know I have not thrown away the magazine with the taper attachment article.  When I find it, I will try to scan and post
         
        The large feed dial conversion will be the last job I will do on this project.
        Thank you for the offer.
         
        Felt wise, I dismantled the whole lathe, and there was only one felt in the apron that needed replacement.  I had left overs from a rebuild kit for the 10K.  Eventually, the headstock felts will need replacement.  Even though the rebuild manual says long felt wicks for headstock for UMD, this lathe requires the short felts (felts were all cleaned in ultrasonic bath with solvent
         
        I still have many felts for the V ways as well.
         
        It is the V belt portion on the belt drive system that I will have to find a work around.  I wonder if these linked V belt stretch over the time  I will try to take a picture of the issue I have and post it on the group sometimes this week.  (right now, it is running on flat belt with poly V belt with  a dollar store wire lacing as belt link..... it is doing the job while testing the machine. The belt that came with the machine, relatively modern, fabric/rubber, delaminated after a few minutes of use)
         
        Gear train is very quiet.
         
        I noted that the headstock is not fitted for the hand lever collet attachment.
         
        This brings in another question...... motor pulley.   Is there a reason why South Bend manufactured 2 different motor pulleys  size (2 steps)?   Is it related to lathe max speed for cast iron spindle bearings versus max speed on bronze spindle bearings?  (My 10K came with a large pulley while this one came with  a smaller one)
         
        I have colour issues as well.  The lathe was re-painted once.  When scratching paint to original paint, depending on which part I pick, I get a slightly different shade of grey. It became even more weird when I started to lift the various plates on the lathe. (original paint in those locations)  Last plate to lift is the gear box plate.... I will see there.  
         
        The inside of drawers were never re-painted and color seems uniform for scanning.  It might be the color I will pick.
         
        Once rebuilt, it might become a 10K.  (I have a spare headstock UMD and tailstock for a 10K)
         
        Overall it is a challenging project that will keep me busy but will provide me an amazing machine
         
         
        Guy Cadrin
         


        ---------- Original Message ----------
        From: "Steve Wells" <wswells@...>
        To: <southbend10k@yahoogroups.com>
        Subject: Re: [southbend10k] South Bend 9A/10K UMD questions on V belt and question on xfeed assembly bearing
        Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 20:13:31 -0500

         

        Hi Guy,
        Hope you are doing well.
        I would really be interested in seeing the telescopic taper conversion if you can take pictures through the project that would be great.
        Im going to try to post some new content to the website and that sounds like a great read.
        The bearings you need for the gear side of the handle shaft is Boston Gear 17195, I order them from MSC and their part number is 03548591,
        this is for a Bearing set that includes 2 flat washers, you can follow the SBL instructions for refit but I consider these the drop in replacement,
        although you do need to remove material to refit, it's a minor job as the closer fitting is in the dial/handle and front CF sleeve.
        In the front bushing and under the sleeve you can use the same bearing set (17195) or you can use an INA TC613 flat needle bearing and the matching INA
        TWA613 flat washers, the MSC part numers for these are (1) 03380896 and (2) 03381068. The INA set is the bearing to use under the compound dial too.
        Hope That helped.
        and PS...I have a large dial handle blank that has the gear pre-cut, the shaft is the full OD of the Gear blank, so it has to be turned to size. $30.00.
         
        Steve Wells
          
        ----- Original Message -----
        Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2013 8:35 PM
        Subject: [southbend10k] South Bend 9A/10K UMD questions on V belt and question on xfeed assembly bearing
         
         

        A few weeks ago I bought a 9A tool room lathe UMD with 42" bed.

        It seems to be a model manufactured between 1953 and 1954 according to the Serial No. Unfortunately it lost its taper attachment. It was missing a few parts that I already had in my spare box. The overall condition of the machine is very good. With a test mandrel between centres, a dial indicator moves a max of 0.001" (lathe able to perform work plus or minus 0.002" over the full length). The bed is very clean, only a few dints around the headstock. I am preparing the bed for a full re-scrape that I expect to take about one month by evenings (I am not working every night on it). It will be my 2nd lathe rebuild. (My 10K rear drive is almost perfect). I am in the process of checking the tools I used in the scraping process for the other lathe.

        I mam investigating conversion to V belt. (take the V belts from my 10K). I have seen a few occurrences on ebay and Youtube of UMD with V belt configuration. The issue I am facing is that Link belts 5/8" wide are riding just above the top of the pulley. The other issue associated to these belts is that it seems to be extremely difficult to put the belt on the large pulley on the headstock and there might be interference with the back gear pulley shaft when basck gear is engaged. On the rear drive 10K I have I don't face this issue as I am using a continuous V belt

        Did anyone make similar observations and find a corrective action? Substitute belt?

        I am also investigating the conversion to large dials. Many years ago, I recall an article in Home shop Machinist there was an article written by somebody that made a telescopic taper attachment for 9/10K South Bend lathes. In this article he was explaining how to convert to large dials. I currently have all the components required but I ned to change the bearings on the cross feed assembly. Does anybody have a bearing No for substitute? I checked the SKF catalog and cannot find anything that would suit the need. (On SB part List it is Bearing AS841R1)

        Guy Cadrin

         

         



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      • Peter Merriam
        Guy Looking at the HSM index here:http://www.homeshopmachinist.net/articleindex?noredirect=true&noredirect=true I see “Telescopic Taper Attachment for South
        Message 3 of 3 , Mar 3, 2013
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          Guy
          I see “Telescopic Taper Attachment for South Bend 9 or 10 Lathes” by John Foster, HSM Vol23, No.1 Jan-Feb 2004
          This might be what you seek.
          Peter M
           
          Sent: Sunday, March 03, 2013 11:05 PM
          Subject: Re: [southbend10k] South Bend 9A/10K UMD questions on V belt and question on xfeed assembly bearing
           
           

          Thank you for the info on the bearing.  I will drop by at General Bearing sometimes this week.
          With regards to telescopic taper attachment, I don't intend on building it.  I already have a taper attachment on my 10K rear drive.  (It will just move from one lathe to the other.)   The 10K is already a large dial fitted unit. This gives me all dimensions.  I already have two spare cross feed bushing assemblies and many spare cross feed screws.  The feed screw fitted on this lathe is, I believe the hardened and ground screws that were fitted on the tool room version (based on model Number CL8344ZD) so I want to keep the feed screw portion.  (for my other 10K, I cut a new acme screw and nut.  Somebody lent me the tap and I have a valenite threading ho;der with 10TPI acme insert... it made a very nice job)  I already have a used large dial for xfeed.  I won't strip out a 10K that was rebuilt as new.  The only components I want to rob is the V belt pulleys and it is where I have an issue
           
          I know I have not thrown away the magazine with the taper attachment article.  When I find it, I will try to scan and post
           
          The large feed dial conversion will be the last job I will do on this project.
          Thank you for the offer.
           
          Felt wise, I dismantled the whole lathe, and there was only one felt in the apron that needed replacement.  I had left overs from a rebuild kit for the 10K.  Eventually, the headstock felts will need replacement.  Even though the rebuild manual says long felt wicks for headstock for UMD, this lathe requires the short felts (felts were all cleaned in ultrasonic bath with solvent
           
          I still have many felts for the V ways as well.
           
          It is the V belt portion on the belt drive system that I will have to find a work around.  I wonder if these linked V belt stretch over the time  I will try to take a picture of the issue I have and post it on the group sometimes this week.  (right now, it is running on flat belt with poly V belt with  a dollar store wire lacing as belt link..... it is doing the job while testing the machine. The belt that came with the machine, relatively modern, fabric/rubber, delaminated after a few minutes of use)
           
          Gear train is very quiet.
           
          I noted that the headstock is not fitted for the hand lever collet attachment.
           
          This brings in another question...... motor pulley.   Is there a reason why South Bend manufactured 2 different motor pulleys  size (2 steps)?   Is it related to lathe max speed for cast iron spindle bearings versus max speed on bronze spindle bearings?  (My 10K came with a large pulley while this one came with  a smaller one)
           
          I have colour issues as well.  The lathe was re-painted once.  When scratching paint to original paint, depending on which part I pick, I get a slightly different shade of grey. It became even more weird when I started to lift the various plates on the lathe. (original paint in those locations)  Last plate to lift is the gear box plate.... I will see there. 
           
          The inside of drawers were never re-painted and color seems uniform for scanning.  It might be the color I will pick.
           
          Once rebuilt, it might become a 10K.  (I have a spare headstock UMD and tailstock for a 10K)
           
          Overall it is a challenging project that will keep me busy but will provide me an amazing machine
           
           
          Guy Cadrin
           


          ---------- Original Message ----------
          From: "Steve Wells" <wswells@...>
          To: <southbend10k@yahoogroups.com>
          Subject: Re: [southbend10k] South Bend 9A/10K UMD questions on V belt and question on xfeed assembly bearing
          Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 20:13:31 -0500

           

          Hi Guy,
          Hope you are doing well.
          I would really be interested in seeing the telescopic taper conversion if you can take pictures through the project that would be great.
          Im going to try to post some new content to the website and that sounds like a great read.
          The bearings you need for the gear side of the handle shaft is Boston Gear 17195, I order them from MSC and their part number is 03548591,
          this is for a Bearing set that includes 2 flat washers, you can follow the SBL instructions for refit but I consider these the drop in replacement,
          although you do need to remove material to refit, it's a minor job as the closer fitting is in the dial/handle and front CF sleeve.
          In the front bushing and under the sleeve you can use the same bearing set (17195) or you can use an INA TC613 flat needle bearing and the matching INA
          TWA613 flat washers, the MSC part numers for these are (1) 03380896 and (2) 03381068. The INA set is the bearing to use under the compound dial too.
          Hope That helped.
          and PS...I have a large dial handle blank that has the gear pre-cut, the shaft is the full OD of the Gear blank, so it has to be turned to size. $30.00.
           
          Steve Wells
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Saturday, March 02, 2013 8:35 PM
          Subject: [southbend10k] South Bend 9A/10K UMD questions on V belt and question on xfeed assembly bearing
           
           

          A few weeks ago I bought a 9A tool room lathe UMD with 42" bed.

          It seems to be a model manufactured between 1953 and 1954 according to the Serial No. Unfortunately it lost its taper attachment. It was missing a few parts that I already had in my spare box. The overall condition of the machine is very good. With a test mandrel between centres, a dial indicator moves a max of 0.001" (lathe able to perform work plus or minus 0.002" over the full length). The bed is very clean, only a few dints around the headstock. I am preparing the bed for a full re-scrape that I expect to take about one month by evenings (I am not working every night on it). It will be my 2nd lathe rebuild. (My 10K rear drive is almost perfect). I am in the process of checking the tools I used in the scraping process for the other lathe.

          I mam investigating conversion to V belt. (take the V belts from my 10K). I have seen a few occurrences on ebay and Youtube of UMD with V belt configuration. The issue I am facing is that Link belts 5/8" wide are riding just above the top of the pulley. The other issue associated to these belts is that it seems to be extremely difficult to put the belt on the large pulley on the headstock and there might be interference with the back gear pulley shaft when basck gear is engaged. On the rear drive 10K I have I don't face this issue as I am using a continuous V belt

          Did anyone make similar observations and find a corrective action? Substitute belt?

          I am also investigating the conversion to large dials. Many years ago, I recall an article in Home shop Machinist there was an article written by somebody that made a telescopic taper attachment for 9/10K South Bend lathes. In this article he was explaining how to convert to large dials. I currently have all the components required but I ned to change the bearings on the cross feed assembly. Does anybody have a bearing No for substitute? I checked the SKF catalog and cannot find anything that would suit the need. (On SB part List it is Bearing AS841R1)

          Guy Cadrin

           

           



          ____________________________________________________________
          Woman is 53 But Looks 25
          Mom reveals 1 simple wrinkle trick that has angered doctors...
          ConsumerLifestyleMag.com
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