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Blue states buzz over secession

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  • some friends call me snowy
    Blue states buzz over secession By Joseph Curl THE WASHINGTON TIMES Secession, which didn t work very well when it was tried once before, is suddenly red hot
    Message 1 of 2 , Nov 10, 2004
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      Blue states buzz over secession


      By Joseph Curl
      THE WASHINGTON TIMES

      Secession, which didn't work very well when it was tried once before,
      is suddenly red hot in the blue states. In certain precincts, anyway.
      One popular map circulating on the Internet shows the 19 blue
      states won by Sen. John Kerry — Washington, Oregon, California,
      Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, Illinois, Maryland and the
      Northeastern states — conjoined with Canada to form the "United States
      of Canada." The 31 red states carried by Mr. Bush are depicted as a
      separate nation dubbed "Jesusland."
      The idea isn't just a joke; one top Democrat says, "The segment of
      the country that pays for the federal government is now being governed
      by the people who don't pay for the federal government."
      "Some would say, 'Oh, poor Alabama. It's cut off from the wealth
      infusion that it gets from New York and California,' " said Lawrence
      O'Donnell, a veteran Democratic insider and now senior political
      analyst at MSNBC. "But the more this political condition goes on at
      the presidential level of the red and blue states, the more you're
      testing the inclination of the blue states to say, 'So what?' "
      Mr. O'Donnell raised the subject of secession on "The McLaughlin
      Group" during the weekend. "Ninety percent of the red states are
      welfare-client states of the federal government," said Mr. O'Donnell,
      who was an aide to Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan, New York Democrat.
      In a telephone interview, Mr. O'Donnell said the red states that
      went to Mr. Bush "collect more from the federal government than they
      send in. New York and California, Connecticut — the states that are
      blue are all the states that are paying for the bulk of everything
      this government does, from ... Social Security to everything else, and
      the people in those states don't like what this government is doing."
      The Internet has exploded with talk of a blue-state confederacy,
      including one screed circulating by e-mail that features a map of a
      new country called "American Coastopia" and proposes lopping off the
      Northeast, the West Coast and the upper Midwest to form a new country,
      away from the "rednecks in Oklahoma" and the "homophobic
      knuckle-draggers in Wyoming."
      "We were all going to move to various other countries, but then
      we thought — why should WE move?" the anonymous message asks. "We hold
      our noses as we fly over you. We are sickened by the way you treat
      people that are different from you. The rest of the world despises
      America, and we don't want to be lumped in with you anymore."
      The secession movement has already spawned commercial
      opportunism. One Web site is selling T-shirts that read "I seceded."
      No one at the White House would comment on the calls for
      secession, but one top Republican official with ties to the Bush
      administration said the recent talk is not surprising, coming off an
      election in which the president received more than 59 million votes —
      the most in history.
      "If we were that far out of the mainstream, maybe we'd be pushing
      the creation of our own country," the official said. "Then we might
      have a chance of ever winning an election again."
      But Andy Nowicki, a libertarian blogger, said the blue states
      will never secede because "liberals don't want to leave their enemies
      alone. Instead, as their track record shows, they want to take over
      the government in order to force their enemies to endure perpetual
      sensitivity training for being such racist, sexist, homophobic,
      'closed-minded' boors, i.e., for disagreeing with them."
      The emergence of a solidly Republican South prompted longtime
      Democratic activist Bob Beckel to advocate Southern independence the
      morning after Election Day.
      "I think now that slavery is taken care of, I'm for letting the
      South form its own nation. Really, I think they ought to have their
      own confederacy," Mr. Beckel said on the "Fox and Friends" program.
      While secession is often thought to be a Southern phenomenon,
      Northern leaders repeatedly threatened secession in the 19th century,
      in protest of such provocations as the War of 1812, as well as the
      admission of Louisiana and Texas to the Union. In 1803, Massachusetts
      Sen. Timothy Pickering proposed "a new confederacy," naming the New
      England states members along with New York ("the center of the
      confederacy").
      In 1839, former President John Quincy Adams defended the right of
      secession in a speech in New York, saying, "Far better will it be ...
      to part in friendship with each other than to be held together by
      constraint."
      But according to Slate.com — another liberal Web site that has
      explored the topic of secession — there are no provisions in U.S. law
      for a state or states to opt out of the Union, citing such authorities
      as Bruce Ackerman of Yale Law School and Lawrence Tribe of Harvard Law
      School who say that since Appomattox "scholars have agreed that the
      Constitution grants no right of secession."
      While legal scholars say states cannot leave the Union, nothing
      stops individuals. Before the 2000 election, actor Alec Baldwin was
      one of several Hollywood figures who threatened to leave the country
      if Mr. Bush was elected — but didn't.
      "Unfortunately, there were no such pronouncements this time
      around," said Martin Grove, a columnist for HollywoodReporter.com,
      "perhaps because the last time around, when push came to shove, all of
      these people decided maybe they were in the best place they could
      possibly be to begin with."


      http://washingtontimes.com/national/20041109-122753-5113r.htm
    • Don Quixote
      To tell you the truth, the red states sound like communism or Banana Republic at best. Why don t we launch a Banana Revolution for the rest? Please see...
      Message 2 of 2 , Nov 10, 2004
      • 0 Attachment
        To tell you the truth, the red states sound like communism or Banana Republic at best.

        Why don't we launch a Banana Revolution for the rest? Please see...

        http://webspawner.com/users/donquijote40

        PS: Nice article, I forwarded it.

        some friends call me snowy <a_cascadian@...> wrote:


        Blue states buzz over secession


        By Joseph Curl
        THE WASHINGTON TIMES

        Secession, which didn't work very well when it was tried once before,
        is suddenly red hot in the blue states. In certain precincts, anyway.
        One popular map circulating on the Internet shows the 19 blue
        states won by Sen. John Kerry � Washington, Oregon, California,
        Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan, Illinois, Maryland and the
        Northeastern states � conjoined with Canada to form the "United States
        of Canada." The 31 red states carried by Mr. Bush are depicted as a
        separate nation dubbed "Jesusland."
        The idea isn't just a joke; one top Democrat says, "The segment of
        the country that pays for the federal government is now being governed
        by the people who don't pay for the federal government."
        "Some would say, 'Oh, poor Alabama. It's cut off from the wealth
        infusion that it gets from New York and California,' " said Lawrence
        O'Donnell, a veteran Democratic insider and now senior political
        analyst at MSNBC. "But the more this political condition goes on at
        the presidential level of the red and blue states, the more you're
        testing the inclination of the blue states to say, 'So what?' "
        Mr. O'Donnell raised the subject of secession on "The McLaughlin
        Group" during the weekend. "Ninety percent of the red states are
        welfare-client states of the federal government," said Mr. O'Donnell,
        who was an aide to Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan, New York Democrat.
        In a telephone interview, Mr. O'Donnell said the red states that
        went to Mr. Bush "collect more from the federal government than they
        send in. New York and California, Connecticut � the states that are
        blue are all the states that are paying for the bulk of everything
        this government does, from ... Social Security to everything else, and
        the people in those states don't like what this government is doing."
        The Internet has exploded with talk of a blue-state confederacy,
        including one screed circulating by e-mail that features a map of a
        new country called "American Coastopia" and proposes lopping off the
        Northeast, the West Coast and the upper Midwest to form a new country,
        away from the "rednecks in Oklahoma" and the "homophobic
        knuckle-draggers in Wyoming."
        "We were all going to move to various other countries, but then
        we thought � why should WE move?" the anonymous message asks. "We hold
        our noses as we fly over you. We are sickened by the way you treat
        people that are different from you. The rest of the world despises
        America, and we don't want to be lumped in with you anymore."
        The secession movement has already spawned commercial
        opportunism. One Web site is selling T-shirts that read "I seceded."
        No one at the White House would comment on the calls for
        secession, but one top Republican official with ties to the Bush
        administration said the recent talk is not surprising, coming off an
        election in which the president received more than 59 million votes �
        the most in history.
        "If we were that far out of the mainstream, maybe we'd be pushing
        the creation of our own country," the official said. "Then we might
        have a chance of ever winning an election again."
        But Andy Nowicki, a libertarian blogger, said the blue states
        will never secede because "liberals don't want to leave their enemies
        alone. Instead, as their track record shows, they want to take over
        the government in order to force their enemies to endure perpetual
        sensitivity training for being such racist, sexist, homophobic,
        'closed-minded' boors, i.e., for disagreeing with them."
        The emergence of a solidly Republican South prompted longtime
        Democratic activist Bob Beckel to advocate Southern independence the
        morning after Election Day.
        "I think now that slavery is taken care of, I'm for letting the
        South form its own nation. Really, I think they ought to have their
        own confederacy," Mr. Beckel said on the "Fox and Friends" program.
        While secession is often thought to be a Southern phenomenon,
        Northern leaders repeatedly threatened secession in the 19th century,
        in protest of such provocations as the War of 1812, as well as the
        admission of Louisiana and Texas to the Union. In 1803, Massachusetts
        Sen. Timothy Pickering proposed "a new confederacy," naming the New
        England states members along with New York ("the center of the
        confederacy").
        In 1839, former President John Quincy Adams defended the right of
        secession in a speech in New York, saying, "Far better will it be ...
        to part in friendship with each other than to be held together by
        constraint."
        But according to Slate.com � another liberal Web site that has
        explored the topic of secession � there are no provisions in U.S. law
        for a state or states to opt out of the Union, citing such authorities
        as Bruce Ackerman of Yale Law School and Lawrence Tribe of Harvard Law
        School who say that since Appomattox "scholars have agreed that the
        Constitution grants no right of secession."
        While legal scholars say states cannot leave the Union, nothing
        stops individuals. Before the 2000 election, actor Alec Baldwin was
        one of several Hollywood figures who threatened to leave the country
        if Mr. Bush was elected � but didn't.
        "Unfortunately, there were no such pronouncements this time
        around," said Martin Grove, a columnist for HollywoodReporter.com,
        "perhaps because the last time around, when push came to shove, all of
        these people decided maybe they were in the best place they could
        possibly be to begin with."


        http://washingtontimes.com/national/20041109-122753-5113r.htm







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