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Solectria E10 - The Lazarus Project

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  • dwitte82
    Hello Solectria Group! My school has a Solectria E10 that is a 1995 model. It has not run for about 10 years. We are going to get this baby up and running
    Message 1 of 43 , Sep 5, 2012
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      Hello Solectria Group!

      My school has a Solectria E10 that is a 1995 model. It has not run for about 10 years. We are going to get this baby up and running with lithium batteries.

      I'm trying to figure out what voltage it is running at in order to buy new batteries. We are planning on keeping everyone posted on the Li upgrade. It should be B.A.

      Here is the issue: There are 22 white batteries (15" x 4.5" x 7") in the vehicle. They don't hold a charge worth a darn. There are 6 in series under the hood, and 13 hooked in series under the bed. Three of the batteries under the bed are not hooked to anything. Nineteen (19) 12v batteries would be 228 volts, Right?

      BUT... There are two AMC325 controllers. The manual for the AMC325 says that the max voltage is 119-225 volts. The two (2) ACgtx20 motors have nameplate voltage of 150V. Finally the two (2) onboard BC1000u chargers say there is an output of 194VDC.

      Does anyone know if this AMC325 controller, motor, and charger set-up would run at 228 volts?

      Any suggestions on how we should check if the controllers work with out buying 12 lead acid batts?

      Any help will be much appreciated.

      Thanks!
      Drew

      P.S. Anyone know of any solectria cruise nights anywhere?
    • Ray Darby
      There are companies on the internet that make voltage converters.....got a special one a while back so I m not sure but it may have been voltageconverters.com
      Message 43 of 43 , Sep 19, 2012
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        There are companies on the internet that make voltage converters.....got a
        special one a while back so I'm not sure but it may have been
        voltageconverters.com - if not, try a google search as I know they're out
        there and can be special-made for almost any voltage......

        -----Original Message-----
        From: William Swann
        Sent: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 12:41 PM
        To: solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [solectria_ev] Re: Solectria E10 - The Lazarus Project

        I wish I could find a MPPT that boosts the voltage to 170. Most of the
        solar stuff is not that high of a voltage. Is this on a Force?

        On Wed, Sep 19, 2012 at 2:34 PM, d. Bouton Baldridge
        <cfrkeepr@...>wrote:

        > **
        >
        >
        > The panel is only 30v, that is what the MPPT does. Metric Mind used to
        > sell them, but my Force was already equiped with the arrangement, I only
        > upgraded it so that is was more than just show, now I just drive it and
        > carefully monitor the amphour meter to determine how long I must park it
        > in
        > the sun.
        > Bouty
        >
        > ________________________________
        > From: William Swann <william.swann2@...>
        > To: solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com
        > Sent: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 3:06 PM
        > Subject: Re: [solectria_ev] Re: Solectria E10 - The Lazarus Project
        >
        > It is unusual to find PV with that output voltage. Who sells that? Also,
        > the MPPT operating at that voltage - who sells that? Did you make it?
        >
        > On Wed, Sep 19, 2012 at 1:57 PM, d. Bouton Baldridge <cfrkeepr@...
        > >wrote:
        >
        > > **
        > >
        > >
        > > yes I have a 223 watt panel on the top. I didn't call it the MPPT
        > > because
        > > nobody knows what that is, it is a device that matches the pack voltage
        > up
        > > to 170v. Solectria actually offered the option in '92".
        > > Bouty
        > >
        > > ________________________________
        > > From: William Swann <william.swann2@...>
        > > To: "solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com" <solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com>
        > > Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 9:51 PM
        > > Subject: Re: [solectria_ev] Re: Solectria E10 - The Lazarus Project
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Could you expand on the purpose of the solar controller. Are you using a
        > > couple of PV panels to make the voltage, with a charge controller to
        > limit
        > > it?
        > >
        > > Thanks, Bill Swann
        > > http://www.watt-tracker.com/
        > > http://www.promotingevs.com/
        > >
        > >
        > > On Sep 18, 2012, at 8:36 PM, "d. Bouton Baldridge" <mailto:
        > > cfrkeepr%40yahoo.com> wrote:
        > >
        > > > My '92' is a 144v system, but I have 48 lithium cells which will
        > > > charge
        > > to about 180v at that voltage the controller balks, but if the cells
        > settle
        > > a little just below 180v the system works fine. I have been running this
        > > way for going on 4 years. the normal voltage is 160 and for the last 2
        > > years using a solar controller which only goes to 170v there are no
        > issues
        > > at all, I have not plugged into the grid in 30 months this way. there
        > > really is no need to over charge beyond 3.5v per cell because it will
        > > settle back very shortly and that anything higher is kind of wasted and
        > > a
        > > plus, because starting at the settle voltage allows regen without the
        > > squeel.
        > > > FWIW
        > > > Bouty
        > > >
        > > > ________________________________
        > > > From: jacambri <mailto:jacambri%40iupui.edu>
        > > > To: mailto:solectria_ev%40yahoogroups.com
        > > > Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2012 2:07 PM
        > > > Subject: [solectria_ev] Re: Solectria E10 - The Lazarus Project
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > All,
        > > >
        > > > So I have a urgent question because I am trying to pick out batteries
        > > today. On the controller nameplate the nominal voltage is 144, but on
        > > the
        > > Solectria spec sheet it says nominal for a AMC 325 is 156-180V. The max
        > > current on the nameplate is 280 for the motor and 287 for the batteries.
        > On
        > > the spec sheet the max current for both motor and batteries is 240. So
        > > which one do I go off of? Also what is the max regen current the
        > controller
        > > can handle?
        > > >
        > > > Thanks for the help,
        > > >
        > > > Jason
        > > >
        > > > --- In mailto:solectria_ev%40yahoogroups.com, theoldcars@... wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > Hello Drew
        > > > >
        > > > > You could try what Wolf outlined as it is the first and easiest path
        > > to
        > > > > take.
        > > > >
        > > > > I have found if they have been a zero volts for an extended amount
        > > > > of
        > > time
        > > > > they will not accept any current at normal charging voltages.
        > > Regardless
        > > > > of how long you try to charge them.
        > > > >
        > > > > It takes a more radical approach and if your not having any luck it
        > > > > leaves no other options. Also forget about the battery savers that
        > > claim to
        > > > > remove sulfate and recover lead batteries. At least for AGMs after
        > all
        > > kinds of
        > > > > testing with 5 different ones I found they do nothing. One of them
        > > cost 300
        > > > > dollars and has quite a few followers. Maybe they work for flooded
        > > > > batteries but without going into great detail as Wolf points out
        > > batteries will
        > > > > gain capacity from just cycling. One has to make certain what your
        > > seeing is
        > > > > actually an improvement repeatable with the same conditions. I took
        > 26
        > > > > modules out of an 1998 S-10 EV that had been at zero volts for years
        > > and used
        > > > > them as a test. I repeated this with two additional trucks. I found
        > no
        > > > > gains that could not be matched with just charging and cycling. That
        > > is once
        > > > > they would accept any voltage.
        > > > >
        > > > > If not accepting voltage.
        > > > >
        > > > > I used a DC regulated power supply set at 20 volts with 1/2 amp of
        > > current.
        > > > > It took about a day but modules that would not accept any current
        > > started
        > > > > to accept a charge. Sometimes they would start accepting current as
        > > soon as
        > > > > you hit 18 volts but back down to 14 volts and current went to zero.
        > > > >
        > > > > Good luck and don't get your hopes up too high. They might do fairly
        > > well
        > > > > if used in other applications but EVs are a heavy load for even
        > > > > brand
        > > new
        > > > > batteries of any chemistry.
        > > > >
        > > > > Don Blazer
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > In a message dated 9/7/2012 8:52:50 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
        > > > > wolf@... writes:
        > > > >
        > > > > 1. Recover each individual battery with a 13.8V @ 2 Amp charge for
        > > > > 24
        > > > > hours.
        > > > >
        > > > > Let the battery sit for an hour, then measure the open circuit
        > > voltage, it
        > > > > should be around 13 volts. Place a 1 ohm 500 Watt load on the
        > > > > battery
        > > for
        > > > > 30 seconds, if the battery voltage stays above 12 volts, it is ready
        > > to
        > > > > use.
        > > > >
        > > > > For the batteries that did not pass place back on the 13.8V @ 2 Amp
        > > charge
        > > > > for another 24 hours. Then try again.
        > > > >
        > > > > For the batteries that passed the first test, you need to cycle them
        > a
        > > few
        > > > > times to rebuild and desulfate the plates, they will only have about
        > a
        > > 10
        > > > > amp-hour capacity at first, each cycle will recover more capacity,
        > > until
        > > > > they plateau around 50-60 amp-hours.
        > > > >
        > > > > Around 12 years ago (can't believe it has been that long), there was
        > a
        > > > > computer controlled battery tester in the EV lab, (it was in the
        > > > > cage
        > > with
        > > > > all the batteries) where you could write a script and have it charge
        > > and
        > > > > discharge the battery. It would give you a printout of the capacity,
        > > > > internal resistance, and the such.
        > > > >
        > > > > It it is still around use it, and write a script (there should be
        > many
        > > > > scripts on it all ready that you can modify) that will discharge at
        > 20
        > > amps
        > > > > to 10 volts, charge at 10 amps to 15 volts. Record last amp-hour
        > > capacity,
        > > > > and keep cycling till there is only about a 1 amp-hour difference
        > > between
        > > > > cycles. Then label that battery with its capacity.
        > > > >
        > > > > 2. I doubt it the bulk caps are only rated to 250 Volts, it would
        > have
        > > an
        > > > > AMC 230 controller rated to 300 Volts.
        > > > >
        > > > > 3. 130 is the min voltage cut out, so your supply should be able to
        > > power
        > > > > it on.
        > > > >
        > > > > I would recommend that you unplug the power steering and vacuum
        > pumps,
        > > and
        > > > > turn off the radio and all lights.
        > > > >
        > > > > You will need an RS485 to RS232 adapter to hook a laptop up to the
        > > > > controller and the AMC program to read/write settings.
        > > > >
        > > > > Then hook up your supply and turn the key and see what happens.
        > > > > On Fri, Sep 7, 2012 at 9:22 AM, Drew Witte <dwitte82@...> wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > > **
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > This is sweet that we found someone who has actually driven our
        > E10.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > A few questions:
        > > > > >
        > > > > > 1) Don and Wolf, How did you recharge the Panasonic OEM batteries
        > > that
        > > > > had
        > > > > > been sitting around for years with no voltage on them? 12 Volt
        > > trickle
        > > > > > charge? What Amperage? We are going to try to revive the batteries
        > to
        > > > > > have something to test with until we get our Li Batteries.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > 2) Wolf, do you know if our AMC325 was ever hooked up to the 228
        > > > > > Volt battery pack?
        > > > > > The User's Manual I have to the AMC325 says the Max Voltage Range
        > is
        > > > > > 119-225 V.
        > > > > > Absolute Maximal Battery Voltage (cut off) is 230-242 V
        > > > > > The 228 Volts seem like its very close to the high voltage
        > > recommended
        > > > > for
        > > > > > the AMC325. When the batteries are charged, the voltage would be
        > over
        > > > > > these values.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > 3) If we hooked up a 130VDC 5 Amp power supply to the battery
        > > terminals
        > > > > on
        > > > > > the AMC325, would we be able to hook up a computer and look at the
        > > > > current
        > > > > > parameters loaded onto the controller? What is the lowest battery
        > > > > voltage
        > > > > > that we need to look at the programming parameters?
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Thanks,
        > > > > > Drew
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > > >
        > > >
        > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > > >
        > > >
        > >
        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >
        > --
        > Thanks, Bill S
        > Ph 832-338-3080
        > www.watt-tracker.com
        > www.promotingevs.com
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        > ------------------------------------
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >



        --
        Thanks, Bill S
        Ph 832-338-3080
        www.watt-tracker.com
        www.promotingevs.com


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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