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B-5971 SmartSockets

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  • cyberb0
    Hey all... I posted some preliminary Eagle drawings and support files for the Burroughs B-5971 top-view Nixie. The design actually consists of three separate
    Message 1 of 14 , Mar 18, 2014
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      Hey all...


      I posted some preliminary Eagle drawings and support files for the Burroughs B-5971 top-view Nixie.  The design actually consists of three separate boards: a breadboard-friendly socket board, an identically-sized I/O adapter, and a SmartSocket driver board.  The socket board is stacked on top of the adapter with the driver connected behind the adapter at 90 degrees.  This maintains the small footprint of the tube without resorting to SMD components, and also allows for plug-in daisy-chaining.


      B-5971 tubes only have 13 segments (no underscore and only one vertical segment in the middle) so I’m assuming I’ll need to create a custom font to suit - any help with this would be appreciated!  I’ll also need to re-assign the PIC pins to match the appropriate segments.


      I should be receiving a dozen prototype boards in the next few days for testing.  Hopefully, there will be no show-stoppers and I’ll be able to finalize the design and post updated files...


      Robert

    • cyberb0
      I received the prototype boards last night! You can check them out in the Photos section... I did catch a layout error in the RX and TX lines prior to
      Message 2 of 14 , Mar 21, 2014
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        I received the prototype boards last night!  You can check them out in the Photos section...

        I did catch a layout error in the RX and TX lines prior to receiving the boards, which I've already fixed in the schematic.  After seeing the boards in-person, I clearly need to address my feeble attempt at mounting holes!  For the final version I'll be re-working the socket board dimensions to make it a drop-in replacement for the SK-136 socket.  Hopefully, cutting/breaking the boards myself will prove to be a workable, cost-saving solution.  If so, the last thing I need to do is verify the resistance ratio for the final output resistors.  Any guidance would be appreciated...

        Robert

      • cyberb0
        Breaking the boards went better than expected! I used a $10 OLFA PC-L plastic laminate cutter to score the boards on both sides. I just had to score them a
        Message 3 of 14 , Mar 25, 2014
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          Breaking the boards went better than expected!  I used a $10 OLFA PC-L plastic laminate cutter to score the boards on both sides.  I just had to score them a bit deeper than I would acrylic prior to breaking them.  A little light filing smoothed out the edges.  I have one almost assembled and ready for testing - still waiting on some parts.

          I updated the Eagle files in the Files section to reflect the latest changes for those interested.  The final version should be ready for production sometime this week...
        • jon_daddio
          Your design is awesome! I just ordered a set of the 3 boards to try out -- thanks for making those available. Not having ever made a board with Eagle, is
          Message 4 of 14 , Apr 5, 2014
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            Your design is awesome!  I just ordered a set of the 3 boards to try out -- thanks for making those available.

            Not having ever made a board with Eagle, is there an easy way to get to a parts list so I can order the correct connectors?

            Thanks for your efforts,

             

            Jon

          • cyberb0
            Thanks! I unfortunately ran out of time after posting the final design files here and on OSH Park yesterday. I ll post parts lists for them as soon as time
            Message 5 of 14 , Apr 5, 2014
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              Thanks!  I unfortunately ran out of time after posting the final design files here and on OSH Park yesterday.  I'll post parts lists for them as soon as time allows.  You can actually purchase a Smart Socket Parts Kit (1386-K) from Taylor Electronics for $12.45 that will give you everything you need except for the pin headers - that's where I originally purchased mine from.  The pin headers were direct from either Newark or Mouser.

              For those interested in more info, check out the README.TXT file in the B-5971 Folder or my Shared Projects page on OSH Park

              Robert
            • jon_daddio
              Robert, No rush. I appreciate the time it took you to get to this point. Yeah, it s the pin headers I want to make sure I get right for the mechanical fit
              Message 6 of 14 , Apr 6, 2014
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                Robert,

                No rush.  I appreciate the time it took you to get to this point.

                Yeah, it's the pin headers I want to make sure I get right for the mechanical fit since it's a 3-dimensional package.  Thanks.

                Jon
              • cyberb0
                Hey Jon, I’m working on the parts lists right now. I’m actually updating all my Eagle libraries to include part numbers and distributors. That way the
                Message 7 of 14 , Apr 7, 2014
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                  Hey Jon, I’m working on the parts lists right now.  I’m actually updating all my Eagle libraries to include part numbers and distributors.  That way the lists can be dynamically generated within Eagle (by running bom.ulp) to reflect any future design changes.  I’ll be posting the lists and updated Eagle libraries later today once they’re finalized.


                  Also, I posted updated B-5971 PIC Code late last week.  Please note that this code is currently untested!  I remapped all of the pins throughout the code so it should be semi-functional.  However, due to the smaller number of segments, some additional work will need to be done to at least properly map segments 11-13, especially with concern to the animations/transitions.  If someone gets that far before I do, feel free to update the code and pass it back on to me so I can properly attribute the work to you.


                  Chris, I posted a reference image and a text file for the Burroughs 13-segment font under the B-5971 PIC Code folder.  Any chance you could add the font to your PIC code natively so it doesn’t need to be mapped in memory?  I was planning on doing this myself but wasn’t able to figure out how to do it by looking at your code.  Thanks…

                   

                  Robert


                • cyberb0
                  I just posted the parts list (BOM) under the B-5971 Project Folder https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/smartsockets/files/B-5971/. I also updated the Eagle
                  Message 8 of 14 , Apr 7, 2014
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                    I just posted the parts list (BOM) under the B-5971 Project Folder.  I also updated the Eagle design files and libraries...

                    Here is the latest info from my README.TXT file for those interested:
                    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                    B-5971 SmartSockets
                    MadLabs/Ward0
                    Rev3 - 04-07-2014

                    INFORMATION:

                    Eagle drawings and support files for Burroughs B-5971 SmartSockets.  The design consists of three separate boards: a breadboard-friendly socket board, an identically-sized I/O adapter, and a SmartSocket driver board.  The socket board is stacked on top of the adapter with the driver connected behind the adapter at 90 degrees.  This maintains the small footprint of the tube without using SMD components, and also allows for plug-in daisy-chaining.

                    B-5971 SmartSocket (1of3)
                    Socket Board for Burroughs B-5971 Nixie Tube
                    * Plugs into B-5971 SmartLink
                    * SK-136 Footprint
                    * Breadboard-friendly
                    * 2.8mm Mounting Pads

                    B-5971 SmartLink (2of3)
                    I/O Adapter Board for B-5971 SmartSocket & SmartDriver
                    * Plugs into B-5971 SmartSocket
                    * SmartDriver plugs into back at 90°

                    B-5971 SmartDriver (3of3)
                    Driver Board for Burroughs B-5971 Nixie Tube
                    * Plugs into back of SmartLink at 90°
                    * PIC16F690 Running SmartSocket Code
                    * Based on B7971 V2 - Chris/fixitsan2

                    ORDERING:
                    Available for purchase on OSH Park
                    B-5971 SmartSocket   - $ 6.15 for 3 - oshpark.com/shared_projects/Xb1mF0UR
                    B-5971 SmartLink     - $ 6.15 for 3 - oshpark.com/shared_projects/6DPlWIX9
                    B-5971 SmartDriver   - $12.75 for 3 - oshpark.com/shared_projects/GJ2hmwVD

                    (NOTE: I make no money from the boards purchased from OSH Park. You are only paying for production.)
                  • cyberb0
                    Quick FYI... ... B-5971 SmartSocket TypeA (1of3) SK-136 Replacement for B-5971 Nixie Tube * Replaces SK-136 Socket * Plugs into B-5971 SmartLink *
                    Message 9 of 14 , Apr 8, 2014
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                      Quick FYI...
                      There are now 2 types of B-5971 socket boards.  Type A is the standard variety you can plug the tube directly into.  The newer Type B accepts a Burroughs SK-136 socket, which you then plug the tube into:
                      ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

                      B-5971 SmartSocket TypeA (1of3)
                      SK-136 Replacement for B-5971 Nixie Tube
                      * Replaces SK-136 Socket
                      * Plugs into B-5971 SmartLink
                      * Breadboard-friendly
                      * 2.8mm Mounting Pads
                      * $6.15 for 3 - oshpark.com/shared_projects/c7O8lSHJ

                      -OR-

                      B-5971 SmartSocket TypeB (1of3)
                      SK-136 Socket Adapter for B-5971 Nixie Tube
                      * Accepts SK-136 Socket
                      * Plugs into B-5971 SmartLink
                      * Breadboard-friendly
                      * 2.8mm Mounting Pads
                      * $6.15 for 3 - oshpark.com/shared_projects/WDuv0pcz
                    • cyberb0
                      Finally had time to test the operational characteristics of some NOS NL-5971 tubes, as well as some used B-5971 tubes. I started out with the resistor setup
                      Message 10 of 14 , Apr 14, 2014
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                        Finally had time to test the operational characteristics of some NOS NL-5971 tubes, as well as some used B-5971 tubes.  I started out with the resistor setup from the B7971 V2 design and adjusted the values accordingly.  However, after experimenting with different cathode resistor values, the tubes seemed to be generating too much heat.  The datasheet actually recommends a single 6.8k anode resistor with a 170V supply to efficiently utilize "...the ability of the tube’s dynamic impedance to compensate for different numbers of cathodes being ionized."  Switching to this setup I was able to successfully light 1 to all 13 segments without generating excessive heat.  As expected, the actual brightness of any given segment will slightly decrease with the lighting of each subsequent segment.  However, from a normal viewing distance, the apparent brightness of the output remains about the same.


                        For now, I’m using a single 6.8k anode resistor (currently JMP on the B-5971 SmartLink board) with jumpers in place of the 13 cathode resistors (currently R1-R13 on the B-5971 SmartDriver board).  You could also try a 5.6k anode resistor and experiment with various cathode resistor values to fine tune the output.  I’ll be updating the Eagle files and BOM later today to reflect these findings.


                        Robert

                      • sjefvangool
                        Nice project! The following I calculated for your cathode resistors, Looking at your bulletin 1141A of 1969 (which has different max. currents for the B-5971
                        Message 11 of 14 , Apr 14, 2014
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                          Nice project!

                          The following I calculated for your cathode resistors,

                          Looking at your bulletin 1141A of 1969 (which has different max. currents for the B-5971 than your 1961 datasheet) and knowing that there is app. 20V on the cathode resistor and that Chris used a factor of app. 0.562 against the maximum current of the B-7971, I would recommend:
                          39K for R1-7, R9 and R11-12
                          47K for R10 and R13
                          22K for R8

                          If you want to know the details:
                          • B-7971 cathode current:
                            • 3*6.0*X+4*5.5*X+2*4.0*X+6*5.0*X=21.0mA  X=21/78 mA (all segments on)
                            • 3*1.62mA+4*1.48mA+2*1.08mA+6*1.35mA=21mA Max versus 11.8mA nominal (sum of cathode resistor currents at 20V) : nominal factor = 11.8/21 = 0.562
                          • B-5971 cathode current:
                            • 10*1.7*Y+2*1.5*Y+1*3.0*Y=12.0mA Y=12/23 mA (all segments on)
                            • 10*0.89mA+2*0.78mA+1*1.57mA=12mA Max.
                            • 10*0.50mA+2*0.44mA+1*0.88mA=6.76mA nominal
                          • Resistors:
                            • 10p 20/0.5=40 K + 2p 20/0.44=45.5K + 1p 20/0.88=22.7K
                            • E24: 10p 39K + 2p 47K + 1p 22K
                          With these values, your Anode resistor can be 0 (short) at 170 Volt Anode voltage
                        • cyberb0
                          Thanks so much! I really appreciate the information and the detailed explanation! I ll try out your recommended values tonight and update the design files
                          Message 12 of 14 , Apr 15, 2014
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                            Thanks so much! I really appreciate the information and the detailed explanation!

                            I'll try out your recommended values tonight and update the design files accordingly...

                            Robert
                          • cyberb0
                            Thanks to Sjef, the cathode resistor values have now been finalized and all design elements updated to Rev4. The cathode resistors are the only real change to
                            Message 13 of 14 , Apr 21, 2014
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                              Thanks to Sjef, the cathode resistor values have now been finalized and all design elements updated to Rev4.  The cathode resistors are the only real change to be concerned about if you already ordered Rev3 of the SmartDriver board.  Make sure to use the values from the Rev4 design and not the values printed on the Rev3 board!


                              I should be receiving my first order of the Rev3 boards sometime this week.  With a little luck, no further changes will be necessary and I’ll be able to move on to the PIC code!  Cheers…


                              Robert

                            • cyberb0
                              I received the Rev3 boards last night and they turned out even better than I expected! I was a little concerned about the mounting holes on the Type B socket
                              Message 14 of 14 , Apr 22, 2014
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                                I received the Rev3 boards last night and they turned out even better than I expected!  I was a little concerned about the mounting holes on the Type B socket board, but when I pushed on the SK-136 socket, it snapped right into place like a LEGO.  Check out the Photos section for more...

                                 

                                Robert

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