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Why? Is your neighbor safe?

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  • kenhaining777
    Here is a post by std_for_ever posted on Escape From the Fellowship. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Escape_from_the_Fellowship/ The number of people that know I
    Message 1 of 5 , Oct 31, 2005
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      Here is a post by std_for_ever posted on Escape From the Fellowship.

      http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Escape_from_the_Fellowship/

       

      The number of people that know I run the STD website can be counted on one hand still people ask me why all the time. Why "waste" my time with STD. Why don't I just walk away and get on with my life. Why am I so "obsessed" with CFM stuff? Well, on occasion I also hear people complain about our involvement in Iraq. I try to help them understand the reasoning like this:
      (Note: This is a simple analogy to make a point. It is not an attempt to start a political discussion.)

      If you knew that someone was going to break into your house, rape and kill your daughter, would you allow it? The answer is always no. Then I ask if you knew that someone was going to break into your neighbor's house, rape and kill their daughter, would you allow it?
      Again, the answer is always no. What about the neighbor two streets over, or someone in another state... again, no. We know that is exactly what was happening in Iraq and somehow the different culture
      or the distance or something has allowed the answer to change to yes in the minds of some. Well, my answer is still no.

      The same logic applies to CFM. I know that people are being spiritually raped and murdered in CFM. How can I walk away from that?


      All to often the talking Potterheads will post an attack against Ken , his newsgroup or us that post here as "being led astray by an unbeliever." The greater message is this: Ken, a self proclaimed unbeliever, is doing more to rescue the children of God from the clutches of a spiritually murdering rapist than many of the very family of the victims being assaulted.

      So, to whom am I addressing this message? I am addressing those that read here and do nothing. You don't post, you don't speak out, you don't even pray for those still entrapped in the spiritual rape rooms of CFM. The truth is that there are more of us that have left CFM
      than there are still attending. Think of the potential.

      What can you do? Send me an email with your testimony so that I can put it on the website. Send me an article that exposes the CFM lies. We were so bold back then that we stood on street corners promoting a cult. What are we doing now that we know the truth? Do
      something.

      I fear for the neighbors of those that seem to be able to just walk away.

    • kenhaining777
      [All to often the talking Potterheads will post an attack against Ken , his newsgroup or us that post here as being led astray by an unbeliever. ] The
      Message 2 of 5 , Oct 31, 2005
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        [All to often the talking Potterheads will post an attack against Ken , his newsgroup or us that post here as "being led astray by an unbeliever." ]

         

        The interesting thing is that the Bible does not warn, to any real degree, the people of God being misled by someone who states that they are an unbeliever.  The real warnings are about false teachers who claim they are teaching the Word of God, when they are teaching the doctrines of men.  Peter stated that there would be false teachers among the people of God.

        False teachers are most easily seen by motive.  The two main motives are to be exalted and to be enriched.  The attraction to the ministry in the fellowship is to be exalted and to be enriched.  That is easily seen.  A disciple sees some big shot leader preaching before a cheering crowd at an evening conference service and says, "I want to do that."  That is one of the purposes of conference.  It is about as spiritual as wanting to be a rock star. 

        I am not leading anyone here.  I just won't allow nasty attacks on ex members, that's all.  I won't allow fellowship disciples to come in and rewound those who are healing. 

        On that note, I got a nasty email from someone the other day who was probably trying to post without joining the group.  The post never would have made it anyway, unless I put it up for amusement purposes.  It stated that this site was for the purpose of diverting people from the will of God.  It further stated that if I wanted to attack something evil, I should go after all the Jezebel women who are preaching when the Bible clearly states that women should not preach.  These guys are out of their minds. 

        Anyway, I am grateful to anyone who takes the time to write here about the whole fellowship experience, and give the perspective of what it is like to get out.  I appreciate the many points of view which have been offered on these message boards

      • kenhaining777
        Here is a reply by naboth posted on Escape From the Fellowship. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Escape_from_the_Fellowship/ Here s another message to add to that
        Message 3 of 5 , Oct 31, 2005
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          Here is a reply by naboth posted on Escape From the Fellowship.

           

          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Escape_from_the_Fellowship/

          Here's another message to add to that list Ken. Mr.Ernest Toppin {For it was he yet again} on several occasions would start ranting about women preachers despite the fact that no-one in the church believed they should preach anyway. Toppin felt we should be protected from the kind of viewpoint that said they could. At one point he kept stressing that he had nothing against women {denial} but would get real vexed with those who persisted in believing women
          should preach. He likened women preachers to a dog on it's hind legs. Another disciple said that idea of women preachers was so stupid. Apparently if we had a woman preacher behind the pulpit the men would 'fancy her' and this would put them off the sermon. How
          can you fancy your pastor he sneered. Another time this hyper loyalist said 'the day the fellowship allows women preachers is the day I leave!'.Being a fellowship loyalist at the time myself I thought well that doesn't make sense. Where would you go? If you went anywhere else you would always find a doctrine or a practice
          that is different or objectionable. I began to think of questions like 'where would you go if there was no Potters House and what about christians that don't have a Potters House in their city and does a church have to be perfect in every area of doctrine for God
          to use it. I didn't know half the stuff I know now when I was one year saved. How can you comdemn a church for one mistake and say it has another spirit. Toppin makes mistakes. No man or ministry is perfect. This doesn't make sense.

          All these thoughts and others led me to the conclusion that we could be far too hard on other churches. Occasionaly I would get into loyalist mode but it was getting harder to believe the hardline stance that the fellowship was teaching without switching my brain
          off and I didn't see why I should do that and entrust my mind and my beliefs to a man who was starting to prove he was less that competant.

          As far as the women preacher issue is concerned I believe that the calling is for a man to preach. As far as slaying any so called 'Jezebel' who dares to preach and leaving her carcase for the dogs to eat well I'd rather be a part of a church that is a staunch defender of women preachers that be part of that nasty fellowship of
          chauvenists.

          Incidently Joe Campbell preached a sermon where he made mention of a woman in the church who would offer to pray with a person at the altar. Campbell saw this woman as a Jezebel spirit {he spiritualy discerned it!?} and told her not to do it again. She clearly thought
          he was wrong so one day she went to pray with someone and Campbell {in his own words} ran forward and jumped wildly in front of her and shouted at the top of his voice aaarrgggh! or something equally ridiculous. He proudly said that she jumped back in fright and ran
          back to her chair and never did it again. That's how you've got to treat this spirt, he said, you've got to show it who is boss. This spirit hates men and wants to dominate them so you have to be a strong man. Men who are not prepared to be confrontational like this
          are compromised with a Jezebel spirit.

          Toppin was at that conference and loved the sermon. One woman who came to the church had a christian mother who was concerned about the fellowship and it's attitude to women preachers. The daughter came to church one day and told Toppin's wife that she thought the church was in error on this point. Toppins' wife hit the roof and went bazerk st the idea that her church was in error. Toppin believing that women were mentaly weaker and needed to be protected from themselves stepped in and told his wife several times that he
          would deal with it before having a go at the girl himself and leaving her walking away in a flood of tears.

          Toppins response to this was to gather us all around and pray for this girl as she needed prayer. God is dealing with her, he said. I just couldn't do it. I couldn't speak to God like a hypocrite and pray for her after what I just saw. I think even Toppin was nervous
          about it but settled for spiritualising the issue and praying before us all to look righteous. What a jerk.

          regards...naboth675

        • kenhaining777
          [Here s another message to add to that list Ken. Mr.Ernest Toppin {For it was he yet again} on several occasions would start ranting about women preachers
          Message 4 of 5 , Oct 31, 2005
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            [Here's another message to add to that list Ken. Mr.Ernest Toppin {For it was he yet again} on several occasions would start ranting about women preachers despite the fact that no-one in the church believed they should preach anyway. Toppin felt we should be protected from the kind of viewpoint that said they could. At one point he kept stressing that he had nothing against women {denial} but would get real vexed with those who persisted in believing women should preach. He likened women preachers to a dog on it's hind legs.]

             

            I think I heard that "dog on its hind legs" before.  Sounds very Mitchellite.

            Back in the late seventies several of the pastors, including Harold Warner and the Mighty Mitch, had a couple preach week long meetings.  This husband and wife team took turns preaching.  That's right.  The Prescott and Tucson churches had a woman preaching evening services.  We were still in Foursquare at the time.

            I have to marvel at this Toppin guy.  He managed to preach in Prescott conference one year, as you told me.  There are basically two ways to achieve such an honor.  One is to send lots and lots of money to Mecca.  The other is to praise Lord Wayman and espouse all of his doctrines as divine truth.  I suppose with such a small church, Toppin made it in by praising the leader.  I remember Harry Hills achieved instant leadership when he joined the fellowship and was preaching all of the Prescott conferences.  Although he had a church of only about 40 people, he was able to raise some immense offerings to send to Prescott, and he never ceased praising Lord Wayman.

            If I wasn't familiar with the fellowship and I read some of your accounts about Toppin, I would think that you must be grossly exagerating.  He sounds like another really strange man calling himself "pastor."

            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Escape_from_the_Fellowship/

          • kenhaining777
            Here is a reply from Yooticus posted on Escape From the Fellowship. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Escape_from_the_Fellowship/ ... This just made me remember a
            Message 5 of 5 , Oct 31, 2005
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              Here is a reply from Yooticus posted on Escape From the Fellowship.

              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Escape_from_the_Fellowship/

               

              --- In Escape_from_the_Fellowship@yahoogroups.com, kenhaining777 <no_reply@y...> wrote:

              >
              > Back in the late seventies several of the pastors, including Harold Warner and the Mighty Mitch, had a couple preach week long meetings. This husband and wife team took turns preaching. That's right. The Prescott and Tucson churches had a woman preaching evening services. We were still in Foursquare at the time.
              >


              This just made me remember a couple that preached at the Tucson church a couple times in the new building, so it was long past Foursquare. They were Mexicans from LA who worked with gang members & stuff, and while they passed the mic back & forth all night, she clearly carried the authority. Not being a Mexican gangster myself I didn't pay that much attention but what struck me was their fixation on kids who wore their pants low enough to expose their butt cracks. They mentioned this OVER and OVER and OVER...buttcracks this and buttcracks that...it really got me to longing for a good ol' Mitchell discipleship class about tits to get my mind off of butts. Isn't that what they called balance?

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