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A time to reflect

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  • bema_seat
    There are questions that seem to dog one s mind whilst in The Fellowship and perhaps fear of being interned prevents people from asking. One such question
    Message 1 of 2 , Jan 1, 2008
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      There are questions that seem to dog one's mind whilst in The
      Fellowship and perhaps fear of being interned prevents people from
      asking.
      One such question relates to the number of black leaders amongst the
      rank and file members of the potters house.

      I am not what you might term as ...being part of the political
      correctness brigade...but it strikes me that the number of black
      leaders be that: Area leaders, Conference leaders,members of
      Executive councils,is disproportionate to the numbers of black people
      that make up a large proportion of congregations.

      Alvin Smith was once the Associate pastor at Tucson, but when Harold
      Warners health began to take a turn for the worst Alvin was
      unceremoniously sidelined and given a role as " Director of Overseas
      Affairs". To compound the situation, Alvin wasn't even consulted in
      the initial stages of discusion.

      When Tom Payne was hosting conferences in Africa, main speakers and
      international speakers where put up in hotels whilst local african
      pastors and there wives where put up in tents.

      There have been reports of racial tensions between pastors in certain
      parts of USA.

      During Tucson conference a pastor from Canada refrered to members of
      the Sikh religion as wearing nappies on their heads.

      Wayman srikes me as a wanna be mormon.

      I am not accusing the fellowship of institutional racism but the
      question does make for interesting debate.

      Shalom...
    • kenhaining777
      [There are questions that seem to dog one s mind whilst in The Fellowship and perhaps fear of being interned prevents people from asking.] Asking the wrong
      Message 2 of 2 , Jan 1, 2008
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        [There are questions that seem to dog one's mind whilst in The
        Fellowship and perhaps fear of being interned prevents people from
        asking.]

        Asking the wrong questions can get you into a lot of trouble.  Asking Bible questions, and demanding real answers, is fastest way to find the exit, with the exception of perhaps asking for an exact accounting of how the money collected is spent.  Asking other questions can have a variety of reactions depending on how challenging you sound.  If you ask submissively, then you will get the political answers.  If you ask in a challenging way, you once again may be finding the exit.

        [One such question relates to the number of black leaders amongst the
        rank and file members of the potters house.

        I am not what you might term as ...being part of the political
        correctness brigade...but it strikes me that the number of black
        leaders be that: Area leaders, Conference leaders,members of
        Executive councils,is disproportionate to the numbers of black people
        that make up a large proportion of congregations.]

        My own observation is that most of the churches in the U.S. have very few African Americans.  I don't know if it is different in England, or other countries.  That would be the main explaination given over here. 

        There was one African American pastor of note over here, but he left in the 1990 "rebellion."  Another one pioneered in a small Arizona town, and he was actually the only African American in that town when he was living there.  He also left the fellowship and tragically died of a disease.

        Then you bring up Alvin Smith....

        [Alvin Smith was once the Associate pastor at Tucson, but when Harold
        Warners health began to take a turn for the worst Alvin was
        unceremoniously sidelined and given a role as " Director of Overseas
        Affairs". To compound the situation, Alvin wasn't even consulted in
        the initial stages of discusion.]

        Generally speaking, regardless of race, these decisions are made at "the leadership level," and many a man has been told that his position is changing, etc.  That had nothing to do with Alvin's race.  That is just the way the leadership pretty much treats everyone. 

        There are no "associate pastors" in the fellowship.  They might give them that title for a while, but really there is only one pastor of a fellowship church, and he is subject to his pastor, and Wayman O.

        [When Tom Payne was hosting conferences in Africa, main speakers and
        international speakers where put up in hotels whilst local african
        pastors and there wives where put up in tents.]

        I would call that the Third World Treatment.  Would they do that in a Third World country where the people were white?  I don't know for sure, but I would say probably.  Leadership in the fellowship is treated like royalty. 

        When they held a healing crusade in the city where I pastored, Albuquerque, New Mexico, featuring none other than Lord Wayman, I was never invited to eat with the leadership after the crusade services, even though my church contributed heavily, and I brought the people in my church to attend.  I was consulted on where the best places to eat were, and then dismissed.  They have this real separation with the upper echelon in the fellowship of Wayman O.  Dale Reece, the "area leader," was in charge, and there were some other "big shots" there.  I was not one of them.  It didn't really bother me, and I knew the drill.  However, looking back on it, they were religious snobs.

        [There have been reports of racial tensions between pastors in certain
        parts of USA.]

        Haven't heard anything specific.

        [During Tucson conference a pastor from Canada refrered to members of
        the Sikh religion as wearing nappies on their heads.]

        Mocking other beliefs and religions is the order of the day in the fellowship.  If they mock other Christians, do you think they are going to spare Sikhs?  I am constantly mocked by a Waymanite loyalist on the Cracked Pots message board for being agnostic.  In fact, a lot of non fellowship Christians mock other Christians and other beliefs.  It is the nature of any hardened religion to view with contempt other beliefs.  When I was a boy, my Catholic school mates would sometimes mock me for not being Catholic, telling me I was going to burn in hell. 

        Wayman srikes me as a wanna be mormon.

        Well, he surely wants to be a god.  And he is not willing to wait for some after life.  He wants worship now, money now, and I have my own opinion on whether or not he has availed himself of women.

        I am not accusing the fellowship of institutional racism but the
        question does make for interesting debate.

        If Lord Wayman found a way to get more minorities, and thus more money and power, he would not hesitate to implement the plan.  But other than that, it is of no particular concern to him if his fellowship lacks minorities.  He would just as soon exploit and use up some more white folks.   

        Shalom...

        Shalom indeed

         

         


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