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VUSDR ZAZ

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  • David Turnbull
    I was wondering if anyone here knows more about the VUSDR ZAZ. I made the Peaberry SDR source code available so others could design zero-IF radios that
    Message 1 of 21 , Aug 12, 2014
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      I was wondering if anyone here knows more about the VUSDR ZAZ. I made the Peaberry SDR source code available so others could design zero-IF radios that sidestep the never-ending "which sound card" discussion and this appears to be the first design which does so.

      http://www.siars.org.in/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2751


    • Mike
      Nope .. its a first to me .. but cool i guess ... On 08/12/2014 10:11 PM, David Turnbull dturnbull@gmail.com [softrock40] ... -- Mike KC7NOA
      Message 2 of 21 , Aug 12, 2014
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        Nope .. its a first to me .. but cool i guess ...


        On 08/12/2014 10:11 PM, David Turnbull dturnbull@... [softrock40] wrote:
         
        I was wondering if anyone here knows more about the VUSDR ZAZ. I made the Peaberry SDR source code available so others could design zero-IF radios that sidestep the never-ending "which sound card" discussion and this appears to be the first design which does so.

        http://www.siars.org.in/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2751



        -- 
        Mike KC7NOA
      • warrenallgyer
        Wow! Can you believe these guys? Ripping off someone else s design and putting it out there as your own work! Some people have no conscience. Warren Allgyer
        Message 3 of 21 , Aug 12, 2014
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          Wow!

          Can you believe these guys? Ripping off someone else's design and putting it out there as your own work!

          Some people have no conscience.

          Warren Allgyer
          9V1TD
        • Sid Boyce
          I thought these were open hardware designs and on the VUSDR ZAZ home page it explicitly states that it s based on Peaberry. It didn t say that it is based on
          Message 4 of 21 , Aug 13, 2014
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            I thought these were open hardware designs and on the VUSDR ZAZ home page it explicitly states that it's based on Peaberry. It didn't say that it is based on wonderful new and unique ideas they dreamt up.

            Peaberry was based on the Ensemble RXTX and this design is a derivative of Peaberry.

            If you go deeper you'll see many other people's ideas embedded in any SDR design including Softrock  - It's like saying Tony ripped off Tayloe mixers and Flex software which itself ripped off ideas from gnuradio or that David ripped off Ensemble RXTX and SDR2GO/SDR-Cube in designing Peaberry.

            I saw no objection to Peaberry voiced by Tony or by David regarding VUSDR ZAZ.
            73 ... Sid.

            On 13/08/14 07:16, allgyer@... [softrock40] wrote:
             

            Wow!

            Can you believe these guys? Ripping off someone else's design and putting it out there as your own work!

            Some people have no conscience.

            Warren Allgyer
            9V1TD



            -- 
            Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot
            Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support
            Senior Staff Specialist, Cricket Coach
            Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks
            
          • warrenallgyer
            Sid The Facebook page contains only this: This multiband SD radio named as VUSDR ZAZ is designed by by Dr B.N.A.M Naidu, VU2ZAZ, Hyderabad. You are correct.
            Message 5 of 21 , Aug 13, 2014
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              Sid

              The Facebook page contains only this: " This multiband SD radio named as VUSDR ZAZ is designed by by Dr B.N.A.M Naidu, VU2ZAZ, Hyderabad."

              You are correct. If you dig far enough into http://www.siars.org.in/ you will find attribution for David. I was not aware of these being open designs and I am not quite sure what that means if it is the case. The moral status is that no one should claim, directly or by omission, that the work of others is "their design".

              Tony has always and consistently refused credit for any part of the Softrocks design, saying that is is the work of a collective. His silence on this subject of attribution does not make it right to use his designs without acknowledgment.

              My tongue in cheek comment was directed at any of those in the design chain who have not bothered to do so.

              Warren Allgyer
              9V1TD
            • John Greusel
              Well there is certainly some creativity involved in what he s done but it is a derivative design. I wouldn t fault him for doing it but the attributions should
              Message 6 of 21 , Aug 13, 2014
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                Well there is certainly some creativity involved in what he's done but it is a derivative design.
                I wouldn't fault him for doing it but the attributions should be there (including Tony Parks)- there and plainly stated.

                John
                KC9OJV
                 



                From: "allgyer@... [softrock40]" <softrock40@yahoogroups.com>
                To: softrock40@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2014 8:13 AM
                Subject: Re: [softrock40] Re: VUSDR ZAZ

                 
                Sid

                The Facebook page contains only this: " This multiband SD radio named as VUSDR ZAZ is designed by by Dr B.N.A.M Naidu, VU2ZAZ, Hyderabad."

                You are correct. If you dig far enough into http://www.siars.org.in/ you will find attribution for David. I was not aware of these being open designs and I am not quite sure what that means if it is the case. The moral status is that no one should claim, directly or by omission, that the work of others is "their design".

                Tony has always and consistently refused credit for any part of the Softrocks design, saying that is is the work of a collective. His silence on this subject of attribution does not make it right to use his designs without acknowledgment.

                My tongue in cheek comment was directed at any of those in the design chain who have not bothered to do so.

                Warren Allgyer
                9V1TD


              • Brad Thompson
                ... Hello-- The version of Malware Bytes software running on my PC flags the web site as malicious and blocks access. Be careful. 73-- Brad AA1IP ... This
                Message 7 of 21 , Aug 13, 2014
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                  On 8/13/2014 1:11 AM, David Turnbull dturnbull@... [softrock40] wrote:
                  > I was wondering if anyone here knows more about the VUSDR ZAZ. I made
                  > the Peaberry SDR source code available so others could design zero-IF
                  > radios that sidestep the never-ending "which sound card" discussion
                  > and this appears to be the first design which does so.
                  >
                  Hello--

                  The version of "Malware Bytes" software running on my PC flags the web site
                  as "malicious" and blocks access. Be careful.

                  73--

                  Brad AA1IP

                  ---
                  This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
                  http://www.avast.com
                • Mike
                  My linux box running Ubuntu 14.04 with firefox didn t blink ... did i miss it? On 08/13/2014 10:42 AM, Brad Thompson brad.thompson@valley.net ... -- Mike
                  Message 8 of 21 , Aug 13, 2014
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                    My linux box running Ubuntu 14.04 with firefox didn't blink ... did i miss it?


                    On 08/13/2014 10:42 AM, Brad Thompson brad.thompson@... [softrock40] wrote:
                     


                    On 8/13/2014 1:11 AM, David Turnbull dturnbull@... [softrock40] wrote:
                    > I was wondering if anyone here knows more about the VUSDR ZAZ. I made
                    > the Peaberry SDR source code available so others could design zero-IF
                    > radios that sidestep the never-ending "which sound card" discussion
                    > and this appears to be the first design which does so.
                    >
                    Hello--

                    The version of "Malware Bytes" software running on my PC flags the web site
                    as "malicious" and blocks access. Be careful.

                    73--

                    Brad AA1IP

                    ---
                    This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
                    http://www.avast.com


                    -- 
                    Mike KC7NOA
                  • Brad Thompson
                    ... Hello, Mike-- I m running Windows 7 SP1, with anti-malware software, hardware and software firewalls, and a shrunken head affixed to the cable router (just
                    Message 9 of 21 , Aug 13, 2014
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                      On 8/13/2014 2:21 PM, Mike Patriot121@... [softrock40] wrote:
                      >
                      > My linux box running Ubuntu 14.04 with firefox didn't blink ... did i
                      > miss it?
                      >
                      Hello, Mike--

                      I'm running Windows 7 SP1, with anti-malware software, hardware and
                      software firewalls, and a shrunken head affixed to the cable router
                      (just kidding
                      about the latter).

                      Whatever is setting off Malware Bytes may not be interested in
                      afflicting Ubuntu.

                      73--

                      Brad AA1IP



                      ---
                      This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
                      http://www.avast.com
                    • Ravi Miranda
                      I think it is easy to copy works of another, but rightly said he should give credit, after all he is marketing it for £85 ish as shown on the site. Credit
                      Message 10 of 21 , Aug 13, 2014
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                        I think it is easy to copy works of another, but rightly said he should give credit, after all he is marketing it for £85 ish as shown on the site. Credit must be given where due.. A similar incident was also observed in BITx project.. Anyway, I'm writing to him directly :-) to point this out

                        Ravi/2E0RVI


                        On 13 August 2014 16:07, John Greusel greusel@... [softrock40] <softrock40@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
                         

                        Well there is certainly some creativity involved in what he's done but it is a derivative design.
                        I wouldn't fault him for doing it but the attributions should be there (including Tony Parks)- there and plainly stated.

                        John
                        KC9OJV
                         



                        From: "allgyer@... [softrock40]" <softrock40@yahoogroups.com>
                        To: softrock40@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2014 8:13 AM
                        Subject: Re: [softrock40] Re: VUSDR ZAZ

                         
                        Sid

                        The Facebook page contains only this: " This multiband SD radio named as VUSDR ZAZ is designed by by Dr B.N.A.M Naidu, VU2ZAZ, Hyderabad."

                        You are correct. If you dig far enough into http://www.siars.org.in/ you will find attribution for David. I was not aware of these being open designs and I am not quite sure what that means if it is the case. The moral status is that no one should claim, directly or by omission, that the work of others is "their design".

                        Tony has always and consistently refused credit for any part of the Softrocks design, saying that is is the work of a collective. His silence on this subject of attribution does not make it right to use his designs without acknowledgment.

                        My tongue in cheek comment was directed at any of those in the design chain who have not bothered to do so.

                        Warren Allgyer
                        9V1TD





                        --
                        I'm here to add more value to the world than I'm using up.
                      • Brad Thompson
                        ... Hello-- From Tom Lehrer s opus entitled, Lobachevsky http://graeme.50webs.com/lehrer/lobachev.htm ... Plagiarize, Let no one else s work evade your
                        Message 11 of 21 , Aug 13, 2014
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                          On 8/13/2014 3:47 PM, Ravi Miranda ravimiranda@... [softrock40] wrote:
                          > I think it is easy to copy works of another, but rightly said he
                          > should give credit, after all he is marketing it for £85 ish as shown
                          > on the site. Credit must be given where due.. A similar incident was
                          > also observed in BITx project.. Anyway, I'm writing to him directly
                          > :-) to point this out
                          >
                          Hello--

                          From Tom Lehrer's opus entitled, "Lobachevsky"

                          http://graeme.50webs.com/lehrer/lobachev.htm

                          "...

                          Plagiarize,
                          Let no one else's work evade your eyes,
                          Remember why the good Lord made your eyes,
                          So don't shade your eyes,
                          But plagiarize, plagiarize, plagiarize...
                          Only be sure always to call it please, "/research/"...."

                          73--

                          Brad AA1IP


                          ---
                          This email is free from viruses and malware because avast! Antivirus protection is active.
                          http://www.avast.com
                        • gtilford
                          I ve reached out to the SIARS website to get some additional information, including if the radio kit can be ordered. 73, Greg, KM5GT
                          Message 12 of 21 , Aug 14, 2014
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                            I've reached out to the SIARS website to get some additional information, including if the radio kit can be ordered.
                            73, Greg, KM5GT
                          • Sid Boyce
                            Hi Warren, I went to the URL given in the post and attribution to David was clearly visible. Facebook I don t do but it s obviously the right thing for the
                            Message 13 of 21 , Aug 14, 2014
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                              Hi Warren,
                              I went to the URL given in the post and attribution to David was clearly visible. Facebook I don't do but
                              it's obviously the right thing for the VUSDR ZAZ guys to do.

                              There was a fair bit of comment when David announced the Peaberry on this list. I don't know if Tony was consulted and I guess we'll never know as he has never enjoined such conversations.
                              However, Peaberry brought a worthwhile enhancement to the RXTX for portable use and consequently has been priced accordingly but has not damaged sales of Softrock kits as far as I can tell.
                              SDR-Cube still uses the "obsoleted" SR v6.3 to good effect.

                              Where credits should start and end begs the question -- Pre-Dan Tayloe or Dan Tayloe and every one else since? Don't forget the guys who developed the firmware and software - DG8SAQ and others.

                              Even before that there was similar series of comments that followed the announcement of the SR63ng though George followed up with a statement that he had consulted Tony who voiced no objection.

                              Tony has to be held in the highest regard for bringing the whole range of SDR within the range of practical skills, experience and affordability of most amateurs and SWL's by providing kits.

                              Nothing is ever set in stone and there are very many other exciting SDR developments to look forward to in the not too distant future.
                              73 ... Sid.


                              On 13/08/14 14:13, allgyer@... [softrock40] wrote:
                               

                              Sid

                              The Facebook page contains only this: " This multiband SD radio named as VUSDR ZAZ is designed by by Dr B.N.A.M Naidu, VU2ZAZ, Hyderabad."

                              You are correct. If you dig far enough into http://www.siars.org.in/ you will find attribution for David. I was not aware of these being open designs and I am not quite sure what that means if it is the case. The moral status is that no one should claim, directly or by omission, that the work of others is "their design".

                              Tony has always and consistently refused credit for any part of the Softrocks design, saying that is is the work of a collective. His silence on this subject of attribution does not make it right to use his designs without acknowledgment.

                              My tongue in cheek comment was directed at any of those in the design chain who have not bothered to do so.

                              Warren Allgyer
                              9V1TD



                              -- 
                              Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot
                              Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support
                              Senior Staff Specialist, Cricket Coach
                              Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks
                              
                            • warrenallgyer
                              Sid I agree it is a fine line. And that line may be in a different place for something that is built for personal use versus something that is presented as a
                              Message 14 of 21 , Aug 14, 2014
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                                Sid

                                I agree it is a fine line. And that line may be in a different place for something that is built for personal use versus something that is presented as a commercial product.

                                There is also a considerable difference between taking design concepts such as the Tayloe mixer and incorporating them into a new system design versus lifting a system or sub-system, component for component, or taking source code verbatim, and representing it as "my design".

                                Changing a component designation, laying it out differently on the board, or adding a few sub-routines to a code listing do indeed make a different product. But there is a huge difference between calling that "My design" and calling it "My design incorporating the Oscillation Overthruster from Peter Weller and the modified source code of John Big Bootee".

                                The second is certainly more accurate, much more polite, and would satisfy even grumpy old farts like me in most cases. I think it still begs a legal question when it is used for commercial purposes and certainly would not satisfy that requirement had the original designs been patented or copyrighted.

                                Warren Allgyer
                                9V1TD
                              • Ravi Miranda
                                SIARS has sent in the following clarification re my discussion with them. ZAZ already made it clear that all the designs were taken from various pioneer
                                Message 15 of 21 , Aug 15, 2014
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                                  SIARS has sent in the following clarification re my discussion with them.

                                  ZAZ already made it clear that all the designs were taken from various pioneer designs and developed a new circuit that fits to VU users. He never said that he personally designed the entire circuit.

                                  He always transferred the credits to all original authors and all his developments were being shared to all of them for possible suggestions.

                                  In fact if you analyze the circuit you may find bits and pieces taken from Peaberry, SDR1000, SoftRock, MOBO...etc


                                  Facts to know:

                                  Peaberry - AE9RB designed the circuit for dual band operation only . But ZAZ compiled a new firmware and made it multi-band operation with the same components used in Pea berry. No doubt soon .. Pea berry may use ZAZs code in next version.

                                  SDR1000 - The final output 1W amplifier is taken from SDR-1000 driving an external amplifier.

                                  Similarly you may find many changes/enhancements to original circuits


                                  The article will be published on the HFI-2014 Souvenir. And PCB's will be made available.

                                  73

                                  Ravi/2E0RVI


                                  On 15 August 2014 03:40, Sid Boyce sboyce@... [softrock40] <softrock40@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
                                   

                                  Hi Warren,
                                  I went to the URL given in the post and attribution to David was clearly visible. Facebook I don't do but
                                  it's obviously the right thing for the VUSDR ZAZ guys to do.

                                  There was a fair bit of comment when David announced the Peaberry on this list. I don't know if Tony was consulted and I guess we'll never know as he has never enjoined such conversations.
                                  However, Peaberry brought a worthwhile enhancement to the RXTX for portable use and consequently has been priced accordingly but has not damaged sales of Softrock kits as far as I can tell.
                                  SDR-Cube still uses the "obsoleted" SR v6.3 to good effect.

                                  Where credits should start and end begs the question -- Pre-Dan Tayloe or Dan Tayloe and every one else since? Don't forget the guys who developed the firmware and software - DG8SAQ and others.

                                  Even before that there was similar series of comments that followed the announcement of the SR63ng though George followed up with a statement that he had consulted Tony who voiced no objection.

                                  Tony has to be held in the highest regard for bringing the whole range of SDR within the range of practical skills, experience and affordability of most amateurs and SWL's by providing kits.

                                  Nothing is ever set in stone and there are very many other exciting SDR developments to look forward to in the not too distant future.
                                  73 ... Sid.



                                  On 13/08/14 14:13, allgyer@... [softrock40] wrote:
                                   

                                  Sid

                                  The Facebook page contains only this: " This multiband SD radio named as VUSDR ZAZ is designed by by Dr B.N.A.M Naidu, VU2ZAZ, Hyderabad."

                                  You are correct. If you dig far enough into http://www.siars.org.in/ you will find attribution for David. I was not aware of these being open designs and I am not quite sure what that means if it is the case. The moral status is that no one should claim, directly or by omission, that the work of others is "their design".

                                  Tony has always and consistently refused credit for any part of the Softrocks design, saying that is is the work of a collective. His silence on this subject of attribution does not make it right to use his designs without acknowledgment.

                                  My tongue in cheek comment was directed at any of those in the design chain who have not bothered to do so.

                                  Warren Allgyer
                                  9V1TD



                                  -- 
                                  Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot
                                  Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support
                                  Senior Staff Specialist, Cricket Coach
                                  Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks
                                  




                                  --
                                  I'm here to add more value to the world than I'm using up.
                                • Sid Boyce
                                  Hi Warren, I have just read Ravi s post on the matter and I see nothing there to disapprove of and much to commend. There is such a thing as the spirit of
                                  Message 16 of 21 , Aug 15, 2014
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                                    Hi Warren,
                                    I have just read Ravi's post on the matter and I see nothing there to disapprove of and much to commend. There is such a thing as the spirit of amateur radio that has always been about sharing That's how the hobby advances and the reason we have the freedom to enjoy new and exciting ideas.

                                    There is so much prior art and transgressions involved that patenting any of this stuff would be very difficult even if some monopolist decided to pursue that course - I don't see how anyone could patent Dan's work when all QSD/QSE designs are essentially identical, even in implementation
                                    http://www.norcalqrp.org/files/Tayloe_mixer_x3a.pdf

                                    In any case fresh ideas are to be welcomed in the spirit that has always characterised amateur radio.
                                    If you buy a commercial rig you won't see credits to Signor Marconi, Tesla, Logie Beard or even to more recent inventors of techniques such as SSB, etc. none of them ever wishing for their inventions to be buried in a vault to stop others from using them.
                                    If every idea was patented nothing would ever get built and deployed by anyone not having a bunch of high flying corporate lawyers to fight their court battles - Apple vs Samsung being typical of what is currently happening. What we don't see is the small fry that these heavyweights have squashed.

                                    Going back some years Microsoft threatened the KDE developers with court action if they didn't take down their logo that said "Where do you want to go tomorrow" - no contest.

                                    SparkFun (https://www.sparkfun.com/) was once served with a notice from Sun Microsystems' lawyers saying that their name implied to customers that their products were based on Sun SPARC and that they should change their name.

                                    Ideas don't survive in a vacuum either.
                                    A colleague here in the UK discovered that he could print circuit patterns on to a PCB using a plotter.
                                    The results were amazing. Three months later a guy Stateside independently discovered exactly the same technique.
                                    73 ... Sid.

                                    On 15/08/14 07:01, allgyer@... [softrock40] wrote:
                                     

                                    Sid

                                    I agree it is a fine line. And that line may be in a different place for something that is built for personal use versus something that is presented as a commercial product.

                                    There is also a considerable difference between taking design concepts such as the Tayloe mixer and incorporating them into a new system design versus lifting a system or sub-system, component for component, or taking source code verbatim, and representing it as "my design".

                                    Changing a component designation, laying it out differently on the board, or adding a few sub-routines to a code listing do indeed make a different product. But there is a huge difference between calling that "My design" and calling it "My design incorporating the Oscillation Overthruster from Peter Weller and the modified source code of John Big Bootee".

                                    The second is certainly more accurate, much more polite, and would satisfy even grumpy old farts like me in most cases. I think it still begs a legal question when it is used for commercial purposes and certainly would not satisfy that requirement had the original designs been patented or copyrighted.

                                    Warren Allgyer
                                    9V1TD



                                    -- 
                                    Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot
                                    Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support
                                    Senior Staff Specialist, Cricket Coach
                                    Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks
                                    
                                  • warrenallgyer
                                    Sid The focus of my initial comment was not limited to or even primarily directed at the contents of Ravi s post. The issue has been highlighted sufficiently
                                    Message 17 of 21 , Aug 15, 2014
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                                      Sid

                                      The focus of my initial comment was not limited to or even primarily directed at the contents of Ravi's post. The issue has been highlighted sufficiently and I have no need to beat this drum further.

                                      Warm regards,

                                      Warren Allgyer
                                      9V1TD
                                    • Sid Boyce
                                      OK Warren, Likewise, enough said. I would recommend QST September 2014 page 101 as worth a read by all with access to it as a reminder of core amateur radio
                                      Message 18 of 21 , Aug 15, 2014
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                                        OK Warren,
                                        Likewise, enough said.
                                        I would recommend QST September 2014 page 101 as worth a read by all with access to it as a reminder of core amateur radio values.
                                        73 ... Sid.
                                         
                                        On 15/08/14 14:21, allgyer@... [softrock40] wrote:
                                         

                                        Sid

                                        The focus of my initial comment was not limited to or even primarily directed at the contents of Ravi's post. The issue has been highlighted sufficiently and I have no need to beat this drum further.

                                        Warm regards,

                                        Warren Allgyer
                                        9V1TD



                                        -- 
                                        Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot
                                        Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support
                                        Senior Staff Specialist, Cricket Coach
                                        Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks
                                        
                                      • dsasibhushan
                                        Dear Friends, We don t see the world as it is, we see it as we are.. ― Anaïs Nin ZAZ never said that he designed the entire circuit of his own and did not
                                        Message 19 of 21 , Aug 16, 2014
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                                          Dear Friends, 

                                          We don't see the world as it is, we see it as we are.. ― Anaïs Nin

                                          ZAZ never said that he designed the entire circuit of his own and did not mention anywhere about this. He always told that he developed using bits and pieces from other pioneer circuits. I feel this how a home brewer really works. 
                                          For information to you all ZAZ is not a kit selling Guy. By profession he is a medical Doctor and a  Professor in Physiology,heading his department in a Medical college. Inspite of all his busy schedules, his passion about home-brewing and encouragement from many local Hams made him to work on SDRs.
                                          Coming to SDR workshop, it is upto SIARS for collecting money from the delegates for the purchase of all components in a group buy and not for any personal entertainment or kit selling business. On request of SIARS to conduct work shop ZAZ is attending to help the hams in building SDR.
                                           HAMFEST INDIA 2014, Hyderabad is planning to publish all his works in its souvenir. On the request of HFI 2014, ZAZ did not post or publish any writing of the entire circuit. He only had all his discussions over mails individually to intrested ones in this SDR. Interested HAMs can get the PCBs durring HFI2014 at a cost of no loss - no profit basis. 
                                          I write this to avoid cheep comments on a homebrewer from Mr. Ravi Miranda and others in this group. So Guys lets don't piss our self with cheep comments criticizing other homebrewer's work and lets concentrate on our own work only.
                                          73, DE
                                          VU3ELR
                                          ---In softrock40@yahoogroups.com, <sboyce@...> wrote :
                                          Hi Warren,I have just read Ravi's post on the matter and I see nothing there to disapprove of and much to commend. There is such a thing as the spirit of amateur radio that has always been about sharing That's how the hobby advances and the reason we have the freedom to enjoy new and exciting ideas. There is so much prior art and transgressions involved that patenting any of this stuff would be very difficult even if some monopolist decided to pursue that course - I don't see how anyone could patent Dan's work when all QSD/QSE designs are essentially identical, even in implementation http://www.norcalqrp.org/files/Tayloe_mixer_x3a.pdfIn any case fresh ideas are to be welcomed in the spirit that has always characterised amateur radio.If you buy a commercial rig you won't see credits to Signor Marconi, Tesla, Logie Beard or even to more recent inventors of techniques such as SSB, etc. none of them ever wishing for their inventions to be buried in a vault to stop others from using them. If every idea was patented nothing would ever get built and deployed by anyone not having a bunch of high flying corporate lawyers to fight their court battles - Apple vs Samsung being typical of what is currently happening. What we don't see is the small fry that these heavyweights have squashed.Going back some years Microsoft threatened the KDE developers with court action if they didn't take down their logo that said "Where do you want to go tomorrow" - no contest.SparkFun (https://www.sparkfun.com/) was once served with a notice from Sun Microsystems' lawyers saying that their name implied to customers that their products were based on Sun SPARC and that they should change their name.Ideas don't survive in a vacuum either.A colleague here in the UK discovered that he could print circuit patterns on to a PCB using a plotter. The results were amazing. Three months later a guy Stateside independently discovered exactly the same technique.73 ... Sid.
                                          On 15/08/14 07:01, allgyer@... [softrock40] wrote:
                                           

                                          SidI agree it is a fine line. And that line may be in a different place for something that is built for personal use versus something that is presented as a commercial product.There is also a considerable difference between taking design concepts such as the Tayloe mixer and incorporating them into a new system design versus lifting a system or sub-system, component for component, or taking source code verbatim, and representing it as "my design". Changing a component designation, laying it out differently on the board, or adding a few sub-routines to a code listing do indeed make a different product. But there is a huge difference between calling that "My design" and calling it "My design incorporating the Oscillation Overthruster from Peter Weller and the modified source code of John Big Bootee". The second is certainly more accurate, much more polite, and would satisfy even grumpy old farts like me in most cases. I think it still begs a legal question when it is used for commercial purposes and certainly would not satisfy that requirement had the original designs been patented or copyrighted.Warren Allgyer9V1TD

                                          -- 
                                          Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot
                                          Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support
                                          Senior Staff Specialist, Cricket Coach
                                          Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks
                                          
                                           
                                        • Ravi Miranda
                                          Dear Sasi Please do not pick on me and single me out on this, there are no cheep (cheap) comments, I of course would not stoop to your level and raise
                                          Message 20 of 21 , Aug 16, 2014
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            Dear Sasi

                                            Please do not pick on me and single me out on this, there are no cheep (cheap) comments, I of course would not stoop to  your level and raise allegations about me seeking clarifications on the issue. I merely voiced the comments to SIARS. Maybe you picked me out because of the name, and decided let's pick on him, instead of David, Dick,  Peter and Harry????
                                            Had you been vocal about the issue when it first brewed up, the issue would not have come to rise.

                                            I of course seek an apology on the group from you for picking me out of a group that correctly pointed out that the acknowledgement was quickly evident. Enough said!!!!

                                            73/Happy DX

                                            Ravi/2E0RVI




                                            On 16 August 2014 09:23, dsasibhushan@... [softrock40] <softrock40@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
                                             

                                            Dear Friends, 

                                            We don't see the world as it is, we see it as we are.. ― Anaïs Nin

                                            ZAZ never said that he designed the entire circuit of his own and did not mention anywhere about this. He always told that he developed using bits and pieces from other pioneer circuits. I feel this how a home brewer really works. 
                                            For information to you all ZAZ is not a kit selling Guy. By profession he is a medical Doctor and a  Professor in Physiology,heading his department in a Medical college. Inspite of all his busy schedules, his passion about home-brewing and encouragement from many local Hams made him to work on SDRs.
                                            Coming to SDR workshop, it is upto SIARS for collecting money from the delegates for the purchase of all components in a group buy and not for any personal entertainment or kit selling business. On request of SIARS to conduct work shop ZAZ is attending to help the hams in building SDR.
                                             HAMFEST INDIA 2014, Hyderabad is planning to publish all his works in its souvenir. On the request of HFI 2014, ZAZ did not post or publish any writing of the entire circuit. He only had all his discussions over mails individually to intrested ones in this SDR. Interested HAMs can get the PCBs durring HFI2014 at a cost of no loss - no profit basis. 
                                            I write this to avoid cheep comments on a homebrewer from Mr. Ravi Miranda and others in this group. So Guys lets don't piss our self with cheep comments criticizing other homebrewer's work and lets concentrate on our own work only.
                                            73, DE
                                            VU3ELR
                                            ---In softrock40@yahoogroups.com, <sboyce@...> wrote :
                                            Hi Warren,I have just read Ravi's post on the matter and I see nothing there to disapprove of and much to commend. There is such a thing as the spirit of amateur radio that has always been about sharing That's how the hobby advances and the reason we have the freedom to enjoy new and exciting ideas. There is so much prior art and transgressions involved that patenting any of this stuff would be very difficult even if some monopolist decided to pursue that course - I don't see how anyone could patent Dan's work when all QSD/QSE designs are essentially identical, even in implementation http://www.norcalqrp.org/files/Tayloe_mixer_x3a.pdfIn any case fresh ideas are to be welcomed in the spirit that has always characterised amateur radio.If you buy a commercial rig you won't see credits to Signor Marconi, Tesla, Logie Beard or even to more recent inventors of techniques such as SSB, etc. none of them ever wishing for their inventions to be buried in a vault to stop others from using them. If every idea was patented nothing would ever get built and deployed by anyone not having a bunch of high flying corporate lawyers to fight their court battles - Apple vs Samsung being typical of what is currently happening. What we don't see is the small fry that these heavyweights have squashed.Going back some years Microsoft threatened the KDE developers with court action if they didn't take down their logo that said "Where do you want to go tomorrow" - no contest.SparkFun (https://www.sparkfun.com/) was once served with a notice from Sun Microsystems' lawyers saying that their name implied to customers that their products were based on Sun SPARC and that they should change their name.Ideas don't survive in a vacuum either.A colleague here in the UK discovered that he could print circuit patterns on to a PCB using a plotter. The results were amazing. Three months later a guy Stateside independently discovered exactly the same technique.73 ... Sid.
                                            On 15/08/14 07:01, allgyer@... [softrock40] wrote:
                                             

                                            SidI agree it is a fine line. And that line may be in a different place for something that is built for personal use versus something that is presented as a commercial product.There is also a considerable difference between taking design concepts such as the Tayloe mixer and incorporating them into a new system design versus lifting a system or sub-system, component for component, or taking source code verbatim, and representing it as "my design". Changing a component designation, laying it out differently on the board, or adding a few sub-routines to a code listing do indeed make a different product. But there is a huge difference between calling that "My design" and calling it "My design incorporating the Oscillation Overthruster from Peter Weller and the modified source code of John Big Bootee". The second is certainly more accurate, much more polite, and would satisfy even grumpy old farts like me in most cases. I think it still begs a legal question when it is used for commercial purposes and certainly would not satisfy that requirement had the original designs been patented or copyrighted.Warren Allgyer9V1TD

                                            -- 
                                            Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot
                                            Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support
                                            Senior Staff Specialist, Cricket Coach
                                            Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks
                                            
                                             




                                            --
                                            I'm here to add more value to the world than I'm using up.
                                          • dsasibhushan
                                            Dear Ravi, I definitely sticks calling them cheep comments as they are made criticizing some one s handwork with no reasons and value behind. 73 VU3ELR ...
                                            Message 21 of 21 , Aug 16, 2014
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              Dear Ravi,
                                              I definitely sticks calling them cheep comments as they are made criticizing some one's handwork with no reasons and value behind. 
                                              73
                                              VU3ELR
                                              ---In softrock40@yahoogroups.com, <ravimiranda@...> wrote :
                                              Dear Sasi
                                              Please do not pick on me and single me out on this, there are no cheep (cheap) comments, I of course would not stoop to  your level and raise allegations about me seeking clarifications on the issue. I merely voiced the comments to SIARS. Maybe you picked me out because of the name, and decided let's pick on him, instead of David, Dick,  Peter and Harry????
                                              Had you been vocal about the issue when it first brewed up, the issue would not have come to rise.
                                              I of course seek an apology on the group from you for picking me out of a group that correctly pointed out that the acknowledgement was quickly evident. Enough said!!!!
                                              73/Happy DX
                                              Ravi/2E0RVI
                                              On 16 August 2014 09:23, dsasibhushan@... [softrock40] <softrock40@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
                                               
                                              Dear Friends, 

                                              We don't see the world as it is, we see it as we are.. ― Anaïs Nin

                                              ZAZ never said that he designed the entire circuit of his own and did not mention anywhere about this. He always told that he developed using bits and pieces from other pioneer circuits. I feel this how a home brewer really works. 
                                              For information to you all ZAZ is not a kit selling Guy. By profession he is a medical Doctor and a  Professor in Physiology,heading his department in a Medical college. Inspite of all his busy schedules, his passion about home-brewing and encouragement from many local Hams made him to work on SDRs.
                                              Coming to SDR workshop, it is upto SIARS for collecting money from the delegates for the purchase of all components in a group buy and not for any personal entertainment or kit selling business. On request of SIARS to conduct work shop ZAZ is attending to help the hams in building SDR.
                                               HAMFEST INDIA 2014, Hyderabad is planning to publish all his works in its souvenir. On the request of HFI 2014, ZAZ did not post or publish any writing of the entire circuit. He only had all his discussions over mails individually to intrested ones in this SDR. Interested HAMs can get the PCBs durring HFI2014 at a cost of no loss - no profit basis. 
                                              I write this to avoid cheep comments on a homebrewer from Mr. Ravi Miranda and others in this group. So Guys lets don't piss our self with cheep comments criticizing other homebrewer's work and lets concentrate on our own work only.
                                              73, DE
                                              VU3ELR
                                              ---In softrock40@yahoogroups.com, <sboyce@...> wrote :
                                              Hi Warren,I have just read Ravi's post on the matter and I see nothing there to disapprove of and much to commend. There is such a thing as the spirit of amateur radio that has always been about sharing That's how the hobby advances and the reason we have the freedom to enjoy new and exciting ideas. There is so much prior art and transgressions involved that patenting any of this stuff would be very difficult even if some monopolist decided to pursue that course - I don't see how anyone could patent Dan's work when all QSD/QSE designs are essentially identical, even in implementation http://www.norcalqrp.org/files/Tayloe_mixer_x3a.pdfIn any case fresh ideas are to be welcomed in the spirit that has always characterised amateur radio.If you buy a commercial rig you won't see credits to Signor Marconi, Tesla, Logie Beard or even to more recent inventors of techniques such as SSB, etc. none of them ever wishing for their inventions to be buried in a vault to stop others from using them. If every idea was patented nothing would ever get built and deployed by anyone not having a bunch of high flying corporate lawyers to fight their court battles - Apple vs Samsung being typical of what is currently happening. What we don't see is the small fry that these heavyweights have squashed.Going back some years Microsoft threatened the KDE developers with court action if they didn't take down their logo that said "Where do you want to go tomorrow" - no contest.SparkFun (https://www.sparkfun.com/) was once served with a notice from Sun Microsystems' lawyers saying that their name implied to customers that their products were based on Sun SPARC and that they should change their name.Ideas don't survive in a vacuum either.A colleague here in the UK discovered that he could print circuit patterns on to a PCB using a plotter. The results were amazing. Three months later a guy Stateside independently discovered exactly the same technique.73 ... Sid.
                                              On 15/08/14 07:01, allgyer@... [softrock40] wrote:
                                               

                                              SidI agree it is a fine line. And that line may be in a different place for something that is built for personal use versus something that is presented as a commercial product.There is also a considerable difference between taking design concepts such as the Tayloe mixer and incorporating them into a new system design versus lifting a system or sub-system, component for component, or taking source code verbatim, and representing it as "my design". Changing a component designation, laying it out differently on the board, or adding a few sub-routines to a code listing do indeed make a different product. But there is a huge difference between calling that "My design" and calling it "My design incorporating the Oscillation Overthruster from Peter Weller and the modified source code of John Big Bootee". The second is certainly more accurate, much more polite, and would satisfy even grumpy old farts like me in most cases. I think it still begs a legal question when it is used for commercial purposes and certainly would not satisfy that requirement had the original designs been patented or copyrighted.Warren Allgyer9V1TD

                                              -- 
                                              Sid Boyce ... Hamradio License G3VBV, Licensed Private Pilot
                                              Emeritus IBM/Amdahl Mainframes and Sun/Fujitsu Servers Tech Support
                                              Senior Staff Specialist, Cricket Coach
                                              Microsoft Windows Free Zone - Linux used for all Computing Tasks
                                              
                                               

                                              -- I'm here to add more value to the world than I'm using up.
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