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Quantum physics; book recommendations

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  • Noah Won
    I should have done this first, rather than as a question on Kathy s thread. Apologize, Kathy. Anyway, I recently got an angelic directive to learn more about
    Message 1 of 21 , Mar 1, 2014
      I should have done this first, rather than as a question on Kathy's thread.
      Apologize, Kathy.
      Anyway, I recently got an angelic directive to learn more about quantum physics. I also previously got a directive to get and read "Prometheus Rising", by Robert Anton Wilson, which talks about neuroscience and the 8 brain circuits, 4 of which have to do with extrasensory experiences.
      My question to you is, which quantum physics book would you recommend for a newbie?
      Thank you in advance for your reply.
    • rsussan
      David Deutsch fabric of reality is an absolute must imho. Not only about quantum physics, it s really abook of philosophy strongly inspired by quantum
      Message 2 of 21 , Mar 2, 2014

        David Deutsch "fabric of reality" is an absolute must imho. Not only about quantum physics, it's really abook of philosophy strongly inspired by quantum physics, especially from a quantum computing perspective. One of the ten most important books I ever read.
        In a more "popular science" genre, Brian Greene's books are good introductions. You can find interesting writings by John Gribbin, or Paul Davies, too..
        If you are in Robert Anton Wilson, you might find fun to read "how the hippies saved physics" by MIT professor David Kaiser. It's not a physics books, it's an history of science book, but I'm sure you'll love it and it help you to put in context some of RA  Wilson's sources on quantum physics (mostly, Jack Sarfattti, Nick Herbert and Paul Sirag).
        Penrose's "road to reality" is considered as a masterpiece, and probably rightly so. It's more about the maths underlying quantum physics, asking no former education in mathematics. I confess: I was never able to past the first 100 pages, it's very dense, every day I think: today, I will go back to the Penrose, but I never do it :-(.

        When you read an introductory bok, never forget that quantum physics remain a highly debated field, and that an author point of view is frequently contested by others: Greene is championing string theory, which remain contested by some physicists; Deutsch advocate the many worlds theory, against the consensus favouring Copenhagen theory; And Penrose can be very, very controversial too...

        Good luck!

        remi

        "Nobody understands quantum physics"" Richard Feynman




        ---- Message d'origine ----
        De : "Noah Won" <seermagician@...>
        À : solomonic@yahoogroups.com
        Objet : [Solomonic] Quantum physics; book recommendations
        Date : 02/03/2014 00:34:02 CET

         

        I should have done this first, rather than as a question on Kathy's thread.
        Apologize, Kathy.
        Anyway, I recently got an angelic directive to learn more about quantum physics. I also previously got a directive to get and read "Prometheus Rising", by Robert Anton Wilson, which talks about neuroscience and the 8 brain circuits, 4 of which have to do with extrasensory experiences.
        My question to you is, which quantum physics book would you recommend for a newbie?
        Thank you in advance for your reply.

      • Sara
        How much math do you have? To get any traction on quantum physics, you re going to have to have some intuitions in vector calc and some complex analysis. If
        Message 3 of 21 , Mar 2, 2014
          How much math do you have?  To get any traction on quantum physics, you're going to have to have some intuitions in vector calc and some complex analysis. If you don't, try: 


          Once you've got that, here are some physics things to start with:


          Sara



          On Sun, Mar 2, 2014 at 5:32 AM, <rsussan@...> wrote:
           


          David Deutsch "fabric of reality" is an absolute must imho. Not only about quantum physics, it's really abook of philosophy strongly inspired by quantum physics, especially from a quantum computing perspective. One of the ten most important books I ever read.
          In a more "popular science" genre, Brian Greene's books are good introductions. You can find interesting writings by John Gribbin, or Paul Davies, too..
          If you are in Robert Anton Wilson, you might find fun to read "how the hippies saved physics" by MIT professor David Kaiser. It's not a physics books, it's an history of science book, but I'm sure you'll love it and it help you to put in context some of RA  Wilson's sources on quantum physics (mostly, Jack Sarfattti, Nick Herbert and Paul Sirag).
          Penrose's "road to reality" is considered as a masterpiece, and probably rightly so. It's more about the maths underlying quantum physics, asking no former education in mathematics. I confess: I was never able to past the first 100 pages, it's very dense, every day I think: today, I will go back to the Penrose, but I never do it :-(.

          When you read an introductory bok, never forget that quantum physics remain a highly debated field, and that an author point of view is frequently contested by others: Greene is championing string theory, which remain contested by some physicists; Deutsch advocate the many worlds theory, against the consensus favouring Copenhagen theory; And Penrose can be very, very controversial too...

          Good luck!

          remi

          "Nobody understands quantum physics"" Richard Feynman




          ---- Message d'origine ----
          De : "Noah Won" <seermagician@...>
          À : solomonic@yahoogroups.com
          Objet : [Solomonic] Quantum physics; book recommendations
          Date : 02/03/2014 00:34:02 CET



           

          I should have done this first, rather than as a question on Kathy's thread.
          Apologize, Kathy.
          Anyway, I recently got an angelic directive to learn more about quantum physics. I also previously got a directive to get and read "Prometheus Rising", by Robert Anton Wilson, which talks about neuroscience and the 8 brain circuits, 4 of which have to do with extrasensory experiences.
          My question to you is, which quantum physics book would you recommend for a newbie?
          Thank you in advance for your reply.


        • kathy_mcdonald62
          Good idea Noah, best to keep new topic on new thread it makes later searches for info easier. What you are saying sounds distinctly like information presented
          Message 4 of 21 , Mar 2, 2014
            Good idea Noah, best to keep new topic on new thread it makes later searches for info easier.
            What you are saying sounds distinctly like information presented in chapter 3 of Aaron's first book. Have you read it yet?
            Love
            Kathy
          • Noah Won
            Thank you! [:-)] I appreciate it. On Monday, March 3, 2014 5:11 AM, Sara wrote:   How much math do you have?  To get any traction on
            Message 5 of 21 , Mar 5, 2014
              Thank you! [:-)]
              I appreciate it.


              On Monday, March 3, 2014 5:11 AM, Sara <academy23@...> wrote:
               
              How much math do you have?  To get any traction on quantum physics, you're going to have to have some intuitions in vector calc and some complex analysis. If you don't, try: 


              Once you've got that, here are some physics things to start with:


              Sara



              On Sun, Mar 2, 2014 at 5:32 AM, <rsussan@...> wrote:
               

              David Deutsch "fabric of reality" is an absolute must imho. Not only about quantum physics, it's really abook of philosophy strongly inspired by quantum physics, especially from a quantum computing perspective. One of the ten most important books I ever read.
              In a more "popular science" genre, Brian Greene's books are good introductions. You can find interesting writings by John Gribbin, or Paul Davies, too..
              If you are in Robert Anton Wilson, you might find fun to read "how the hippies saved physics" by MIT professor David Kaiser. It's not a physics books, it's an history of science book, but I'm sure you'll love it and it help you to put in context some of RA  Wilson's sources on quantum physics (mostly, Jack Sarfattti, Nick Herbert and Paul Sirag).
              Penrose's "road to reality" is considered as a masterpiece, and probably rightly so. It's more about the maths underlying quantum physics, asking no former education in mathematics. I confess: I was never able to past the first 100 pages, it's very dense, every day I think: today, I will go back to the Penrose, but I never do it :-(.

              When you read an introductory bok, never forget that quantum physics remain a highly debated field, and that an author point of view is frequently contested by others: Greene is championing string theory, which remain contested by some physicists; Deutsch advocate the many worlds theory, against the consensus favouring Copenhagen theory; And Penrose can be very, very controversial too...

              Good luck!

              remi

              "Nobody understands quantum physics"" Richard Feynman




              ---- Message d'origine ----
              De : "Noah Won" <seermagician@...>
              À : solomonic@yahoogroups.com
              Objet : [Solomonic] Quantum physics; book recommendations
              Date : 02/03/2014 00:34:02 CET


               
              I should have done this first, rather than as a question on Kathy's thread.
              Apologize, Kathy.
              Anyway, I recently got an angelic directive to learn more about quantum physics. I also previously got a directive to get and read "Prometheus Rising", by Robert Anton Wilson, which talks about neuroscience and the 8 brain circuits, 4 of which have to do with extrasensory experiences.
              My question to you is, which quantum physics book would you recommend for a newbie?
              Thank you in advance for your reply.



            • James Verran
              Although not really about quantum physics, Quantum Psychology by Robert Anton Wilson is a fun read. It s a followup to Prometheus Rising. ... thread. ...
              Message 6 of 21 , Mar 8, 2014
                Although not really about quantum physics, Quantum Psychology by Robert Anton Wilson is a fun read. It's a followup to Prometheus Rising.


                On Sat, Mar 1, 2014 at 3:34 PM, Noah Won <seermagician@...> wrote:
                >
                >  
                >
                > I should have done this first, rather than as a question on Kathy's thread.
                > Apologize, Kathy.
                > Anyway, I recently got an angelic directive to learn more about quantum physics. I also previously got a directive to get and read "Prometheus Rising", by Robert Anton Wilson, which talks about neuroscience and the 8 brain circuits, 4 of which have to do with extrasensory experiences.
                > My question to you is, which quantum physics book would you recommend for a newbie?
                > Thank you in advance for your reply.
                >
                >

              • Noah Won
                Hi Kathy, I ve read up to and including chapter 5 of Aaron s book, Secrets of the Magickal Grimoires . I haven t read it all, yet, as I had an experience
                Message 7 of 21 , Mar 9, 2014
                  Hi Kathy,
                  I've read up to and including chapter 5 of Aaron's book, "Secrets of the Magickal Grimoires". I haven't read it all, yet, as I had an experience while reading what Aaron had to say about "Prometheus Rising". Feelings of intense, non-sexual physical pleasure filling me up. I took this as a directive to read "Prometheus Rising". I had a similar experience after viewing online a video comparing Kabbalah and Quantum physics. So, I took this as a directive to learn more about Quantum.
                  I've still got Aaron's book, of course, and plan to go back to it. But for the moment there's a sense of urgency to re-reading Prometheus Rising and investigating Quantum physics.
                  I'm sure it's no secret to anyone here that we're entering a time of accelerated changes. There's a sense of urgency at the moment to doing what I've been directed to do.


                  On Sunday, March 9, 2014 12:17 AM, James Verran <sendme105@...> wrote:
                   
                  Although not really about quantum physics, Quantum Psychology by Robert Anton Wilson is a fun read. It's a followup to Prometheus Rising.


                  On Sat, Mar 1, 2014 at 3:34 PM, Noah Won <seermagician@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >  
                  >
                  > I should have done this first, rather than as a question on Kathy's thread.
                  > Apologize, Kathy.
                  > Anyway, I recently got an angelic directive to learn more about quantum physics. I also previously got a directive to get and read "Prometheus Rising", by Robert Anton Wilson, which talks about neuroscience and the 8 brain circuits, 4 of which have to do with extrasensory experiences.
                  > My question to you is, which quantum physics book would you recommend for a newbie?
                  > Thank you in advance for your reply.
                  >
                  >



                • Noah Won
                  Thanks James.  I did find it on Amazon prior to getting your contribution, and it s currently in my Wish List. On , Noah Won wrote:
                  Message 8 of 21 , Mar 9, 2014
                    Thanks James. 
                    I did find it on Amazon prior to getting your contribution, and it's currently in my Wish List.


                    On , Noah Won <seermagician@...> wrote:
                    Hi Kathy,
                    I've read up to and including chapter 5 of Aaron's book, "Secrets of the Magickal Grimoires". I haven't read it all, yet, as I had an experience while reading what Aaron had to say about "Prometheus Rising". Feelings of intense, non-sexual physical pleasure filling me up. I took this as a directive to read "Prometheus Rising". I had a similar experience after viewing online a video comparing Kabbalah and Quantum physics. So, I took this as a directive to learn more about Quantum.
                    I've still got Aaron's book, of course, and plan to go back to it. But for the moment there's a sense of urgency to re-reading Prometheus Rising and investigating Quantum physics.
                    I'm sure it's no secret to anyone here that we're entering a time of accelerated changes. There's a sense of urgency at the moment to doing what I've been directed to do.


                    On Sunday, March 9, 2014 12:17 AM, James Verran <sendme105@...> wrote:
                     
                    Although not really about quantum physics, Quantum Psychology by Robert Anton Wilson is a fun read. It's a followup to Prometheus Rising.


                    On Sat, Mar 1, 2014 at 3:34 PM, Noah Won <seermagician@...> wrote:
                    >
                    >  
                    >
                    > I should have done this first, rather than as a question on Kathy's thread.
                    > Apologize, Kathy.
                    > Anyway, I recently got an angelic directive to learn more about quantum physics. I also previously got a directive to get and read "Prometheus Rising", by Robert Anton Wilson, which talks about neuroscience and the 8 brain circuits, 4 of which have to do with extrasensory experiences.
                    > My question to you is, which quantum physics book would you recommend for a newbie?
                    > Thank you in advance for your reply.
                    >
                    >





                  • Mark Newell
                    Great to see people leaning in the direction of quantum physics. I often wonder if quantum physicists ever read in comparative or ancient religion/philosophy.
                    Message 9 of 21 , Mar 9, 2014
                      Great to see people leaning in the direction of quantum physics. I often wonder if quantum physicists ever read in comparative or ancient religion/philosophy. Reading some of the most ancient texts concerning the meaning and nature of existence and creation—and quantum physics — is to realize both field are saying the same thing. The language may be different but the underlying message is the same! A Stanford scientist recently demonstrated that the mind can actually change the nature of matter-really? Occultists were doing this aeons ago.
                    • Noah Won
                      Thanks, Sara. Math and I aren t on the best of terms. Currently, we re not speaking to each other. The highest I got was college Algebra. Never got to Trig nor
                      Message 10 of 21 , Mar 11, 2014
                        Thanks, Sara.
                        Math and I aren't on the best of terms. Currently, we're not speaking to each other.
                        The highest I got was college Algebra. Never got to Trig nor Calc.


                        On Monday, March 10, 2014 3:33 AM, Mark Newell <mmnewell@...> wrote:
                        Great to see people leaning in the direction of quantum physics. I often wonder if quantum physicists ever read in comparative or ancient religion/philosophy. Reading some of the most ancient texts concerning the meaning and nature of existence and creation—and quantum physics — is to realize both field are saying the same thing. The language may be different but the underlying message is the same!  A Stanford scientist recently demonstrated that the mind can actually change the nature of matter-really? Occultists were doing this aeons ago.


                        ------------------------------------

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                      • Jake Stratton-Kent
                        will someone explain how equating magic with Quantum physics, with a Rob Wilson s book on the coffee table, is scientific? Because it seems a lot more like
                        Message 11 of 21 , Mar 13, 2014
                          will someone explain how equating magic with Quantum physics, with a
                          Rob Wilson's book on the coffee table, is scientific? Because it seems
                          a lot more like recycled 1970s nostalgia to me. Pop occulture crossed
                          with pop-science, not scientific magic.

                          More scientific magic involves - surprise - more magical work with
                          traditional materials, and a sustained effort at understanding the
                          context of the ideas involved.

                          Understanding magic in its own terms, informed by a historical
                          perspective based on *evidence* is extremely scientific. Not
                          glamorous, not easy, but genuinely scientific. Unlike 'Quantum Magic'
                          it has actually made some headway in the last several decades - no
                          thanks to the majority of would be occult modernists.

                          Yup, well informed traditional magicians, guided by proper research
                          and regular hands on involvement in magical work *are* the scientific
                          magicians.

                          PS there's a practical disconnect between quantum physics and the
                          practice of magic. We'd be better advised to examine the biological
                          bases of language, where a clear interface with magical theory &
                          practice is virtually a given.

                          ALWays

                          Jake
                        • Sara
                          I completely agree with everything Jake said. However, I think that quantum mechanics is awesome, and completely worth learning for its own sake. Or because
                          Message 12 of 21 , Mar 13, 2014
                            I completely agree with everything Jake said.  However, I think that quantum mechanics is awesome, and completely worth learning for its own sake.  Or because a trusted spirit told you to.

                            Noah, you'll need to learn calculus (well) before you have any chance of any kind of understanding related to quantum mechanics.  Anyone who tells you differently is selling something.  Conveniently, calculus is awesome. 

                            Sara


                            On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 8:27 AM, Jake Stratton-Kent <jakestrattonkent@...> wrote:
                             

                            will someone explain how equating magic with Quantum physics, with a
                            Rob Wilson's book on the coffee table, is scientific? Because it seems
                            a lot more like recycled 1970s nostalgia to me. Pop occulture crossed
                            with pop-science, not scientific magic.

                            More scientific magic involves - surprise - more magical work with
                            traditional materials, and a sustained effort at understanding the
                            context of the ideas involved.

                            Understanding magic in its own terms, informed by a historical
                            perspective based on *evidence* is extremely scientific. Not
                            glamorous, not easy, but genuinely scientific. Unlike 'Quantum Magic'
                            it has actually made some headway in the last several decades - no
                            thanks to the majority of would be occult modernists.

                            Yup, well informed traditional magicians, guided by proper research
                            and regular hands on involvement in magical work *are* the scientific
                            magicians.

                            PS there's a practical disconnect between quantum physics and the
                            practice of magic. We'd be better advised to examine the biological
                            bases of language, where a clear interface with magical theory &
                            practice is virtually a given.

                            ALWays

                            Jake


                          • Freeman Presson
                            ... Heisenberg said: I think that modern physics has definitely decided in favor of Plato. In fact the smallest units of matter are not physical objects in
                            Message 13 of 21 , Mar 13, 2014
                              On Sun, Mar 9, 2014 at 2:11 PM, Mark Newell <mmnewell@...> wrote:
                              Great to see people leaning in the direction of quantum physics. I often wonder if quantum physicists ever read in comparative or ancient religion/philosophy. [...]
                              Heisenberg said: "I think that modern physics has definitely decided in favor of Plato. In fact the smallest units of matter are not physical objects in the ordinary sense; they are forms, ideas which can be expressed unambiguously only in mathematical language." As quoted in The New York Times Book Review (8 March 1992)

                              In general, the first generation of quantum physicists were much more open to trying to interpret what their theories meant and relate them to philosophy, but for the next generations, the weird speculations lost their flavor, and they tend to understand QM as a mathematical system without any need to relate it back to "common sense."

                              I agree with what Sara said above, and to an extent with Jake's later comment. There is no point in thinking you are going to comprehend QM enough to have metaphysical insights from it if you can't follow the math. It's like reading a translation of a translation of a fragmentary text. I have a mathematics degree from MIT[1], and I would have to brush up some of my prerequisites to even have a chance to read any of the new stuff.

                              It's amusing, up to a point, to watch people try. Most of the ones who write about it fall flat on their faces (I'm looking at YOU, Fritzjof Capra). RAW and Peter J. Carroll came closest of the ones I have seen.

                              For working magicians, I think it might be enough to note that the Laplacian mechanical Cosmos was overturned by 1920, and that leading-edge science no longer supports philosophical materialism[2], then go back to the Temple.

                              Mark>  A Stanford scientist recently demonstrated that the mind can actually change the nature of matter...

                              I'd like to see the cite on this. As stated, it fails my smell test.

                              ----
                              1. Considering my subsequent interests, I tend to tell people it stands for Miskatonic Institute of Thaumaturgy nowadays.
                              2. I treated this at somewhat greater length at http://freemanpresson.wordpress.com/2012/12/28/the-re-enchantment-project/.

                              --
                              -- Freeman <namsaga@...>
                              -- Fr. Ophis, CHS
                              -- Blog/book reviews: http://freemanpresson.wordpress.com
                              "Every time you fail to correct a typo, the errorists win."

                            • Noah Won
                              Maybe the direction I was being given was something specific to me, rather than something that was generally applicable.  On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 12:10 PM,
                              Message 14 of 21 , Mar 13, 2014
                                Maybe the direction I was being given was something specific to me, rather than something that was generally applicable. 


                                On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 12:10 PM, Noah Won <seermagician@...> wrote:
                                 
                                Thanks, Sara.
                                Math and I aren't on the best of terms. Currently, we're not speaking to each other.
                                The highest I got was college Algebra. Never got to Trig nor Calc.


                                On Monday, March 10, 2014 3:33 AM, Mark Newell <mmnewell@...> wrote:
                                Great to see people leaning in the direction of quantum physics. I often wonder if quantum physicists ever read in comparative or ancient religion/philosophy. Reading some of the most ancient texts concerning the meaning and nature of existence and creation—and quantum physics — is to realize both field are saying the same thing. The language may be different but the underlying message is the same!  A Stanford scientist recently demonstrated that the mind can actually change the nature of matter-really? Occultists were doing this aeons ago.


                                ------------------------------------

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                              • Sara
                                Freeman, thanks so much for the link to your blog post. I enjoyed it very much. You have a new follower. If you ever want to talk math, let me know. (I went
                                Message 15 of 21 , Mar 14, 2014
                                  Freeman, thanks so much for the link to your blog post.  I enjoyed it very much.  You have a new follower. If you ever want to talk math, let me know.  (I went to Caltech as a math major.)

                                  Sara


                                  On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 3:03 PM, Noah Won <seermagician@...> wrote:
                                   

                                  Maybe the direction I was being given was something specific to me, rather than something that was generally applicable. 


                                  On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 12:10 PM, Noah Won <seermagician@...> wrote:
                                   
                                  Thanks, Sara.
                                  Math and I aren't on the best of terms. Currently, we're not speaking to each other.
                                  The highest I got was college Algebra. Never got to Trig nor Calc.


                                  On Monday, March 10, 2014 3:33 AM, Mark Newell <mmnewell@...> wrote:
                                  Great to see people leaning in the direction of quantum physics. I often wonder if quantum physicists ever read in comparative or ancient religion/philosophy. Reading some of the most ancient texts concerning the meaning and nature of existence and creation—and quantum physics — is to realize both field are saying the same thing. The language may be different but the underlying message is the same!  A Stanford scientist recently demonstrated that the mind can actually change the nature of matter-really? Occultists were doing this aeons ago.


                                  ------------------------------------

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                                • Jake Stratton-Kent
                                  ... for sure, and there are all sorts of interesting aspects to quantum physics. As far as explaining how magic works, that d have to be qualified. It probably
                                  Message 16 of 21 , Mar 17, 2014
                                    On 13 March 2014 19:03, Noah Won <seermagician@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > Maybe the direction I was being given was something specific to me, rather than something that was generally applicable.
                                    >

                                    for sure, and there are all sorts of interesting aspects to quantum physics.

                                    As far as explaining how magic works, that'd have to be qualified. It
                                    probably doesn't, strictly speaking. What is relevant to magic is more
                                    general, involving the interplay of science and philosophy.

                                    Quantum physics influences modern scientific theory about how the
                                    universe works. Materialism and the 'observer effect' don't play well
                                    together. This affects questions like 'what is Matter?', even 'does
                                    matter exist?'.

                                    Even so, the main arena for this isn't quantum physics, but
                                    neuroscience. The question being 'what is Mind?' If the materialist
                                    corner is wrong about its answer to this, then philosophical
                                    traditions intimately associated with the history of magic are on the
                                    right side of a hugely significant debate.

                                    We're still rather quaint, of course. ;)
                                  • Roy
                                    ... Amen Jake, I doubt there will ever be a materialist explanation for mind. Contemplating the nature of mind is what brought me to magic in the first place.
                                    Message 17 of 21 , Mar 17, 2014
                                      On 3/17/2014 5:26 PM, Jake Stratton-Kent wrote:
                                      Even so, the main arena for this isn't quantum physics, but
                                      neuroscience. The question being 'what is Mind?' If the materialist
                                      corner is wrong about its answer to this, then philosophical
                                      traditions intimately associated with the history of magic are on the
                                      right side of a hugely significant debate.
                                      Amen Jake, I doubt there will ever be a materialist explanation for mind.

                                      Contemplating the nature of mind is what brought me to magic in the first place.

                                      -- 
                                      --------------------------------------------
                                      Q: Why is this email five sentences or less?
                                      A: http://five.sentenc.es
                                      
                                      Roy
                                    • kheph777
                                      Personally, I think you d get much further in understanding magick if you study memetics, rather than quantum physics. :) Ideas are living things - today they
                                      Message 18 of 21 , Mar 19, 2014
                                        Personally, I think you'd get much further in understanding magick if you study memetics, rather than quantum physics.  :)

                                        Ideas are living things - today they call them "viruses" (as in, that video went viral!).  Memetics studies how ideas are born, live, produce both waste and offspring and finally die.

                                        Angels and gods and spirits and ghosts and magick all exist in the same "place" that ideas exist.  And they seem to be made of the same "stuff" as ideas.  That doesn't automatically mean that spiritual entities are "just ideas" that someone somewhere made up - because that isn't the case.  But they still seem to live in the same place and follow the same rules, just like we live here in the third dimension and have to obey the rules of physics.

                                        Quantum physics isn't going to teach you about the mental realm / astral plane / spirit world.  Memetics will.

                                        But Quantum physics remains an awesome study and it's got to be the most mystical of the sciences since early mathematics.  :):):)

                                        LVX
                                        Aaron.
                                      • Sara
                                        I agree. These are the things I d recommend as magically inspirational AND accessible to people without strong backgrounds in math and physics. (My academic
                                        Message 19 of 21 , Mar 19, 2014
                                          I agree. These are the things I'd recommend as magically inspirational AND accessible to people without strong backgrounds in math and physics.  (My academic background is in math and the history and philosophy of science, so this list leans that way)  I teach everything on this list to smart high school students; they're not easy, but they are well within the grasp of any smart, well-educated person.


                                          2) theories of refutability as the underpinning of the scientific method.  Try this: http://www.lse.ac.uk/philosophy/About/lakatos/scienceandpseudoscience.aspx

                                          3) Godel incompleteness (hard, but not incomprehensible.  I teach it to bright high schoolers)  Try this for a brief intro: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00dshx3

                                          4) The Fractal Geometry of Nature, by Benoit Madalbrot.  (real understanding of fractals takes a lot of math, but try this for a cursory overview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmxJ1KDR_s0



                                          Sara


                                          On Wed, Mar 19, 2014 at 4:24 AM, <kheph777@...> wrote:
                                           

                                          Personally, I think you'd get much further in understanding magick if you study memetics, rather than quantum physics.  :)

                                          Ideas are living things - today they call them "viruses" (as in, that video went viral!).  Memetics studies how ideas are born, live, produce both waste and offspring and finally die.

                                          Angels and gods and spirits and ghosts and magick all exist in the same "place" that ideas exist.  And they seem to be made of the same "stuff" as ideas.  That doesn't automatically mean that spiritual entities are "just ideas" that someone somewhere made up - because that isn't the case.  But they still seem to live in the same place and follow the same rules, just like we live here in the third dimension and have to obey the rules of physics.

                                          Quantum physics isn't going to teach you about the mental realm / astral plane / spirit world.  Memetics will.

                                          But Quantum physics remains an awesome study and it's got to be the most mystical of the sciences since early mathematics.  :):):)

                                          LVX
                                          Aaron.


                                        • Colin Low
                                          Sticking to the original question, and avoiding a lot of populist literature that personally I find irritating, I would suggest Feynman s Lectures on Physics
                                          Message 20 of 21 , Mar 20, 2014
                                            Sticking to the original question, and avoiding a lot of populist literature that personally I find irritating, I would suggest Feynman's Lectures on Physics Vol 3 as the most accessible introduction to real QM. Some understanding of linear operators and vectors cannot be avoided, but his focus throughout is building intuition.

                                            I still read it.

                                            Colin Low
                                          • Sara
                                            Oh! Good idea. I second the Feynman books. Although, I think you might need the vector book I recommended first.
                                            Message 21 of 21 , Mar 21, 2014
                                              Oh!  Good idea.  I second the Feynman books. Although, I think you might need the vector book I recommended first. 


                                              On Thu, Mar 20, 2014 at 5:03 AM, Colin Low <valkeerie@...> wrote:
                                               

                                              Sticking to the original question, and avoiding a lot of populist literature that personally I find irritating, I would suggest Feynman's Lectures on Physics Vol 3 as the most accessible introduction to real QM. Some understanding of linear operators and vectors cannot be avoided, but his focus throughout is building intuition.

                                              I still read it.

                                              Colin Low


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