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Sensor cable weirdness... Wolf? Anybody?

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  • Sean K
    So I ve gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think that I ve got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get my hands on an actual
    Message 1 of 13 , Nov 29, 2012
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      So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think that I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get my hands on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout box I can get LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them to flash at about the same rate.

      I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good because prior to getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to drive around the block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.

      If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up how it was originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks, about the same in forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line it still moves very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear like an electronic chirping sound.

      I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is generally a connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my soldering iron to replace connectors I figured I should check in with you guys to see if you have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an idea why putting the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness, and what that chirping sound is.

      I should mention that the test drive with the printed pattern ended up with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting bunched up on the edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires (temp sensor?) are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I mentioned the A and B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.

      Any thoughts?
    • Wolf
      Sounds like a grounding issue to me... Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the motor, to the metal connector end, it should be a short. ...
      Message 2 of 13 , Nov 30, 2012
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        Sounds like a grounding issue to me...

        Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the motor, to the
        metal connector end, it should be a short.

        On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@...> wrote:

        > **
        >
        >
        > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think that
        > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get my hands
        > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout box I can get
        > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them to flash at about
        > the same rate.
        >
        > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good because prior to
        > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to drive around the
        > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
        >
        > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up how it was
        > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks, about the same in
        > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line it still moves
        > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear like an
        > electronic chirping sound.
        >
        > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is generally a
        > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my soldering iron to
        > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you guys to see if you
        > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an idea why putting
        > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness, and what that
        > chirping sound is.
        >
        > I should mention that the test drive with the printed pattern ended up
        > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting bunched up on the
        > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires (temp sensor?)
        > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I mentioned the A and
        > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
        >
        > Any thoughts?
        >
        >
        >


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Sean K
        Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or the 25 pin connectors there s less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that enough to cause a
        Message 3 of 13 , Dec 1, 2012
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          Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or the 25 pin connectors there's less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that enough to cause a problem?

          I've also borrowed an o-scope and the A and B channels each seem to be outputting basically the same thing, nice square pulses, unfortunately it's only a single channel so I can't watch them in relation to eachother.

          --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@...> wrote:
          >
          > Sounds like a grounding issue to me...
          >
          > Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the motor, to the
          > metal connector end, it should be a short.
          >
          > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@...> wrote:
          >
          > > **
          > >
          > >
          > > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think that
          > > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get my hands
          > > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout box I can get
          > > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them to flash at about
          > > the same rate.
          > >
          > > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good because prior to
          > > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to drive around the
          > > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
          > >
          > > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up how it was
          > > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks, about the same in
          > > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line it still moves
          > > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear like an
          > > electronic chirping sound.
          > >
          > > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is generally a
          > > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my soldering iron to
          > > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you guys to see if you
          > > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an idea why putting
          > > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness, and what that
          > > chirping sound is.
          > >
          > > I should mention that the test drive with the printed pattern ended up
          > > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting bunched up on the
          > > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires (temp sensor?)
          > > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I mentioned the A and
          > > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
          > >
          > > Any thoughts?
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
        • Wolf
          Nope, that sounds good. There is an encoder A/B switch under under the back cover... is it possible that got flipped by accident? Or is it possible that one of
          Message 4 of 13 , Dec 2, 2012
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            Nope, that sounds good.

            There is an encoder A/B switch under under the back cover... is it possible
            that got flipped by accident?
            Or is it possible that one of the phases to the motor got swapped
            accidently?

            Both of those could cause the conditions you are seeing.

            On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 4:40 PM, Sean K <seankmc@...> wrote:

            > **
            >
            >
            > Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or the 25 pin
            > connectors there's less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that enough to
            > cause a problem?
            >
            > I've also borrowed an o-scope and the A and B channels each seem to be
            > outputting basically the same thing, nice square pulses, unfortunately it's
            > only a single channel so I can't watch them in relation to eachother.
            >
            > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@...> wrote:
            > >
            > > Sounds like a grounding issue to me...
            > >
            > > Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the motor, to the
            > > metal connector end, it should be a short.
            > >
            > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@...> wrote:
            > >
            > > > **
            >
            > > >
            > > >
            > > > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think that
            > > > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get my
            > hands
            > > > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout box I can get
            > > > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them to flash at
            > about
            > > > the same rate.
            > > >
            > > > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good because prior
            > to
            > > > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to drive around the
            > > > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
            > > >
            > > > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up how it was
            > > > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks, about the same
            > in
            > > > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line it still
            > moves
            > > > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear like an
            > > > electronic chirping sound.
            > > >
            > > > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is generally a
            > > > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my soldering
            > iron to
            > > > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you guys to see if
            > you
            > > > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an idea why
            > putting
            > > > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness, and what that
            > > > chirping sound is.
            > > >
            > > > I should mention that the test drive with the printed pattern ended up
            > > > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting bunched up on the
            > > > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires (temp
            > sensor?)
            > > > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I mentioned the A
            > and
            > > > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
            > > >
            > > > Any thoughts?
            > > >
            > > >
            > > >
            > >
            > >
            > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            > >
            >
            >
            >


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Sean K
            I haven t messed with the phases at all, the switch sounds like a maybe, is it under the back cover of the motor? like on the sensor board itself?
            Message 5 of 13 , Dec 2, 2012
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              I haven't messed with the phases at all, the switch sounds like a maybe, is it under the back cover of the motor? like on the sensor board itself?

              --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@...> wrote:
              >
              > Nope, that sounds good.
              >
              > There is an encoder A/B switch under under the back cover... is it possible
              > that got flipped by accident?
              > Or is it possible that one of the phases to the motor got swapped
              > accidently?
              >
              > Both of those could cause the conditions you are seeing.
              >
              > On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 4:40 PM, Sean K <seankmc@...> wrote:
              >
              > > **
              > >
              > >
              > > Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or the 25 pin
              > > connectors there's less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that enough to
              > > cause a problem?
              > >
              > > I've also borrowed an o-scope and the A and B channels each seem to be
              > > outputting basically the same thing, nice square pulses, unfortunately it's
              > > only a single channel so I can't watch them in relation to eachother.
              > >
              > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Sounds like a grounding issue to me...
              > > >
              > > > Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the motor, to the
              > > > metal connector end, it should be a short.
              > > >
              > > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > > **
              > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think that
              > > > > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get my
              > > hands
              > > > > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout box I can get
              > > > > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them to flash at
              > > about
              > > > > the same rate.
              > > > >
              > > > > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good because prior
              > > to
              > > > > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to drive around the
              > > > > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
              > > > >
              > > > > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up how it was
              > > > > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks, about the same
              > > in
              > > > > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line it still
              > > moves
              > > > > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear like an
              > > > > electronic chirping sound.
              > > > >
              > > > > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is generally a
              > > > > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my soldering
              > > iron to
              > > > > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you guys to see if
              > > you
              > > > > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an idea why
              > > putting
              > > > > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness, and what that
              > > > > chirping sound is.
              > > > >
              > > > > I should mention that the test drive with the printed pattern ended up
              > > > > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting bunched up on the
              > > > > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires (temp
              > > sensor?)
              > > > > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I mentioned the A
              > > and
              > > > > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
              > > > >
              > > > > Any thoughts?
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > > >
              > > >
              > > >
              > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • Wolf
              It is on the back of the controller, not the motor. ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              Message 6 of 13 , Dec 2, 2012
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                It is on the back of the controller, not the motor.
                On Dec 2, 2012 9:25 PM, "Sean K" <seankmc@...> wrote:

                > **
                >
                >
                > I haven't messed with the phases at all, the switch sounds like a maybe,
                > is it under the back cover of the motor? like on the sensor board itself?
                >
                > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@...> wrote:
                > >
                > > Nope, that sounds good.
                > >
                > > There is an encoder A/B switch under under the back cover... is it
                > possible
                > > that got flipped by accident?
                > > Or is it possible that one of the phases to the motor got swapped
                > > accidently?
                > >
                > > Both of those could cause the conditions you are seeing.
                > >
                > > On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 4:40 PM, Sean K <seankmc@...> wrote:
                > >
                > > > **
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or the 25 pin
                > > > connectors there's less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that enough to
                > > > cause a problem?
                > > >
                > > > I've also borrowed an o-scope and the A and B channels each seem to be
                > > > outputting basically the same thing, nice square pulses, unfortunately
                > it's
                > > > only a single channel so I can't watch them in relation to eachother.
                > > >
                > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > Sounds like a grounding issue to me...
                > > > >
                > > > > Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the motor, to
                > the
                > > > > metal connector end, it should be a short.
                > > > >
                > > > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > > **
                > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think
                > that
                > > > > > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get
                > my
                > > > hands
                > > > > > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout box I
                > can get
                > > > > > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them to flash
                > at
                > > > about
                > > > > > the same rate.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good because
                > prior
                > > > to
                > > > > > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to drive around
                > the
                > > > > > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up how it was
                > > > > > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks, about the
                > same
                > > > in
                > > > > > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line it still
                > > > moves
                > > > > > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear like an
                > > > > > electronic chirping sound.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is generally
                > a
                > > > > > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my soldering
                > > > iron to
                > > > > > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you guys to
                > see if
                > > > you
                > > > > > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an idea why
                > > > putting
                > > > > > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness, and what
                > that
                > > > > > chirping sound is.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > I should mention that the test drive with the printed pattern
                > ended up
                > > > > > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting bunched up
                > on the
                > > > > > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires (temp
                > > > sensor?)
                > > > > > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I mentioned
                > the A
                > > > and
                > > > > > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
                > > > > >
                > > > > > Any thoughts?
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > >
                > >
                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > >
                >
                >
                >


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Sean K
                Oh then probably not, I haven t opened up the controller at all yet, the only cover I ve taken off is the one on the back of the motor to get to the sensor. It
                Message 7 of 13 , Dec 2, 2012
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                  Oh then probably not, I haven't opened up the controller at all yet, the only cover I've taken off is the one on the back of the motor to get to the sensor.

                  It still weirds me out that when I have the breakout box in place that the jerkiness goes away.

                  If the temp sensor is damaged or has a bad connection to the encoder board would that cause anything like this or would the controller just not turn on?

                  --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > It is on the back of the controller, not the motor.
                  > On Dec 2, 2012 9:25 PM, "Sean K" <seankmc@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > > **
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > I haven't messed with the phases at all, the switch sounds like a maybe,
                  > > is it under the back cover of the motor? like on the sensor board itself?
                  > >
                  > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > Nope, that sounds good.
                  > > >
                  > > > There is an encoder A/B switch under under the back cover... is it
                  > > possible
                  > > > that got flipped by accident?
                  > > > Or is it possible that one of the phases to the motor got swapped
                  > > > accidently?
                  > > >
                  > > > Both of those could cause the conditions you are seeing.
                  > > >
                  > > > On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 4:40 PM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > > **
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or the 25 pin
                  > > > > connectors there's less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that enough to
                  > > > > cause a problem?
                  > > > >
                  > > > > I've also borrowed an o-scope and the A and B channels each seem to be
                  > > > > outputting basically the same thing, nice square pulses, unfortunately
                  > > it's
                  > > > > only a single channel so I can't watch them in relation to eachother.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Sounds like a grounding issue to me...
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the motor, to
                  > > the
                  > > > > > metal connector end, it should be a short.
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > > **
                  > > > >
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think
                  > > that
                  > > > > > > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get
                  > > my
                  > > > > hands
                  > > > > > > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout box I
                  > > can get
                  > > > > > > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them to flash
                  > > at
                  > > > > about
                  > > > > > > the same rate.
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good because
                  > > prior
                  > > > > to
                  > > > > > > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to drive around
                  > > the
                  > > > > > > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up how it was
                  > > > > > > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks, about the
                  > > same
                  > > > > in
                  > > > > > > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line it still
                  > > > > moves
                  > > > > > > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear like an
                  > > > > > > electronic chirping sound.
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is generally
                  > > a
                  > > > > > > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my soldering
                  > > > > iron to
                  > > > > > > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you guys to
                  > > see if
                  > > > > you
                  > > > > > > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an idea why
                  > > > > putting
                  > > > > > > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness, and what
                  > > that
                  > > > > > > chirping sound is.
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > I should mention that the test drive with the printed pattern
                  > > ended up
                  > > > > > > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting bunched up
                  > > on the
                  > > > > > > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires (temp
                  > > > > sensor?)
                  > > > > > > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I mentioned
                  > > the A
                  > > > > and
                  > > > > > > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > > Any thoughts?
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  > > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                • Sean K
                  New information, attempting to take a reading between pins 2 and 9 tonight my meter was jumping all over the place from about 30 to 190 ohms. Also if I plug
                  Message 8 of 13 , Dec 2, 2012
                  • 0 Attachment
                    New information, attempting to take a reading between pins 2 and 9 tonight my meter was jumping all over the place from about 30 to 190 ohms. Also if I plug the fan back in it constantly runs full speed even though the motor has been sitting off since yesterday.

                    Looking closer I did notice that the black wire closest to the edge of the encoder board was barely connected, in fact in wiggling the wire it completely broke away from the solder.

                    I'm off to bed and probably wont have a chance to dig out my soldering iron until after work tomorrow. Do you think this could be the issue? I know that without the temp sensor connected at all the car wont run, and this wire is right on the corner where my makeshift paper encoder came off the disc and bunched up around the board.

                    I guess the only way to know for sure is to solder it back on.

                    --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, "Sean K" <seankmc@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Oh then probably not, I haven't opened up the controller at all yet, the only cover I've taken off is the one on the back of the motor to get to the sensor.
                    >
                    > It still weirds me out that when I have the breakout box in place that the jerkiness goes away.
                    >
                    > If the temp sensor is damaged or has a bad connection to the encoder board would that cause anything like this or would the controller just not turn on?
                    >
                    > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > It is on the back of the controller, not the motor.
                    > > On Dec 2, 2012 9:25 PM, "Sean K" <seankmc@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > > **
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > I haven't messed with the phases at all, the switch sounds like a maybe,
                    > > > is it under the back cover of the motor? like on the sensor board itself?
                    > > >
                    > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                    > > > >
                    > > > > Nope, that sounds good.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > There is an encoder A/B switch under under the back cover... is it
                    > > > possible
                    > > > > that got flipped by accident?
                    > > > > Or is it possible that one of the phases to the motor got swapped
                    > > > > accidently?
                    > > > >
                    > > > > Both of those could cause the conditions you are seeing.
                    > > > >
                    > > > > On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 4:40 PM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                    > > > >
                    > > > > > **
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or the 25 pin
                    > > > > > connectors there's less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that enough to
                    > > > > > cause a problem?
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > I've also borrowed an o-scope and the A and B channels each seem to be
                    > > > > > outputting basically the same thing, nice square pulses, unfortunately
                    > > > it's
                    > > > > > only a single channel so I can't watch them in relation to eachother.
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                    > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > Sounds like a grounding issue to me...
                    > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the motor, to
                    > > > the
                    > > > > > > metal connector end, it should be a short.
                    > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                    > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > > **
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think
                    > > > that
                    > > > > > > > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get
                    > > > my
                    > > > > > hands
                    > > > > > > > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout box I
                    > > > can get
                    > > > > > > > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them to flash
                    > > > at
                    > > > > > about
                    > > > > > > > the same rate.
                    > > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good because
                    > > > prior
                    > > > > > to
                    > > > > > > > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to drive around
                    > > > the
                    > > > > > > > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
                    > > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up how it was
                    > > > > > > > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks, about the
                    > > > same
                    > > > > > in
                    > > > > > > > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line it still
                    > > > > > moves
                    > > > > > > > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear like an
                    > > > > > > > electronic chirping sound.
                    > > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is generally
                    > > > a
                    > > > > > > > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my soldering
                    > > > > > iron to
                    > > > > > > > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you guys to
                    > > > see if
                    > > > > > you
                    > > > > > > > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an idea why
                    > > > > > putting
                    > > > > > > > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness, and what
                    > > > that
                    > > > > > > > chirping sound is.
                    > > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > > I should mention that the test drive with the printed pattern
                    > > > ended up
                    > > > > > > > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting bunched up
                    > > > on the
                    > > > > > > > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires (temp
                    > > > > > sensor?)
                    > > > > > > > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I mentioned
                    > > > the A
                    > > > > > and
                    > > > > > > > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
                    > > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > > Any thoughts?
                    > > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > >
                    > > > > > >
                    > > > > > >
                    > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    > > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    > > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    > >
                    >
                  • Reed Bement
                    If the temp sensor is damaged or has a bad connection to the encoder board would that cause anything like this or would the controller just not turn on? Yes.
                    Message 9 of 13 , Dec 3, 2012
                    • 0 Attachment
                      "If the temp sensor is damaged or has a bad connection to the encoder board would that cause anything like this or would the controller just not turn on?"

                      Yes. The controller won't start with an open motor sensor. You need to be able to measure ~240 ohms between pins 9 and 5 on the encoder DB9 connector.

                      Header DBM-9 Description
                      1 - Shield
                      2 1 Test Point
                      3 6 +6VDC
                      4 2 Gnd
                      5 7 B- Lo
                      6 3 A- Lo
                      7 8 B+ Hi
                      8 4 A+ Hi
                      9 9 Motor Temp (240 ohm to Gnd @ 70 degree F)
                      10 5 Gnd

                      IIRC the "Malfunction LED", pin 25 on the controller DB25 connector will also be in an active (low) state when this error occurs, with the "Power" selector in "Neutral". Easy to check with a breakout box.

                      -Reed



                      On 2012-12-02, at 10:37 PM, Sean K wrote:

                      > New information, attempting to take a reading between pins 2 and 9 tonight my meter was jumping all over the place from about 30 to 190 ohms. Also if I plug the fan back in it constantly runs full speed even though the motor has been sitting off since yesterday.
                      >
                      > Looking closer I did notice that the black wire closest to the edge of the encoder board was barely connected, in fact in wiggling the wire it completely broke away from the solder.
                      >
                      > I'm off to bed and probably wont have a chance to dig out my soldering iron until after work tomorrow. Do you think this could be the issue? I know that without the temp sensor connected at all the car wont run, and this wire is right on the corner where my makeshift paper encoder came off the disc and bunched up around the board.
                      >
                      > I guess the only way to know for sure is to solder it back on.
                      >
                      > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, "Sean K" <seankmc@...> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Oh then probably not, I haven't opened up the controller at all yet, the only cover I've taken off is the one on the back of the motor to get to the sensor.
                      > >
                      > > It still weirds me out that when I have the breakout box in place that the jerkiness goes away.
                      > >
                      > > If the temp sensor is damaged or has a bad connection to the encoder board would that cause anything like this or would the controller just not turn on?
                      > >
                      > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > It is on the back of the controller, not the motor.
                      > > > On Dec 2, 2012 9:25 PM, "Sean K" <seankmc@> wrote:
                      > > >
                      > > > > **
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > > I haven't messed with the phases at all, the switch sounds like a maybe,
                      > > > > is it under the back cover of the motor? like on the sensor board itself?
                      > > > >
                      > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > Nope, that sounds good.
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > There is an encoder A/B switch under under the back cover... is it
                      > > > > possible
                      > > > > > that got flipped by accident?
                      > > > > > Or is it possible that one of the phases to the motor got swapped
                      > > > > > accidently?
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > Both of those could cause the conditions you are seeing.
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 4:40 PM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > > **
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or the 25 pin
                      > > > > > > connectors there's less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that enough to
                      > > > > > > cause a problem?
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > I've also borrowed an o-scope and the A and B channels each seem to be
                      > > > > > > outputting basically the same thing, nice square pulses, unfortunately
                      > > > > it's
                      > > > > > > only a single channel so I can't watch them in relation to eachother.
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > Sounds like a grounding issue to me...
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the motor, to
                      > > > > the
                      > > > > > > > metal connector end, it should be a short.
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > > **
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think
                      > > > > that
                      > > > > > > > > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get
                      > > > > my
                      > > > > > > hands
                      > > > > > > > > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout box I
                      > > > > can get
                      > > > > > > > > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them to flash
                      > > > > at
                      > > > > > > about
                      > > > > > > > > the same rate.
                      > > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good because
                      > > > > prior
                      > > > > > > to
                      > > > > > > > > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to drive around
                      > > > > the
                      > > > > > > > > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
                      > > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up how it was
                      > > > > > > > > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks, about the
                      > > > > same
                      > > > > > > in
                      > > > > > > > > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line it still
                      > > > > > > moves
                      > > > > > > > > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear like an
                      > > > > > > > > electronic chirping sound.
                      > > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is generally
                      > > > > a
                      > > > > > > > > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my soldering
                      > > > > > > iron to
                      > > > > > > > > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you guys to
                      > > > > see if
                      > > > > > > you
                      > > > > > > > > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an idea why
                      > > > > > > putting
                      > > > > > > > > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness, and what
                      > > > > that
                      > > > > > > > > chirping sound is.
                      > > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > > I should mention that the test drive with the printed pattern
                      > > > > ended up
                      > > > > > > > > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting bunched up
                      > > > > on the
                      > > > > > > > > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires (temp
                      > > > > > > sensor?)
                      > > > > > > > > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I mentioned
                      > > > > the A
                      > > > > > > and
                      > > > > > > > > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
                      > > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > > Any thoughts?
                      > > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      > > > > > > >
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > > >
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > >
                      > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      > > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      > > >
                      > >
                      >
                      >
                    • Sean K
                      Re-soldered the temp sensor connection first thing this morning, still have the creep. If I have the fan plugged in it still kicks on full the moment I turn on
                      Message 10 of 13 , Dec 3, 2012
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Re-soldered the temp sensor connection first thing this morning, still have the creep.

                        If I have the fan plugged in it still kicks on full the moment I turn on the car, I thought it was only supposed to run while the motor is hot.

                        As the temp sensor warms up does the resistance increase or decrease?

                        --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, "Sean K" <seankmc@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > New information, attempting to take a reading between pins 2 and 9 tonight my meter was jumping all over the place from about 30 to 190 ohms. Also if I plug the fan back in it constantly runs full speed even though the motor has been sitting off since yesterday.
                        >
                        > Looking closer I did notice that the black wire closest to the edge of the encoder board was barely connected, in fact in wiggling the wire it completely broke away from the solder.
                        >
                        > I'm off to bed and probably wont have a chance to dig out my soldering iron until after work tomorrow. Do you think this could be the issue? I know that without the temp sensor connected at all the car wont run, and this wire is right on the corner where my makeshift paper encoder came off the disc and bunched up around the board.
                        >
                        > I guess the only way to know for sure is to solder it back on.
                        >
                        > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, "Sean K" <seankmc@> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > Oh then probably not, I haven't opened up the controller at all yet, the only cover I've taken off is the one on the back of the motor to get to the sensor.
                        > >
                        > > It still weirds me out that when I have the breakout box in place that the jerkiness goes away.
                        > >
                        > > If the temp sensor is damaged or has a bad connection to the encoder board would that cause anything like this or would the controller just not turn on?
                        > >
                        > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > It is on the back of the controller, not the motor.
                        > > > On Dec 2, 2012 9:25 PM, "Sean K" <seankmc@> wrote:
                        > > >
                        > > > > **
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > > I haven't messed with the phases at all, the switch sounds like a maybe,
                        > > > > is it under the back cover of the motor? like on the sensor board itself?
                        > > > >
                        > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Nope, that sounds good.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > There is an encoder A/B switch under under the back cover... is it
                        > > > > possible
                        > > > > > that got flipped by accident?
                        > > > > > Or is it possible that one of the phases to the motor got swapped
                        > > > > > accidently?
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > Both of those could cause the conditions you are seeing.
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 4:40 PM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > > **
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or the 25 pin
                        > > > > > > connectors there's less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that enough to
                        > > > > > > cause a problem?
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > I've also borrowed an o-scope and the A and B channels each seem to be
                        > > > > > > outputting basically the same thing, nice square pulses, unfortunately
                        > > > > it's
                        > > > > > > only a single channel so I can't watch them in relation to eachother.
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                        > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > Sounds like a grounding issue to me...
                        > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the motor, to
                        > > > > the
                        > > > > > > > metal connector end, it should be a short.
                        > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                        > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > **
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think
                        > > > > that
                        > > > > > > > > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get
                        > > > > my
                        > > > > > > hands
                        > > > > > > > > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout box I
                        > > > > can get
                        > > > > > > > > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them to flash
                        > > > > at
                        > > > > > > about
                        > > > > > > > > the same rate.
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good because
                        > > > > prior
                        > > > > > > to
                        > > > > > > > > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to drive around
                        > > > > the
                        > > > > > > > > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up how it was
                        > > > > > > > > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks, about the
                        > > > > same
                        > > > > > > in
                        > > > > > > > > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line it still
                        > > > > > > moves
                        > > > > > > > > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear like an
                        > > > > > > > > electronic chirping sound.
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is generally
                        > > > > a
                        > > > > > > > > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my soldering
                        > > > > > > iron to
                        > > > > > > > > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you guys to
                        > > > > see if
                        > > > > > > you
                        > > > > > > > > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an idea why
                        > > > > > > putting
                        > > > > > > > > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness, and what
                        > > > > that
                        > > > > > > > > chirping sound is.
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > I should mention that the test drive with the printed pattern
                        > > > > ended up
                        > > > > > > > > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting bunched up
                        > > > > on the
                        > > > > > > > > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires (temp
                        > > > > > > sensor?)
                        > > > > > > > > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I mentioned
                        > > > > the A
                        > > > > > > and
                        > > > > > > > > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > > Any thoughts?
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        > > > > > > >
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > >
                        > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        > > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        > > >
                        > >
                        >
                      • Wolf
                        You could also try and hook up to the monitor port on the controller and see if the controller thinks it its over temp. ... [Non-text portions of this message
                        Message 11 of 13 , Dec 3, 2012
                        • 0 Attachment
                          You could also try and hook up to the monitor port on the controller and
                          see if the controller thinks it its over temp.
                          On Dec 3, 2012 11:26 AM, "Sean K" <seankmc@...> wrote:

                          > **
                          >
                          >
                          > Re-soldered the temp sensor connection first thing this morning, still
                          > have the creep.
                          >
                          > If I have the fan plugged in it still kicks on full the moment I turn on
                          > the car, I thought it was only supposed to run while the motor is hot.
                          >
                          > As the temp sensor warms up does the resistance increase or decrease?
                          >
                          > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, "Sean K" <seankmc@...> wrote:
                          > >
                          > > New information, attempting to take a reading between pins 2 and 9
                          > tonight my meter was jumping all over the place from about 30 to 190 ohms.
                          > Also if I plug the fan back in it constantly runs full speed even though
                          > the motor has been sitting off since yesterday.
                          > >
                          > > Looking closer I did notice that the black wire closest to the edge of
                          > the encoder board was barely connected, in fact in wiggling the wire it
                          > completely broke away from the solder.
                          > >
                          > > I'm off to bed and probably wont have a chance to dig out my soldering
                          > iron until after work tomorrow. Do you think this could be the issue? I
                          > know that without the temp sensor connected at all the car wont run, and
                          > this wire is right on the corner where my makeshift paper encoder came off
                          > the disc and bunched up around the board.
                          > >
                          > > I guess the only way to know for sure is to solder it back on.
                          > >
                          > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, "Sean K" <seankmc@> wrote:
                          > > >
                          > > > Oh then probably not, I haven't opened up the controller at all yet,
                          > the only cover I've taken off is the one on the back of the motor to get to
                          > the sensor.
                          > > >
                          > > > It still weirds me out that when I have the breakout box in place that
                          > the jerkiness goes away.
                          > > >
                          > > > If the temp sensor is damaged or has a bad connection to the encoder
                          > board would that cause anything like this or would the controller just not
                          > turn on?
                          > > >
                          > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > > It is on the back of the controller, not the motor.
                          > > > > On Dec 2, 2012 9:25 PM, "Sean K" <seankmc@> wrote:
                          > > > >
                          > > > > > **
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > I haven't messed with the phases at all, the switch sounds like a
                          > maybe,
                          > > > > > is it under the back cover of the motor? like on the sensor board
                          > itself?
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > Nope, that sounds good.
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > There is an encoder A/B switch under under the back cover... is
                          > it
                          > > > > > possible
                          > > > > > > that got flipped by accident?
                          > > > > > > Or is it possible that one of the phases to the motor got swapped
                          > > > > > > accidently?
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > Both of those could cause the conditions you are seeing.
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 4:40 PM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > **
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or
                          > the 25 pin
                          > > > > > > > connectors there's less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that
                          > enough to
                          > > > > > > > cause a problem?
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > I've also borrowed an o-scope and the A and B channels each
                          > seem to be
                          > > > > > > > outputting basically the same thing, nice square pulses,
                          > unfortunately
                          > > > > > it's
                          > > > > > > > only a single channel so I can't watch them in relation to
                          > eachother.
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                          > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > Sounds like a grounding issue to me...
                          > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the
                          > motor, to
                          > > > > > the
                          > > > > > > > > metal connector end, it should be a short.
                          > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                          > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > > **
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and
                          > I think
                          > > > > > that
                          > > > > > > > > > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right,
                          > trying to get
                          > > > > > my
                          > > > > > > > hands
                          > > > > > > > > > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout
                          > box I
                          > > > > > can get
                          > > > > > > > > > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them
                          > to flash
                          > > > > > at
                          > > > > > > > about
                          > > > > > > > > > the same rate.
                          > > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good
                          > because
                          > > > > > prior
                          > > > > > > > to
                          > > > > > > > > > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to
                          > drive around
                          > > > > > the
                          > > > > > > > > > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
                          > > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up
                          > how it was
                          > > > > > > > > > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks,
                          > about the
                          > > > > > same
                          > > > > > > > in
                          > > > > > > > > > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line
                          > it still
                          > > > > > > > moves
                          > > > > > > > > > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear
                          > like an
                          > > > > > > > > > electronic chirping sound.
                          > > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is
                          > generally
                          > > > > > a
                          > > > > > > > > > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my
                          > soldering
                          > > > > > > > iron to
                          > > > > > > > > > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you
                          > guys to
                          > > > > > see if
                          > > > > > > > you
                          > > > > > > > > > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an
                          > idea why
                          > > > > > > > putting
                          > > > > > > > > > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness,
                          > and what
                          > > > > > that
                          > > > > > > > > > chirping sound is.
                          > > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > > I should mention that the test drive with the printed
                          > pattern
                          > > > > > ended up
                          > > > > > > > > > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting
                          > bunched up
                          > > > > > on the
                          > > > > > > > > > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires
                          > (temp
                          > > > > > > > sensor?)
                          > > > > > > > > > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I
                          > mentioned
                          > > > > > the A
                          > > > > > > > and
                          > > > > > > > > > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
                          > > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > > Any thoughts?
                          > > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          > > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > >
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          > > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > >
                          > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          > > > >
                          > > >
                          > >
                          >
                          >
                          >


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Sean K
                          Looks like that is probably the next step I need to take, have just been resisting opening up the controller... For my clarification if I open up the
                          Message 12 of 13 , Dec 3, 2012
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Looks like that is probably the next step I need to take, have just been resisting opening up the controller... For my clarification if I open up the controller there should be a 15 pin connector, correct?

                            If I'm reading the docs I've found I would need to tie pin 1 to Rx+, 2 to Tx-, 9 to Rx- and 10 to Tx+ of a rs232-422 converter, or do I have my Tx and Rx flipped? will any commercial (full duplex) converter work?

                            --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > You could also try and hook up to the monitor port on the controller and
                            > see if the controller thinks it its over temp.
                            > On Dec 3, 2012 11:26 AM, "Sean K" <seankmc@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > > **
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > Re-soldered the temp sensor connection first thing this morning, still
                            > > have the creep.
                            > >
                            > > If I have the fan plugged in it still kicks on full the moment I turn on
                            > > the car, I thought it was only supposed to run while the motor is hot.
                            > >
                            > > As the temp sensor warms up does the resistance increase or decrease?
                            > >
                            > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, "Sean K" <seankmc@> wrote:
                            > > >
                            > > > New information, attempting to take a reading between pins 2 and 9
                            > > tonight my meter was jumping all over the place from about 30 to 190 ohms.
                            > > Also if I plug the fan back in it constantly runs full speed even though
                            > > the motor has been sitting off since yesterday.
                            > > >
                            > > > Looking closer I did notice that the black wire closest to the edge of
                            > > the encoder board was barely connected, in fact in wiggling the wire it
                            > > completely broke away from the solder.
                            > > >
                            > > > I'm off to bed and probably wont have a chance to dig out my soldering
                            > > iron until after work tomorrow. Do you think this could be the issue? I
                            > > know that without the temp sensor connected at all the car wont run, and
                            > > this wire is right on the corner where my makeshift paper encoder came off
                            > > the disc and bunched up around the board.
                            > > >
                            > > > I guess the only way to know for sure is to solder it back on.
                            > > >
                            > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, "Sean K" <seankmc@> wrote:
                            > > > >
                            > > > > Oh then probably not, I haven't opened up the controller at all yet,
                            > > the only cover I've taken off is the one on the back of the motor to get to
                            > > the sensor.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > It still weirds me out that when I have the breakout box in place that
                            > > the jerkiness goes away.
                            > > > >
                            > > > > If the temp sensor is damaged or has a bad connection to the encoder
                            > > board would that cause anything like this or would the controller just not
                            > > turn on?
                            > > > >
                            > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > It is on the back of the controller, not the motor.
                            > > > > > On Dec 2, 2012 9:25 PM, "Sean K" <seankmc@> wrote:
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > > **
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > I haven't messed with the phases at all, the switch sounds like a
                            > > maybe,
                            > > > > > > is it under the back cover of the motor? like on the sensor board
                            > > itself?
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Nope, that sounds good.
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > There is an encoder A/B switch under under the back cover... is
                            > > it
                            > > > > > > possible
                            > > > > > > > that got flipped by accident?
                            > > > > > > > Or is it possible that one of the phases to the motor got swapped
                            > > > > > > > accidently?
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > Both of those could cause the conditions you are seeing.
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 4:40 PM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > **
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or
                            > > the 25 pin
                            > > > > > > > > connectors there's less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that
                            > > enough to
                            > > > > > > > > cause a problem?
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > I've also borrowed an o-scope and the A and B channels each
                            > > seem to be
                            > > > > > > > > outputting basically the same thing, nice square pulses,
                            > > unfortunately
                            > > > > > > it's
                            > > > > > > > > only a single channel so I can't watch them in relation to
                            > > eachother.
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > Sounds like a grounding issue to me...
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the
                            > > motor, to
                            > > > > > > the
                            > > > > > > > > > metal connector end, it should be a short.
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > > **
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and
                            > > I think
                            > > > > > > that
                            > > > > > > > > > > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right,
                            > > trying to get
                            > > > > > > my
                            > > > > > > > > hands
                            > > > > > > > > > > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout
                            > > box I
                            > > > > > > can get
                            > > > > > > > > > > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them
                            > > to flash
                            > > > > > > at
                            > > > > > > > > about
                            > > > > > > > > > > the same rate.
                            > > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good
                            > > because
                            > > > > > > prior
                            > > > > > > > > to
                            > > > > > > > > > > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to
                            > > drive around
                            > > > > > > the
                            > > > > > > > > > > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
                            > > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up
                            > > how it was
                            > > > > > > > > > > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks,
                            > > about the
                            > > > > > > same
                            > > > > > > > > in
                            > > > > > > > > > > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line
                            > > it still
                            > > > > > > > > moves
                            > > > > > > > > > > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear
                            > > like an
                            > > > > > > > > > > electronic chirping sound.
                            > > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is
                            > > generally
                            > > > > > > a
                            > > > > > > > > > > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my
                            > > soldering
                            > > > > > > > > iron to
                            > > > > > > > > > > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you
                            > > guys to
                            > > > > > > see if
                            > > > > > > > > you
                            > > > > > > > > > > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an
                            > > idea why
                            > > > > > > > > putting
                            > > > > > > > > > > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness,
                            > > and what
                            > > > > > > that
                            > > > > > > > > > > chirping sound is.
                            > > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > > I should mention that the test drive with the printed
                            > > pattern
                            > > > > > > ended up
                            > > > > > > > > > > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting
                            > > bunched up
                            > > > > > > on the
                            > > > > > > > > > > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires
                            > > (temp
                            > > > > > > > > sensor?)
                            > > > > > > > > > > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I
                            > > mentioned
                            > > > > > > the A
                            > > > > > > > > and
                            > > > > > > > > > > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
                            > > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > > Any thoughts?
                            > > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            > > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            > > > > > > >
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > > >
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > >
                            > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            > > > > >
                            > > > >
                            > > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            > >
                            >
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >
                          • Sean K
                            Ambient temp here is in the 50s and I m seeing 170 ohms after re-soldering the connection between the temp sensor and the sensor board, is this in the
                            Message 13 of 13 , Dec 4, 2012
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Ambient temp here is in the 50s and I'm seeing 170 ohms after re-soldering the connection between the temp sensor and the sensor board, is this in the ballpark?

                              --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Reed Bement <reedb@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > "If the temp sensor is damaged or has a bad connection to the encoder board would that cause anything like this or would the controller just not turn on?"
                              >
                              > Yes. The controller won't start with an open motor sensor. You need to be able to measure ~240 ohms between pins 9 and 5 on the encoder DB9 connector.
                              >
                              > Header DBM-9 Description
                              > 1 - Shield
                              > 2 1 Test Point
                              > 3 6 +6VDC
                              > 4 2 Gnd
                              > 5 7 B- Lo
                              > 6 3 A- Lo
                              > 7 8 B+ Hi
                              > 8 4 A+ Hi
                              > 9 9 Motor Temp (240 ohm to Gnd @ 70 degree F)
                              > 10 5 Gnd
                              >
                              > IIRC the "Malfunction LED", pin 25 on the controller DB25 connector will also be in an active (low) state when this error occurs, with the "Power" selector in "Neutral". Easy to check with a breakout box.
                              >
                              > -Reed
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > On 2012-12-02, at 10:37 PM, Sean K wrote:
                              >
                              > > New information, attempting to take a reading between pins 2 and 9 tonight my meter was jumping all over the place from about 30 to 190 ohms. Also if I plug the fan back in it constantly runs full speed even though the motor has been sitting off since yesterday.
                              > >
                              > > Looking closer I did notice that the black wire closest to the edge of the encoder board was barely connected, in fact in wiggling the wire it completely broke away from the solder.
                              > >
                              > > I'm off to bed and probably wont have a chance to dig out my soldering iron until after work tomorrow. Do you think this could be the issue? I know that without the temp sensor connected at all the car wont run, and this wire is right on the corner where my makeshift paper encoder came off the disc and bunched up around the board.
                              > >
                              > > I guess the only way to know for sure is to solder it back on.
                              > >
                              > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, "Sean K" <seankmc@> wrote:
                              > > >
                              > > > Oh then probably not, I haven't opened up the controller at all yet, the only cover I've taken off is the one on the back of the motor to get to the sensor.
                              > > >
                              > > > It still weirds me out that when I have the breakout box in place that the jerkiness goes away.
                              > > >
                              > > > If the temp sensor is damaged or has a bad connection to the encoder board would that cause anything like this or would the controller just not turn on?
                              > > >
                              > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                              > > > >
                              > > > > It is on the back of the controller, not the motor.
                              > > > > On Dec 2, 2012 9:25 PM, "Sean K" <seankmc@> wrote:
                              > > > >
                              > > > > > **
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > I haven't messed with the phases at all, the switch sounds like a maybe,
                              > > > > > is it under the back cover of the motor? like on the sensor board itself?
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > Nope, that sounds good.
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > There is an encoder A/B switch under under the back cover... is it
                              > > > > > possible
                              > > > > > > that got flipped by accident?
                              > > > > > > Or is it possible that one of the phases to the motor got swapped
                              > > > > > > accidently?
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > Both of those could cause the conditions you are seeing.
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 4:40 PM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > **
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > Between the motor and the metal shell of either the 9 pin or the 25 pin
                              > > > > > > > connectors there's less than one ohm, around 0.1-0.2, is that enough to
                              > > > > > > > cause a problem?
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > I've also borrowed an o-scope and the A and B channels each seem to be
                              > > > > > > > outputting basically the same thing, nice square pulses, unfortunately
                              > > > > > it's
                              > > > > > > > only a single channel so I can't watch them in relation to eachother.
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Wolf <wolf@> wrote:
                              > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > Sounds like a grounding issue to me...
                              > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > Double check the continuity from the frame ground of the motor, to
                              > > > > > the
                              > > > > > > > > metal connector end, it should be a short.
                              > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 11:14 AM, Sean K <seankmc@> wrote:
                              > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > > **
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > > So I've gotten my hands on a replacement encoder disc and I think
                              > > > > > that
                              > > > > > > > > > I've got the sensor gap tweaked in just about right, trying to get
                              > > > > > my
                              > > > > > > > hands
                              > > > > > > > > > on an actual O-Scope to verify but with my rs232 breakout box I
                              > > > > > can get
                              > > > > > > > > > LEDs connected to the A and B output pins I can get them to flash
                              > > > > > at
                              > > > > > > > about
                              > > > > > > > > > the same rate.
                              > > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > > I'm confident that the controller and the motor are good because
                              > > > > > prior
                              > > > > > > > to
                              > > > > > > > > > getting this replacement disc I was able to manage to drive around
                              > > > > > the
                              > > > > > > > > > block with a laser printed pattern glued to my old disc.
                              > > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > > If I disconnect my breakout box and hook the db9 back up how it was
                              > > > > > > > > > originally the car now moves very slowly and it jerks, about the
                              > > > > > same
                              > > > > > > > in
                              > > > > > > > > > forward and reverse, if I put my breakout box back in line it still
                              > > > > > > > moves
                              > > > > > > > > > very slowly, but it doesn't jerk at all, I do however hear like an
                              > > > > > > > > > electronic chirping sound.
                              > > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > > I know the symptom of barely moving along and jerking is generally
                              > > > > > a
                              > > > > > > > > > connectivity issue, however before I start heating up my soldering
                              > > > > > > > iron to
                              > > > > > > > > > replace connectors I figured I should check in with you guys to
                              > > > > > see if
                              > > > > > > > you
                              > > > > > > > > > have any input, I'm especially curious if anyone has an idea why
                              > > > > > > > putting
                              > > > > > > > > > the 232 breakout in line could smooth out the jerkyness, and what
                              > > > > > that
                              > > > > > > > > > chirping sound is.
                              > > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > > I should mention that the test drive with the printed pattern
                              > > > > > ended up
                              > > > > > > > > > with the paper encoder pattern coming off and getting bunched up
                              > > > > > on the
                              > > > > > > > > > edge of the sensor board next to where the two black wires (temp
                              > > > > > > > sensor?)
                              > > > > > > > > > are soldered on, nothing is obviously damaged and as I mentioned
                              > > > > > the A
                              > > > > > > > and
                              > > > > > > > > > B channels of the sensor both appear to be working.
                              > > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > > Any thoughts?
                              > > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              > > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > >
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              > > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > >
                              > > > >
                              > > > >
                              > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              > > > >
                              > > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
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