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Re: [snowkiteidaho] Re: kites for sale!!!1

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  • Whitney Rearick
    We had a similar issue on the Idaho Whitewater listserv. The solution? They started a listserv just for buying and selling river-related gear - they call it
    Message 1 of 9 , May 25, 2007
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      We had a similar issue on the Idaho Whitewater listserv.  The solution?  They started a listserv just for buying and selling river-related gear - they call it RiverTrader.  It only sends out emails when someone posts, and only people who might sometime be interested in buying or selling something (which is most of us) subscribe.  Meanwhile nobody is allowed to post things for sale/trade to the main Idaho Whitewater listserv.  That way nobody is perceived as getting free/cheap advertising, or of getting an advantage.  Seems fair.
       
      In this case, for maximum participation I'd suggest creating a broad Yahoo Group for people interested in buying/selling gear related to all wind sports.
       
      wr

      ----- Original Message ----
      From: Ryan Wait <ryanwait@...>
      To: snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 5:18:01 PM
      Subject: [snowkiteidaho] Re: kites for sale!!!1

        I realize that you started this user group. i also realize that kiting in boise is your baby. most of us can say that you helped us get into kiting. But i didnt realize that "snowkiteidaho" was a censored user group. it should be an open forum where people can sell, buy, and talk about whatever they want. if i think i have a great product to offer, than people should be able to hear about it.

      If you want people to ride your kites, your boards, and know nothing else, then you should start "Eddy's kite club" then they will only hear and see what you want them to.

      stop feeling threatened by Kite Soldier, i think its great that gear daddy LLC exists. there are plenty of kiters out there. having a choice will only make our market grow.

      Ryan.


      From:  "Eddy" <geardaddy@cableone. net>
      To:  "Ryan Wait" <ryanwait@hotmail. com>
      Subject:  Re: kites for sale!!!1
      Date:  Thu, 24 May 2007 21:05:37 -0000
      >Ryan,
      >
      >Just in Case you did not know. I started this site for my business,
      >which is Gear Daddy LLC. I don't care if you sell personal stuff on
      >it. But please use if for personal stuff only and not your business.
      >
      >Let me know if you have a problem with that.
      >Eddy
      >

      PC Magazine’s 2007 editors’ choice for best Web mail—award-winning Windows Live Hotmail.



      Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's Comedy with an Edge to see what's on, when.
    • Jason Brickner
      For me it isn t a problem. We are such a small group, that I don t mind a couple extra emails. Two of the BEST pieces of equipment I own came from someone
      Message 2 of 9 , May 25, 2007
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        For me it isn't a problem.  We are such a small group, that I don't mind a couple extra emails.  Two of the BEST pieces of equipment I own came from someone posting information on this site.  The best kite I own is an old 2002 16M kite I bought used from Steve Linane last year.  I wouldn't have know about it if he hadn't posted it on this site.  My favorite piece of equipment is my Crazy-fly board which I bought brand new from Eddy.  Eddy let us know he had a few and let me take it to the Bahamas to try before I bought.  THAT WAS AWESOME.  The reason I say this is that I bought two kites from a store in hood river site unseen.  I do NOT like them.  From now on, I will not purchase a NEW kite until I fly it first.  I think it's great that Eddy lets you try something before buying.  I don't mind paying him whatever he thinks is fair for that service.  And if you have a problem with equipment he will work with you on getting the issue resolved. 
         
        I know that Eddy has access to Ozone and Airush kites and Crazy Fly boards.  Now Ryan has access to Flysurfer equipment.  The best part is that they will let you try them before you buy them so you don't end up like me with two kites that you spent a bunch of money on that you don't like.  I don't see how this is a bad thing for the group.  Plus, I don't think anyone is trying to get rich selling kiteboarding equipment in Idaho.  If they are, they better go get some help.  We don't have the room for a valley full of water Kiteboarders.  :-)
         
        I look forward to seeing you all out on the water.  I was ready to go this morning.  Darn it!
         
        -Jason


        From: snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com [mailto:snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Whitney Rearick
        Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 8:08 AM
        To: snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [snowkiteidaho] Re: kites for sale!!!1

         
        We had a similar issue on the Idaho Whitewater listserv.  The solution?  They started a listserv just for buying and selling river-related gear - they call it RiverTrader.  It only sends out emails when someone posts, and only people who might sometime be interested in buying or selling something (which is most of us) subscribe.  Meanwhile nobody is allowed to post things for sale/trade to the main Idaho Whitewater listserv.  That way nobody is perceived as getting free/cheap advertising, or of getting an advantage.  Seems fair.
         
        In this case, for maximum participation I'd suggest creating a broad Yahoo Group for people interested in buying/selling gear related to all wind sports.
         
        wr

        ----- Original Message ----
        From: Ryan Wait <ryanwait@hotmail. com>
        To: snowkiteidaho@ yahoogroups. com
        Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 5:18:01 PM
        Subject: [snowkiteidaho] Re: kites for sale!!!1

          I realize that you started this user group. i also realize that kiting in boise is your baby. most of us can say that you helped us get into kiting. But i didnt realize that "snowkiteidaho" was a censored user group. it should be an open forum where people can sell, buy, and talk about whatever they want. if i think i have a great product to offer, than people should be able to hear about it.

        If you want people to ride your kites, your boards, and know nothing else, then you should start "Eddy's kite club" then they will only hear and see what you want them to.

        stop feeling threatened by Kite Soldier, i think its great that gear daddy LLC exists. there are plenty of kiters out there. having a choice will only make our market grow.

        Ryan.


        From:  "Eddy" <geardaddy@cableone. net>
        To:  "Ryan Wait" <ryanwait@hotmail. com>
        Subject:  Re: kites for sale!!!1
        Date:  Thu, 24 May 2007 21:05:37 -0000
        >Ryan,
        >
        >Just in Case you did not know. I started this site for my business,
        >which is Gear Daddy LLC. I don't care if you sell personal stuff on
        >it. But please use if for personal stuff only and not your business.
        >
        >Let me know if you have a problem with that.
        >Eddy
        >

        PC Magazine’s 2007 editors’ choice for best Web mail—award-winning Windows Live Hotmail.



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      • Tom von Alten
        ... Interesting issue. I m not in the market for kiting gear (yet), but if a new group were set up specifically for buying and selling stuff related to all
        Message 3 of 9 , May 25, 2007
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          Whitney Rearick wrote:
          > We had a similar issue on the Idaho Whitewater listserv....
          > They started a listserv just for buying and selling river-related
          > gear - they call it RiverTrader....

          Interesting issue.

          I'm not in the market for kiting gear (yet), but if a new group
          were set up specifically for buying and selling stuff "related to
          all wind sports," the Boise Sailors Association group
          ( http://groups.google.com/group/BoiseSailors ) members would
          probably want to participate.

          As it is now, there is no restriction (or problem) with the
          occasional "used gear wanted/for sale" posts from whomever, and
          the BSA group is non-commercial (and managed by a benevolent
          dictator - me).

          I think it would have been better (or at least more professional)
          had Ryan not responded publicly to Eddy's private message, but
          that's done, so we all can discuss it here until Eddy kicks us out.

          While I knew that Eddy had a commercial interest here, I did
          not know that he saw this group as a commercial enterprise; if
          that's what you want Eddy, consider a more descriptive Description
          on http://groups.yahoo.com/group/snowkiteidaho/ . As it is now
          ("Snowkite, snow kite, kitesurf, kiteboard, kiteski Adventures in
          Idaho."), it reads more like keywords, and does not let anyone
          know that it's proprietary to Gear Daddy LLC.
          _____________
          Tom von Alten http://fortboise.org
          tva@...
        • Gear Daddy, LLC
          Gear Daddy Here A.K.A. Eddy!!! Most people know that I started snowkiteidaho web group when I started my business 2004, Gear Daddy LLC now with ~1500
          Message 4 of 9 , May 25, 2007
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            Gear Daddy Here  A.K.A.  Eddy!!! 
             
            Most people know that I started "snowkiteidaho" web group when I started my business 2004, Gear Daddy LLC now with ~1500 posts. It was setup so that I could communicate when I or others were going kiting, also it was available so that anyone could sell their personal "used" gear, and to promote the sports locally. I do moderate the group and keep "undesirables" out!!! Ryan you are not the "undesirables" I'm referring to.
             
            If everyone thinks that I should not promote my business on this group and should start another site for that then so be it. But I have a feeling that this will happen again and I'll get told the same thing. I chose a web group over a website for a reason, It keeps people involved. If I need to redo the title bar then I will.  I will leave this up to the group to decide.
             
            FYI: the only time I post Gear sales on this group is when a really terrific deal is available. I don't get on this site and Praise or Bash any particular Brand. I don't undercut anyone who is selling gear to sell mine, But I guess I should mention that I can get ANY BRAND of kite! But I do prefer to sell what I fly and know. There are a lot of brands out there that just follow someone else's lead and try to pick up the free ride...happens all the time. You get what you pay for!
             
            I was asking Ryan on a private level, to not promote his business on something I setup and moderate for my business. Ryan has his own site in which he can promote his business. Just in case you have not heard of it it is called snowkiteidaho.com, I have no problem promoting his site.  I also will promote any site he wants to start.
             
            I take a lot of  pride in what I've helped establish locally...I'm happy to help anyone out, when ever , where ever. I'm not making a so-called "killing" in kiting and never was that a goal. I have not made a profit in this business. I got into this to help promote the industry which I have many great friends. Those people working and surviving are important to me. I've been in wind sports (kiting, windsurfing, paragliding, snowkiting, etc) for over 30 years and I don't see that changing. I plan on promoting it for a while or for at least as long as my body works. 
             
            I'm sorry this personal request was listed to the group!
             
            Don't worry I'm not a dictator like "Tom" And I'm not going to kick anyone out nor would he...lol....
             
            I have asked and therefore what happens happens.
             
            Eddy


            From: snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com [mailto:snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tom von Alten
            Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 12:09 PM
            To: snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [snowkiteidaho] Selling on snowkiteidaho

            Whitney Rearick wrote:

            > We had a similar issue on the Idaho Whitewater
            listserv....
            > They started a listserv just for buying and selling
            river-related
            > gear - they call it
            RiverTrader. ...

            Interesting issue.

            I'm not in the market for kiting gear (yet), but if a new group
            were set up specifically for buying and selling stuff "related to
            all wind sports," the Boise Sailors Association group
            ( http://groups. google.com/ group/BoiseSailo rs ) members would
            probably want to participate.

            As it is now, there is no restriction (or problem) with the
            occasional "used gear wanted/for sale" posts from whomever, and
            the BSA group is non-commercial (and managed by a benevolent
            dictator - me).

            I think it would have been better (or at least more professional)
            had Ryan not responded publicly to Eddy's private message, but
            that's done, so we all can discuss it here until Eddy kicks us out.

            While I knew that Eddy had a commercial interest here, I did
            not know that he saw this group as a commercial enterprise; if
            that's what you want Eddy, consider a more descriptive Description
            on http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/snowkiteid aho/ . As it is now
            ("Snowkite, snow kite, kitesurf, kiteboard, kiteski Adventures in
            Idaho."), it reads more like keywords, and does not let anyone
            know that it's proprietary to Gear Daddy LLC.
            ____________ _
            Tom von Alten http://fortboise. org
            tva@fortboise. org

          • hawkicd11
            this is a touche subject, many different aspects to consider. my take is that eddie has never had a problem with people posting used gear for sale on here.
            Message 5 of 9 , May 25, 2007
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              this is a touche subject, many different aspects to consider. my
              take is that eddie has never had a problem with people posting used
              gear for sale on here. the issue started when ryan mentioned
              distributing flexifoils locally. eddie probably doesn't care about
              the fact that ryan is trying to directly compete with him, but it is
              the fact that ryan is utilizing the foundation that eddie
              established to market his new business that can be frustrating.
              eddie has never claimed to be the dictator of anything, but he is
              the moderator of this group, and he has been an integral part of
              establishing a kiting community in this area for the last ten
              years. maybe that deserves a little bit of respect.

              i personally dig what ryan and monte are trying to do with snowkite
              soldier, opening a lodge up at camas and trying to grow the sport
              locally. maybe its time they put a forum(or possibly just update
              their site occassionally) on snowkitesoldier.com to discuss what
              products they are planning on selling and the services they plan on
              rendering to backup their products. that would be all they needed
              to market locally. i would check it out.....

              lets face the facts. we are a small community of wind enthusiasts
              just looking for a thrill. neither eddie nor ryan are going to get
              rich off of selling kites anytime soon, probably not even close.
              eddie was just trying to protect what little market he has built so
              he can continue to offer the service he renders. which i believe is
              definitely good service.

              for example: i bought a 2007 instinct sport 13m from eddie two
              months ago. absolutely love it.... last weekend i dropped it on the
              leading edge and cut a big gash in it... eddie took it home and
              fixed the repair that night.. excellent repair job, rendered in a
              timely fashion, for no charge. I call that an excellent warranty
              program...

              what kind of warranty program will you establish to backup your
              Ion2's ryan? do you have the experience to repair kites properly,
              not to mention the right equipment..... maybe you should list this
              stuff on your website.

              i think these are important questions.. and before you bash eddie
              for being a dictator consider the amount of time, money, and effort
              he has put into this community to support it properly, and to get us
              to the point where we can enjoy this sport together.....




              --- In snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com, "Jason Brickner"
              <jasonbrickner@...> wrote:
              >
              > For me it isn't a problem. We are such a small group, that I
              don't mind a
              > couple extra emails. Two of the BEST pieces of equipment I own
              came from
              > someone posting information on this site. The best kite I own is
              an old
              > 2002 16M kite I bought used from Steve Linane last year. I
              wouldn't have
              > know about it if he hadn't posted it on this site. My favorite
              piece of
              > equipment is my Crazy-fly board which I bought brand new from
              Eddy. Eddy
              > let us know he had a few and let me take it to the Bahamas to try
              before I
              > bought. THAT WAS AWESOME. The reason I say this is that I bought
              two kites
              > from a store in hood river site unseen. I do NOT like them. From
              now on, I
              > will not purchase a NEW kite until I fly it first. I think it's
              great that
              > Eddy lets you try something before buying. I don't mind paying
              him whatever
              > he thinks is fair for that service. And if you have a problem with
              > equipment he will work with you on getting the issue resolved.
              >
              > I know that Eddy has access to Ozone and Airush kites and Crazy
              Fly boards.
              > Now Ryan has access to Flysurfer equipment. The best part is that
              they will
              > let you try them before you buy them so you don't end up like me
              with two
              > kites that you spent a bunch of money on that you don't like. I
              don't see
              > how this is a bad thing for the group. Plus, I don't think anyone
              is trying
              > to get rich selling kiteboarding equipment in Idaho. If they are,
              they
              > better go get some help. We don't have the room for a valley full
              of water
              > Kiteboarders. :-)
              >
              > I look forward to seeing you all out on the water. I was ready to
              go this
              > morning. Darn it!
              >
              > -Jason
              >
              > _____
              >
              > From: snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com
              [mailto:snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com]
              > On Behalf Of Whitney Rearick
              > Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 8:08 AM
              > To: snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: Re: [snowkiteidaho] Re: kites for sale!!!1
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > We had a similar issue on the Idaho Whitewater listserv. The
              solution?
              > They started a listserv just for buying and selling river-related
              gear -
              > they call it RiverTrader. It only sends out emails when someone
              posts, and
              > only people who might sometime be interested in buying or selling
              something
              > (which is most of us) subscribe. Meanwhile nobody is allowed to
              post things
              > for sale/trade to the main Idaho Whitewater listserv. That way
              nobody is
              > perceived as getting free/cheap advertising, or of getting an
              advantage.
              > Seems fair.
              >
              > In this case, for maximum participation I'd suggest creating a
              broad Yahoo
              > Group for people interested in buying/selling gear related to all
              wind
              > sports.
              >
              > wr
              >
              >
              > ----- Original Message ----
              > From: Ryan Wait <ryanwait@...>
              > To: snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com
              > Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 5:18:01 PM
              > Subject: [snowkiteidaho] Re: kites for sale!!!1
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > I realize that you started this user group. i also realize that
              kiting in
              > boise is your baby. most of us can say that you helped us get into
              kiting.
              > But i didnt realize that "snowkiteidaho" was a censored user
              group. it
              > should be an open forum where people can sell, buy, and talk about
              whatever
              > they want. if i think i have a great product to offer, than people
              should be
              > able to hear about it.
              >
              > If you want people to ride your kites, your boards, and know
              nothing else,
              > then you should start "Eddy's kite club" then they will only hear
              and see
              > what you want them to.
              >
              > stop feeling threatened by Kite Soldier, i think its great that
              gear daddy
              > LLC exists. there are plenty of kiters out there. having a choice
              will only
              > make our market grow.
              >
              > Ryan.
              >
              >
              > _____
              >
              > From: "Eddy" <geardaddy@cableone. net>
              > To: "Ryan Wait" <ryanwait@hotmail. com>
              > Subject: Re: kites for sale!!!1
              > Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 21:05:37 -0000
              > >Ryan,
              > >
              > >Just in Case you did not know. I started this site for my
              business,
              > >which is Gear Daddy LLC. I don't care if you sell personal stuff
              on
              > >it. But please use if for personal stuff only and not your
              business.
              > >
              > >Let me know if you have a problem with that.
              > >Eddy
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              > PC <http://g.msn.com/8HMBENUS/2740??PS=47575> Magazine's 2007
              editors'
              > choice for best Web mail-award-winning Windows Live Hotmail.
              >
              >
              > _____
              >
              > Sick sense of humor? Visit Yahoo! TV's Comedy
              >
              <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=47093/*http://tv.yahoo.com/collections/22
              2> with
              > an Edge to see what's on, when.
              >
            • Tom von Alten
              You don t have any reason to care about my opinion, Ryan, as I don t kite and don t seem too likely to start (although Eddy did generously give me a shot at
              Message 6 of 9 , May 26, 2007
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                You don't have any reason to care about my opinion, Ryan, as I don't
                kite and don't seem too likely to start (although Eddy did generously
                give me a shot at it), and I sure as hell am not going to do anything
                to help you get rich... but I've done my part to promote collegiality
                and goodwill in local area windsports.

                I have to say you're coming across as a rather amazing butthead,
                starting with the totally unprofessional forwarding of a private email
                to the list. I don't imagine you checked with Eddy if it was OK to do
                that.

                Or to buy up the snowkiteidaho.com domain... not to actually USE it,
                but just to make it a redirection to your other domain.

                Huh.

                You want to advertise on the list, put a link in your .sig, and that
                way every message you send will have a "free" ad. Just don't make it
                plain www.snowkiteidaho.com or www.snowkitesoldier.com until you
                figure out how to put up a default index page. The Apache error
                message, the whining, the plan to "get rich" -- none of those seem
                particularly attractive as advertising.

                Cheers,
                _____________
                Tom von Alten http://fortboise.org/
                tva@...
              • hawkicd11
                ryan, i understand where you are coming from in the belief that you have the right to market your business on this forum. yet eddie has specifically told you
                Message 7 of 9 , May 26, 2007
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                  ryan, i understand where you are coming from in the belief that you
                  have the right to market your business on this forum. yet eddie has
                  specifically told you that he finds it inappropriate to market your
                  business on this site. many forums have these types of associations
                  to companies, just look at their sponsors. eddie does have
                  responsibilities to maintain with his sponsors and i understand his
                  desire to keep people using those products.

                  but this is beside the point, my kite got screwed up because i had
                  the bridle tuned improperly, you were there, you saw that it wasn't
                  flying well.... that was my fault, but eddie took care of it
                  anyway...... why, because he does things like that, for lots of
                  people. i dont know much about self mending plasma(i will check it
                  out), but i do know that things need to be fixed sometimes, and a
                  good supplier has the ability to take care of things like that.. i
                  wouldn't want to send my kite to flexifoil to get it fixed, i would
                  rather the seller be able to take care of it, quick, so i can get
                  back on the water the next day.

                  my kite spins on a dime by the way, it is super stable, and has tons
                  of power and adjustability....

                  he is not the only one helping to improve this community, but he is
                  an integral part. im waiting to see what you have to offer..... i
                  don't know how much business experience you have, but it seems that
                  you are too focused on hyping your product, selling your product,
                  and hopes and wishes.. i have been a key player in the paintball
                  industry for over 8 years and watched the the industry lose alot of
                  ground because of this type of behaviour. i have watched companies
                  fall to pieces because of jerks that want to improve margins
                  (outsourcing to china), hype crappy product, and fail to recognize
                  the key to any niche sport of this nature, good stores and
                  suppliers. the key to growing kiteboarding is good lessons(safety
                  is #1), good service, and then sales of outstanding products.... i
                  understand that monte is capable of selling, servicing, and teaching
                  people how to use the flexifoil kites, but are you? i also
                  understand that flexifoil makes great kites, has good service, and
                  isn't going to f*&k the industry because of greed... i am excited
                  about the potential of this sport, and the opportunities that we as
                  a community can create together... just don't put the cart before
                  the horse, and try to have a little respect for those that are
                  already doing what you aspire to do... and i am serious when i say
                  that you guys should update your site, maybe even add a forum...

                  regards,
                  Hawk
                • kiterguuy
                  iv heard good things about flexi foil but one of there team riders billy parker a lot of people say he is better than hadlow and flexi wont help out with him
                  Message 8 of 9 , May 27, 2007
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                    iv heard good things about flexi foil but one of there team riders
                    billy parker a lot of people say he is better than hadlow and flexi
                    wont help out with him geting to the comps on the pkra read the
                    messege below sounds like they are in it for the money not the sol
                    part

                    Only posting this here because I know that some of you have met and
                    rode with Billy. Besides being one the most amazing kiteboarders out
                    there he is about as cool of a guy as you could ever imagine.

                    Well, his sponser seems to be content with Aaron Hadlow being the
                    face of their company and are not helping out with getting Billy to
                    the PKRA events. He only entered one last year and came in 2nd..
                    beating Ruben Lenten and Hadlow himself. The guy is truly one of the
                    best on a kite. Us locals are lucky beyond belief to get to ride with
                    him anytime the wind comes up.

                    Local rider, and close friend to Billy, Jayson is trying to get folks
                    to donate a small amount of $$$ and surprise Billy with enough to
                    cover a trip to next months Cabarete event. Anything will help.

                    And ya.. being sponsered apparently does not mean much....

                    This is all happening without Billy knowing so if you are in contact
                    w/ him please dont mention it.

                    Details are at:
                    http://www.fksa.org/showthread.php?p=19657#post19657

                    if any issues getting to the forum, payapl email address is
                    raver_jay@....

                    Any questions at all, feel free to contact me or send Jayson an email
                    at the same address as his paypal account.

                    Thanks all!!

                    -Bryan
                    St. Petersburg, FL
                    _________________
                  • Ryan Wait
                    hey jon, did you write all this about billy parker? or did you cut and paste from some forum. Andrew and I stayed with billy and the other flexi guys in pismo,
                    Message 9 of 9 , May 29, 2007
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                      hey jon, did you write all this about billy parker? or did you cut and paste from some forum.

                      Andrew and I stayed with billy and the other flexi guys in pismo, ca. rode with him alot. a super  powerful kiter, every trick was huge, fast, and clean! They might not pay him to go to all the pkra events, but he gets plenty of support. And yes he is a really humble, cool guy. i will likely see him this fall @ hatteras.

                      cheers, RTW-K.S.-I.K.A.  


                      From: "kiterguuy" <kiterguuy@...>
                      Reply-To: snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com
                      To: snowkiteidaho@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [snowkiteidaho] Re: kites for sale!!!1
                      Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 05:42:26 -0000

                      iv heard good things about flexi foil but one of there team riders
                      billy parker a lot of people say he is better than hadlow and flexi
                      wont help out with him geting to the comps on the pkra read the
                      messege below sounds like they are in it for the money not the sol
                      part

                      Only posting this here because I know that some of you have met and
                      rode with Billy. Besides being one the most amazing kiteboarders out
                      there he is about as cool of a guy as you could ever imagine.

                      Well, his sponser seems to be content with Aaron Hadlow being the
                      face of their company and are not helping out with getting Billy to
                      the PKRA events. He only entered one last year and came in 2nd..
                      beating Ruben Lenten and Hadlow himself. The guy is truly one of the
                      best on a kite. Us locals are lucky beyond belief to get to ride with
                      him anytime the wind comes up.

                      Local rider, and close friend to Billy, Jayson is trying to get folks
                      to donate a small amount of $$$ and surprise Billy with enough to
                      cover a trip to next months Cabarete event. Anything will help.

                      And ya.. being sponsered apparently does not mean much....

                      This is all happening without Billy knowing so if you are in contact
                      w/ him please dont mention it.

                      Details are at:
                      http://www.fksa. org/showthread. php?p=19657# post19657

                      if any issues getting to the forum, payapl email address is
                      raver_jay@excite. com.

                      Any questions at all, feel free to contact me or send Jayson an email
                      at the same address as his paypal account.

                      Thanks all!!

                      -Bryan
                      St. Petersburg, FL
                      ____________ _____




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