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Re: a/c unit

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  • nick@npcimaging.com
    Our NiCd Force died today at an intersection... put my foot down when the light turned green and everything shut off. No power, no display on the Ah meter
    Message 1 of 7 , Jan 5, 2011
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      Our NiCd Force died today at an intersection... put my foot down
      when the light turned green and everything shut off.
      No power, no display on the Ah meter even, no 12V, zippo.
      So, starting the troubleshooting process...
      I've checked the back battery box and it's at ~100V, so that appears good.
      Now I'm trying to get into the front battery box and I can't remove the a/c unit.
      There are two obvious nuts that I've removed but there seems to be a 3rd
      mounting point underneath towards the back that I can't even see let alone
      get at. Anyone know if I have to dismount the DC motor and compressor
      in order to remove their mounting plate?! Seems crazy and so frustrating...
      Any help very much appreciated!
      Nick

      Nick Carter, PhD
      Owner, npc Imaging
      www.npcimaging.com
      Tel: (707) 573 9361
    • Nick Austin
      ... Humm, why are you trying to get into the front box? Seems like you should be looking at the 12v system. The DC- DC converter is likely dead, check the
      Message 2 of 7 , Jan 5, 2011
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        On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 9:41 PM, <nick@...> wrote:

        > Our NiCd Force died today at an intersection... put my foot down
        > when the light turned green and everything shut off.
        > No power, no display on the Ah meter even, no 12V, zippo.
        > So, starting the troubleshooting process...
        > I've checked the back battery box and it's at ~100V, so that appears good.
        > Now I'm trying to get into the front battery box and I can't remove the a/c
        > unit.
        > There are two obvious nuts that I've removed but there seems to be a 3rd
        > mounting point underneath towards the back that I can't even see let alone
        > get at. Anyone know if I have to dismount the DC motor and compressor
        > in order to remove their mounting plate?! Seems crazy and so frustrating...
        > Any help very much appreciated!
        >

        Humm, why are you trying to get into the front box?
        Seems like you should be looking at the 12v system.

        The DC->DC converter is likely dead, check the input and output fuses.
        Look for HV on the input line to the DC->DC, disconnect the 12v Anderson
        connectors and check
        for 12v under no load.

        If you have a current limited 12v power supply, you could apply voltage to
        the car side of the Anderson connector
        and see if everything else still works.

        Thanks!


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • jim donovan
        Nick: You don t dismount (and remove from the car).  I ve replaced quite a few battery packs in Forces and learned that you disconnect the three nuts/bolts,
        Message 3 of 7 , Jan 6, 2011
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          Nick:

          You don't dismount (and remove from the car).  I've replaced quite a few battery
          packs in Forces and learned that you disconnect the three nuts/bolts, rotate the
          ac unit about 180 degrees and either suspend it from the hood or (my preferred)
          set it on some scrap lumber sitting on anything that will hold it up (front
          grill to the drive motor).  Yes, you have to work around it, but the rest of the
          battery box is exposed and there is plenty of access space.

          Jim




          ________________________________
          From: Nick Austin <yahoo@...>
          To: solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Wed, January 5, 2011 11:48:26 PM
          Subject: Re: [solectria_ev] Re: a/c unit

           
          On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 9:41 PM, <nick@...> wrote:

          > Our NiCd Force died today at an intersection... put my foot down
          > when the light turned green and everything shut off.
          > No power, no display on the Ah meter even, no 12V, zippo.
          > So, starting the troubleshooting process...
          > I've checked the back battery box and it's at ~100V, so that appears good.
          > Now I'm trying to get into the front battery box and I can't remove the a/c
          > unit.
          > There are two obvious nuts that I've removed but there seems to be a 3rd
          > mounting point underneath towards the back that I can't even see let alone
          > get at. Anyone know if I have to dismount the DC motor and compressor
          > in order to remove their mounting plate?! Seems crazy and so frustrating...
          > Any help very much appreciated!
          >

          Humm, why are you trying to get into the front box?
          Seems like you should be looking at the 12v system.

          The DC->DC converter is likely dead, check the input and output fuses.
          Look for HV on the input line to the DC->DC, disconnect the 12v Anderson
          connectors and check
          for 12v under no load.

          If you have a current limited 12v power supply, you could apply voltage to
          the car side of the Anderson connector
          and see if everything else still works.

          Thanks!

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Stephen Taylor
          I think I d follow the advice here and check for full pack voltage in other places before opening the front right away.  It has been a number of years since I
          Message 4 of 7 , Jan 6, 2011
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            I think I'd follow the advice here and check for full pack voltage in other
            places before opening the front right away. 


            It has been a number of years since I opened the front box on a NiCD Force, but
            if I remember correctly the AC unit has to come out in 2 pieces on the NiCD car
            rather than the one for the lead acid car.  You have to seperate the motor from
            the compressor to get to the proper bolts.  Makes it much harder to put back
            together when you close it up again.

            Stephen Taylor




            ________________________________
            From: "nick@..." <nick@...>
            To: solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Thu, January 6, 2011 12:41:29 AM
            Subject: [solectria_ev] Re: a/c unit

             
            Our NiCd Force died today at an intersection... put my foot down
            when the light turned green and everything shut off.
            No power, no display on the Ah meter even, no 12V, zippo.
            So, starting the troubleshooting process...
            I've checked the back battery box and it's at ~100V, so that appears good.
            Now I'm trying to get into the front battery box and I can't remove the a/c
            unit.

            There are two obvious nuts that I've removed but there seems to be a 3rd
            mounting point underneath towards the back that I can't even see let alone
            get at. Anyone know if I have to dismount the DC motor and compressor
            in order to remove their mounting plate?! Seems crazy and so frustrating...
            Any help very much appreciated!
            Nick

            Nick Carter, PhD
            Owner, npc Imaging
            www.npcimaging.com
            Tel: (707) 573 9361






            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • electric vehicle
            i would first make sure you have @156vdc on the motor controller dc ( grey andersen) connector if not and based on your post of the back box at 100v . i would
            Message 5 of 7 , Jan 6, 2011
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              i would first make sure you have @156vdc on the motor controller dc ( grey andersen) connector if not and based on your post of the back box at 100v . i would guess that the front box fuse is gone .. if you have @156vdc on the motoe controller check for 156vdc on the dc/dc converter input car side ..if 156vdc is present there then check the dc12vdc side of the dc/dc converter. . an go from there you more then likel;y have blown fuses either pack fuse or a feed to or from the sc/sc converter

              ----- Original Message -----
              From: jim donovan
              To: solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 7:57 AM
              Subject: Re: [solectria_ev] Re: a/c unit



              Nick:

              You don't dismount (and remove from the car). I've replaced quite a few battery
              packs in Forces and learned that you disconnect the three nuts/bolts, rotate the
              ac unit about 180 degrees and either suspend it from the hood or (my preferred)
              set it on some scrap lumber sitting on anything that will hold it up (front
              grill to the drive motor). Yes, you have to work around it, but the rest of the
              battery box is exposed and there is plenty of access space.

              Jim

              ________________________________
              From: Nick Austin <yahoo@...>
              To: solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Wed, January 5, 2011 11:48:26 PM
              Subject: Re: [solectria_ev] Re: a/c unit


              On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 9:41 PM, <nick@...> wrote:

              > Our NiCd Force died today at an intersection... put my foot down
              > when the light turned green and everything shut off.
              > No power, no display on the Ah meter even, no 12V, zippo.
              > So, starting the troubleshooting process...
              > I've checked the back battery box and it's at ~100V, so that appears good.
              > Now I'm trying to get into the front battery box and I can't remove the a/c
              > unit.
              > There are two obvious nuts that I've removed but there seems to be a 3rd
              > mounting point underneath towards the back that I can't even see let alone
              > get at. Anyone know if I have to dismount the DC motor and compressor
              > in order to remove their mounting plate?! Seems crazy and so frustrating...
              > Any help very much appreciated!
              >

              Humm, why are you trying to get into the front box?
              Seems like you should be looking at the 12v system.

              The DC->DC converter is likely dead, check the input and output fuses.
              Look for HV on the input line to the DC->DC, disconnect the 12v Anderson
              connectors and check
              for 12v under no load.

              If you have a current limited 12v power supply, you could apply voltage to
              the car side of the Anderson connector
              and see if everything else still works.

              Thanks!

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • ldr214
              I agree strongly in regards to checking the dc/dc and high voltage line from pack if you haven t done that yet. The car is dead without the 12V circuit. If
              Message 6 of 7 , Jan 6, 2011
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                I agree strongly in regards to checking the dc/dc and high voltage line from pack if you haven't done that yet. The car is "dead" without the 12V circuit. If it is the dc/dc it might even recover by simply unplugging it and plugging it back in.

                But I'll assume you have found a problem that has dircected you to the batteries. Stephen probably has the most experience with the Nicad setup. The regular Pba powered a/c unit is pretty easy as previously answered. A NBEAA "shout out" could get you some extra hands/eyes this weekend if you need it.

                Mike R

                --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Nick Austin <yahoo@...> wrote:
                >
                > On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 9:41 PM, <nick@...> wrote:
                >
                > > Our NiCd Force died today at an intersection... put my foot down
                > > when the light turned green and everything shut off.
                > > No power, no display on the Ah meter even, no 12V, zippo.
                > > So, starting the troubleshooting process...
                > > I've checked the back battery box and it's at ~100V, so that appears good.
                > > Now I'm trying to get into the front battery box and I can't remove the a/c
                > > unit.
                > > There are two obvious nuts that I've removed but there seems to be a 3rd
                > > mounting point underneath towards the back that I can't even see let alone
                > > get at. Anyone know if I have to dismount the DC motor and compressor
                > > in order to remove their mounting plate?! Seems crazy and so frustrating...
                > > Any help very much appreciated!
                > >
                >
                > Humm, why are you trying to get into the front box?
                > Seems like you should be looking at the 12v system.
                >
                > The DC->DC converter is likely dead, check the input and output fuses.
                > Look for HV on the input line to the DC->DC, disconnect the 12v Anderson
                > connectors and check
                > for 12v under no load.
                >
                > If you have a current limited 12v power supply, you could apply voltage to
                > the car side of the Anderson connector
                > and see if everything else still works.
                >
                > Thanks!
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
              • dexion111
                At this point knowing the rear box voltage and knowing what the front box should be, you could check at either the charger or the main anderson or the dc to dc
                Message 7 of 7 , Jan 6, 2011
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                  At this point knowing the rear box voltage and knowing what the front box should be, you could check at either the charger or the main anderson or the dc to dc anderson connection with a dvm. Subtract the rear packs voltage and what is left is the front battery box voltage. If they are in spec check the 12 volt output (and the input I suppose to make sure HV is getting to the input side of the dc to dc.) If the input is 156V all is good to that point. If the output is 12V (which would suprise me) then check at the fusebox and see if there is power there. On mine if I remember correctly it runs from the dc to dc directly to the fusebox. So if 12V exists on output check all fuses on the dc to dc and the fusebox and on the main box as well.

                  If theres no voltage at the main anderson or the charger anderson then its possible the front battery box fuse lit up and there is an issue up there. Then remove the cover.

                  If the dc to dc has stopped working it contains vicor bricks which azure is (or was a few weeks back) are selling as well as some complete dc to dc converters.

                  Never mind I just checked their online store they have 10 dc to dc converters for sale at $250 each free shipping.

                  http://cgi.ebay.com/DC-DC-converter-150-250V-input-12V-output-750W-/190486370069?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c59df5715

                  So thats a farely cheap fix if it turns out to be the unit and not just a fuse. But the way it failed it sounds like a fuse. When the vicors go they start putting out less and less voltage normally. its a slowish death. So perhaps something on the 12volt side shorted and took out a fuse.

                  EDIT- 9 left I just bought one. Couldnt pass up $250 to have one sit on a shelf.

                  Please keep us updated because once you have it fixed someone else may have the same problem.
                  dex
                  --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, "ldr214" <replytome@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > I agree strongly in regards to checking the dc/dc and high voltage line from pack if you haven't done that yet. The car is "dead" without the 12V circuit. If it is the dc/dc it might even recover by simply unplugging it and plugging it back in.
                  >
                  > But I'll assume you have found a problem that has dircected you to the batteries. Stephen probably has the most experience with the Nicad setup. The regular Pba powered a/c unit is pretty easy as previously answered. A NBEAA "shout out" could get you some extra hands/eyes this weekend if you need it.
                  >
                  > Mike R
                  >
                  > --- In solectria_ev@yahoogroups.com, Nick Austin <yahoo@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > On Wed, Jan 5, 2011 at 9:41 PM, <nick@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > > Our NiCd Force died today at an intersection... put my foot down
                  > > > when the light turned green and everything shut off.
                  > > > No power, no display on the Ah meter even, no 12V, zippo.
                  > > > So, starting the troubleshooting process...
                  > > > I've checked the back battery box and it's at ~100V, so that appears good.
                  > > > Now I'm trying to get into the front battery box and I can't remove the a/c
                  > > > unit.
                  > > > There are two obvious nuts that I've removed but there seems to be a 3rd
                  > > > mounting point underneath towards the back that I can't even see let alone
                  > > > get at. Anyone know if I have to dismount the DC motor and compressor
                  > > > in order to remove their mounting plate?! Seems crazy and so frustrating...
                  > > > Any help very much appreciated!
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > > Humm, why are you trying to get into the front box?
                  > > Seems like you should be looking at the 12v system.
                  > >
                  > > The DC->DC converter is likely dead, check the input and output fuses.
                  > > Look for HV on the input line to the DC->DC, disconnect the 12v Anderson
                  > > connectors and check
                  > > for 12v under no load.
                  > >
                  > > If you have a current limited 12v power supply, you could apply voltage to
                  > > the car side of the Anderson connector
                  > > and see if everything else still works.
                  > >
                  > > Thanks!
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  > >
                  >
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