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Re: [sig] Natena

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  • Susan Koziel
    Hi, Actually in the world of Botany the common names of plants tend to be quite regional (Both the names lambsquarters and pigweed are considered common
    Message 1 of 15 , Nov 12, 2004
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      Hi,
      Actually in the world of Botany the common names of
      plants tend to be quite regional (Both the names
      lambsquarters and pigweed are considered common
      names).
      The Latin or scientific names of the plant are
      actually the only thing that distinguishes them.
      Pigweed is the common name for a specific plant
      family, and in some areas it is a also indicative of a
      particular variety of Chenopodium.

      I included the latin name so that you could track
      down the exact plant I was speaking of.

      Both my mom (grew up in Northern Alberta), and my
      Uncle (Northern Saskatchewan) call the same plant
      pigweed, and distinguish it from other weeds that
      you'd feed the pigs. It also happens to be the plant
      that you are calling lambs quarters.
      :)

      Here is the list of common names that are used for
      Lamb's Quarters: Goosefoot, Mutton chops, Pigweed,
      Fat-Hen, and Wild Spinach. My understanding from the
      book I have in front of me (which is the one from my
      orginal email) is that any of the related species of
      Chenopodiaceae can be eaten by humans. But not to
      confuse it with Black nightshade (aka wild tomato aka
      Solanum nigrum)

      Also, all of the varieties of Lambs quarters (of
      which there are many) are imports from Europe, and not
      actually native to North America.

      :)
      It also probably has a lot to do with which area of
      the Ukraine they were from as well as which area of
      Canada they settled as to what they call the plant.

      The whole common name problem is a huge hurdle for
      anyone who works in the field of botany, or related
      agricultural fields... some days it makes me twitch -
      my dad's a botanist and I'm an agricultural
      geneticist, and we have different names for things.
      :)

      I have a reprint of a late 1500's early 1600's English
      Botany text at home... I'll go into it and see if I
      can give you some period info on the plant once I get
      home (I'm visiting my parents this weekend)
      -Kataryna

      PS: a quick modern recipe for the interested:
      Lamb's-Quarters and Bacon
      Dice 2 strips of bacon and fry until crisp. Remove all
      fat from the pan except 1 tbsp, add 1 cup washed
      chopped lamb's quarters leaves. Fry until leaves are
      tender 3-5 minutes. Serves 1
    • Lisa Kies
      X-JumpGate Networks Webmail - Mason City, Iowa: Originating-IP Fresh-water pearls were very popular for embellishing garments in Kievan Rus. Glass beads were
      Message 2 of 15 , Nov 13, 2004
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        X-JumpGate Networks Webmail - Mason City, Iowa: Originating-IP

        Fresh-water pearls were very popular for embellishing garments in Kievan Rus.
        Glass beads were also popular. Ibn Fadlan mentions that green beads were
        particularly prized by the Rus ladies, but I have not seen that verified
        anywhere else. I have seen blue, yellow, green, black with yellow
        stripes/squiggles, millefiore, amber, black with white stripes/squiggles,
        transluscent crystal, transluscent yellow, yellow with red stripes, etc. glass
        beads from the Novgorod excavations.

        Jewelry used enameling, filigree, pearls, some jewels (rough cabochen cut, of
        course).

        Rus ornament is a huge, slippery subject, but I hope this helps get you
        started.

        In Service,
        Sofya la Rus

        *************************************************
        ***> JumpGate Networks - Mason City, Iowa <***
        ***> Voice: 641-424-5307 Fax: 641-424-5346 <***
        ***> www.jumpgate.net <***
        *************************************************
      • Marina
        Thanks for the further elucidation.  I find all the different names fascinating.  I wonder what the taste differences are between the different varieties.
        Message 3 of 15 , Nov 13, 2004
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          Thanks for the further elucidation.  I find all the different names
          fascinating.  I wonder what the taste differences are between the different
          varieties.  Guess I will wait till summer and then raid the weeds growing in
          my parents garden (I live 10 floors up in downtown Ottawa - no weeds - gosh
          darn!)

          Thanks again
          Marina


          On 13/11/04 02:00 am, Susan Koziel wrote:
          > Hi,
          > Actually in the world of Botany the common names of
          > plants tend to be quite regional (Both the names
          > lambsquarters and pigweed are considered common
          > names).
          > The Latin or scientific names of the plant are
          > actually the only thing that distinguishes them.
          > Pigweed is the common name for a specific plant
          > family, and in some areas it is a also indicative of a
          > particular variety of Chenopodium.
          >
          > I included the latin name so that you could track
          > down the exact plant I was speaking of.
          >
          > Both my mom (grew up in Northern Alberta), and my
          > Uncle (Northern Saskatchewan) call the same plant
          > pigweed, and distinguish it from other weeds that
          > you'd feed the pigs. It also happens to be the plant
          > that you are calling lambs quarters.
          >
          > :)
          >
          > Here is the list of common names that are used for
          > Lamb's Quarters: Goosefoot, Mutton chops, Pigweed,
          > Fat-Hen, and Wild Spinach. My understanding from the
          > book I have in front of me (which is the one from my
          > orginal email) is that any of the related species of
          > Chenopodiaceae can be eaten by humans. But not to
          > confuse it with Black nightshade (aka wild tomato aka
          > Solanum nigrum)
          >
          > Also, all of the varieties of Lambs quarters (of
          > which there are many) are imports from Europe, and not
          > actually native to North America.
          >
          > :)
          >
          > It also probably has a lot to do with which area of
          > the Ukraine they were from as well as which area of
          > Canada they settled as to what they call the plant.
          >
          > The whole common name problem is a huge hurdle for
          > anyone who works in the field of botany, or related
          > agricultural fields... some days it makes me twitch -
          > my dad's a botanist and I'm an agricultural
          > geneticist, and we have different names for things.
          >
          > :)
          >
          > I have a reprint of a late 1500's early 1600's English
          > Botany text at home... I'll go into it and see if I
          > can give you some period info on the plant once I get
          > home (I'm visiting my parents this weekend)
          > -Kataryna
          >
          > PS: a quick modern recipe for the interested:
          > Lamb's-Quarters and Bacon
          > Dice 2 strips of bacon and fry until crisp. Remove all
          > fat from the pan except 1 tbsp, add 1 cup washed
          > chopped lamb's quarters leaves. Fry until leaves are
          > tender 3-5 minutes. Serves 1
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
        • Thomas Huber
          Thanks for the Kievan bead answers, that was actually a lot of help. I have some other questions now. First: What kind of clothes designs am I looking at for
          Message 4 of 15 , Nov 14, 2004
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            Thanks for the Kievan bead answers, that was actually
            a lot of help. I have some other questions now.

            First: What kind of clothes designs am I looking at
            for kiev in 900 b.c.e.? I am not shure what it correct
            for my time period in Kiev (Kyiv).

            Second: I am aslo looking for underwear designs. I
            have some undergarment instructions, but they are
            mainly from the 13th Century.

            Thanks for all your help so far and in the future. It
            has been extreemly welcomed.

            -Bjorn Blundr


            =====
            http://www.meregeeks.com/ .WEBCOMIC



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          • Alexey Kiyaikin aka Posadnik
            Greetings! ... It all depends on what direction your persona is looking. Early Kiev was 1) rather cosmopolitan-looking, as 2) it was standing on a very old
            Message 5 of 15 , Nov 15, 2004
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              Greetings!

              > Thanks for the Kievan bead answers, that was actually
              > a lot of help. I have some other questions now.
              > First: What kind of clothes designs am I looking at
              :-)
              > for kiev in 900 b.c.e.? I am not shure what it correct
              > for my time period in Kiev (Kyiv).
              It all depends on what direction your persona is looking. Early Kiev was 1) rather cosmopolitan-looking, as 2) it was standing on a very old trade route from the (today) central Russia to the Balcans and Mediterranean. It was also on teh weay from the Steppe (Mongolia to Hungary) to European woods. Thus, it borrowed a lot from the Steppe and fom the tradeers that passed it. Thus, steppe (Turcic), oriental (Arabic & Persian), Nortern (Scandinavian & Finnish), European (Frankish) and Balcan (Bulgarian and Byzantian) motifs. It's you to make the salad, just choose the ingredients.


              > Second: I am aslo looking for underwear designs. I
              > have some undergarment instructions, but they are
              > mainly from the 13th Century.

              Afair it's not the case in the 9 century. Underwear was the same pattern wear. Simply two pants worn together, in cold weather. The same with shirts. No bras, of course :-)
              Changes in all that took place later (btw, "undergarment of 13 century" marked the need for it, as the climate changed, which led, say, to blocking of inter-Atlantic routes and desolation of Viking settlements in the New World and Greenland - and in the 9 century the climate was quite opposite, The Minor Climatic Optimum), and (imho + some research) the underwear patterns used to be a little more obsolete pattern of the everyday apparel.

              Bye,
              Alex
            • Danks Cole
              To anyone in or near the Toronto area....there is an exibit at the Royal Ontario Museum called Pearls that has a Russian gown with 100,000 pearls beaded into
              Message 6 of 15 , Nov 15, 2004
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                To anyone in or near the Toronto area....there is an exibit at the Royal
                Ontario Museum called 'Pearls' that has a Russian gown with 100,000
                pearls beaded into it.... it was most spectacular.....

                Vlakh

                [Clip your posts, please. --Moderator]
              • Susan Koziel
                I d assume that different varieties could have vastly different tastes... Broccoli & Cauliflower both are varieties of Brassica oleracea -Kataryna
                Message 7 of 15 , Nov 15, 2004
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                  I'd assume that different varieties could have vastly
                  different tastes... Broccoli & Cauliflower both are
                  varieties of Brassica oleracea
                  -Kataryna

                  --- Jane Boyko <jboyko@...> wrote:

                  > Thanks for the further elucidation. I find all the
                  > different names
                  > fascinating. I wonder what the taste differences
                  > are between the different
                  > varieties. Guess I will wait till summer and then
                  > raid the weeds growing in
                  > my parents garden (I live 10 floors up in downtown
                  > Ottawa - no weeds - gosh
                  > darn!)
                  >
                  > Thanks again
                  > Marina
                  >
                  > On 13/11/04 02:00 am, Susan Koziel wrote:
                  > > Hi,
                  > > Actually in the world of Botany the common names
                  > of
                  > > plants tend to be quite regional (Both the names
                  > > lambsquarters and pigweed are considered common
                  > > names).
                  > > The Latin or scientific names of the plant are
                  > > actually the only thing that distinguishes them.
                  > > Pigweed is the common name for a specific plant
                  > > family, and in some areas it is a also indicative
                  > of a
                  > > particular variety of Chenopodium.
                  > >
                  > > I included the latin name so that you could
                  > track
                  > > down the exact plant I was speaking of.
                  > >
                  > > Both my mom (grew up in Northern Alberta), and
                  > my
                  > > Uncle (Northern Saskatchewan) call the same plant
                  > > pigweed, and distinguish it from other weeds that
                  > > you'd feed the pigs. It also happens to be the
                  > plant
                  > > that you are calling lambs quarters.
                  > >
                  > > :)
                  > >
                  > > Here is the list of common names that are used for
                  > > Lamb's Quarters: Goosefoot, Mutton chops, Pigweed,
                  > > Fat-Hen, and Wild Spinach. My understanding from
                  > the
                  > > book I have in front of me (which is the one from
                  > my
                  > > orginal email) is that any of the related species
                  > of
                  > > Chenopodiaceae can be eaten by humans. But not to
                  > > confuse it with Black nightshade (aka wild tomato
                  > aka
                  > > Solanum nigrum)
                  > >
                  > > Also, all of the varieties of Lambs quarters
                  > (of
                  > > which there are many) are imports from Europe, and
                  > not
                  > > actually native to North America.
                  > >
                  > > :)
                  > >
                  > > It also probably has a lot to do with which
                  > area of
                  > > the Ukraine they were from as well as which area
                  > of
                  > > Canada they settled as to what they call the
                  > plant.
                  > >
                  > > The whole common name problem is a huge hurdle for
                  > > anyone who works in the field of botany, or
                  > related
                  > > agricultural fields... some days it makes me
                  > twitch -
                  > > my dad's a botanist and I'm an agricultural
                  > > geneticist, and we have different names for
                  > things.
                  > >
                  > > :)
                  > >
                  > > I have a reprint of a late 1500's early 1600's
                  > English
                  > > Botany text at home... I'll go into it and see if
                  > I
                  > > can give you some period info on the plant once I
                  > get
                  > > home (I'm visiting my parents this weekend)
                  > > -Kataryna
                  > >
                  > > PS: a quick modern recipe for the interested:
                  > > Lamb's-Quarters and Bacon
                  > > Dice 2 strips of bacon and fry until crisp. Remove
                  > all
                  > > fat from the pan except 1 tbsp, add 1 cup washed
                  > > chopped lamb's quarters leaves. Fry until leaves
                  > are
                  > > tender 3-5 minutes. Serves 1
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > sig-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                • Susan Koziel
                  Hi, From another list I found that Pigweed is also used for Amaranthus retroflexus (aka red root) http://www.ppws.vt.edu/scott/weed_id/amare.htm This, from
                  Message 8 of 15 , Nov 15, 2004
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                    Hi,
                    From another list I found that Pigweed is also used
                    for Amaranthus retroflexus (aka red root)
                    http://www.ppws.vt.edu/scott/weed_id/amare.htm

                    This, from what I've found is not edible.

                    Here's a picture of the edible Pigweed/Lambs Quarters
                    http://www.ppws.vt.edu/scott/weed_id/cheal.htm
                    -Kataryna
                  • Susan Koziel
                    Also here s Solanum nigrum http://www.ppws.vt.edu/scott/weed_id/solni.htm The poisonous one, for reference -Kataryna
                    Message 9 of 15 , Nov 15, 2004
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                      Also here's
                      Solanum nigrum
                      http://www.ppws.vt.edu/scott/weed_id/solni.htm
                      The poisonous one, for reference
                      -Kataryna
                    • Tat'ianna Radokovaia Codlin
                      A picture of it would be wonderful for us poor souls that don t live near Toronto. Tat ianna Radokovaia Codlin
                      Message 10 of 15 , Nov 15, 2004
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                        A picture of it would be wonderful for us poor souls that don't live near
                        Toronto.


                        Tat'ianna Radokovaia Codlin


                        > To anyone in or near the Toronto area....there is an exibit at the Royal
                        > Ontario Museum called 'Pearls' that has a Russian gown with 100,000
                        > pearls beaded into it.... it was most spectacular.....
                        >
                        > Vlakh
                        >
                        > [Clip your posts, please. --Moderator]
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